Forepaughs by Seth Hamilton - Short - Forepaughs, a comical, yet touching, look at a place each of us inhabit -- an upside-down, backward world of hate (clamation, children's story).   31 pages - pdf, format 8)

This story certainly has its charms.  It reminds me of “The Sneetches” by Dr. Seuss.  If you intend any rewrites of this, I would encourage you to check that story out -- either again, or for the first time -- to see what wisdom you might glean from Geisel’s vision and apply it to your own.

Right off the bat, while I am no expert on claymation, I suspect your townsfolk need more description than “odd looking” and “bizarrely dressed”.  You need to help us see this.  How are they odd?  Big noses?  Big shoes?  What makes them odd and bizarre?  And “rolls” of houses?  Did you mean rows?  With clay, I can't be sure.  And why give us Sid’s age when he is made of clay haha.

I did not find the plethora of camera angles you suggested I might, and in fact, I think the cartoon-like method by which you have chosen to tell this story would demand (or at least excuse) a few of these transgressions.

I actually enjoyed Sadie’s little asides that were just to us, and a lot of the dialogue was very clever.  Very quick jabs back and forth between the characters that displayed a lot of wit.  You make your points without ramming them down our throats.  The “shoulds” and “shouldn’ts” were particularly nice.  Good job there.

I did find the character of Jason to be a little elusive.  Unless I missed something, I never really understood why he was supposed to be so great.  Perhaps you should have a little backstory for him.

But the single, biggest problem I had with this story may strike you at first as being quite petty.  It is quite petty, actually, but it is also a significant problem made all the more significant by its importance in this story.  And that is that virtually every single character name begins with the letter “S”.

That simple detail makes this story very, very difficult to follow.  Darn near impossible, actually.  I'm serious.  I would constantly have to backtrack to determine who was speaking -- who they were -- and it made this story really drag when it should have been zipping along.

Now, you have chosen to make this story claymation, so the possibilities for your characters should be endless!  Why differentiate them based upon something as simple as their name when you can mold them into any form imaginable?  Seuss made his Sneetches different based upon whether or not they had stars upon their bellies, and I would encourage you to adopt a similar approach.  Let their prejudice lie in something visual, not in their names, which really only makes sense on the page.  Can you see how that is a weakness?

I did enjoy your little morality tale, particularly the dialogue, and particularly the dialogue from Sadie.  It is a well written piece, no doubt, but I also feel that it could be improved upon.

My advice would be to exploit your chosen medium a bit more.  I get the absurdity of the “S” and “J” thing, but I think you can keep the spine of this story intact while basing their differences on something that is absurd but also visual at the same time.

And I also wondered why the cat’s name began with “F”.

First, let me thank you for reading this. I appreciate it, big time!

Quoted from bert This story certainly has its charms.  It reminds me of "The Sneetches" by Dr. Seuss.  If you intend any rewrites of this, I would encourage you to check that story out -- either again, or for the first time -- to see what wisdom you might glean from Geisel's vision and apply it to your own.

I'll definitely give it a read.

Quoted from bert Right off the bat, while I am no expert on claymation, I suspect your townsfolk need more description than "odd looking" and "bizarrely dressed".  You need to help us see this.  How are they odd?  Big noses?  Big shoes?  What makes them odd and bizarre?

Good point. Odd looking and bizarre is vague -- too vague.  

Quoted from bert And "rolls" of houses?  Did you mean rows? With clay, I can't be sure.  And why give us Sid's age when he is made of clay haha.

Yes, I meant rows. Not sure how that one got past me!  With the exception of Sid, I neglected to assign an age to any of the other adult characters. I thought I'd get called on this -- but you, being difficult, (j/k) question why Sid is given an age. In any case, I think you're right. I'll remove the reference in the next draft.

Quoted from bert I did not find the plethora of camera angles you suggested I might, and in fact, I think the cartoon-like method by which you have chosen to tell this story would demand (or at least excuse) a few of these transgressions.

This is good news. I struggled with whether or not I should remove 'em. But, in the end, couldn't bring myself to. I thought do so would lessen the impact of what I wanted to convey.

Quoted from bert I actually enjoyed Sadie's little asides that were just to us, and a lot of the dialogue was very clever.  Very quick jabs back and forth between the characters that displayed a lot of wit.  You make your points without ramming them down our throats.  The "shoulds" and & "shouldn'ts" were particularly nice.  Good job there.

