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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Screenwriting Discussion    Contests - Screenwriting and Filmmaking  ›  American Zoetrope Screenplay Comp. Moderators: Don
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  Author    American Zoetrope Screenplay Comp.  (currently 3739 views)
Scar Tissue Films
Posted: February 16th, 2018, 4:05pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from PrussianMosby
Actually, I stand behind him. No screenwriter should pay… blah, is my thing on and on…

At the moment I ask myself if people would even like my stuff.

It's that complicated so that I don't write anymore. I just see the chaos and shake my head.


If you speak from the heart, someone will like it.
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eldave1
Posted: February 16th, 2018, 6:41pm Report to Moderator
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My thoughts:

1. Your may be right. You may be wrong about Zeotrope - who knows.

2. Regardless of whether you are right or wrong about Zeotrope, it has no bearing on the quality of your script. It could be great - it could be crap.





My Scripts can all be seen here:

http://dlambertson.wix.com/scripts
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PrussianMosby
Posted: February 17th, 2018, 12:12am Report to Moderator
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@ scar

Yeah, the meaning of the word I understand for sure. I don't understand how you use the language. Is it sarcastic or do you make an intellectual statement…


In the Head of the Driver (3p - drama, sports, SF)

Those Infinite Wolves  (8p - psychological horror)

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Dustin
Posted: February 17th, 2018, 3:15am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from PrussianMosby

Is it sarcastic or do you make an intellectual statement…


I'd say it's a bit of both.

I'm not averse to diversity, I love it. What I don't like though is unfairness. If 10 scripts are put in front of you, you should pick the best one and not the one you feel you should pick to help make society - mostly overly liberal white men - feel better about itself. You go in blind. Who the writer is shouldn't matter at all.

It's one of the reasons I stopped entering. The competitions are clearly not looking for white men so we should all save our money.
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PrussianMosby
Posted: February 17th, 2018, 3:47am Report to Moderator
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I hear. Where I live it's completely not in fashion to discuss this white male and back and so on… Perhaps the train has just arrived here, and I just didn't notice.

The agents and producers I talk to are 95 % female. Sometimes I ask myself if that is normal… But they're fine, I believe. However, the film industry became an insane melting pot of making/producing a position and keep it, if you know what I mean.  Politicized.

To keep my stereotype and play my role: Let's talk about surrogate motherhood and how we position ourselves there, Dustin ;-) How do we look good there

You know that I actually speak up for women in deciding positions, f.i. no other than the Liberian woman would have solved that situation in West Africa. I just fear the society breads a kind of women that is an old white man, throwing some weapons and yelling as is the case today, just in another avatar. But it's what is going to happen… no illusions.


In the Head of the Driver (3p - drama, sports, SF)

Those Infinite Wolves  (8p - psychological horror)

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Anon
Posted: February 17th, 2018, 1:31pm Report to Moderator
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Diversity issues aside - this thread has got me wondering about the script quality. If it blows - Eric's getting burned. And if it's good - get a decent read. It's win win.

Bring on BURN by Eric Ward!
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eldave1
Posted: February 17th, 2018, 8:47pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Anon
Diversity issues aside - this thread has got me wondering about the script quality. If it blows - Eric's getting burned. And if it's good - get a decent read. It's win win.

Bring on BURN by Eric Ward!


My gut tells me the latter.

The dude comes in railing on liberals (which I am one) and women (which I am not). But I do know that your name does not go on the script in most screenplay competitions as they want the judges reading blind to the gender/name of the writer. Now, the Zeotrope mission does include:

We seek original voices whose work will contribute to the quality, diversity, and longevity of contemporary cinema."

So, yeah - maybe this particular contest in the end when Francis picks the winner is slanted towards diversity - but it says it right up front - so not sure why the complaint?

In terms of women for 2017:

Of the top 100 grossing films, women represented:

8% of directors
10% of writers
2% of cinematographers
24% of producers
14% of editors

Not exactly an avalanche of hormones killing the industry. Add to that of the top 100 films of 2016 females comprised only 29% of protagonists.  So I am a bit lost as too the overwhelming advantage this fellow thinks females have in the industry. Are there some programs specifically designed to benefit females and minority writers - sure. primarily based on the data above. Our there similar programs for white males? - no.   One can argue if that is fair or not, but not sure how one builds a case in terms of gender/ethnicity bias in contests when the judges don't see the writer's name in the first place.

In terms of a liberal bias - yeah, it ain't too difficult to conclude that Hollywood leans left. You can whine about that or write stories that you think are marketable within that paradigm.

Long winded way of saying it sounded like sour grapes to me.  But that's just my ear.


My Scripts can all be seen here:

http://dlambertson.wix.com/scripts

Revision History (2 edits; 1 reasons shown)
eldave1  -  February 17th, 2018, 9:36pm
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AnthonyCawood
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 3:45am Report to Moderator
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Has he posted his screenplay yet?

Personally. as a white middle-aged Brit, I hit no diversity targets whatsoever, I'm not yet even old enough to be considered a senior.

So that's it, I'm giving in, stopping writing, forced out of the industry by those blessed by birth with a difference...

Oh, hang on, I've sold stuff, optioned features, had stuff made... not the big break yet but definite progress... all without ever experiencing any specific bias.

Actually, I think I'll just go back to writing scripts and concentrate on making them good.


