Jeff, said this the other day.

Quoted from Dreamscale IN all seriousness. if you haven't watched multiple movies in whatever genre you're working in, you're really at an extreme disadvantage. Movie watchers make better writers than just good writers every time.

I'm wondering if that's true. To be honest, I don't really watch very many movies anymore. I used to watch 2-3 every week at the theaters 10 years ago. Now I go to see films about 4 times a year. I am however, an avid book reader. IMO, there just isn't enough time to read all the good books out there.

My question is, do you really have to watch a bunch of movies to be a good screenwriter? IMHO, it's all about story telling and the "format" doesn't matter.

Again, IMHO, it seems to me that a lot of screenwriters try to emulate other screenplays when they write, rather than just write their story. Too much focus on formula and studying old films.

Thoughts?

The last film I saw at the cinema was the dark knight in July 2008.

I don't watch DVDs of new movies. You could make a list of the top films of the last 5 years and I won't have seen them

I would rather read a book or play online games   Occaisonally I'll watch some of my fave old films

None of this has affected my writing; if anything it helps me think more originally as I'm not influenced by stuff

Also wouldn't have the spare cash to waste at the cinema anyway...

IMNSHO, I'd say if you want to be a great screenwriter, and not just a serviceable one, it's good to watch a lot of movies and based on your above post, I'd say you of all people, Pia, would benefit from it. I totally subscribe to the Jarmusch/Tarantino mentality and try to watch a new movie every single day. I don't necessarily meet my quota every week but I do watch a lot and I feel like my spectrum of ways a story can be told is expanding at a constant rate. As a result, I feel I have a lot more direction and resources as a storyteller.

I will say, however, that you should try to watch everything and not just specific genres. I also think you need to tap multiple sources of inspiration at all times, not just movies. And most importantly, you shouldn't watch a lot of movies for the sake of emulating them. It's a matter of gaining a broad perspective.

Quoted from James McClung I also think you need to tap multiple sources of inspiration at all times, not just movies.

This is where I am at, too.  Movies, books, graphic novels, scripts -- it's all good.

Everything you watch or read teaches you a little something about what works and what does not.

The only thing I would add is that I am totally convinced scriptwriters must read scripts.  Quality, modern scripts being the most important -- though there is also something to be taken from the classics.

Watching tons of movies is no substitute for that.  Not if you intend to actually write them.

I think it is imperative. Just like I think you should read as many scripts as possible, which sadly I do not do enough of.

I watch something every single day, whether it is a movie or tv series. I watch everything from children movies to horror. No single genre is off limits to me and I have favorites in all of them.

I watch good movies and even bad ones.

The way I see it... it's homework. A doctor (insert any trade) didn't become a doctor with out studying and continuing to study the newest breakthroughs in his/her field.

One of the things I get out of watching movies are some of those pesky things some of us have a hard time coming up with. Ideas. I don't, of course, mean ripping off someone elses idea. I can't tell you how many story ideas have come to me while watching a movie, even if it is completely unrelated to what I am watching. It could spring from an emotion a character is displaying or a piece of dialogue that they just said. I write these out in a notebook and to date I have at least a dozen stories waiting to be written, maybe more.

You can read a thousand books on screenwriting on what works and what doesn't but guess where you will really learn what those books are saying? While watching a movie because it's right there and you say, "Aha! That's what they mean." I also love watching bad movies because they will show you everything that doesn't work in spectacular glory. I keep a separate notebook for these little gems too.

Maybe I'm just strange and maybe what I just said won't make sense to anyone else but it's what I believe.

Hope that helps.

John

I've little time to really watch anything these days -- much, much too busy with my music, contest going, art-work and, of course, writing.  But when I do, it's something 15 to 50 years old.  These new movies don't do much for me and I'd hate to borrow any inspiration from them on that premise alone.

I'd say the idea of being a screenwriter and watching a shit ton of movies was applicable in the day -- even in 2003.  But not anymore.  The net has exploded and everything is literally right at your fingertips at all times... be it at your desktop, tablet, phone or a watch even... "rolls eyes"

But yeah, I'd say watch the movies that best categorize who you aspire to be as a writer.  Any and everything else -- just google.

