Young people especially share your views. IMHO, don't register your next script. Let everyone enjoy it and use it whichever way they want. Especially those who can't pay you to use your script. They deserve a break.  

Quoted from Penoyer79 who wants to take a 15$ chance on what is probably one-hit-wonder after one-hit-wonder. sorry those days are over for me. you want me to buy your CD? i'm going to make sure i'm getting my money's worth first.

iTunes?  Amazon?  Each song is about a buck each.

Quoted from Penoyer79 you want me to buy your CD? i'm going to make sure i'm getting my money's worth first.

Just listen to it on youtube if you're unsure.  That's free and that's cool.

The point is...at least my point is, that many just download music they know they want, based on already knowing they like it and want it.

It's killed the recording industry in so many ways, and is also the MAJOR reason that so many talented, lifelong musicians struggle to get by, let alone live the life of a rock star, like they did back in the day.

Quoted from Grandma Bear Young people especially share your views. IMHO, don't register your next script. Let everyone enjoy it and use it whichever way they want. Especially those who can't pay you to use your script. They deserve a break.

really it depends on whats more important to you - getting paid or getting known? if you get known - you'll get paid... if you are good.
there's more money in touring - always has been and always will be.

btw...i am a musician/artist as well.

Quoted from Dreamscale Just listen to it on youtube if you're unsure.  That's free and that's cool. The point is...at least my point is, that many just download music they know they want, based on already knowing they like it and want it. It's killed the recording industry in so many ways, and is also the MAJOR reason that so many talented, lifelong musicians struggle to get by, let alone live the life of a rock star, like they did back in the day.

is Youtube really all that better than downloading music?

i mean if your primary listening station is the computer... then essentially youre just as guilty as those who download



there will always be many struggling and uber talented musicians. because making it big as a "rockstar" if you will - is about as easy as winning the lottery.

if you are good...if you have the work ethic... EDIT* you can still make money....reguardless of record sales.

This discussion has been here many times. It always divides people. To me, I believe creators of anything deserve to get paid for creating something out of nothing.

That's it for my comments here. Just stating my position is all. Not looking for an argument or anything.  

Quoted from Grandma Bear This discussion has been here many times. It always divides people. To me, I believe creators of anything deserve to get paid for creating something out of nothing. That's it for my comments here. Just stating my position is all. Not looking for an argument or anything.

hey a great debate is a great debate. its a debate because there are two sides to it... and there are positives to both sides when it comes to "pirating music"

as a up and coming musician... getting heard should be your #1 priority.... and the internet is a FANTASTIC OUTLET to that.

I'm too tired to be in this debate. Been there, done that. I am making a short pirate film though.

Quoted from Grandma Bear IMHO, don't register your next script. Let everyone enjoy it and use it whichever way they want.

last bit....

thats a little different. you have to register as a writer because people can steal your work... literally - steal it - and call it their own...or change what you wrote.

you cant modify an artists music... you cant change notes and call it your own.

Quoted from Penoyer79 is Youtube really all that better than downloading music? i mean if your primary listening station is the computer... then essentially youre just as guilty as those who download there will always be many struggling and uber talented musicians. because making it big as a "rockstar" if you will - is about as easy as winning the lottery. if you are good...if you have the work ethic... EDIT* you can still make money....reguardless of record sales.

No, no, and no.

I don't listen to my music on my computer and never will.  I said, if you are in doubt as to whether or not to buy a Cd of whatever music by whatever recording act, you can most likely check it out on youtube.  Then, if you do think it's what you're after, go ahead and plunk down the dough and let the recording act reap their $.015 or so for their efforts.

Pennoyer (sorry, I forgot your actual name), you are incorrect about if you're good and if you have the proper work ethic, you will make money - at least in terms of making real money.

case in point, 1 of the very best and most talented hard rock/metal/progressive recording artists of all time - Savatage.  These guys have been in the game since the early 80's and have put out 12 studio releases, along with a number of compilations and live recordings.  Critics and fans alike who are "in the know" will tell you they are a classic and easily 1 of the best and most influential bands of this era.

But you know what?  They've never had a platinum release and I'm not eve sure they've eve had a gold release.  When they toured on their last studio release, Poets and Madmen, in 2001, I saw them a dive bar in Tempe, AZ, and there weren't more than 75 peeps in the audience (hey, cool for me, actually!).

