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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Unproduced Screenplay Discussion    Short Scripts  ›  Soulshadows II: Tanis Moderators: bert
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  Author    Soulshadows II: Tanis  (currently 7703 views)
bert
Posted: May 2nd, 2010, 11:03am Report to Moderator
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And the rest:


Quoted from grademan
The only thing that hurt my eyes was the underlining.


Noted, thanks.


Quoted from grademan
I thought we would see a story of Tanis as she appears in the SoulShadow series but you took us to her early years.


It occurs to me now, Gary, that you might have never read the "pilot" episode.

Tanis has always been a young teen, right from the start -- 13 at the beginning, but I eventually bumped her up a few years to 15 in my head.  I wonder how much effect that might have on your perception of that character.  Hm.


Quoted from Brian
I'm guessing Tanis appears at the beginning and end of every script in the series...


Yeah, that is how it works.


Quoted from Brian
It took me a couple of pages to get used to the writing style


Noted, thanks.


Quoted from Brian
...so the creepy magic lady was in my mind for every line of Tanis' dialogue.


I know exactly who you mean, and she did inspire Tanis to some degree.


Quoted from Grandma Bear
I found these occasional bolded things distracting. Some people do all their slugs that way. You only do them occasionally...


What I did was bold each new scene, but not within the scene itself.  Bolding means we are now going someplace else.  I read a script with this and found it helpful, but maybe I am not doing it right.


Quoted from Grandma Bear
Why underline this?  It got annoying as well after a while.


I think I did six or so, for pivotal "shock" scenes.  I think we saw a similar technique in the script for "Countdown"?

But yeah -- I can take or leave that technique.  If it bugs Pia -- perhaps my most sympathetic audience to be found anywhere -- then it probably bugs everyone haha.


Quoted from a line Pia does not like
"And Juma the hunter -- his finely honed instincts warn him of danger -- trapped between these two jungle cats"


You do not think a guy would know how to play this line, with a girl on either side of him?  Haha.  I sure do.  Maybe it is a gender thing -- and like you say, a personal preference, too.

Thanks, you guys.  I appreciate all of your thoughts -- it is very gratifying to read that something does not suck after several years of not posting much work on these boards at all.


Hey, it's my tiny, little IMDb!
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jwent6688
Posted: May 2nd, 2010, 11:08am Report to Moderator
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Bert,

So here we have it. The long awaited Tanis episode. For the most, I thoroughly enjoyed this piece. You're descriptions are short and concise, yet extremely vivid. You paint a picture in few words.

I also admire the way you transition from one scene to the next. The scenes glide into one another. AS a film should.

Very creative piece also. Some gut-wrenching moments as expected.

I know it's been brought up, but would've liked to know more about where her accent came from. Haitian voodo goddess, Creole... I hate to admit this, I'm sure to your dismay, But everytime I read Tanis i pictured Tia (Black witch from Pirates of the Carribean). I couldn't discern the two apart.

If I had any qualms of it, it would be the love between Juma and her. Never felt it, so it was difficult to understand her rage.

The twists of him being murdered by accident was nice, as was her being swallowed by the book... assuming for eternity, whereas every now and again we can open it, and she can tell us another story of death.

Good work, you are definitely one of the most talented writers on this board.

Now, let's wait for Jeff's four page review...

James

P.S.   love the new sig.



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Grandma Bear
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I didn't say I didn't like it. I thought it belonged in a book. Not a screenplay.

Btw, I just sat down by the pool ready to read the SC script. The first thing I notice is the script is full of. -- !!!!  


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Mr.Z
Posted: May 2nd, 2010, 1:23pm Report to Moderator
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So… you don’t write anything in, like, forever, and you still write this good? I hate you.

This was a superb supernatural tragedy. Things that I liked:

-- Strong main character. Active. Interesting. Flawed. I really felt sorry for her.
-- Style. The setting. The black magic. Almost every single shot oozes coolness.
-- The writing. Vivid descriptions to carry the strong visuals. Expert attention to detail. You had to bend a few rules, but I think you did it for the right reason: This ain’t no “script” folks. This is a movie experience.

IMHO, there’s room for improvement in the conflict’s resolution.

The ending was good and I think it would be suitable for a good script. But this isn’t a good script. This is a great script. So, a “just good” ending doesn’t fit very well among the rest of the greatness. The ending has to be great too.

If I understood this correctly, what happens to Tanis is the equivalent of wanting the magic lamp in order to make the wishes but become the genie trapped inside instead. This is a great finish line to write towards too.