Thanks. I can't tell you how much fun I had writing this.

Quoted from bert I did find the character of Jason to be a little elusive.  Unless I missed something, I never really understood why he was supposed to be so great.  Perhaps you should have a little backstory for him.

Excellent point. Jason is the leader of the "Js." His import, though, is vague. His character, or at least references to his character, need to be more prominent -- as do references to Simon.

Quoted from bert But the single, biggest problem I had with this story may strike you at first as being quite petty.  It is quite petty, actually, but it is also a significant problem made all the more significant by its importance in this story.  And that is that virtually every single character name begins with the letter "S". That simple detail makes this story very, very difficult to follow.  Darn near impossible, actually.  I'm serious.  I would constantly have to backtrack to determine who was speaking -- who they were -- and it made this story really drag when it should have been zipping along. Now, you have chosen to make this story claymation, so the possibilities for your characters should be endless!  Why differentiate them based upon something as simple as their name when you can mold them into any form imaginable?  Seuss made his Sneetches different based upon whether or not they had stars upon their bellies, and I would encourage you to adopt a similar approach.  Let their prejudice lie in something visual, not in their names, which really only makes sense on the page.  Can you see how that is a weakness?

I considered making the difference between the two groups their dress, but nixed it in favor of something more insignificant. I did this purposely. I wanted the difference to be something that was unimportant -- something so trivial that it, in itself, demonstrated the ridiculousness of the prejudice at issue.  

That said, I hadn't considered how the story would read with almost each character having an "S" name. I wonder if what is an issue on the page wouldn't be on the screen?

Quoted from bert I did enjoy your little morality tale, particularly the dialogue, and particularly the dialogue from Sadie.  It is a well written piece, no doubt, but I also feel that it could be improved upon.

It definitely could be improved upon.

Quoted from bert My advice would be to exploit your chosen medium a bit more.  I get the absurdity of the "S" and "J" thing, but I think you can keep the spine of this story intact while basing their differences on something that is absurd but also visual at the same time.

This is something I'll have to give thought to. At this point, I can't say I agree for reasons I've stated above.

Quoted from bert And I also wondered why the cat's name began with "F".

lol -- When I was a kid, I grew up about a block away from a  French restaurant called Forepaughs. I thought if Sadie, existing in a world of "Ss," named her cat Forepaughs, An "F" word, it would demonstrate that she is different. This was an eariler draft in which she truly was different.  

Thanks for the comments. I definitely have a few things to consider and re-consider.

Seth

Quoted from Seth I can't tell you how much fun I had writing this.

It shows.  That was part of the fun in reading it.

Quoted from Seth That said, I hadn't considered how the story would read with almost each character having an "S" name.

Bear in mind how unfamiliar the reader will be with these characters.  This is one of those problems were you need to exercise some real objectivity to understand just how annoying this can be.

Have you ever watched a movie where all the guys look pretty much alike, and half the time you didn't know who was who?  It's kind of like that.

Quoted from Seth I wonder if what is an issue on the page wouldn't be on the screen?

If it's a problem on the page...well, we might never know if it's a problem on the screen haha.  Get my drift?

Quoted from Seth When I was a kid, I grew up about a block away from a  French restaurant called Forepaughs.

That's good enough for me.

Quoted from Seth I thought if Sadie...named her cat Forepaughs, An "F" word, it would demonstrate that she is different.

You should go with that thought, but make it clear that she intends to be different.  That will help flesh her out a bit.

Bert,

With this one, I think I'm going to continue to have fun -- trying different things, different directions.

I don't think it'll be too difficult to re-tool. That said, I'm not sure how the finished product, assuming I ever finish it, will look (I have a hard time saying, "This is done. This is complete).  

In any case, I am open to advice. I appreciate imput. I'm gonna work up a few different drafts. One of these drafts, without question, will include your suggestions.

I'm a big believer in "writing is re-writing, "

Seth  

J's are Jews right? If so, then I agree, J's do suck. (Just kidding)

Anyways, this was pretty decent. Very confusing however. I had to re-read it to get everything straight, and even then I wasn't able to follow it completely.

For one, I thought Sadie had Forepaugs the whole time when it was under her covers, so why was she looking for it, and why did Judy have it at the end?

