Timmy: Customer Service by Frank MacCrory (FrankM) writing as  - Short, Sci Fi - A troublemaker pushes the limits of cheerful customer service. 8 pages - pdf format

Writer interested in feedback on this work

I honestly thought that I was missing some pages when I got to the end. Am I? You start you FADE IN, but then make no indication that the story is over and it is only 3 pages long.

Some of the humour hits, I chuckled once or twice. I don't think I understand the story though, Jake just wants to create havoc for the robots?

The writing lacks flow.

Interesting. The story is creative to the point I think I actually like it.


Writing: 2
Story: 3.5

2.75

ahaha, this is a very nice beginning to a short.
You do need an ending.

It's still going to be a very tough call when choosing between the two. Nice job here. But I do think it lacks the ending.

Zips along pretty well but no real destination or rationale. Names Timmy/Tammy/Tommy slowed me up.

Just okay for me.

Would have liked a little more foreshadowing of the environment - i.e., maybe place this in the future so the auto cars and droids immediately make more sense.

A difficult them and kudos for the effort.

I'd say a SUPER at the beginning to indicate this is the future would help. Just having autonomous cars on the street isn't enough to show it's the future.  Also, as TIMMY looks human, though fake, from the outside it may be hard for the audience to know what's really going on here.

I wish the boy had a reason to mess with the robot instead of just messing around with him for fun. Once the initial joke of the boy's lies and TIMMY's interactions is set up, it gets old fast.

I do like the ending where the boy's misdeeds come back to hurt him and the ambulance is called off due to his allergy. I think this script would do better if it was shorter and got to the ending/punchline faster. As that's really all it is, a setup to the gag at the end. Which is good.

Again, considering the awkward constraints of the challenge you did a good job. However, having read your competition, they did a better one. Incident at the Super mart gets my vote.

I thought this was pretty hit or miss.  It felt more like a skit rather than a story.

But, you hit the parameters, so, that's good.

Dan

Not a huge fan of this one. Some funny moments but not much of a story or any reason to care about the people/androids. Perhaps with more time you can flesh this out into something more.

Oh, and brutal challenge parameters. So, pretty decent effort.

I like your take on the character who can't tell the truth. It's fun. I agree that it'd be nice for there to be a reason he's messing with the robot, but given the constraints...

The payoff felt a bit like an add-on. Given more time and a couple of rewrites, maybe you could get it to fit into the story a bit more organically.

Overall, I enjoyed the script.

Comedy is always tough.

I didn’t mind it but it's definitely not as good as the super mart script.

Could have used a better payoff.

I liked where this was going but it fell just a tad short. You had one more page to put a good zinger on the end to bring it home but it just seems to end abruptly. I just wanted to know if he was just messing with the bot or if he had another end in mind.

Good stuff, but not great for me.

CUSTOMER SERVICE
I enjoyed the dialogue.
This is the second sci-fi story I’ve read with robots.
This read very fast and the dialogue was snappy.
It was mostly one scene with a quirky gotcha at the end.  I was getting tired of Jake anyway at that point. So glad of the outcome. Like the irony. Good job writer.

I like some SciFi with my SciFi, and this seemed more comedy... having said that I did kinda like the comedy inherent in confusing robots in this way.

Short and funny, though not as sci-fi as I was hoping. Still, it was well done and I liked the dialogue between everyone, especially Timmy and Tammy. Good job with this one.

So it really bothers me that this just ends abruptly, however it does tick all the boxes for me - sci-fi, in a supermarket, with someone who never tells the truth. I do like the writer's take on the lying - typical teenager looking to cause trouble, a bully even, however in the future where everything is automated, this is how you bully people. Or androids. Very dystopian in a way.

And the lack of humor relative to its counterpart is not a problem for me, because the category is sci-fi, not comedy.

Good job writer, just wish you had added an ending.

When I read this the first time I didn't realise that lying was one of the criteria - I thought Jake was just stirring the robot up lol.

Yeah what is it with robots every time a genre has to be sci-fi? They are old hat now and boring. Anyway this was ok. Ended abruptly.

Another fairly decent read.

More comments about comedy vs. Sci-fi which really confuses me. It can be both and still be Sci-fi.