It does feel surprising but (maybe it’s just me) it doesn’t seem inevitable. Great endings elicit two strong reactions in the audience: 1) “Wow” 2) “I should have seen that coming”.

You got number 1 nailed down, but number 2… not so much. Easier said than done but… Is there a way to foreshadow this resolution without giving it away? Like introducing a previous keeper of the book that mysteriously disappeared? Someone who’s freed once Tanis takes his/her place?

One last note on the writing style. Like I said, I think it was top notch. I picked early on the pattern behind the use of bold sluglines. Personally, I like to use quick establishing shots to hint that I’m taking the action to somewhere else, but your choice here didn’t bother me at all.

All in all, a pleasure to read. Honestly. Thanks for sharing. What’s next on the pipeline? Starbuck Star? Lesbian Western?  


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bert
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 7:59am Report to Moderator
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Thank you for having a look, James (the other James...).

As mentioned elsewhere, the "Pirates" witch was, admittedly, something of an influence.  And while I sometimes do a little research, Tanis' accent is just made up, and is not meant to be authentic to any particular region.


Quoted from the other James
If I had any qualms of it, it would be the love between Juma and her. Never felt it...


Well, that is supposed to be because it isn't really there, so I guess I succeeded in a back-hand sort of way.

I tried to make Juma cold and distant -- with Tanis devoted but blind to his lack of real affection -- which was supposed to make Tanis a bit more sympathetic and, ultimately, tragic.

Perhaps a few more pages to explore that relationship might have helped.


Quoted from the other James
Now, let's wait for Jeff's four page review...


Haha...I am not really expecting that much, but yeah -- some of the things I did with this were designed expressly to torment Jeff and his ilk.  But it's all in good fun.


And Z --


Quoted from Z
I hate you.


Well, I think my brief tenure at MP established that the feeling is mutual.


Quoted from Z
This ain't no "script" folks. This is a movie experience.


Now that is really nice.  Thanks.  I usually do not box up the "good" stuff in quotes, but I do particularly like that one.


Quoted from Z
Is there a way to foreshadow this resolution without giving it away? Like introducing a previous keeper of the book that mysteriously disappeared?


That's not bad.  I will have to think on that -- and perhaps this can be accomplished through handling Bimkubwa's demise in a slightly different fashion. Yes, that is something to ponder.


Quoted from Z
I picked early on the pattern behind the use of bold sluglines.


You know, I forget the script where I saw this -- but I really do like it.  It is not mandatory, but I do think it helps in its own way.  I am not really sure yet if I will keep that or not.


Quoted from Z
What's next on the pipeline? Starbuck Starr? Lesbian Western?


This may be his year.....and he might just encounter a few lesbians yet.  We'll see.

Thank you, Z, as always, for some great thoughts.


Hey, it's my tiny, little IMDb!
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Scar Tissue Films
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 10:44am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from bert
I see what you are saying here.  But have you ever had a scene -- and I am sure you must have -- something you have been carrying around for years, just waiting for a chance to use it somewhere?

The sheet magic is one of those.  I have been carrying it around for a very long time, and was thrilled to at last get it out on the page.

Thanks for your thoughts, Rick -- not nearly so rambling as you might have thought -- and certainly appreciated.



If you like haunted sheets you should check out the M R James story  Oh, Whistle and I’ll Come to you, My Lad...really creepy.

http://www.horrormasters.com/Text/a0163.pdf

Well worth a read if you like a bit of Gothic horror.
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Dreamscale
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 1:15pm Report to Moderator
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Hey Bert, I was away all weekend, so didn’t know this was here.  Got home last night and saw the thread and looked very forward to reading this morning.  I honestly hate to say that I didn’t like it…at all.  Also, disliked the actual writing style you implemented here.  I read all the comments just now and see that my feelings are (once again) on an island, all by myself.  What can I say?  I guess you shouldn’t take much stock in my thoughts and opinions, as everyone else literally seems to be in love with this piece.

I took page by page notes as I read.  They will provide details as to what I had problems with technically, so I won’t even bring anything up here.  I will give you my thoughts on the story, though, and why it didn’t do anything for me.

As I’ve said numerous times, I’ve really been looking forward to this.  Maybe that’s part of the problem…I had it up on a pedestal before I even saw it…I had such high hopes…I assumed it would be great.  I was very let down, actually, and other than a few great visuals, IMO, the story was heavily clichéd, and actually quite dull.  It came across as very slow and uneventful, and I feel like you could easily have gotten the same story across in 10 less pages.