Who's Simon? The equilelent to Jason perhaps?

All the S and J names get a little confusing.

Sadie says her parents are dumb, yet she listens to them about J's.

I think she should have an actual reason for disliking Judy, that they resolve later, besides just her grandmother being the voice of reason.

You probably shouldn't say DAMN J's in a kids story. And Sid getting freaky with a J in a previous marriage I think is too advanced of a concept for this type of children's tale too. And why didn't the girls ever know about it.

The moral of the story is also a little ify to me too. Obviously I think you're trying to go for an anti-descrimination type of deal, but all I got out of it is that you can be prejudice about people, just as long as you're not related to them. And it seemed like there was no real cause for Sid's sudden change in his feeling for J's. He just changes on a dime.

I think there should just be a conflict between Judy and Sadie, that leads Sadie to disliking J's, and then she teaches her dad and everyone that it's bad once they resolve the issue. She should be the smart character in this, which I didn't really feel in terms of the irrational hatred for the common J.

Also why were her and Sammy on bad terms?

But there were some cool routines to build on, the talk about the airplane, and the should and shouldn'ts speech come to mind, and  and some sharp dialogue, just some things were confusing. Just simplify it a little more, and go more in one direction with it and it'll be fine.

Sryknows,

Thanks for taking a look at this. I appreciate it.

Quoted from Steve-Dave J's are Jews right? If so, then I agree, J's do suck. (Just kidding)

Okay, Cartman!

Quoted from Steve-Dave Anyways, this was pretty decent. Very confusing however. I had to re-read it to get everything straight, and even then I wasn't able to follow it completely. For one, I thought Sadie had Forepaugs the whole time when it was under her covers, so why was she looking for it, and why did Judy have it at the end?

This is an excellent question. One that can only be answerd by telling you that the story is rushed -- with much of it, it seems, still in my head rather than on the page.

In any case, you've brought a major plot problem to my attention. In the beginning, Sadie is depressed. She can't, though, given the world in which she exists, express her feelings in an honest way. So she employs sublimation, telling people her cat ran away.

That's all well and good, but it doesn't answer how Forepaughs, late in the script, gets into the back of the truck. This is a mystery and it shouldn't be. The parents couldn't have placed him there -- they think he's missing. Major plot problem -- thanks!

Quoted from Steve-Dave Who's Simon? The equilelent to Jason perhaps?

Yes, he is the Simon of "Simon Says" fame, aka, the leader of the Ss. That said, I need to expand on this.

Quoted from Steve-Dave All the S and J names get a little confusing.

There seems to be a consensus forming -- damn it!

Quoted from Steve-Dave Sadie says her parents are dumb, yet she listens to them about J's.

I think most children believe there parents to be dumb. Yet, still, they take on their beliefs.

Quoted from Steve-Dave I think she should have an actual reason for disliking Judy, that they resolve later, besides just her grandmother being the voice of reason.

It's a weak ending, no doubt. As for disliking Judy, I'd like to keep Sadie's reasons general. Still, I see your point -- whatever the reason, it needs to be more prominent.

Quoted from Steve-Dave You probably shouldn't say DAMN J's in a kids story.

True.

Quoted from Steve-Dave And Sid getting freaky with a J in a previous marriage I think is too advanced of a concept for this type of children's tale too.

Maybe, but I don't know --a lot of kids grow up in non-traditional familes,  complex arrangements, step-parents, step-siblings, multible grandparents.

Thinking about it,  there are other, perhaps less "freaky," angles I could employ. Whatever the case, I want the family arrangement to be a complex one, reflective of today's family (some of them, anyway).

Quoted from Steve-Dave And why didn't the girls ever know about it.

Because in the world I am attempting to create, Ss are not at all to consort with Js. To do so gets you shunned.

Quoted from Steve-Dave The moral of the story is also a little ify to me too. Obviously I think you're trying to go for an anti-descrimination type of deal, but all I got out of it is that you can be prejudice about people, just as long as you're not related to them. And it seemed like there was no real cause for Sid's sudden change in his feeling for J's. He just changes on a dime.

Not much of an arc there. Point taken.

Quoted from Steve-Dave I think there should just be a conflict between Judy and Sadie, that leads Sadie to disliking J's, and then she teaches her dad and everyone that it's bad once they resolve the issue. She should be the smart character in this, which I didn't really feel in terms of the irrational hatred for the common J.

