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I actually like bold slug lines. Separates scenes, makes it easier for me to read. I know Rob does it, or did it when he was around.
Then again I also like "we see," "we hear," camera angles, song suggestions, dual dialogue and pretty much every other thing writers are apparently not supposed to do.
I can't live the buttoned-down life like you. I want it all. The dizzying highs, the terrifying lows, the creamy middles. Sure, I may offend some of the blue bloods with my cocky stride and musky odors. Oh, I'll never be the darling of the so-called "city fathers," who cluck their tongues, stroke their beards and talk about what's to be done with this Homer Simpson?
I actually like bold slug lines. Separates scenes, makes it easier for me to read.I know Rob does it, or did it when he was around.
Then again I also like "we see," "we hear," camera angles, song suggestions, dual dialogue and pretty much every other thing writers are apparently not supposed to do.
For your own personal use or your friends -- Sounds exquisite. But I'd be leery of sending it off to an analyst or an agent or a producer like that. Unless you're sleeping with them of course. I hear many things slide in between the sheets when you're sleeping with one.
Balt's colorful dismissal of the concept notwithstanding, I have seen it more and more.
I kind of like it, and can see where it makes the read a little easier. To me, anyway.
Not sure if I am ready to fully buy into it yet, though -- change always comes slowly. I experimented with it in my last script, and was only partially satisfied with the technique. And some people howled about it haha.
Maybe for a feature, but surely unnecessary for a short script.
Through another something I'm working on, I'm forming an opinion that some of the format stuff we haggle over around here really doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.
If the story's good, up front and through-and-through and ends with a bang! - everyone will forgive minor transgressions.
Personally, I just like the bold slugs. Bolding the characters is a bit much for me. I reference back and forth, up and down, a fair bit, so I find it helpful for quick reference points. However, seeing that I'm something of a bulldozing pig, I understand that MOST people are much more delicate readers than I (thus they are to be considered normal).
Honestly, you should pander to the greatest audience of readers. Readers are a fickle lot that will toss your work into the trash for petty reasons. The fewer things you do to offend their delicate eyes the more eyes you will have reading more of your screenplay. IMHO.
When homebrewing beer there is an argument about hot-side aeration. Does introducing air into the hot unfermented beer contribute off-flavors to the finished beer? Some people will say that hot-side aeration ruins the beer. Others say that it's a myth and that it doesn't carry any weight.
Hot side aeration can be avoided. Given this, I chose not to do it. Why take the chance in ruining my beer?
The same argument can be said here. Some people will say it's okay to use bold print. Some will say it will hurt the script. No one, however, will tell you that not using bold print will hurt the script.
Gotta agree with Phil here... Why take the extra second to bold the header when I know Final Draft 8, Sophocles, Movie Outline don't offer it as even a customizable general feature? That, without reading "books", lets me know right there that, while many things aren't addressed within software and certainly books, it's not apart of them for a reason.
That reason being it's just not needed. Regardless if it's acceptable or not.
Auto Cap On Sentences + Auto Guess Next Cued Character + Auto 1.5 space on next line +
AUTO BOLD SCENE HEADER (-)
That's 3 to 1, by the way. But you (TOPIC CREATOR) go ahead and do what makes "YOU" feel better. I hear there is a brilliant screenwriter on youtube teaching you how to bind and write scripts. He's from Tampa Florida and he's an expert. I'll link ya to him if you want. He'll know better than any of us.
Some people will say that hot-side aeration ruins the beer. Others say that it's a myth and that it doesn't carry any weight.
The problem with your analogy, Phil, is that you are leaving out the third group -- those who say hot-side aeration is yummy.
What if there is a growing population that says, "You know, I kind of like hot-side aeration, and while I know some people don't like it or don't care, I had some hot-side aerated beer and it was really good."
Even if it is something that does not catch on, it can be perilous to ignore change and dismiss it out-of-hand. You are like an old dogglebe not interested in new tricks haha.
No one wants oxidized beer (the supposed results of hot side aeration); it tastes like wet cardboard. It's a faulty flavor and not something that the discriminating beer drinker would want.
Evolution - Everything evolves. Even language evolves.
Screenwriting is no different, it has been evolving for a hundred years and will always continue to do so. What was hot ten years ago may not be hot tomorrow and vice versa.
Who knows, the next big thing might be no sluglines at all, maybe it will be YELLOW sluglines. There is no point staying in the past just because someone once said this is the way it should be.
Reading many sold specs, many of them first time sales, has taught me that nobody really cares.
If your title and your logline is good, if your story sounds interesting and commercial then someone will read your script. If they think it is any good they will send it upstairs, they have to, it is their job. They ignore spelling mistakes, format and bad writing (to a degree of course) and only care about the story. That is effectively what the business is all about, story!