I’m assuming this is a Flashback…as in it occurred before Tannis took root in her alcove.  But, if she’s 15 in this script, that doesn’t make sense to me, as I thought she was 13 or so in the first episode.  Am I missing something here?

The premise/plot is one that I’ve seen countless times, actually. Guess you could call it a “classic” plotline if you’re being generous, but I’ve got to call it cliché…sorry.  Even the “sheet death” has been done many times in movies, and a classic example is the original Nightmare on Elm Street (although the actual cause of death is different, obviously).

The setting didn’t work for me at all, for some reason.  It didn’t feel real.  It felt generic, and because of that, I couldn’t really get much of a visual.  I actually was seeing Pandora for some crazy reason!

One thing I definitely did appreciate was your use of transitions into new scenes.  BUT, although I thought most of them worked quite well, I really don’t think they should be so prevalent in a spec script…especially a short like this.  They are very creative and well thought out though.

So, Bert, I want you to know that I really wanted to like this…actually, I wanted to love it, and I was quite sure I would.  Writing this negative review is difficult for me today.  Maybe because everyone else is in love with this, it’s even more difficult, as I know people will think I’m a complete A-Hole, and have no clue what I’m talking about.  I think you know me well enough that you know I’m going to stick up for what I believe and I don’t care if my feelings are in line with the masses.

Take what you can from this and consider the source for all the rest.  Sorry to be negative, Bert.  I really am.

Page by page notes

Page 1 – Hmmm, no opening Slug whatsoever…odd…very odd.

“Having finally reached Tanis, she now raises her eyes to meet ours. – Very awkwardly phrased.

“This could be the alcove. This could be anywhere. It doesn’t really matter.” – I find these lines odd…especially how you decided to skip a space before the last one.  Maybe within Soul Shadows, this is OK, but outside it?  I don’t think so.

Page 2 – I have this sneaky suspicion I’m going to have some issues with the style of writing…Oh Boy!

“SCREAMS. Horrible screams. The stuff of nightmares. And they continue as we...” – Can’t say I like the choice of words here…sounds almost cheesy, sorry to say.  Also, I really dislike the use of “DISSOLVE TO:” following this.  I don’t see how this helps the read (or a possible shoot) at all.  Complete waste of 2 lines, IMO.

I’m glad we’ve got our first Slug finally, but why is it BOLDED?

“The sweaty bodies of NATIVES stuff the small interior of this hut nearly to bursting.” – Really awkwardly phrased, IMO.  I actually had to read this line 3 times to make sure I wasn’t missing something.

“And you wonder if he will ever stop screami...” – Oh Bert…no Bert…no…

Page 3 – You’re probably not at all surprised, but I HATE the constant use of “- -“, as well as unnecessary exclamation points in action lines.

“She intends to decapitate the beast!” – Uhhhh…what?  Huh?  You’re also probably not surprised to hear that I loathe asides, and I’ve got to hand it to you here, Bert…this has got to be ONE OF THE WORST ASIDES I’ve ever seen.

Page 4 – “begins to” – Argh…another pet peeve o’mine.

Tanis is 15?  I thought she was 14 or 15 now…I assumed this script took place years ago.  Maybe I’m wrong…hmmm…I’m confused.

“…and the snake begins to flail.” – Bert, I’m sorry, but this stuff just irks me.  You’ve got a useless “and” in here as well as another “begins to”.  Not my sort of writing style for sure.

“Its struggle is epic.  It ROARS!” – Again, I see this as coming off very cheesy…as in you are trying to make it something it’s not.  Although these 2 lines are short and sweet, it comes off (to me) as being overwritten, because you’re trying to make it more than it actually is, based on the choice of descriptive words and overuse of exclamation points.

“…determined to finish what Sabra Started.” – Another aside…another completely useless aside.

Page 5 – “Even the flies are stilled.” – Although I definitely like this line, I’m a bit confused what it actually is supposed to mean.  All of a sudden, the flies stop flying around?  They hover in place?  What?  I have a feeling it’s another nice literary line that won’t transition to screen very well if at all.

“limp”, “headless”, “dusty” , “heavy” – 4 adjectives in this 1 sentence – too many, IMO!

Page 6 – “She had noticed this, too.” – Another aside!  ARGH!!!!

“10” – why is this not spelled out?

“lays” – should be “lies”

Page 7 – “Tanis scowls like a petulant child, caught with her hand in the cookie jar.” – ARGH!!!!!