I've never drawn much from movies I've seen... And if I did it was to see what I needed to avoid in order to have an understanding of what to leave out going forward.  You always want to know the ground your walking on, but kind of carve your own path through it.  (with the exception of  these new movies... those paths are better left un-attended)

I agree that inspiration comes from all forms.For example, I'm writing this short for someone and there is a ticking clock element. Having knowledge of Edgar Allan Poe's "Tell Tale Heart" is helping me visualize the scenes.

I think it's important to be a sponge (absorb as much as possible). Exposure to classical literature. Poetry. Music. Film. Comic books. Screenplays. It really helps if you've been reading/listening/watching as a kid as you have so much to draw upon. It helps as inspiration and also as a way to understand your target audience. You learn what's already been done and hopefully, inspire you to build on or recreate it.

I understand that you tend to write "like" movies sometimes when you watch movies but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. I watch a lot of movies. It's funny, because now that I've started screenwriting(or trying) I find myself thinking the action lines and such as the movie plays. I know lame....but I do.

I honestly consider it like homework now when I watch one. If I'm going to try to write a thriller, I'll netflix some thrillers and watch them. I think it helps me especially because I'm new to this so I haven't written many different genres yet. I love movies. I always have.

I think it's good to watch movies as a screenwriter but to each  his own. Whatever works ...works. It's all about writing when it boils down..writing and story. If you don't have one, 100 movies aren't gonna make it any better.

I think it all helps: watching movies at home, going to the theater(which is a different experience), reading books, reading scripts. It's a question of what you have time for, and what balance of those things you choose to go with.

A couple of months ago, at the library, I found a book on Shakespeare that had some insight into his plays which I found very interesting and very relevant to a script I was working on at the time. It gave me a whole new insight into the role of the protagonist in story, and I learned of a little trick Shakespeare used that allowed him to explore other characters without it seeming like he was jumping around. And I'm not a reader of Shakespeare either!

I personally don't watch movies. I just don't. I tend to prefer the classics that I've seen before. I like movies with interesting dialogue and complicated scenarios, like A Few Good Men. I just can't get myself to watch all these movies at the end of the dial. Netflix would be useless to me. I probably am at a major disadvantage for that.

The main thing is to write, though. If you're watching a ton of movies, or reading a ton of books, and not writing much, it's called procrastination.

Two schools of thought.

1. That it helps to uderstand the industry that you're working in and keeps you up to date with modern trends.

2. That it effects your ability to write in your own voice and with originalty because you're filling your conscious and subconscious mind with already existing stuff.


Swings and roundabouts. Certainly when you're actually writing, I think it would be better to stay away from too much overt influence.

All things can be inspiration for screenwriting...history, poetry, mathematics, philosphy, science etc...and of course real life. It doesn't hurt to go and meet interesting people if you want to create interesting characters.

I have a collection of movies (around 100 probably) that I've seen before and I liked. I use them as motivation to make me write. They remind me why i wanted to write (I'll like to someday see my story on screen).  Other than, most of my ideas comes from music, literature, and dreams. Not so much movies. It depends on what moves you.

Gabe

Networking in L.A. necessitates familiarity with the current market for me.
I need to know what's going on in town to appear viable to colleagues.
Also paying attention to the spec script market dovetails into that.
Folks like to know that you're in the know.

When it comes to writing and watching movies, I tend to keep them separate.
During story development, I'll formulate a "watch list" for the script.
I'll watch those movies while marinating an idea. Take notes, etc.
Then I treat my story like a roommate for a while...
Put "him" up on the corkboard on index cards and "live" with him for weeks.
Then it's onto the writing... so I do the movies long before words hit the page.
That filtering process keeps the actual films in the proper perspective for me.
And each feature script I write has a short list of films I watched to fuel the concepts.

I suspect that some folks around here could guess some of those titles too.

Regards,
E.D.

Uh hu...I see another quote of mine is now a discussion thread.  OK Pia...you better watch out...

Interesting posts here.  I am glad to see many agree with what I said, but I want to make it clear what I actually meant when I said this.

First of all, IMO, you can be a great writer, but if you're going to write about...oh, let's see...having sex with more than 1 person at a time, or doing drugs, unless you've experienced it, you're not going to be able to realistically pull it off.  And even if you fool the masses who don't know either, those that do will know, and they'll know it BS.