Now it does not mean it is not a good idea not to correct any spelling mistakes you have, and it certainly is not a licence to write badly. But it also means that there are many, many, many more important things you are going to be judged on when a reader reads your script.
In fact format does not even appear in the leaked guidelines given to readers at one particular talent agency.
Personally I do not like bold slugs, so I don't use them. But if they make you feel better about your script then use them. Whatever it takes.
I apologize if I've kicked a dead horse. I'm new to this site. I tried to find the answer to this question earlier but after sifting through a boatload of posts and not finding it, I opted to just ask. Didn't mean to start a pissing match or open any old wounds. Just curious is all.
I apologize if I've kicked a dead horse. I'm new to this site. I tried to find the answer to this question earlier but after sifting through a boatload of posts and not finding it, I opted to just ask. Didn't mean to start a pissing match or open any old wounds. Just curious is all.
Well you did. And now you're the resident asshole instead of me... Have fun with it. The position comes with a few perks -- Though I never got to use them as I'm a jew.
1. You always get a 6lb Ham around this time of year
2. Nobody listens to you ever. Not even when you have good things to say -- This can be both good and bad because you can spew as much shit as you want, when you want, and nobody says anything. Not because they don't read it, rather they just don't care to respond.
Welcome to Simplyscripts.
P.S. The ham has already been claimed this year so maybe next year...
A GREAT story will be recognized! No matter who wrote it. I don't think format will stop that GREAT story to get made.
I disagree. How many times have you read SSers comment, "I tried reading this but I couldn't get past the formatting?" Any greatness that these scripts may have had will not be recognized, which is a shame because learning proper formatting is pretty easy.
Quoted from Murphy
Evolution - Everything evolves. Even language evolves.
Screenwriting is no different, it has been evolving for a hundred years and will always continue to do so. What was hot ten years ago may not be hot tomorrow and vice versa.
If Tarantino wanted to write a script on paper plates, using crayons, people will be anxious to read it. If we were to do this, the critics would kick our ass so much our shit would have foot prints in it.
We are not the ones to evolve scripts. We need to make names for ourselves, and get recognized as great writers first. Then we can force evolution on our scripts.
I wouldn't put a script down because the slugs are in boldface, but the back of my brain would see a red flag. And it would start looking for other red flags.
I think bold sluglines might be catching on, as I've seen and read a number of produced scripts that are that way. They also underline and italicize numerous words.
Of course there's a few key things you need to look at the script:One it's produced or being produced, etc. Second, it's written by a well known writer or one that's making their name noticed. Three: Check and see if it's the final/shooting script. More times than not I've been handed early drafts where none of that was included, but the final script had bold sluglines and italicized and underlined words.
I'd do my best to avoid it during spec, unless a producer or studio said specifically to do so in rewrites or final script. I doubt a reader will put it down, but it may very well take them out of the story and possibly hunt for other formatting errors.
You script will never be perfect. If you are looking for the script to be perfect you'll be correcting the damn thing your whole life and never send it to anyone. I once read an article called 23 deadly sins for a screenplay, and it was about 23 different words that amateur writers make or include in their screenplay. People got scared and thought they were never allowed to use those words. In reality all the writer of the article was saying is: Go over your script, highlight those words and see if you can say that line of action differently.
Some readers want:
John enters kitchen and walks up stairs.
others might be fine with
John enters kitchen and makes his way up the stairs.
I've found it varies with producer and reader. Read the advice and listen to it, but you'll know when your script is ready and when it is, edit it at least one more time before sending it out - you'll be surprised how much better it will be and it shouldn't take you that long.
try to print it out and edit on paper though, it's easier and you're brain should be better than spellcheck.
Actually the last script I read was the Let Me In script. I believe it's under FISH HEAD on this site, but take a look at it. I'd avoid We see and We hear for spec, but it just goes to show that you can get away with it, just don't make a habit of it.
The True Grit print script version had no slug lines at all, it was very interesting how the Coen Brothers chose to write it, if this was the actually script they use. I don't know if the shooting script was like that but it it was it was actually surprisingly easy to read. Below is an example of how it was formatted:
White letters on a black screen:
The wicked flee when none pursueth.
The quotation fades.
A woman’s voice:
Voice-Over
People do not give it credence that a young girl could leave home and go off in the wintertime to avenge her father’s blood, but it did happen.
The street of a western town, night. The street is deserted. Snow falls. We track slowly forward.
I was just fourteen years of age when a coward by the name of Tom Chaney shot my father down in Fort Smith, Arkansas, and robbed him of his life and his horse and two California gold pieces that he carried in his trouser band.
Notice there's no character after each action in the voice over.
Next scene in the script reads like so:
DAY
We are looking into the window of a moving train.
