Justice League: Origins by Chad Handley - Action, Adventure - The world's greatest superheroes meet for the first time, and must overcome their differences to stop a global invasion led by Darkseid. 185 pages - pdf, format

CHRIST ALMIGHTY, 185 pages?

Most users here won't crack this open due to the length.  Might want to try and cut 65 pages from it, industry standard is 120 pages these days.

I'll give it a whirl, but definitely try and cut away as much as possible as it's waaay too long.

EDIT:  Add "FADE IN" to the post-title page, don't just cut straight to the scene as it's the opening.

EDIT 2:  Actually, the first few pages are well-formatted and pretty decent, but still, cut it down.

Some notes on the opening few pages:

Page 1:  Add a "FADE IN" as previously suggested.

Page 1:  "EXT.  PARK -- BASEBALL DIAMOND -- MOMENTS LATER"  no, "EXT. PARK -- BASEBALL DIAMOND -- DAY"

Page 2:  SLOW-MO?  Leave that to the shooting script and director or simply say "Clark sees the ball, it slows"

Page 2:  Capitalized verbs (try to avoid using capitals unless it is for SOUNDS or PROPS or CHARACTER INTROS.

Is this an origin story as well as a Justice League movie? Early on it feels like a Superman movie.  May want to add Darkseid for the prologue and cut away Clark's backstory and Bruce Wayne gets introduced on Page 11, which leaves me to believe the opening 30 or so pages is introductionary scenes for the main ensemble of characters.

Diana introduced on page 15.  I feel as though it's going to take a while to introduce all the characters, therefore "overthrowing" the whole apocalypse thing with Darkseid and focusing merely on character intros, I mean, they're already superheroes in your logline and they have "issues", so why does it feel like an origin story?

Page 19:  "Diana is angry and wants to hit something.  And these guys will do", simply cut it to "Diana is angry, she attacks the frat pack".

Page 21:  Inception horn?  Maybe just say "it sounds like a truck horn"?

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I'd hand you more notes, but by Page 23 we've only introduced Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman and The Flash, no mention of Darkseid whatsoever, or Green Lantern and Martian Manhunter (not sure if you're using him yet).  To me, it feels like an origin story when it should feel like a bunch of heroes coming together to fend off a (so far vacant) dangerous super-villain.

Your structure is good, but sometimes you overwrite things (I know, did it myself plenty of times) and tell rather than show us what is going on.  As stated, it feels like an origin story as opposed to a "coming together".

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A few tips:

Cut out Clark's backstory, away with the "you my new reporter" and have him do something to save Metropolis (Catch a falling plane, stop an asteroid, whatever Superman does).  Then Batman comes along (Bruce Wayne) and talks about something that can benefit Metropolis, whilst being the sardonic playboy he is.  Wonder Woman could arrive on earth, maybe have Superman fly in and save her?

Flash could be like Tony Stark in a way, cocky and arrogant because he's oh so awesome, dig into his character and pull the ace from the deck, per se, have him do something "flashy".

For a prologue, add Darkseid, we need (as an audience) to know the stakes.  Darkseid needs to be more prominent of a threat, because currently he's nowhere.

Just try and cut away most of the backstory and origins, leave it to the imagination.

Lee

I read the first fifteen pages of this and I have to wonder:  is anything going to happen in this script?

This is the JLA for Crissakes!  It's not The Breakfast Club!  Where's tha action?  Where's the invading robot army that Superman takes on?  Or the daring bank heist that Batman stops?  Or the re-animated Nazi soldiers that Wonder Woman should be giving an Amazonian ass-kicking to?

The only action we see in the first fifteen pages is a young Clark Kent crushing a baseball in his hands.  You need to give us something to make our mouth water.  And you ain't doing it here.

You have way too much in this script, which would explain the page count.  I'm under the impression that if you took out the first fifteen pages from this script that nobody would notice.


Phil

Hi, guys.  Author here.