Page 8 – “…it is a tale she is loathe to tell.” – Damn, Bert, what’s up with the “ATTACK OF THE ASIDES”?  I’m sorry but these things just really piss me off and completely take me out of the read.

Page 10 – These Flashback Slugs are totally bizarre, and not in a good way, I’m sorry to say.  How is a scene heading “YOUNG SABRA…”?  Makes zero sense to me and looks awful.

Page 11 – Wouldn’t “blessing” be “blessin’” out of Tannis’ mouth?

General statement – I’ve noticed that you are sometimes bolding your Slugs, and others, not. Looks very odd to me.  Distracting, actually.

Page 13 – Afya’s dialogue does not sound real at all.  Seems like she stepped out of a regular old city into this jungle setting.   Also, I thought they were African…or actually in Africa?  Where is the comment coming from about “hungry tigers”?

“And Juma the hunter -- his finely honed instincts warn him of danger -- trapped between these two jungle cats.” – IMO, this is VERY awkward.  I also don’t like the choice of words again.  Just way over the top.  And finally, you’ve got an extra space between “of” and “danger”.

Page 16 – What’s with the crazy writing on this page?  The use of mini Slugs is a complete waste, IMO.  Just making it read strangely and taking up a bunch of extra spaces.

Page 17 – “But what is this?” – Good question, WTF is this?

“of hair” – not necessary, as we already “know” what the clump is.

Page 18 – “…fighting back tears that Sabra cannot understand.” – Another useless aside, IMO.

Page 20 – “Afya steps into view through her lit window -- but seen from a distance, as if someone were spying on her unawares.” – Again, IMO, this is extremely awkwardly phrased, to the point of being hard to read.

Page 21 – “moments”?  I’d say “seconds” would be much better here.

Page 23 – Now we’re underlining also?  Bert!  What’s going on?

“…like a python swallowing a wild boar.” – Oh boy, this is going WAY TOO FAR now, Bert.  C’mon.

“She needs to scream. She needs to breathe!  But she can do neither.
The sheet magic is a horrible death…” – I really dislike the writing here, especially the final line.  Totally ruins the visuals you had going here.

Page 24 – “…once killer blanket” – sounds like a comedy now.  BTW, you’ve gone back and forth with this thing being a sheet, a blanket, a bedsheet…what is it?  IMO, these words are not synonymous.

Page 27 – “She cannot help Tannis now.” – A complete waste of space.
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Mr.Z
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 2:11pm Report to Moderator
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So, you liked it or not? Don't be shy, man. Bert ain't gonna eat you.  


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Dreamscale
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 2:19pm Report to Moderator
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Didn't like it, sorry to say.

Usually not very shy.

If Bert was going to eat me, he better be REALLY hungry....there's alot of me to eat!
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bert
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 3:18pm Report to Moderator
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No...I won't be eating anyone today haha.

I could almost see the veins on your forehead throbbing, Jeff.  We certainly do have some divergent opinions.

There are a few things that require a thoughtful response -- but they gotta' be worded just right -- lest they come off as defensive.  Which they won't be.

I do not have the time to compose something like that right now -- but I did want to acknowledge the look, and give you a quick thanks for your notes -- lest you think I was ignoring them.  Which I'm not.


Hey, it's my tiny, little IMDb!
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Dreamscale
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 3:22pm Report to Moderator
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HaHa, Bert!  Yes, you are right...the veins in my forehead are throbbing...actually quite a bit more now, because I'm reading "Cabin in the Woods".

Not only am I on a roll today, my head is rolling, my eyes are rolling, and I feel like I'm spinning into a Black Hole!

Don't worry about being or sounding defensive...nothing wrong with that at all, IMO.
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stevie
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 6:09pm Report to Moderator
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Hi bert, have just read 'Tanis'. I'd read Jeff's review before that so was intrigued to see how it panned out. Just saw his review on the Whedon script - you have to love him!

No, i thought this was pretty good. you evoke the vision of the black, spiritey world of voodoo and tribal customs. It reminded me a lot of some of the older Wilbur Smith books - A Falcon Flies, Men of Men, etc. They had this witch character who was pretty full on. She was always nude too, which is good value!!

Actually some parts of the script are almost soft porn, with Juma emerging from the river nude, under the gaze of the two chicks. This would come over good as a short film (or maybe with Moviestorm?)

