Quoted from leitskev Chris, there are a lot of killings in the US, but few like this. Most are gang related. There are innocent victims, but it's gang related. It has nothing to do with a story being "saleable". The idea that you can be sitting in a movie theater with your loved ones and then be trapped and assaulted by a guy like that is pretty horrifying. BTW, those other killings, the gang ones: people care about those too. It's just no one really knows what to do about them. And let's not debate it here, because that would be off topic. But where I am, they are all reported in the news, people care, but no one has answers. Gun control may or may not be a solution, but the problem is caused by something entirely different.

Even in notable gang areas like Oakland and L.A., instances of non-gang homicide are more common than gang-related homicide, in some cases significantly so: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6103a2.htm

I agree that the idea of being trapped in that theatre is horrifying...that's why I refer to it as saleable.  I'm more likely to die of diarrhea, or in a car accident, or completely unexpectedly and unintentionally, than I am to be shot by someone.  Certainly many are much, much, much more likely to die from diseases caused by the way they eat.  As unpleasant as death by diarrhea would be, though, it's not particularly saleable...it can't incite fear from a newspaper article (or for me it wouldn't, anyway), and it can't be a spooky story to tell one's friends.  Fear is saleable, and it's fairly clear that the things we choose to be afraid of have little to do with the things that are most likely to cause us harm.  

That's what I mean when I say people don't really care -- if they did, they'd A) worry about the things that are most likely to kill them, like their diets and their cars; and B) actively work to solve the specific issue in whatever way they saw fit, by fighting for stronger or weaker gun control, or a complete gun ban, or a complete lifting of all gun control, or whatever.  I'm sure people have an emotional reaction -- it's hard not to, as the story is, yes, horrifying.  But like most of the things that temporarily upset people in the world, that emotional reaction, I suspect, won't be transformed into action.

There's no accounting for the way someones brain is wired, or the emotional, relationship or other stimuli responsible for a person committing such an awful act.

This really isn't a forum for debating gun law issues. You could argue an equally valid case for pro and anti.

Ireland has some of the strictest gun control in the world. That didn't stop some nut from jumping into a bus and mowing people over.

It's never the weapon, or the character from a movie someone identified with, it's always the individual.

Chris, I use the word gang as kind of a coverall for inner city and involving certain demographic groups. It is what it is. If someone could convince me of a way to solve it, I would dedicate a percentage of my pay for the rest of my life. But midnight basketball ain't gonna do it. I've never seen anything that will even make a difference. Maybe a time machine that can let is go back and undo history. Culture is a huge determiner of behavior, and culture is a product of historical forces.

And I think people of common sense understand this, and get frustrated trying to think about the problem. Because there is no solution. The huge programs that have been tried since the 1960s not only did not work, but they made things exponentially worse.

That's the thing with the theater murders. People want to do something, but there really, from what's come out so far, isn't much anyone could have done. I think Eoin is right. This guy would have found a way to do something similar. Especially considering his intelligence. We're lucky he didn't blow up the theater.

Hey Kev,

I agree with your comments about culture as a product of historical forces.  Personally, though, from that I would conclude that we have a lot of opportunities to change the immediate problem by changing culture.  I think we are doing this -- in Canada gun violence and homicides have been decreasing steadily; I'm not sure about the States?  Maybe all we can hope for is slow progress (if indeed we are making progress; I'm not sure).  But then, perhaps this places more responsibility than ever on us writers -- as creators of popular culture, perhaps ideally we should be working actively to make arguments against what we find lamentable in the world.

Eoin,

I don't mean to argue for or against gun control.  All I'm saying is that the violence/deaths/tragedies that people choose to care about are very inconsistent, and in my opinion, more related to what the media finds to be a viable story than anything else.  

