Phil.  If you don't do script exchanges, why are you reading that person's script?  

You're giving yourself carte blanche to drop in on a script's forum and tell someone how much you hated their script without having the task of reading their entire script.  I find that a bit lazy.  And an excuse to make your opinions known.  I've been guilty of this from time to time, but I catch myself doing it.  

The real helpful reviews come from those who agree to the exchanges.   But to jump from forum to forum, leaving nasty remarks is a cop out and a sign of insecurity and is counter-productive for not only you, but the author of the script you're reviewing.

And as someone mentioned earlier, if you can't find one good thing to say about a script, then it's better to not say anything at all.

But I do stand behind my belief that most scripts here have at least one good thing working for them.

Quoted from albinopenguin But I don't get angry when they lash back. Instead, I prove my point. If you want to tell everyone that their script is amazing, then go for it. But you're not helping them. I've read many scripts on the boards where literally NOTHING works. I'm not encouraging people to trash other people's scripts, but if they suck, you should tell them (in an appropriate way of course)

In an appropriate way.  Exactly.  I agree.  And that's the point I'm trying to make

Quoted from ericdickson Phil.  If you don't do script exchanges, why are you reading that person's script?   You're giving yourself carte blanche to drop in on a script's forum and tell someone how much you hated their script without having the task of reading their entire script.  I find that a bit lazy.  And an excuse to make your opinions known.  I've been guilty of this from time to time, but I catch myself doing it.   The real helpful reviews come from those who agree to the exchanges.   But to jump from forum to forum, leaving nasty remarks is a cop out and a sign of insecurity and is counter-productive for not only you, but the author of the script you're reviewing. And as someone mentioned earlier, if you can't find one good thing to say about a script, then it's better to not say anything at all. But I do stand behind my belief that most scripts here have at least one good thing working for them.

Jack,

I can completely understand where you are coming from.  However, a long time ago in a thread far far away - as a group - we came to the conclusion that partial reads are ok as long as you are constructive about why you stopped reading.    I know that constructive part probably hasn't been strictly enforced but maybe it will be now.

I can just imagine the situation where a reader providing feedback is required to read the entire script, every time and provide detailed feedback.  Sure...right...

The vast majority of times I provide feedback after not reading the entire script details exactly why I'm not going to read the entire script.  IT also provides detailed feedback about mistakes on display.  I just can't for the life of me see how that's not helpful feedback that any writer should be very happy to receive for free.

Going into a script exchange, which I have done numerous times, is a real hit and miss situation, usually a big miss for me, as the amount of feedback I provide far outweighs what i get in return, but what can you do?

I'd love t post some "anonymous" quotes here from certain people, but fuck it...why?  What good is it going to do at this point?

I'm out.  Enjoy yourselves...

Some of the best public feedback I have received is from people who didn't finish my script because they were not thrilled with the story. I don't think Rick ever finishes my scripts, but he takes the time to give very useful critiques. Others go ahead and finish as a favor, even though they'd rather not, and I appreciate both types of reviews.

The helpful thing for me is to know where the reader stopped. Then you know where to focus on rewrite.

Jack, there was a time when we didn't do exchanges (atleast not these public declarations of "I'll read yours if you read mine").  We just read the scripts.  At the years passed, some people started getting a little mercenary with it.  I went along with it for a while but I got tired of people's comments being "Great script.  Love to see it on the screen."  Many times, they didn't recipricate at all.

Usually, when I read a script now it's because it's a friend's script or the logline grabs me.  I like reading them.  Lastely, I've only had time to read shorts, but I don't expect reads back.  Before you continue thinking that I'm here just to slam the scripts, I recommend that you go through my history and see my reviews on other scripts.  I'm fair and honest in my reviews, whether they be positive or negative.

My opinions on thoise scripts I never finished are just as valid.  If your characters are two-dimensional and lifeless, and they all sound alike in the first twenty pages, they're not going to change after that.  And should I waste my time after that.  If you want me to read past page twenty of your script, give me a reason.  Make me want to read past twenty.

What did you think of that script review I posted a little while ago?  Assuming I wasn't lying in what I wrote, do you think reading/commenting further would've helped that writer?

Quoted from ericdickson The real helpful reviews come from those who agree to the exchanges.   But to jump from forum to forum, leaving nasty remarks is a cop out and a sign of insecurity and is counter-productive for not only you, but the author of the script you're reviewing.

If someone wants to read my scripts, they're more than welcome to.  I've seen people write innacurate reviews so they can get their scripts read.  And then they go ballistic when they get a bad revgiew.  With me, that doesn't happen.  There's a lot less pressure this way

Quoted from ericdickson And as someone mentioned earlier, if you can't find one good thing to say about a script, then it's better to not say anything at all. But I do stand behind my belief that most scripts here have at least one good thing working for them.

If you go back to the script that started this shitstorm, you'll see that I posted something positive and constructive.  I didn't just write, "Slap your Momma for raising such a shitty writer."


Phil

Quoted from Phil Irish diplomacy is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that he looks forward to the trip.  Some people need to learn this.

Everyone go to hell!!! Especially if your french!


Cool it works

Mark

Okay.  Here's the deal boys.  

Jeff, no I'm not targeting you nor have I ever been targeting you.  But you've been out of line with some of your comments.

Phil, you're the worst offender of this on simplyscripts.com and the number one reason I left for so long.  To call out Jeff is like the pot calling the kettle black.


The reason you guys have been arguing is because that lack of encouraging feedback that I've been talking about.  It escalates and blows out of proportion.

  


          

Can you give me some examples of this Jack?


Phil

Quoted from dogglebe Can you give me some examples of this Jack?l

Please don't, Jack.  That is not why I started this conversation.

I think we can all agree that nobody has been perfect about this in the past -- and I even include myself in that.

This thread is about minor tweaks to how we do things going forward.

Nobody is interested in the "been there-done that" argument.  [And if you are, please seek help..]

Thanks all.

Oh, sorry Bert.  I'm done now.  Just saw your post.  

Quoted from bert I think we can all agree that nobody has been perfect about this in the past -- and I even include myself in that.

I challenge you to find one single "ugly" post from Cindy!     

Quoted from Grandma Bear I challenge you to find one single "ugly" post from Cindy!

I notice the challenge was not to find one from YOU haha.

Seriously, guys.  This thread, which I am considering locking up soon, was all about collecting your thoughts to improve the SimplyScripts site for everyone, both the vets and potential new guys.

Not for pointing fingers or giving examples of bad behavior.

Please no more of that.

And, for the record, the lovely and talented Ms. Keller does have a post that I would delete had she made it today.

Check out "Schizophrenic Lesbians."

When I said nobody, I meant nobody.

But that's it!!  No more examples  

I say lock it up now. My opinion. I think you have enough info Bert.