I didn't really have a prob with any of the formatting or other stuff that Jeff brought up.
The only thing I could say was that it was a tad long - you could possibly cut 5 pages off, maybe a couple more.
Anyway, it was well written as part of the Soulshadows concept.

Cheers stevie



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bert
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 7:28pm Report to Moderator
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Alright, Jeff.

I am sure your comments were difficult to compose.  The response, similarly difficult.

While it would be disingenuous of me to pretend that I liked them, I do respect the fearlessness of your commentary.  We all get slammed from time to time -- it is just part of playing on these boards -- and only a fool never expects it.

And I suppose every board needs a few gadflies who will fearlessly stand in their own corner -- espousing their brash opinions that often defy the majority -- while brazenly waving their broomsticks at those who would be so bold as to disagree.

You do not like the story.  I cannot change that, nor can I disagree with it, so we set that issue to the side.

But I will say this -- I think that sometimes you take a narrow view, Jeff, and adhere quite stringently to conventions that, in some cases, have long ago expired.  As someone offering a bit of feedback to you now, I would submit that your (sometimes) stalwart refusal to accept the fluidity of the screenwriting medium shackles you to a certain extent.  I suspect you might even agree with this a tiny, little bit in your darkest heart of hearts.

I write scripts as I like to read them.  And there is some freedom there.  When I find formatting that takes certain risks -- not stupid mistakes, but knowing tweaks at convention -- it makes me like the author better.

I know that this is purely a personal preference, but I also think there are many that feel the same.  Particularly amongst those that read a great many scripts.

I will readily admit, however, that I went overboard here.  On purpose, but yes, too far.  And I accept nearly everything you put forth at face value.

By the strictest, most rigid of interpretations, you are absolutely correct.

So I will take issue with very few.  By addressing only a couple of things -- the ones I feel most strongly about -- perhaps you might reconsider those few:  


Quoted from JC Cleveland
These Flashback Slugs are totally bizarre, and not in a good way...


I disagree.  They are of my own design, and I contend they clearly set the scene and establish a flashback in the most succinct manner possible.


Quoted from JC Cleveland
What's with the crazy writing on this page?  The use of mini Slugs is a complete waste, IMO.  Just making it read strangely and taking up a bunch of extra spaces.


I assume you mean the quick series of shots -- the bird, to Tanis, to the sky.  Again, I disagree.  Three separate shots in six lines is wasted space?  This was Rick's favorite part, Jeff, and I trust his judgment.  You should, too.  That scene is pretty tight.


Quoted from JC Cleveland
"...fighting back tears that Sabra cannot understand."  Another useless aside, IMO.


It is stage directions, Jeff.  Would this have been better written as, "Tanis fights back tears.  Sabra looks confused."  I think not.  Stage directions need not be so robotic.  You pick on me for this a few times, but this is the one I chose to defend, as I think it is the most clearly defensible.

So there is my rebuttal.  More than I intended, but whatever.  In a small number of instances, I think you are wrong.

We clearly have different tastes, and that is not a problem.  I know you spend a great deal of time thinking and composing before you post a review, so I do not take that lightly, and am pleased you dropped one here.  A good deal of your comments I do consider useful.  So you do get a grudging thanks haha.

But the next thing you post?  Let's just say it had better be f*cking flawless, OK?  


Hey, it's my tiny, little IMDb!

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bert  -  May 3rd, 2010, 7:47pm
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bert
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 8:28pm Report to Moderator
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Whew...so, with Jeff out of the way...


Quoted from stevie
Hi bert, have just read 'Tanis'. I'd read Jeff's review before that so was intrigued to see how it panned out.


Ack.  Good thing you started there...


Quoted from stevie
Actually some parts of the script are almost soft porn...


Ha...I don't know if I would go that far, but it did strike me in the latter phases of scripting this how often people were getting naked.  I did not really set out to do that, but it is the jungle and all, I suppose.

An example of characters kind of leading you where you did not really intend to go, you know?  Kind of surprised nobody has mentioned it before now.


Quoted from stevie
I didn't really have a prob with any of the formatting or other stuff that Jeff brought up.


That's OK.  I think he just about covered it.

Thank you, Stevie, for checking it out and taking the time to share some thoughts.

And Rick, I will check out the link when I can, for sure.  Thanks.


Hey, it's my tiny, little IMDb!
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jwent6688
Posted: May 3rd, 2010, 8:29pm Report to Moderator
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There's an ass whoopin' goin' on around here.... But who's???

Lemme pop some popcorn....

I'll just sit back and watch.


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