In a way, the exact same thing is true of being a screenwriter, only it's more difficult.  First of all, you have to know how to technically write screenplays, and then secondly, you have to know how to write movies.  Without being familiar with movies, you're at a serious disadvantage that you won't be able to overcome.

My point originally  was that you have to be familiar with movies, meaning you have to have watched movies.  But, I'll also say that the more movies you watch, the more info you take in.

For instance, Pia - she's watched movies throughout her life, probably alot.  She may not watch that many now, but I bet she still watches more now than many do, as I've had discussions with her about movies we've both recently seen.

I probably watch on average over 250 movies every year, and that's been going on since I was a little kid (now, I'll be the first to admit that before the advent of satellite/cable movie channels, that wasn't possible, but even back in the day, I was going to the theater to see a movie every week, and watching what I could through VHS rentals).

Why do I think that helps and is so important?  Well, it's not to emulate or ripoff movies and movie scenarios.  It's to understand what works, what doesn't work, and what's available to me as a writer and creator.  It's to gain a working knowledge of movie history, which helps avoid cliches or exact situations in movies.  You've got to know what's already been done, and you can't "know" that from reading it online or in a book.

I'll leave you with one of my crazy analogies.  And this one's on basketball.  The best basketball players are the ones who have been playing their entire life.  You can tell the way they move, the way they shoot, the way they play D, even.  Duh, right?  Well, consider all the "big men", many of them being foreign, who both college and Pro have tried to convert into players, because they had incredible height.  I'm not going to throw out any names, but if you follow the sport, I'm sure you can throw some names out yourself.

The point is that unless you know your subject matter, have lived your subject matter, you just can't fake it.  And by subject matter, in the big picture, I'm talking about movies, and having watched 100's and hopefully thousands of movies.  In the smaller picture, I'm talking about knowing your subject matter for exactly what you're writing, by doing research and also by watching genre movies.

I think it's the only way to go.

Here's another example how watching movies can help.

As a bar owner, I knew that music had become the most important aspect of the business. The days of the jukebox were over. And you certainly can't afford to pay a DJ every night. So the best thing to do was to learn how to DJ yourself, which is what I did.

I soon learned that there are little tricks to building the energy in the crowd. Certain sequences of songs, knowing when to cut a song, when to adjust the volume. I learned this by watching crowd reaction, but eventually you know the formula so well you could do it from another room. It becomes second nature.

When I do watch movies, especially the classics, I see little tricks like these DJ tricks being used all the time. And every time I watch the movie, I pick up something new.

For example, once again I watched A Few Good Men the other night. And it really struck me how useful one thing was in the set up. Tom Cruise has two lawyers working with him, Demi Moore and that other guy. Demi wants to defend the clients because she thinks they are innocent, that they were good guys just trying to do their job. The other guy thinks they are at the very least guilty of picking on a weaker kid. They both want to press the case for their own well intended reasons, but this conflict between them is extremely useful to the story.

Plus, the way the inner workings of these characters motivations is often revealed in a very subtle but clear method. No line is wasted or random. And I think some of these techniques become second hand nature for craftsmen like the people who designed this film.

Now, not all of this can be put in a screenplay. Some of it is up to the director and actors. But a lot of it can, and watching the films is a powerful way to learn.

Quoted from leitskev Here's another example how watching movies can help. As a bar owner, I knew that music had become the most important aspect of the business. The days of the jukebox were over. And you certainly can't afford to pay a DJ every night. So the best thing to do was to learn how to DJ yourself, which is what I did. I soon learned that there are little tricks to building the energy in the crowd. Certain sequences of songs, knowing when to cut a song, when to adjust the volume. I learned this by watching crowd reaction, but eventually you know the formula so well you could do it from another room. It becomes second nature. When I do watch movies, especially the classics, I see little tricks like these DJ tricks being used all the time. And every time I watch the movie, I pick up something new. For example, once again I watched A Few Good Men the other night. And it really struck me how useful one thing was in the set up. Tom Cruise has two lawyers working with him, Demi Moore and that other guy. Demi wants to defend the clients because she thinks they are innocent, that they were good guys just trying to do their job. The other guy thinks they are at the very least guilty of picking on a weaker kid. They both want to press the case for their own well intended reasons, but this conflict between them is extremely useful to the story. Plus, the way the inner workings of these characters motivations is often revealed in a very subtle but clear method. No line is wasted or random. And I think some of these techniques become second hand nature for craftsmen like the people who designed this film. Now, not all of this can be put in a screenplay. Some of it is up to the director and actors. But a lot of it can, and watching the films is a powerful way to learn.