Yeah, yeah. 185 pages.  I consoled myself with the knowledge that Joss Wheedon's first draft of Avengers was 190.  

And the first 15 pages are pretty important.  The main thrust of the story is Superman coming to accept himself and his power and to stop hiding from it, so setting up why he's afraid to completely let go is important.

I also realize there's lots of origin stuff, thus the name.  My goal with this is to set up each character as much as possible because unlike the Avengers, these guys don't have solo movies to set them up (at least, to set them up as the version of the characters we see in the film).  If the Justice League movie is supposed to spin these guys off into solo projects, I thought I should probably try to make them interesting as people, not just as superheroes.

I figured most people here would stop reading before the first 30 pages is up. Reading the threads, you guys seem to give up pretty early on scripts.  I'd implore you to read the first 57 pages.  

I'm not the typical newb here (or maybe I am).  Contrary to appearances, I'm not just a fanboy writing fanfic. I've been writing for a while and I've been a semifinalist in scriptapalooza and won a couple of medium-sized contests. This kind of a big budget thing is a stretch for me, and I wrote it under odd circumstances.  But if you keep reading, I promise stuff happens.  Good stuff.

Further caveat, I wrote most of this before the first trailer for Man of Steel was released, so I realize now that much of Superman's arc may be redundant when Man of Steel comes out (assuming the Superman from the Man of Steel will be the Superman in the Justice League, and assuming Justice League is ever a movie.)

Quoted from ScrewtapeJenkins Reading the threads, you guys seem to give up pretty early on scripts.

That's us. There's a reason for that, I promise.

Hi Chad,

I'll admit that I originally thought that this was going to be waaaay overwritten considering the high page count we're working with. In actual fact, it's not too shabby at all. In fact, I'll go as far as saying that you write quite well. Couple orphans here and there, but nothing too serious.

I'll second what Phil said. We need more action in those first 15. Something to draw a potential audience in.

That's as far as I got. The reason we tend to not spend too much time on many feature lengths is all dependent on if the user is a regular member here, or if we've never heard the name, before. As you're a new member to SS, people aren't likely to read your entire screenplay. It takes time to read features and we have to know our feedback is going somewhere before we read entire feature length screenplays. Wouldn't want to put all that effort in for nothing.

If you want more reads, then I suggest you comment on other screenplays around the site. That's how it works here. If you want reads, you read the work of others and hopefully they return the favor. Build yourself a reputation and you'll do well.

Cheers,

Dan

Yeah, that makes sense, Dan. You guys do seem to get a script a day or more, which is quite a lot.

Okay, I'll give a little before I get.  

Chad, for us to read an entire script, you have to give us reason to finish it.  And I saw no reason in doing so.  You need to open with something big.  While I understand you were trying to do something new with Superman and his powers, you went about it the wrong way.

Everyone knows the origins of Batman, Superman and Woman.  There's been fifteen movies between them and numerous television shows and cartoon series.  Not to mention the fact that they've been around forever (the youngest of the three, WW, is over seventy years old).   There's no need to mention them.  You need to cut to the chase and start off with some supervillain ass-kicking.

While you may not consider this fanfic, it might as well be.  If it does end up be the type of script that is very produceable, there's only one place you can bring it too.  When I started coming up with The Devil's Jokebook, I was writing it as a John Constantine/Hellblazer script.  Then I realized how limited I would be if I wanted to show it around.  So I changed it and made it my own.


Phil

With all due respect, how can you know if a script opens the wrong way unless you know how the opening pays off? Everything I'm opening with, especially with the three characters you mention, pays off.  And none of the things in the opening is the classic origins of these characters. I'm not showing Superman land on the planet, or Bruce Wayne's parents being killed, or Steve Trevor landing on Paradise Island (Wonder Woman in this script hasn't met Steve Trevor yet, and is banned from Paradise Island for a character-specific, plot-important reason). You can't say there's no need for this stuff if you don't know where it's going, and you don't.

