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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Screenwriting Discussion    Screenwriting Class  ›  Passive sentences & ing endings Moderators: George Willson
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Forgive
Posted: April 25th, 2012, 4:49pm Report to Moderator
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I still see a lot of people going 'it's an ing ending, so its passive'.

My understanding is that a passive sentence is where the subject of the sentence has an action done to them, and an active sentence is where the subject is doing the action:

Jeff shouts at everyone -- is active as Jeff is doing the action.

Everyone is shouted at by Jeff -- is passive, as 'Everyone' (the subject) is having an action done to them.

ing ending, however, are nothing to do with passive writing. They:

1. Are frowned upon by writers who get annoyed when people start sentences with them.

2. Make sentences longer without good reason. Jeff shouts / Jeff is shouting.

3. Can be present or past tense but are heavily associated with past tense, so avoided.

That's my understanding - but if anyone can add clarification or insight to this, that would be great.
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Baltis.
Posted: April 25th, 2012, 5:04pm Report to Moderator
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It's a catch 22, to be honest.  

It is passive, but more over there are better ways to say things.

Walking - Walks
Sitting - sits
Standing - stands
Looking - looks

All of them can be covered more visually...

"A man sitting at his desk looking over paper work."

Reads better like:

"A man studies paper work at his desk".

Ing words, I tend to stay away from.  Ly adverbs too.  But you,can technically write what's best for you.  Is it right or wrong?  Dunno... I've spent way too much money trying to figure it all out.

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Baltis.  -  April 25th, 2012, 6:09pm
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Felipe
Posted: April 25th, 2012, 5:18pm Report to Moderator
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I think there are instances where it makes a sentence read better. Such as:

Perusing through a newspaper, Jeff spits out his coffee when he reads the day's headline.

reads better than:

Jeff peruses through a newspaper. He spits out his coffe when he sees the day's headline.

Granted you can tweak both of those to make them better, I think the first one is a good way of combining two sentences into one by using an "ing" word.


'Artist' is not a term you should use to refer to yourself. Let others, and your work, do it for you.
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ghost and_ghostie gal
Posted: April 25th, 2012, 5:30pm Report to Moderator
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Present progressive tense, is not a capital offense.  In the end, story is king.  I'll be watching this one from afar.

Ghostie



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James McClung
Posted: April 25th, 2012, 5:50pm Report to Moderator
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I think it's best to avoid "ing" verbs and "ly" adverbs whenever possible. Indeed, an active voice is almost always preferable and the amount of work required to change a passive sentence to an active one tends to be near nonexistent. So it seems a no-brainer to me to work this way.

Of course, it's not always practical. I used to write feature length scripts with absolutely no "ing" verbs (I'm not generalizing; not a single one). Doing that, you will run into a handful of sentences that flat out just don't read well without some use of passive voice. So you can apply these, shall we say, faux pas whenever plausible. I just think one ought to get into the habit of avoiding them. The benefit is considerable.


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Forgive
Posted: April 25th, 2012, 7:51pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Felipe

Perusing through a newspaper, Jeff spits out his coffee when he reads the day's headline.

reads better than:

Jeff peruses through a newspaper. He spits out his coffee when he sees the day's headline.


You're not convincing me here ... why does the second one read better? You've chucked in a gerund and made it passive ... ?

BTW ... interesting study found that (in layman's term) 'thick' people found it harder to understand passive sentences than active sentences -- so with James' post ringing out - active is always better - it reads better - especially in a script.
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Felipe
Posted: April 25th, 2012, 11:18pm Report to Moderator
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I'm not a grammar person, but I don't believe the sentence I wrote is passive.

Ending a verb with "ing" doesn't automatically make something passive.

The real problem is passive sentences, not "ing" verbs.


'Artist' is not a term you should use to refer to yourself. Let others, and your work, do it for you.
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rc1107
Posted: April 26th, 2012, 7:56am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Felipe
Perusing through a newspaper, Jeff spits out his coffee when he reads the day's headline.


Hmm.  Interesting.  I've never seen anybody read the paper first, and then go back and read the main headline.



(EDIT:  I promise this'll be my only smartass comment of the day.  :-)


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leitskev
Posted: April 26th, 2012, 8:20am Report to Moderator
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"Hmm.  Interesting.  I've never seen anybody read the paper first, and then go back and read the main headline."

I pull out the sports page first. Does that count? Though I do read the sports headlines.
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Electric Dreamer
Posted: April 26th, 2012, 10:55am Report to Moderator
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Present progressive tense, is not a capital offense.  In the end, story is king.  I'll be watching this one from afar.

Ghostie



I tend to shy away from present progressive...
But I do like me some present perfect progressive sometimes...

Joe and Jane have been walking for hours. They drink from a creek.

To me that's a good visual and an indicator to the production how to stage the scene.

Ok, now I'll go stand by Ghostie.

Regards,
E.D.


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Felipe
Posted: April 26th, 2012, 5:59pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from rc1107


Hmm.  Interesting.  I've never seen anybody read the paper first, and then go back and read the main headline.



(EDIT:  I promise this'll be my only smartass comment of the day.  :-)


That's alright. I thought the same thing after I wrote it, but it didn't really matter for the sake of the  argument.

I just don't think it's bad when it is used that way. I don't know what it's called, but I don't believe it's passive.

"Albert is sprinting when he slips on a banana peel and flies off the cliff" sounds passive.

"Sprinting, Albert slips on a banana peel and flies off the cliff" sounds like something else.

Sorry about my previous awful example.


'Artist' is not a term you should use to refer to yourself. Let others, and your work, do it for you.
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Forgive
Posted: April 26th, 2012, 9:01pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Felipe
"Albert is sprinting when he slips on a banana peel and flies off the cliff" sounds passive.


"Albert sprints, slips on a banana skin, and flies off the cliff" is not passive.


Quoted from Felipe
"Sprinting, Albert slips on a banana peel and flies off the cliff" sounds like something else.


The thing is, that the 'sprinting' does not matter until you know who is doing it - i.e. the subject of the sentence (Albert) - so if it's superfluous until the appearance of the subject - it may as well be avoided until we have the subject - and then we can introduce the action the subject is carrying out ... ?


Quoted from Felipe
Sorry about my previous awful example.


It's okay.  

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Dreamscale
Posted: April 27th, 2012, 9:49am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Forgive
Albert sprints, slips on a banana skin, and flies off the cliff" is not passive.


Correct.  This is the way to write this line.

Using a word or verb that ends in "ing" is not the issue, but often is.  It is passive writing we're talking about and passive writing dose not belong in screenwriting.  Period.

Passive writing refers to the main verb in the sentence.  You want your main verb to be active.

Do Pros write passively?  Yep.  Do amateurs write passively?  Yep.  Should you write passively?  Nope, not if you can help it.

I agree that there are times when it will actually sound better, read better, and look better.  Much like there are times when an orphan is happy to be hanging out all alone by his lonesome.  No big deal.  Just don't do it remotely often, and don't jump out of the gate this way, as it's a red flag of what's to follow.
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Felipe
Posted: April 27th, 2012, 3:21pm Report to Moderator
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I will also add that I didn't mean for that to be read as the first sentence in a scene. I meant for the situation to be one where you already know Albert is the subject. In either case it can still be written the way you wrote it, though sometimes that can sound too much like just listing things and less like writing.

I just don't like to say never. I have seen situation where "ing" works just fine. I haven't found a situation where passive writing is necessary, though it might exist.


'Artist' is not a term you should use to refer to yourself. Let others, and your work, do it for you.
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