The ending left a bit to be desired and I probably enjoyed the other script more, but well done on entering.

Customer Service

Short notes: the general idea of a character tricking and cheating robots is solid. This version hasn't enough meat, but hell did you have a hard topic and I'll consider that for sure. Good job fighting through here.

story (0-5): 3

character (0-5): 3

presentation (0-5): 2

total: 8

Bit of an anti-climax but I liked it overall, a lot. Androids as checkout chicks, well as staff anyway.

Loved the world you set up and Jake was terrific. I was expecting you to deliver a bit more but it wasn't bad where you left it.

A teenage boy JAKE (15) ...
The punctuation here is wrong. Please add a comma before and after JAKE. Or... you could just delete the entire "teenage boy" description.

Jake's very name, coupled with the fact that you're already telling us he's 15, means that your entire descriptor could and should be deleted. It literally adds no information and only wastes text space. This advice could be applied as generally where applicable. I don't think the script is overwritten and such redundancies weren't common in the script at all, but getting rid of them in future/longer scripts would help tighten up your prose and considerably improve readability at no expense of information.

Minor nit: the irate passenger, minor though he maybe, gets no introduction. As written, it's as if he literally just "appears" to say his line and leave. I realize he was probably meant to be one of the people in the "autonomous cars," but still.

Speaking of autonomous cars, the sci-fi setting here is basically non-existent during this initial scene. Autonomous cars are literally the only thing that makes me think this takes place in a sci-fi setting, and even then it's a rather vague descriptor. I suppose cases appearing at regular intervals could count too, but IMO, it's simply not enough. I realize there's an android in the second scene, but I think your first scene should ideally make a clearer sci-fi impression on the reader, even if it's a "near future" that you're trying to portray.

Speaking of which:   He has the unrealistically perfect proportions and irritatingly friendly expression typical of an older model. I have no problems with the initial description here (could do with fewer adverbs) but what the hell is an "older model" and what is even the context for that? An older model of android? An old-school 50s pin-up? There is zero indication of what you mean here. It's an unfilmable of the worst kind in that it tries to world-build without the actual world-building.

As for the actual story... I don't quite get why Jake was being such an asshole to Timmy, but he deserved to go through that window even if Timmy's just a robot. I liked the dialogue exchange and I liked that there was a punchline, I just didn't quite understand Jake's motivation for trolling the robot... is it because he hates robots or because he's just a jerk? Not sure what to say beyond that. lol. I didn't dislike the script; it was harmless. I just have little to say on it, story-wise. It did meet the parameters perfectly, which is nice.

Hi everyone, sorry for the delay but this one was mine.

First and foremost, I appreciate the reads, the feedback, and that some of you even voted for my story.

This script's primary problem was that it was up against a hilarious rival. Apparently when Tommy was in the back he encountered an asteroid.

The story was supposed to end right there, but I utterly failed to draw the image for the reader. The intended meaning would look like:

Quoted from HOW IT SHOULD HAVE ENDED: Customer Service Jake lands on the sidewalk, bleeding badly. TAMMY Medical emergency! I will summon an ambulance. Please remain calm. TIMMY This young lady is allergic to ambulances. Jake moans in protest, but no intelligible words come out. FADE OUT.

I wasn't the only writer to forget a closing FACE OUT, but in this case it caused serious confusion. Truly sorry about that.

The story wasn't meant to be ha-ha funny, more like a really short episode of The Outer Limits. If you clenched a fist and said "YES!" when Jake got his just desserts, you understood the story

I am going to revise this and send it in as sci-fi short, taking into account that my description of the setting needs considerably more detail. This seems to be a recurring problem with my early drafts. Without the constraint of zero truth-telling, it will be a little easier to use Jake for a bit of exposition. We'll also spend a little longer with Jake after his accident.

Don't worry, he's still a lying turd and there's no chance you'll suddenly have any sympathy for him

Might take a while to get it in, I'm currently traveling. And besides I want a better title.

Looking forward to reading/voting for the rest of this tournament, and hopefully I'll make it further next time.

Quoted from FrankM This script's primary problem was that it was up against a hilarious rival.

Hey, I appreciate that.

I do find it oddly funny how we both managed to have characters named Tommy in our scripts. I look forward to reading the re-write.