Writing a good script essentially comes down to three things:

1. Knowing and applying the principles of writing a good script. This first prerequisite will essentially come from reading a lot of scripts that follow a variety of genres.

2. Knowing and applying the principles of writing a good story. This might come from any determining factors including having a good story teller in the family as a child, high exposure to books in general, high exposure to a diversity of life experiences to draw from or even one particular strange but true life story to draw from.

3. Desire to learn and appreciation of the craft. That desire might come from watching movies or reading books or participating in life experiences that stimulate a need to somehow assimilate, condense, and share those experiences.

Do screenwriters need to watch a lot of movies?

Perhaps not, but they do need to read a lot of scripts.

Do musicians need to listen to a lot of other musicians?

Perhaps not, but they do need to practice.

Sandra

I'm not one to subscribe to any absolutes about anything. I'm sure that it's possible to be a brilliant screenwriter without watching hardly any movies at all and I'm sure there are such individuals out there, making more money in a month than I do in my entire lifetime (which in my case isn't very hard).

Having said that, watching a lot of movies definitely can't hurt. And more than watching movies, I've found it extremely valuable to analyze the films I watch. By making mental notes on what works on any film or television show you happen to see, you pick up insight almost subconsciously, because analyzing what I see has proven to be very easy for myself. Your results will naturally vary.

I watch about seven or eight films every week, especially after I got Netflix working with some proxy-magic. And the movies I find interesting in any way I tend to watch several times to get even better insight (as well as enjoyment).

So even though there are no set rules about what to do and what not to do, there are some good habits that you can follow. Familiarizing yourself with the artform you are functioning in cannot be anything but an advantage.

I'm not too sure I understand people who say they can write films but don't want them?

Last films I saw were 'Swordfish' and 'Raising Arizona' - the only stuff I ever watch on TV is a film - I never really watch any other form of TV.

So when I'm watching these two films above I'm watching all the plots point, the way the story moves, the beats, - blah de blah. I've seen 'Raising Arizona' before, but now it reads differently.

This is (theoretically) our finished product - so how would you not watch them?

Simon, I think you are correct that most screenwriters probably come into this through a love of film. Hopefully that is not the only way. I came into this a little different. I was never really into film. Sure, I liked a good movie now and again, but I mostly watched sports, news, History Channel.

I got into this kind of unexpectedly. I have always liked to read, and even when I was I kid I entertained the idea of being a novelist. But I didn't do a whole lotta writing, never developed the required skill or seriously pursued it.

When I lost my business a couple of years ago, I suddenly had time on my hands, and was in need of a new "career". I tried writing a novel, and things were moving ok, when I took a break from it to try to write a script based loosely on the things I had experienced in my business life. I didn't really intend to keep writing after that, but I got hooked on the screenplay craft and world.

Not being a movie guy, I am at a disadvantage. But I like the writing part, so I'm going to keep at it for now, see if it goes anywhere.

Funny thing is, I still can't get into most movies. I try, too. We have the package with all the premium channels. It just seems like most of these movies aren't very good, and I can't bring myself to sit through them.

I watch lots of films and lots of TV.  I've also studied the process of making both.  

I think it's more important to know how to put a film together to write a good script than it is to watch a lot of films.  

You can learn that to a degree from reading other scripts but I don't think you ever actually understand it until you try to put a film together yourself.

So my answer to this question is no, you don't really need to watch a lot of movies -- but you do need to know how they are made.

My two cents.    

Quoted from Dreamscale Uh hu...I see another quote of mine is now a discussion thread.  OK Pia...you better watch out...

There was nothing wrong with your post, Jeff. It just made me think and I thought the question valid.