I know/knew their web designer and I know what kind of money they made, and I'll tell you it wasn't dick.

Now, to be clear and honest, many don't know this, but Trans Siberian orchestra (TSO) was born of Savatage, and is and has been thriving wildly since their inception, but, it's a different story, and they guys who struggled throughout the years in Sava, didn't get the recognition, star power, or lifestyle they should have.

Now, I can't and won't blame piracy on their situation, but my point is that talent and ethic and drive do not guarantee success in any way, shape, or form.

The music industry, much like the movie industry is driven by marketing, and what's marketed, is what sells, and what makes money and super stars.

If you think Nicki Manaj and Justin Beiber is talent and deserving of mutli million dollar success, more power to you all.

isnt the internet a great source for marketing? youtube sensations? having your product available to world at the click of a button?


and yes music is about marketing... and luck...trust me - i know. we're arguing a little bit of semantics here though.....and it was my mistake to use the word "good" to make money....music liek all art is subjective.

i was thinking of a little band called metallica who got their start without any help from the music industry... they got their start because their demo was copied to death and spread around like wildfire. word of mouth and relentless touring lead their their big break..... obviouslly they sued Napster... but since losing that public relations nightmare they have even since changed their tune about illegal downloading.

fyi i too once shared yoru opinions on this matter.

What I'm curious about is if you opinion in this matter transfers to your own screenplay writing? If not, then why is screenplay writing different than music "writing"?

I just noticed my avatar is a pirate!!!

OK, Chris...it's Chris, right?

I'm not 100% clear on the Metallica situation, but I'm pretty sure I know what I'm saying, and if I'm wrong, you or or someone else can correct me.

Metallica was a successful recording and touring band...until they hit it HUGE and went to mega star status.  It was at this time that Lars and the boys made their stand against Napster, not before.

But either way, Metallica made it BIG...VERY BIG in a relatively short time frame, which isn't what I'm talking about.  But as you say and know, music like everything else that is subjective lives and does with what the public wants...at that time, for whatever reason.

Pirating music is not good in any way, shape or form and I can't believe you, being a writer and musician could or would ever say it is.  What am I possibly missing here?

I think what Chris was getting at with the Metallica thing was the fact that Metallica owes a lot of its success to the tape trading movement back in the 80s and 90s, where their demo got recorded on blank tapes and passed around by hungry metalheads, thus leading to the word of mouth that put them in the spotlight. One could argue that downloading is the tape trading of today. Not that I agree (I don't) but again, one could argue that.

Anyway, I'd rather not get caught up in this ancient argument other than saying I like to buy CDs. I just dug through a box of old ones from college and have since transferred a few to the car. Last I was driving, I was spinning Darkthrone's Transylvanian Hunger.

Downloading/Stealing music is what made music what it is today -- Shit.  The music industry knew Rap, POP and Hip-Hop dance shit isn't worth listening too... They knew that if they marketed it, no one would download it -- let alone buy it.  So they marketed these "artisit" in a way where they could still make money, even if the artist(s) albums bombed at retail.  

The core make up of the industry is built on a foundation of a few idiots who knew a little... they're dying off, the young lions are taking over and they don't know anything because the idiots who did know a thing or two tried to teach them, but they were too busy with their ADD, their games, their phone aps and other diversions that they said "Ta-fuck with it".

Now we're on the threshold of a big ol' ball of amalgamated shit -- And you know who's leading the way?

Katy Perry
Jay-Z
Gwen Stefani
Kanye West

Lady Gaga, surprisingly, is the only one who knows how little she means to the industry (AKA no talent)-- but also knows how incredibly stupid people are and how much money she can make off those very people.  I love her to death, by the way.

See, to be a musician, a successful one, today means nothing... You don't have to know how to play an instrument or sing.  You just have to know how to market yourself via reality Tv show or endorsement of a product or start up a perfume or clothing line.

Back in the day, bands weren't corporations.  They are every bit that and more now.  U2, not a band.  A corporation.  Kiss, not a band.  A corporation.  Aerosmith, not a band... a corporation.  The list goes on and on.

That is why even "good" bands, and I use that term loosely with the above mentioned, are sell outs today.  As a musician myself, played for over 17 years and counting now -- There is no hope for anyone who doesn't fall in line with the above.

Disney, Nick and Sony control it all.