While I think the conflict between Sadie and Judy ought to remain general, I see your point in term story arc, etc.

Quoted from Steve-Dave Also why were her and Sammy on bad terms?

This is another question that the story ignores. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

Quoted from Steve-Dave    But there were some cool routines to build on, the talk about the airplane, and the should and shouldn'ts speech come to mind, and  and some sharp dialogue, just some things were confusing. Just simplify it a little more, and go more in one direction with it and it'll be fine.

Thanks Sryknows. You've been a great help!

Seth

Quoted from Seth Okay, Cartman!

You sayin' I'm fat? Besides, I was going more for Borat. :)

Quoted from Seth Maybe, but I don't know --a lot of kids grow up in non-traditional familes,  complex arrangements, step-parents, step-siblings, multible grandparents.

I see your point. Personally, I just think that that's a whole other moral lesson to be dealt with, you know? I think you should stick more true to the core lesson of being prejudice, or have other stories with Sadie dealing with stepfamilies and other problems with moral values. This is what I mean by just simplifying things. To me, it just seems like you're trying to squeeze in TOO many morality issues.

Quoted from Seth Because in the world I am attempting to create, Ss are not at all to consort with Js. To do so gets you shunned.

Fair enough.

I did like this though, and could tell you had a lot of fun with it, and was fun to read, and I'm not even into children's stuff, so you got points there. I just think you need to focus more on the core issue.

I really liked this Seth.  It was very unconventional but it had it's own distinct voice and followed a certain logic to a conclusion.  It takes a bit of imagination on the part of the reader but thankfully that's one thing I, and most kids, have in abundance.  I had no trouble at all picturing the village with it's odd, abstract angles and silly-looking inhabitants.

As Bert mentioned it draws paralles to Dr. Seuss, however I couldn't help thinking of the Peanuts.  Like that cartoon this story has a certain rythm all it's own - perhaps not the same piano beat but something similar.  

I also started thinking of 'The Lottery' by Shirley Jackson for some reason.  If you've read that short story then you might understand why - or maybe not.  Anyway I'd definitely check it out if you haven't.  It's darker and much more shocking but deals with similar issues and is presented in the same abstract manner.

It's hard to pinpoint specific negatives but I'll try.  I think perhaps Forepaughs could play a more prominent role.  He doesn't have to speak or do anything per se - just be a silent observer, carefully sidestepping his way out of trouble, being a bit of a snoop - stuff like that.

As well, you might want to flesh out Sadie a bit more.  She's kind of precocious.  I wouldn't mind seeing her punch out Sam or something.  Maybe that's a bit harsh but you get the drift.  Perhaps she could swipe some cookies or something instead.  Show her personality a bit more.  Maybe her and Judy get into trouble together.  Maybe she blames her for getting caught and this is the rift that leads to their following out.

There were some nice little touches too - I liked it when the clock showed nine o'clock but Sally said 'It's eight-thirty - time for bed'.  I'm not sure what you intention was but it created the effect that something was amiss in this world, that our normal assumptions about things cannot be trusted.  

Overall this was very good and, I think, could easily be expanded into a feature-length story if you stuck with it.

Quoted from mgj I really liked this Seth.

I was hoping you, in particular, would like this. Having read, and enjoyed, "Milo," I thought you might have a nose for this type of story.  

In any case, thanks for the positive comments. They're encouraging  

Quoted from mgj It was very unconventional but it had it's own distinct voice and followed a certain logic to a conclusion.  It takes a bit of imagination on the part of the reader but thankfully that's one thing I, and most kids, have in abundance.  I had no trouble at all picturing the village with it's odd, abstract angles and silly-looking inhabitants. As Bert mentioned it draws paralles to Dr. Seuss, however I couldn't help thinking of the Peanuts.  Like that cartoon this story has a certain rythm all it's own - perhaps not the same piano beat but something similar.   I also started thinking of 'The Lottery' by Shirley Jackson for some reason.  If you've read that short story then you might understand why - or maybe not.  Anyway I'd definitely check it out if you haven't.  It's darker and much more shocking but deals with similar issues and is presented in the same abstract manner.

I haven't heard of The Lottery -- I am, though, going to a large used book store this weekend. If I see it, I'll pick it up.