I used to go to the movies twice/week and watch a movie every day while on the NordicTrac......This was many wrinkles and pounds ago... At that time though, I LOVED movies. I honestly can't say I do anymore. Seems like "new" films I watch, I have a hard time finishing. I watch movies though, but most of the time I watch films I know I like. This week I've seen Contact for maybe the 50th time. Yesterday, I watched The Shining for maybe the 80th time. Right now, I'm watching One Flew Over The Cookoo's Nest. I can say that I absolutely hate super hero movies and I also HATE the heavy CGI laden films. They have honestly ruined my love for films. I went to see The Hunger Games today. Not bad, but nothing memorable. I liked the book much better. And that is usually the case. The books are so much better. I love books! I'm currently reading Cornwell's Red Mist when I'm sitting poolside relaxing. When the weather keeps me inside I'm currently reading a thriller written by several thriller writers. (can't remember their names...) When in my car, I'm listening to The Hunger Games and when I get ready for work in the morning, I'm listening to V. Flynn's Kill Shot. I just love books. I wish I could write books, but I can't. Screenplays are the only chance for me to write and I do have a need to write, but like I said, movies just aren't really my thing to watch anymore. I have 7+ thousands of pro screenplays. I honestly usually enjoy reading those more than watching the films.

Anyway, I have no idea what the "trends" are, nor will the trends change what I write. I appreciate everyone's answer. I think we all have different reasons why we write and different goals for our writing as well. I wish all of us the best, regardless of goals.  

There has to be many thoughts on this sort of theory.  There has to be.  As many different thoughts as there are people, writers and genres of films.  And each person's idea works for them as an individual.  Whether or not it translates into their being a successful screewriter is a different story altogether.  I do not believe any one approach will make one a success as a screenwriter.  Or any 'one's' approach.  Successful screenwriters are successful screewriters because that is what they were destined to be.  Sure they have to learn their craft, and yes, they have to understand how the business works and what the people want to see, but they do these things and understand these things because that is what they were meant to be.  Look at Pia's success,and her thoughts about movie watching.  She is a success because that is what she was meant to be.

I only try to write scripts because I love films.  I do agree with Jeff that watching films is very important, as I can say, "That's what I love to see on screen!", and then try to use that feeling in what I write.  I think watching film is important for writing film, but reading scripts is just so much fun.  It's all important.

You have to watch movies in order to write screenplays.  How else is someone going to write the next Total Recall, Arthur, Footloose, Fright Night or Conan?  You need to see the first movie in order to know how the story goes.

Quoted from Nomad You have to watch movies in order to write screenplays.  How else is someone going to write the next Total Recall, Arthur, Footloose, Fright Night or Conan?  You need to see the first movie in order to know how the story goes.

Hope this is sarcasm working overtime...  

Quoted from Baltis. Hope this is sarcasm working overtime...

Perhaps it was meant to be a sequel to another comment?  

Quoted from steven8 Perhaps it was meant to be a sequel to another comment?

Perhaps... I was thinking it might've just been his way of saying "how else is Hollywood going to keep re-writing movies without seeing the originals."  But then I thought to myself -- how could they possibly be watching the originals when the source material for the remakes are so far removed???

I think everyone is different... And everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt -- or 10 pages, whatever comes first.

Quoted from Baltis. Hope this is sarcasm working overtime...

Yes that was meant to be sarcastic.  

Every year there seem to be more and more "remakes", "reboots", "sequels".  Whatever you want to call them.  They aren't original.

You don't have to watch movies in order to be a good story teller, and that's what a screenwriter is.

You need to understand movies in order to effectively write screenplays. Sure, you can be a genius and invent a new way to write movies without ever seeing a movie, but chances are none of us are going to do that. Movies are not books. Movies do not take place inside of a character's mind (most of the time). It's a different type of story. I'm sure most of us understand that, but you need a certain level of understanding of what a movie is before you can be successful as a screenwriter.

In my awesome opinion at least....

Quoted from Nomad You don't have to watch movies in order to be a good story teller, and that's what a screenwriter is.

Um Balt, could you make your signature bigger?  There's still some room for text on the screen.

Was it here or elsewhere that there have been conversations about what constitutes a tasteful size for a signature?

Back to the topic.  

Quoted from mcornetto Um Balt, could you make your signature bigger?  There's still some room for text on the screen. Was it here or elsewhere that there have been conversations about what constitutes a tasteful size for a signature? Back to the topic.

I go big, man... I go big...