Regarding "never the weapon, always the individual," though, I'd personally be more tempted to place blame on cultures than individuals.  The ludicrously high (for an affluent nation) level of gun violence in the United States, even when compared to countries with much more relaxed gun laws, suggests to me that you're right to say laws don't have a ton to do with it, but wrong to say that it's always the individual; otherwise, the U.S. seems to have very bad luck with its individuals.  Countries like South Africa and El Salvador also, to me, suggest the influence of culture and circumstance over the actions of the individual.

So, again, maybe we take on a massive responsibility as creators of culture.  

I'll answer this question with a question - anyone feel like strapping themselves to an ACME rocket after watching Wile E. Coyote?

Just found this thread.

This kind of shit has been going on forever with music, movies, and even cable TV.  Is the writer or creator to blame?

HELL NO!  It's ludicrous to even contemplate it.

But here's something that's also ludicrous, and actually should be blamed.

Batman and the like are aimed at the masses and are guaranteed blockbusters.  Guaranteed blockbusters are not going to be R rated, because that would cut their BO revenue way down.  So, "they" go ahead and write these ultra violent movies, film these ultra violent movies, and release them to the masses, almost as if it's perfectly OK and normal to see hundreds, or thousands of peeps getting brutally killed.

It's complete horseshit and to me, actually quite appalling.

A hard R rated horror script or movie is a different beast altogether.  It's not aimed at the masses.  It's marketed as exactly what it is (hopefully).

I've always been so confused when I see feedback or reviews on horror movies, where they say how appalling it is, how violent, how it's in such bad taste and has no place in this lovely world we live in.  Really?  For reals?  C'mon now...

Check out the highest grossing films of all time (and throw out the animated ones) and tell me what they all share.  Wait...I'll tell you what they all share - lots of death, lots of killing, lots of violence.

There will always be whackjobs out there who will relate to this or that and then use this or that for their reasoning when they go off the deep end.  They are to blame, not someone who created something for entertainment.

Guns don't kill people, sequels do!

It had to be said...

Shawn.....><

Ban sequels!

Probably would've been better just to pose this question more as a "yes" or "no" poll.

The original question was - "Do you as a screenwriter feel the need to be a bit more selective and responsible as to what you put on the page, lest it gets produced into a film and some pshycho watches it and decides to imitate it?"

With the exception of 3 yesses, the "general consesus" is no.  Or in Dreamscale's case, HELL NO.

HELL NO!!!!

Quoted from Dreamscale HELL NO!!!!

What if one of your family members was a victim of the Colorado shooting?  Would you then?

Just curious as to what'd it take to sway your opinion.  

My opinion will not be swayed, as I definitely do no buy into the belief that what someone creates, can or should be used against them, when some nutjob goes off.

Should we blame that freak Tom Sixx if someone goes and kidnaps 12 innocent peeps and surgically connects them anus to mouth?  I don't think so.

It's absurd, IMO.

Quoted from Dreamscale My opinion will not be swayed, as I definitely do no buy into the belief that what someone creates, can or should be used against them, when some nutjob goes off. Should we blame that freak Tom Sixx if someone goes and kidnaps 12 innocent peeps and surgically connects them anus to mouth?  I don't think so. It's absurd, IMO.

I wouldn't exactly call it absurd.   I mean ultimately what we're talking about here is the moral compass of society.   It's off kilter and getting worse by the day.

Do we as screenwriter/filmmakers have the ability to change the tide to some degree?  Of course we do, IMO.

I'm gonna hopefully bow out of this discusssion from here on out, being that I have a script to wwrite and need to focus.  But it's been a very interesting topic.

Thanks.

I guess Volta and, to a lesser degree, Franklin are responsible for every death caused by electrocution than... Since they found ways to harness electricity.   Those diabolical pricks!

Absolutely not -- No movie, song, book, comic, piece of art or video game should ever be to blame for the actions of one man/woman.  Then again, Charles Manson never killed anyone and yet we found him to be more guilty than the guilty party involved.  

In america you are always guilty until proven innocent and it seems entertaining forms of media and creative arts are under heavy attack by the left wing.