Quoted from mgj It's hard to pinpoint specific negatives but I'll try.  I think perhaps Forepaughs could play a more prominent role.  He doesn't have to speak or do anything per se - just be a silent observer, carefully sidestepping his way out of trouble, being a bit of a snoop - stuff like that.

This is an excellent idea. And one that might help to fill a plot hole here and there.

Quoted from mgj As well, you might want to flesh out Sadie a bit more.  She's kind of precocious.  I wouldn't mind seeing her punch out Sam or something.  Maybe that's a bit harsh but you get the drift.  Perhaps she could swipe some cookies or something instead.  Show her personality a bit more.  Maybe her and Judy get into trouble together.  Maybe she blames her for getting caught and this is the rift that leads to their following out.

Not harsh at all. In fact, I think you've got a good understanding of who she is in terms of personality. As for Sammy, he, in my mind, acts with blind enthusiasm. I'd like to take this to another, more comic, level.

Quoted from mgj There were some nice little touches too - I liked it when the clock showed nine o'clock but Sally said 'It's eight-thirty - time for bed'.  I'm not sure what you intention was but it created the effect that something was amiss in this world, that our normal assumptions about things cannot be trusted.   Overall this was very good and, I think, could easily be expanded into a feature-length story if you stuck with it.

I do plan to stick with it.

Again, thanks for the review. I appreciate it.    

Why clamation? If i'd want to create a script for claymation I'd have weird and wonderful things happen, but this is pretty straight forward. Just think Gumby. That aside its still a very good story ad teaches descrimination in a children-safe way. There aint no J's being lynched.

Your descriptions are really breif and too to the point, very vague. And some of your descriptions seemed out of place. eg.

"SADIE
Help me find him.

She says to Sammy."

Should be:

SADIE
(To Sammy)
Help me find him.

He lifts a can, half-grunts. Then, mumbling, says,

SAUL
No one moves.

Should be:

He lifts a can, half grunts.

SAUL
(mumbling)
No one moves

There are a few of these in the script. I could be wrong because i'm not 110% on formatting. They just strike me as things to be included not in the descriptions, but action.

Your dialogue is really tight and confusingly humourous. I really enjoyed the Should, Shouldn't conversation.

I enjoyed the story and the script was written superbly.

Quoted from Alex J. Cooper Why clamation? If i'd want to create a script for claymation I'd have weird and wonderful things happen, but this is pretty straight forward. Just think Gumby. That aside its still a very good story ad teaches descrimination in a children-safe way. There aint no J's being lynched.

LOL -- there "ain't no Js being lynched" cuz I hate the south! Hate red-necks, too :)

Quoted from Alex J. Cooper Your descriptions are really breif and too to the point, very vague.

This may be the case. I'll have to give this some thought. I, on purpose, kept them brief -- thinking that others, like the director, may want to fill in gaps -- hopeful thinking, maybe.

Quoted from Alex J. Cooper And some of your descriptions seemed out of place. eg. "SADIE Help me find him. She says to Sammy.

I'm not sure what you're referring to. The above is dialogue, not descriptive. Maybe you're making reference to "She says," which is narrative.

If this is the case, you may be right. I'm not sure. Fact is, you're the first one to mention it. I figured if others haven't read in a book that it's wrong, it's probaby okay.
Fact is, we're like sheep, if we read in a book that we "shouldn't" do it, we don't.

You're the first to point it out -- lol -- thought I'd get away with it! Still, you have to allow me personal license, don't ya?

Quoted from Alex J. Cooper Your dialogue is really tight and confusingly humourous. I really enjoyed the Should, Shouldn't conversation.

Cool.

Quoted from Alex J. Cooper I enjoyed the story and the script was written superbly.

Ther are some mistakes.

Thanks for being critical,

Seth

ill fist stated off, all sentences need to be moved in active form. no INGS on verbs
ou can visit active and passive thread in class room forum for clarifications.