Actually, I've been using my phone so I didn't realize how big it was... I uploaded it from facespace -- I'll just make it a linkable instead.    I knew when I drafted it up it was only landscaped at 720... I'll re-scale it sometime.

Actually, I agree with most of you about the reading part, but watching the movies part is subjective for me. However, I would rather be unconventional sometimes than be a strict disciplinarian in improving any form of art, including playing my own Violin in a very special genre.

Screenwriters are NOT special people. They are just "Heart oriented writers" who can bridge the gaps between being poetic, literal, figurative and visual.

Advises available are plenty, but few are really applicable. Write what you feel and feel what you have written by giving adequate gaps. Stop writing from time to time to see if you are not "Men staring at Goats" at times. Beware of "Poser producers" who have no talent but harp about "How the story must be written because it succeeded in one way when previously it was made into a movie".

James Cameron, the master that he is and is considered to be, recently was approached by an Astronomer about an anomaly in his great hit Titanic when he was in the middle of making its three D version. So, the Astronomer wrote to Cameron "The star constellation you have shown on that particular night when the Titanic sunk in the ocean, in 1912, is impossible for us to see it at that spot in the night sky that same time". So, I believe (Someone can confirm this to me, if I am right or wrong about this news), Cameron corrected this to prove how much of a perfectionist he is in his craft.

But one thing about Avatar, the great revenue earner -- Did anybody else notice these flaws in the movie?

A) When Grace and Jake Sully are first sent to Pandora they are both in their Blue Avatars and their original bodies are inside the laying down KIOSKS where they SLEEP on one side to wake up on the other. But when the entire Helicopter range of army arrives they do so as "Humans", not as Avatars. Is this possible?
B) Even if a person is shot dead in the Pandora side of the Avatar's story, the person's body, mind and psyche on the other side would still be intact and function alright.

Any thoughts on the above?
JAG R

Quoted from Nomad You don't have to watch movies in order to be a good story teller, and that's what a screenwriter is.

Can't really go with this - and this is really the difference isn't it? If I just wanted to tell a story, I'd tell it in a magazine, blog, book, to my mate(s) in the pub.

Doesn't telling a story through a visual medium make it a different form of storytelling, and doesn't understanding that visual medium make you more effective at telling a story through it? How can you understand it if you don't partake in it?

BTW I watched 'Stryker' last night. Written by none other than the great Howard R  Cohen. Yes. You got it - he also wrote 'Care Bears' and 'Rainbow Brite and the Star Stealer'. What a man.

End of story -- "Tell the story".

I've been to 3 movies over the last thirty years.

I rarely watch ANY T.V or rent movies to watch.

I pull from my mind what it is I want to write. No pre-conceived formulas, no "stamped" pattern that makes my writing fit in a certain box.

I haven’t written that way, I wont write that way and I think all some writers do, having read many scripts here, is try and recreate the next fashionable script based on XXX at the box office.

Format, I read about, Rules to writing, I read about and am still reading in order to learn as I go.

I don’t need someone else’s ideas of what sells to dictate my style.

read my scripts. if you like them, then I done my job. If not, there will always be another.

Shawn.....><

Quoted from Grandma Bear Jeff, said this the other day. I'm wondering if that's true. To be honest, I don't really watch very many movies anymore. I used to watch 2-3 every week at the theaters 10 years ago. Now I go to see films about 4 times a year. I am however, an avid book reader. IMO, there just isn't enough time to read all the good books out there. My question is, do you really have to watch a bunch of movies to be a good screenwriter? IMHO, it's all about story telling and the "format" doesn't matter. Again, IMHO, it seems to me that a lot of screenwriters try to emulate other screenplays when they write, rather than just write their story. Too much focus on formula and studying old films. Thoughts?

I reckon it's pretty damn critical to watch movies.

Quoted from Forgive Can't really go with this - and this is really the difference isn't it? If I just wanted to tell a story, I'd tell it in a magazine, blog, book, to my mate(s) in the pub. Doesn't telling a story through a visual medium make it a different form of storytelling, and doesn't understanding that visual medium make you more effective at telling a story through it? How can you understand it if you don't partake in it?

Scripts follow a different format than magazines, blogs, books, or talking to mates in pubs.  That's the difference.  The story is still being told.

Understanding the visual medium helps make you more effective, sure.  But you don't have to go see every movie in order to understand it.