I can appreciate that it didn't grab you, but I made the conscious decision to establish the characters as people first rather than to start with supervillain punching.  I've read scripts where they went the other way, and I just never cared about the heroes as people.  I can say with certainty that no one who reads the script to the end will complain about a lack of action.

Quoted from ScrewtapeJenkins With all due respect, how can you know if a script opens the wrong way unless you know how the opening pays off?

If I get bored reading it and put it down, it's a sure bet that the opening doesn't pay off.  And I'm sure I won't be the only one who feels this way.

As I said earlier, if you want us to read the entire script then you have to give a script we want to read in its entirety.  The first script I ever read, here, I read it completely even though I thought it sucked big time.  Why?  Because I thought I had to.  It nearly turned me away from SS.

If you want to include origins in the script, that's fine.  Just do it later in the script, after you hook us in.


Phil

I just disagree.  If the first 15 pages didn't hook you, then there's no arguing against that. But you can't say the first 15 pages have no structural purpose because you got bored. One thing has nothing to do with the other.

My version of Clark Kent discovered his powers by permanently disabling a playmate.  This led him to pretend to be a germaphobe for the rest of his life so that he didn't have to risk hurting anyone else through casual contact.  This fear of his own power spills into his life as Superman, and makes him afraid to really let go even when it's called for.  He can't stop holding back, but unfortunately for the world, he's the only one who can beat Darkseid, and he can't do that if he doesn't learn to stop being afraid of his own potential.  And it's his teammates, particularly Wonder Woman, who has the opposite problem, who teach him that it's okay to let go.  My vision of Justice League is for characters who don't just need each other's superpowers to help them defeat a supervillain, but characters who need each other as people to help them defeat their own inner demons.

Batman is used to getting his way through intimidation and manipulation, and has no idea how to cooperate with people as equals.  Green Lantern thinks as a Green Lantern he shouldn't need help, and if he can't defend Earth from a global invasion (which is his whole reason for being made a Green Lantern) that he's failed. Wonder Woman is a warrior from a warrior culture who treats every confrontation, even ones with her teammates, like it's war.  Everything I'm setting up in the first 30 pages is about how much the characters need to learn from each other.  At least, that's what I'm going for.

Now, it's a fair note to say maybe I should start with some action before I establish that, but to say I could get rid of the first 15 pages and no one would notice is something no one could know after 15 pages.

Also, I happen to know that after the first 30 or so pages, the rest of the movie is 150 pages of more or less solid action.  And since I have a hard time believing that anyone will walk out of a hypothetical Justice League movie after 30 minutes (particularly people who have seen the hypothetical trailer) I don't think action in the first 15 pages serves the movie as well as taking the time to set up the characters.

But these are larger, deeper, structural issues that, in my opinion,  can't be meaningfully commented on after 15 pages.  Now, maybe you think the first 15 pages are so bad that it doesn't matter. That may well be the case.  But the idea that you can ascertain whether the script is properly structured after 15 pages is pretty presumptuous, unless you're clairvoyant.  

Give us something to whet our appetites, then you can show us about the characters' quirks.  And be brief with it.  You can show us their quirks without origins.

You can show someone try to shake Superman's hand (to thank him) and Supes turns away.  Stuff like this.


Phil

Well, that would just make people think Superman was a dick.  

I appreciate your input and I'll give it some thought, but I really think given the ludicrous amount of action in the script from page 35-185, the last thing the script needs is more action.

But I appreciate you taking the time to read as much of the script as you did.

Superman is a dick.

You can briefly explain after the super-snub why he doesn't touch others.  Maybe he snubs Batman and Wonder Woman explains it to him.  This could be done within a page of script and would look a lot better than three page explanation you open with.

You mention that Joss Whedon's first draft of Avengers was 190 pages.  Is this your first draft?


Phil