It is to my understanding that camera directions can be used in shorts, but use sparringly.

pg 2. INT Hall, need to be followed by description. I have fell victim to this aswell. but all scenes need a decription of whats going on before dialog.  Small or big

pg6, Sally "Fine, you are not.." Shouldnt this diaglos be  voice over from answering machine?

pg8 lol Im enjoying your dailogue, cute and funny
pg did you have her mispell fault on purpose. f a l t, to she is the the dumb one? Also since this is for children I dont think dumb she be used. Not the brightest?
pg 9, Im not getting the reference you "shoulds" and he hates them...

pg 11. You prolly already know, but ill state anyway. Reframe from your camaera directions and the dreaded " we hear,we see, and we's period" when writing a spec feature length
pg 12. Are you thinking again? Lol this one TWISTED story. i dont know what to think anymore
Im easily gettin lost throught out your script, with lack of descriptions in some scenes in whats going on. example.
pg 14. A DIAL TONE then:.-- I have go back and  assume Judy hit the phone for it to hang up on sue.

Also with everyone named with S, I have to look back to see which person this is, which add to the confusion
pg 16. Saul should be mentioned in description since she thinks she is talking to Saul, and sally is there. I think. I trying to feel for what u are getting it.
pg 25 You cant have Judy disappearing back into the crowd of u nver established she was there

Im doneand I dnt really know what to make of this short story... perhas if you have some questions I could answer regarding what I read.

I thought this script was cute and it has lots of potential. You need to do a couple of things.

Explore alternatives to naming all of your characters with an S. I know it is integral to the story and if you can’t part with it then at least try to name your characters differently.  It will probably play on screen as is but it is too hard to read and follow with all those esses.

Lose the camera directions and the implied ones as well. You do not need them to tell the story.  You can get away with them if they are part of the story but I didn’t see any that seemed necessary.

The inciting event is weak. There needs to be more than just a meeting with Judy.  I think they need to be friends and have a fight.  This would provide Sadie with motivation for hating Js.

I didn’t see any real reason for forepaughs to be in the script. He could be just nonsense, which is fine, but I think if you are going to name the script after him he should have more of an effect on the story.

I don’t see any reason this couldn’t be live rather than claymation. If you want it to be claymation give us visible reasons.

Take the idea and bring it up a notch. Play it for all it is worth.  Occasionally, it seemed like you dropped the ball. The script fell into subtleties and got muddled when it should be broad and clear.  This is for kids, remember, they aren’t going to get subtle.

You have a good idea and it is definitely for the kids.  I question wether they will get it or not.  Do you have a little kid nearby that you can act it out for? Get their opinion.

Pg 2.
A muddled two syllable sound is heard.
It begins taking on definition…

Describe buildings first then people.
A mechanical marching band enters.

Nix camera direction.
Too many parentheticals already!

Pg 3
I’m lisping, three characters start with S already. It’s looking like a trend.
Into camera should be replaced with ‘to audience’

Pg 4
I really having a difficult time following all of these S characters.

Pg 6
Into camera again!

Affecting not effecting.
If you have more than two commas in a sentence you probably worded the sentence wrong.  Sid staggers in. A gust of wind follows him, blowing the clock to the floor, silencing it.

Pg 7
This is Sue.
I hate esses!
It they really didn’t like J then it probably wouldn’t be polite for them to say J. They might have a euphemism or a derogatory term depending on the mood.

Pg 15
Jason is a she?

Pg 22
Into camera

Pg 23
Kids won’t get Drama queen.

Pg 29
We know she says it you don’t have to tell us she says.

mcornetto,

Thanks for detailed review. It's appreciated.

Quoted from mcornetto Explore alternatives to naming all of your characters with an S.

This seems to be the consensus. I didn't want to make the change, but it's obvious that a change *is* needed.

Quoted from mcornetto Lose the camera directions

I, too, think they need to be removed.  

Quoted from mcornetto The inciting event is weak. There needs to be more than just a meeting with Judy.  I think they need to be friends and have a fight.  This would provide Sadie with motivation for hating Js.

I think Sryknows brought this up, too. Her motivation needs to be more concrete.

Quoted from mcornetto I didn't see any real reason for forepaughs to be in the script. He could be just nonsense, which is fine, but I think if you are going to name the script after him he should have more of an effect on the story.

True.

Quoted from mcornetto I don't see any reason this couldn't be live rather than claymation. If you want it to be claymation give us visible reasons. Take the idea and bring it up a notch. Play it for all it is worth.  Occasionally, it seemed like you dropped the ball.

I definitely dropped the ball -- but that's why I'm here, to learn.

Quoted from mcornetto The script fell into subtleties and got muddled when it should be broad and clear.  This is for kids, remember, they aren't going to get subtle. You have a good idea and it is definitely for the kids.  I question wether they will get it or not.  Do you have a little kid nearby that you can act it out for? Get their opinion.