Quoted from ReaperCreeper Jake's very name, coupled with the fact that you're already telling us he's 15, means that your entire descriptor could and should be deleted. It literally adds no information and only wastes text space.

Excellent, well said.

Quoted from ReaperCreeper I don't think the script is overwritten...

Huh?


This proves what I've suspected all along. Many writers don't know what overwriting actually is. Overwriting is not about how many words are on the page, or how many lines there are. It is about writing unnecessary and repetitive information. That's it. If you want to spend 30 seconds building a visual image of flowers blowing in the wind, and can find the words to do so without being repetitive and unnecessary, then you're fine.

Clearly, adding 'teenager' and then telling us the age in brackets is overwriting. So the script is overwritten.

Quoted from DustinBowcot Clearly, adding 'teenager' and then telling us the age in brackets is overwriting. So the script is overwritten.

The passage is overwritten, but this is like saying one typo makes an entire script "sloppy."

In case anyone is curious, the kernel of the story is extrapolating two trends:

1. People put too much faith in the safety of their technology. Seriously, who hasn't thrust their arm into a closing elevator? This manifests in both crossing the street and getting in the android's face.

2. Machines do bizarre things when they rely on conflicting information. On July 2, 2013, a Russian Proton-M rocket failed in a terrifying manner when half of its attitude sensors were installed upside down. In hindsight, the rocket's reaction made perfect sense: the only way to make all of the sensors report the same vertical velocity was to turn and fly sideways.

Combine these trends about twenty years from now with a troll like Jake and you get a broken window.

Quoted from FrankM The passage is overwritten, but this is like saying one typo makes an entire script "sloppy."

I have no reason to assume it's a single error. Usually, this indicates more of the same throughout. Which is beside the point. My point was only meant to illustrate what overwriting actually is.

Quoted from DustinBowcot I have no reason to assume it's a single error. Usually, this indicates more of the same throughout.

I appreciate your feedback because you can put a name (and often a path to a remedy) where I have little more than an inkling something was wrong. Your comment that time just struck me as unfairly generalizing.

At least to my eye, there is very little other overwriting in the script. That said, of the four speaking characters, one had that overwriting, one had an unfilmable in the description, and one lacked any introduction at all. So your intuition is correct that this “vomit draft” is a trainwreck of technical issues... it’s just not systematically overwritten.

I haven't got time to go through your whole script atm, so here's an example from page 1:

Code Across the street, someone stacks cases of drinks just inside the window of a supermarket. The cases appear at regular intervals. Very regular intervals.

Across the street, SOMEONE stacks cases of drinks at regular
intervals just inside the window of a supermarket.

More from the same page:

Code Jake jogs across the street toward that supermarket. Several autonomous cars slow down and swerve to avoid him.

We already know where the supermarket is. Plus 'street' is in the slug.

Jake jogs toward the supermarket. Several
autonomous cars slow down and swerve to avoid him.

Code He has the unrealistically perfect proportions and irritatingly friendly expression typical of an older model.

Unrealistically and irritatingly in one sentence is very amateur. I get that a face can be irritating but why the 'ly' modifier? 'Typical of an older model' is unfilmable.

Here's the whole block:

Code Just inside the window, an android in a store uniform labeled TIMMY stacks cases of drinks. He has the unrealistically perfect proportions and irritatingly friendly expression typical of an older model.

It needs a restructure. Maybe an angry customer punches the android in the face just for looking at him and being over-nice, or something... this would show how irritating the android can be. I'm finding it hard to imagine an android with perfect proportions as you haven't described it other than that. What are perfect proportions? 'Perfect proportions' is actually lazy and a tell. You need to show what perfect proportions are. Perhaps you could describe the android as being a man-sized Ken doll, this nails perfect and irritating all in one image, IMO. The above action block shows instances of both under and overwriting.


I could go on... but, as you said, this is a vomit draft... however it is an overwritten script.

I've done several drafts of scripts, polished them till I could see my face in them..... and still, upon a fresh read a few days later I will find an instance of overwriting. Overwriting is in regard to wasted words, not how many words are on the page. Some think this means taking out 'ands' and replacing them with commas.... because they've seen it done. However, this is a tool to help action appear faster and should only be used when the flow calls for it. Not as a general rule with the belief it helps one write better.