Anthony Cawood - Award winning screenwriter
Available Short screenplays - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/short-scripts
Available Feature screenplays - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/feature-film-scripts/
Screenwriting articles - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/articles
IMDB Link - http://www.imdb.com/name/nm6495672/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1
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Dustin
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 3:49am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from eldave1


We seek original voices whose work will contribute to the quality, diversity, and longevity of contemporary cinema."

So, yeah - maybe this particular contest in the end when Francis picks the winner is slanted towards diversity - but it says it right up front - so not sure why the complaint?


If it said right up front that they were only looking for white males then this wouldn't be complaint-worthy?

The competition would be declared racist, prejudiced, homophobic, etc, etc. I would complain too.
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Dustin
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 3:53am Report to Moderator
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I was going to write something for the Green Door comp run here in the UK by Idris Alba but then I realised they weren't looking for me... because of the colour of my skin and my sex.

That's racist and prejudiced toward white men. Simple as that... the crazy thing is they don't even have to do much to hide it because most white men agree that it's fine.
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Angry Bear
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 9:14am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from AnthonyCawood


Oh, hang on, I've sold stuff, optioned features, had stuff made... not the big break yet but definite progress... all without ever experiencing any specific bias.

Actually, I think I'll just go back to writing scripts and concentrate on making them good.


I usually don't bother with contests at all although I did enter one this year just for the hell of it. Other than contests that ask specifically for a certain type of writer, I believe that Robert McKee is right when he says "Everyone in Hollywood is looking for a GREAT story". I believe that 100%. Hollywood would never turn down a GREAT story because it's written by a white male.

Now, the hard part is writing a GREAT script. I know I can't. I can write so so scripts that indie filmmakers might consider. Most writers believe their scripts are gold and if only they could get a chance to show the right people...


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eldave1
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 11:54am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Dustin


If it said right up front that they were only looking for white males then this wouldn't be complaint-worthy?

The competition would be declared racist, prejudiced, homophobic, etc, etc. I would complain too.


Yes, it would be (although probably not declared homophobic).  

My real problem is with the specific complaint with his specific script. To complain that you were filtered out somehow because you did not meet the parameters of those inviting participation is a useless exercise. By way of example, I had script that neatly met the parameters of what a Canadian Production company stated they were looking for story and budget wise - but - the requirement was I had to be Canadian. Can't imagine submitting and then crying about my "unfair" rejection because I was not Canadian. Anyway - strike one.

Strike two - there is no evidence that his script did not progress in the contest for the reason he stated. What - did it just smash the other contest circuits? Is it on the Blacklist 100? Or - maybe - just maybe - it wasn't as good as the others.

Long winded way of saying that I could respect a debate on the merits of race/gender based programs for writers (or any other industry for that matter). What I don't care for as whether his specific script somehow got black balled for that reason. So...

On to the debate:

Personally, even as a card carrying left winger, I think the economic status one is born and raised in as a far more meaningful indicator of barriers than race or gender. e.g., I see no reason to give preference to a Asian female whose parents sent her to Harvard. If you're going to have preferences, I would rather give it to the child raised in poverty, regardless of race.

I think that it is easy to see from the stats that females are underrepresented. What isn't answered (or perhaps even known) is the why. Zeotrope is trying to address that under representation. I don't agree with their method, but I understand the motive.  



My Scripts can all be seen here:

http://dlambertson.wix.com/scripts
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Dustin
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 12:37pm Report to Moderator
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He may have a point. As the comp are looking for specific people it stands to reason that the readers would have been aware of this. So any 'white' sounding male names may have been discarded with barely a read.

If they want to do things like this then be more transparent and stop white males from entering altogether. They won't do that because they would not only be accused of blatant prejudice but also lose lots of revenue. They're quite happy to take our money even though we don't have any chance of winning.
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RJP
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 2:51pm Report to Moderator
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Hey, first ever post here. I'm new :p

Interesting debate going on. The way that I've come to understand it is that Hollywood needs diversity in voices. So even though the majority of aspiring screenwriters are white men, they still need just as many women and minorities as writers. It wouldn't make sense to have African-American programs about life on the street that's written by white guys.

So in my eyes complaining about it is sort of like a AAA hockey player that was never good enough to make the pros, but spends his days complaining about how much better he is than players from the olympic women's team.

Sometimes however, contests go too far. For instance, the Academy Nicholl admits in their FAQ that they receive 70% of their submissions from Men and 30% from women. And yet the last 2 years have awarded only 1 of the 5 fellowship to a man. If that trend continues, I can't help but think it's maybe a little sexist.

Anyways, one last thing: you don't need this guy to post his script for you because you can read it right now. Just search "Burn" in the little search bar at the top of SS. Scroll down a bit and you'll find it.

My opinion: The script needs a lot of work. But I'd take it easy on him...he's still licking his wounds.
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AnthonyCawood
Posted: February 18th, 2018, 2:57pm Report to Moderator
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The diversity policy of this comp isn't why his script didn't place, that's evident after less than a page.


Anthony Cawood - Award winning screenwriter
Available Short screenplays - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/short-scripts
Available Feature screenplays - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/feature-film-scripts/
Screenwriting articles - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/articles
IMDB Link - http://www.imdb.com/name/nm6495672/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1
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