This is a good idea.

Seth

JD,

Thanks!

Quoted from JD_OK ill fist stated off, all sentences need to be moved in active form. no INGS on verbs ou can visit active and passive thread in class room forum for clarifications.

I thought my sentences were active. Maybe not, though. I'll recheck it.

Quoted from JD_OK It is to my understanding that camera directions can be used in shorts, but use sparringly.

I've decided to remove them.

Quoted from JD_OK pg 2. INT Hall, need to be followed by description. I have fell victim to this aswell. but all scenes need a decription of whats going on before dialog.  Small or big

Are you sure that all scenes require the inclusion of discription before dialogue? I can see how this makes sense, but there must be exceptions.

Quoted from JD_OK pg6, Sally "Fine, you are not.." Shouldnt this diaglos be  voice over from answering machine?

I think I have it as O.S. -- maybe it should be voice over, I'm not sure.

Quoted from JD_OK pg8 lol Im enjoying your dailogue, cute and funny pg did you have her mispell fault on purpose. f a l t, to she is the the dumb one?

She's young and, apparently, not familiar with the word. She certainly isn't dumb. Still, I sometimes get annoyed by how children, in movies, are so often portrayed as being beyond there years in in terms of intellect.

Quoted from JD_OK Also since this is for children I dont think dumb she be used. Not the brightest? pg 9, Im not getting the reference you "shoulds" and he hates them...

Just a play on words.

Quoted from JD_OK pg 11. You prolly already know, but ill state anyway. Reframe from your camaera directions and the dreaded " we hear,we see, and we's period" when writing a spec feature length

Yep, I think I gotta "we see" in there. I'll remove it.

Seth

Good times, again i did enjoy your story. It is very different and thats good. I did agree what others wrote in their feedback. I dont normally read shorts. So I dont try and get into depth on the short realm critique as i do features cuz I dont wanan state anything that I have not business in doing.

Again if you have any questions regarding what i read Ill be happy to answer

This was very diffrent.  very well written. the dialouge was playful. But writing style was unconventional and flippant. Made it a little hard to follow.

You seem to really go out of your way to twist this whole story, right down to the dilaouge, inside out. For example they got a removal van ready to move everything but only think about moving.

Talk about look for cat and end up talking about red trees in California. It almost made me dizzy trying to keep up with everything but it was fun to read.

Why claymation. Your story could suit any style of animation from cgi, water color cel animation to stop motion with dolls and toys.  

I've noticed you are a regular here and have posted a review on many a script but do not seem to have any scripts of your own. (with the exception of this one)

I really enjoyed this. will you be posting anymore scripts?

Quoted from tonkatough This was very diffrent.  very well written. the dialouge was playful. But writing style was unconventional and flippant. Made it a little hard to follow.

The script is, somewhat, unconventional in terms of spec writing. It includes, for example, a handful of camera angles, etc -- these as I told JD in this thread, will be removed in a future rewite.

While the inclusion of such devices may be unconventional, I wouldn't characterize the script as having a flippant air about it. In fact, I'm fairly careful in terms of what words I use.  

Quoted from tonkatough You seem to really go out of your way to twist this whole story, right down to the dilaouge, inside out. For example they got a removal van ready to move everything but only think about moving. Talk about look for cat and end up talking about red trees in California. It almost made me dizzy trying to keep up with everything but it was fun to read.

I think you've missed understood -- Sue and Sid are not simply thinking about moving, they are, as evidenced by the moving truck, moving. They tell Sadie they're "thinking about it" in an effort to avoid speaking the truth.

Quoted from tonkatough Why claymation. Your story could suit any style of animation from cgi, water color cel animation to stop motion with dolls and toys.

You're right. I'll drop the reference.  

Quoted from tonkatough I've noticed you are a regular here and have posted a review on many a script but do not seem to have any scripts of your own. (with the exception of this one)

I've been posting here since, I think, fall. In that time, yes, I've reviewed more scripts than I've submitted. I enjoy reading scripts. As for writing 'em, I've submitted three. One I've removed.

Quoted from tonkatough I really enjoyed this. will you be posting anymore scripts?

I'm working on two now. One is another 30 (or so) page script, the other is a feature. Neither will include camera angles. Both will be simple, easy to read, stories.  