This is incredibly helpful feedback. I have no intention of having someone punch an android in the face, but I did recently read something on how conflict/mishap is helpful for prying exposition out of characters in an organic way.

(In my own recent experience, no one would have known I was on a business trip if there wasn't a hiccup with my flight. I then had to explain to the gate agent that, no, getting there tomorrow is not acceptable. In the end I was able to get where I was going, though the cancelled direct flight turned into three short, uncomfortable flights. Damn you, Act II, and your need for rising tension!)

My screenwriting looks amateur because I'm an amateur screenwriter trying to get better. On the other hand, I am a published author in a very different field and know the value of un-sugarcoated feedback.

My screenwriting will probably never reach maximal terseness, since I do this to take a break from writing computer code, mathematical proofs, and academese.  But I will make a concerted effort to improve on this script before sending it in as a short to get another round of harsh feedback.

I was taught to give harsh feedback using the sandwich method.

Step 1: Say the work is interesting, novel, whatever... and mention a major thing or two you like about it. If the work is long or complicated, summarize it to demonstrate that you understood what you read.

Step 2: Tell them in no uncertain terms that this and that need to be fixed, with general directions on how if you're able (often determining the best fix requires access to stuff that only the author has).

Step 3: Wrap up on a positive note, about how much you look forward to the improved version once these understandable flaws have been fixed.

This is just advice on the order in which to say things. If you're insincere about what you say in any of those steps most people will see right through your bull and can easily get too defensive to accept the advice... possibly turning the whole exercise into a waste of your time.

Hey Frank,

You will be fine. What Dustin's trying to get at, if I may summarize for him, is that it takes practice, and is an art form, to be descriptive while at the same time scrutinizing every word. THAT is screenwriting.

I liked your competitor's script, however I voted for you because you actually handled the key element of lying more effectively IMHO.

Much luck moving forward.

AJR

The best lessons I've had came from the harshest deliveries. The earliest being my father when, at 7-years-old, I showed him my first piece of writing and he called it a pile of shit. He wasn't wrong. Write what you know, he said, and he was angry. Angry that his 7-year-old son had dared show him such drivel.

I learned from that that a writer is the sum of their experience and education. Experience is the most important. Which is where the 'write what you know' stuff comes in. I also grew a thicker skin.

The advice I've given you usually means I get paid afterward. I gave it, not to show off, but to help you become a better screenwriter. I wouldn't have bothered if I didn't think you were talented. I also owe this site, so my words hopefully help others that are reading.

Quoted from DustinBowcot The best lessons I've had came from the harshest deliveries. The earliest being my father when, at 7-years-old, I showed him my first piece of writing and he called it a pile of shit. He wasn't wrong. Write what you know, he said, and he was angry. Angry that his 7-year-old son had dared show him such drivel.

It all makes sense now!!!!

Quoted from DustinBowcot The best lessons I've had came from the harshest deliveries. The earliest being my father when, at 7-years-old, I showed him my first piece of writing and he called it a pile of shit. He wasn't wrong. Write what you know, he said, and he was angry. Angry that his 7-year-old son had dared show him such drivel.

I never had my Dad or anyone else get pissed at me for my writing, and I distinctly remember there being plenty of paper around for me to use when I was five. Probably earlier, but definitely by five.

I was literally thrown into the deep end of a pool to prove to me that swimming worked just as well on that side as the shallow side, so it's not like the adults in my life were afraid to show their displeasure. Creative works just didn't rise to the level of importance to elicit that kind of response.

Quoted from DustinBowcot The advice I've given you usually means I get paid afterward. I gave it, not to show off, but to help you become a better screenwriter. I wouldn't have bothered if I didn't think you were talented. I also owe this site, so my words hopefully help others that are reading.

I do think it's valuable, and had I paid for coverage would have been quite satisfied to receive what I did. Just would never dream of paying for coverage on a three-page vomit draft Hopefully this is helpful to others reading this as well.

Quoted from TheUsualSuspect It all makes sense now!!!!

"Were you toilet trained at gunpoint?" -- Bill Rago (Renaissance Man)