Looking out past us is a fourteen-year-old girl, Mattie Ross. Next to her is Yarnell, a middle-aged black man. Reading backward in the mirror of the window we see a station sign easing in as the train slows: FORT SMITH.
i actually like this style - it reads smoother IMO - I still got through it in just under two hours. Yes, they include shots, but remember this is the Coen brothers, they can pretty much do want they want and no one will probably say anything.
Anyway read some scripts that have been written on spec and produced, and follow that path while remembering that in the eyes of a producer or reader, etc. you are nobody and nobodies have very little pull if any.
Now if you are looking to produce this yourself and pull in other producers, etc. that's a little different and you can get away with a little more, just know that if investors are privy to scripts and such the more you follow the rules, they more apt they are to feel like you know what your doing and write you that nice fat check, well okay probably not that fat of a check, but at least it's something!!
I use bold sluglines when writing the script just to give myself a visual reference to where my scenes are. I don't think I would keep them bold if I sent them to a producer or agent though. It depends. I have been seeing it more and more often recently and I do hope it sticks.
I like reading bold slugline scripts. Easier to distinguish scenes in my opinion.
'Artist' is not a term you should use to refer to yourself. Let others, and your work, do it for you.
I've been looking at about 7 pro or recently optioned scripts a week for a while. These are all scripts sold within the last couple years. I regularly see things like bold slugs, underlining of key action lines, or underlined slugs instead of bold. Anyone who stops reading a script because of that shouldn't be reading scripts. You can tell a script that has been capably written pretty quick.
I have not used bold slugs, but I do like reading scripts written with them. It helps being able to spot the slug at a glance. Hell, I wish we could number them!
I have started using some underlining, but I use it sparingly. I use it when I'm afraid a faster reader might skip something important that will cause confusion later if he misses. If someone stops reading because of that, what can I say.
Like Pia, I have been here long enough to see the same topics come up time and time again.
What's noticeable for me is that they are almost always about format. Hardly anyone talks about ways of creating interesting characters, or ways of developing exciting premises, ways of creating tension etc... fundamental blocks of story-telling.
You have a similar thing amongst some filmmakers..."pixel peepers" who study microscopic flaws in footage and that kind of thing and talk for hours about the respective merits of cameras.
In the meantime the people who make it just get on with it and make the best film/story they can.
Like Pia, I have been here long enough to see the same topics come up time and time again.
What's noticeable for me is that they are almost always about format.
I think that is because there are so many beginners here -- and as new people join the boards, the basics are revisited again and again.
I think most of the old-timers have grown accustomed to it -- but yeah, you cannot help but groan "again??" when somebody pipes up about the dreaded unfilmables...
You have a similar thing amongst some filmmakers..."pixel peepers" who study microscopic flaws in footage and that kind of thing and talk for hours about the respective merits of cameras.
Oh, man -- I can only imagine what a tedious group of trolls that must be.
Yet another reason to write instead of direct. Have at it, Rick.
It detracts from the read and it might be just me, but it takes me "out" of the story. Maybe others feel different, but I agree with most others I think. Too much underlining or other strong marks should be used sparingly.
It's beginners that bring up the argument because they have not been here for previous rounds of it. And I understand how old timers get tired of it. But it's veterans that are the ones that point out things like bold slugs, or Fade Ins on the wrong side of the script. The Fade In thing comes up multiple times every OWC, and it's always a regular who brings it up. There are regulars here that actually have a hard time reading a story if the Fade is on the right. I spent two days trying to coax my software into putting it on the left just so I wouldn't have to hear it.
The new people generally want to resolve what's acceptable and move on.
Rick, I think we talk about those things. We've had some great battles about theme and structure. You've given me advice on building tension, at my request.
People just want to know what they can get away with on format so they can focus on story elements.
Sandra: yeah, it's like an exclamation point. You don't want to overuse. Break out only when necessary!
I have got to the stage where I simply just read. If the story is good, I sometimes forget if it is a novel or script I'm reading. Format variations, to some degree, I don't even notice anymore. I only get hung up on things if the story drags.
Write a GREAT story! If you do, it will get noticed.
I honestly think bold slugs are pretty harmless. They're never distracting because slugs are inherently technical and have nothing to do with flow and immersive reading. Maybe the bold makes them 2% easier to read. 3% at the most. I would, however, not apply bold to action or dialogue, nor italics or underlining.
A trivial concern, nevertheless. Don't care either way. Do what you want.
Whenever I see this discussion I'm reminded of a bit by comedienne Margaret Smith, whose image is best described as plain Jane, low-key, monotone, etc. Think of a female Stephen Wright...
So she says that her manager told her to wear bright red lipstick during her act to improve her image. And she says to the manager "yeah, but what if I'm not funny and it's coming out of these big old bright red lips? It's like being a crummy baseball catcher with a paisley mitt."
The studio development script I got the other day was loaded with them. The screenwriter's pages are dense. So, in this particular case... It actually helped me get through the pages.
E.D.
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