Thanks for the comments. I'll return the favor, but it may take a week or so, I've an off-board script to read.

Seth

Quoted from Seth I'm working on two now. One is another 30 (or so) page script, the other is a feature. Neither will include camera angles. Both will be simple, easy to read, stories.   Thanks for the comments. I'll return the favor, but it may take a week or so, I've an off-board script to read. Seth

Look forward to reading them!

Yep, will have to agree with JD on that one. particular the feature.

Hi Seth, I just finished this, in between work and mandatory Ezra Pound (thematical, no?), so I'll probably have to re-read again, because my thoughts were a bit garbled while reading.

Where to start? The Good stuff? Yes, the good stuff:

I adored Sadie. I thought her remarks ad camera were extremely well done and not too 'cute' or reminiscent of other shows I've seen employ that means of communication. Sadie is a great friend to the reader in that she calls out the hypocrisy and general nonsense of her parents and soceity, yet at the same time she's swept up into the whole J's VS S's hysteria. This means we don't just get a precocious eight-year-old who points her finger at her dumb parents, but a flawed, impressionable kid who invokes sympathy from the reader. For a person made of clay, I found Sadie to be extremely well-rounded character (geddit? Well-rounded? 'Cause she's made of-...don't tell someone else already made that joke?)

The rest of the cast are pretty generic, but I suppose they represent the madness of your society so it doesn't matter.

This did get very confusing at some point. After Sadie runs away from home and there's a lot of cross-cutting going on between Sadie and everyone else, I had a hard time figuring who was with who and why. But this could be the Ezra talking. I need to clear my head tomorrow and give it another gander.

Your descriptions were short and simple, which is exactly how they should be given the simplicity of the story and...welll...simple physiology of the characters. It's very different from the way I write description, which tends to be sort of literary. So it took a little getting used to from this end.

Dialogue was really perfexct for a semi-satirical kid's movie. Especially Sid's Should and Shouldn't dialogue. Extremely creative. Like I think Bert mentioned, this looked like you had a blast writing it. A lot of the wordplays and nonsensical conversations reminded me of Alice in Wonderland when she meets the Queen of Hearts.

The thing I disliked most was, in fact, the ending. But that's because I hate sappy endings with lots of morals and stuff. I know it's a children's story but I was kinda hoping for Sadie to realize that Judy might be a J, but she's still okay (hey that rhymed), and then they would be overwhelmed by each opposing crowds trying to hijack each kid as a poster-child for their kind. Maybe Sadie and Judy could then do an inspirational speech about how it doesn't matter if you're a J or a S and so on. After which the two groups would just continue their quarrelling, not seeing reason at all. Judy and Sadie could then walk away together, rolling their eyes.

I dunno, that was just a random spiel.

But other than that there really wasn't anything wrong with this story, not anything I found in my first reading. It was simply a brilliant, cute kid's film.

Good read.

Quoted from Death Monkey The thing I disliked most was, in fact, the ending. But that's because I hate sappy endings with lots of morals and stuff. I know it's a children's story but I was kinda hoping for Sadie to realize that Judy might be a J, but she's still okay (hey that rhymed), and then they would be overwhelmed by each opposing crowds trying to hijack each kid as a poster-child for their kind. Maybe Sadie and Judy could then do an inspirational speech about how it doesn't matter if you're a J or a S and so on. After which the two groups would just continue their quarrelling, not seeing reason at all. Judy and Sadie could then walk away together, rolling their eyes.

Death Monkey,

Thanks for giving this a read. I appreciate it. As for the ending, you're right. I, when re-reading it, cringe -- it is sappy.  Your idea, though, is a good one. I'm going to give it some thought.  

Thanks again,

Seth

Seth,
I liked this, it was far different from anything I've read on this site. Good back and forth dialogue, you never over did it.
I'm not usually a fan of characters speaking into the camera, but it was effective here...Especially Sadie's bit on pg. 21.
I could picture Grandma's up-do bobbing through the crowd, that was a funny visual.
Overall it was really good, only thing was the ending, but I don't think its that far off. I wouldn't completely overhaul it though, a few minor changes could fix it.

N7, thanks for the read. I plan on returning to this one at some point (hopefully soon).

Be sure to message me when Puppy Love is finished.  

Seth