SimplyScripts Discussion Board
Blog Home - Produced Movie Script Library - TV Scripts - Unproduced Scripts - Contact - Site Map
ScriptSearch
Welcome, Guest.
It is March 28th, 2024, 4:28pm
Please login or register.
Was Portal Recent Posts Home Help Calendar Search Register Login
Please do read the guidelines that govern behavior on the discussion board. It will make for a much more pleasant experience for everyone. A word about SimplyScripts and Censorship


Produced Script Database (Updated!)
One Week Challenge - Who Wrote What and Writers' Choice.


Scripts studios are posting for award consideration

Short Script of the Day | Featured Script of the Month | Featured Short Scripts Available for Production
Submit Your Script

How do I get my film's link and banner here?
All screenplays on the simplyscripts.com and simplyscripts.net domain are copyrighted to their respective authors. All rights reserved. This screenplaymay not be used or reproduced for any purpose including educational purposes without the expressed written permission of the author.
Forum Login
Username: Create a new Account
Password:     Forgot Password

SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    General Boards    Questions or Comments  ›  Constructive criticism
Users Browsing Forum
No Members and 2 Guests

 Pages: « ... 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29 » : All
Recommend Print
  Author    Constructive criticism  (currently 54936 views)
Max
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 11:06am Report to Moderator
Been Around


Ain't nobody write like that, bruh.

Location
UK
Posts
578
Posts Per Day
0.10
Yeah but if I was to criticize one of Dreamscale's scripts or whatever, I know in the back of his head he's probably thinking "Who is this scrub? What has he written? Show me!"

I kind of feel as if my perspective would be wasted in cases like this, I'm not saying he or anyone else thinks like that but still...
Logged
Private Message Reply: 345 - 434
JSimon
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 11:09am Report to Moderator
New


Posts
105
Posts Per Day
0.03
Fenigus, that is wrong. And Dream would agree with me. Because you can give feedback on what works with the story, which is really the most important thing anyway.

There is much value in the review of someone who's opinion has not been colored by pet peeves or theory. Someone who just has pure reaction to the story. And for veteran writers, that's much more important.
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 346 - 434
eldave1
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 11:37am Report to Moderator
January Project Group



Location
Southern California
Posts
6874
Posts Per Day
1.95

Quoted from DustinBowcot


Plenty of people take honesty in the wrong way. I know I did. People told me what was wrong with my scripts and I got all butt hurt. It wasn't that the reviews were dickish in any way it was simply that they were negative.

IMO, negativity in itself is enough for some writers to get the hump and declare the person delivering the negativity a dick.


True.




My Scripts can all be seen here:

http://dlambertson.wix.com/scripts
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 347 - 434
eldave1
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 11:40am Report to Moderator
January Project Group



Location
Southern California
Posts
6874
Posts Per Day
1.95

Quoted from JSimon
A critique has to be more than honest to be a model. It has to be useful.


To be a "model" - perhaps. I can see that. That being said, I would not want to limit critiques to those that are "useful."


My Scripts can all be seen here:

http://dlambertson.wix.com/scripts
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 348 - 434
JSimon
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 11:48am Report to Moderator
New


Posts
105
Posts Per Day
0.03
What good is a critique that is not useful?

Of course there are all kinds of ways a critique can be useful. Even "I didn't open your script because I don't like the title" is useful.

However, "I didn't open your script because at the moment I am watching the Beverly Hillbillies" is not useful. Neither is "I stopped reading your script because it's not written in iambic pentameter" or "I stopped reading your script because the Fade was on the wrong side".
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 349 - 434
eldave1
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 12:06pm Report to Moderator
January Project Group



Location
Southern California
Posts
6874
Posts Per Day
1.95

Quoted from JSimon
What good is a critique that is not useful?

Of course there are all kinds of ways a critique can be useful. Even "I didn't open your script because I don't like the title" is useful.

However, "I didn't open your script because at the moment I am watching the Beverly Hillbillies" is not useful. Neither is "I stopped reading your script because it's not written in iambic pentameter" or "I stopped reading your script because the Fade was on the wrong side".


Because sometimes "usefulness" is in the eye of the beholder (subjective).  

The extremes of this equation are obvious (i.e., pointing out a typo is useful - concluding that the script is horrible because there is a typo, is not).  However, there are gray areas. The filmables issue comes to mind. If someone says - you should never write something that is not filmable - I don't find that useful because I think that the premise is wrong.  However, I'm okay with some one offering that as a critique.  

Now, if someone said you included a filmable in your script and therefore you suck at writing - then it is both not useful and dickish. If they said you didn't include a DAY or NIGHT on your third scene heading and therefore you suck at writing - then it is useful and dickish.


My Scripts can all be seen here:

http://dlambertson.wix.com/scripts
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 350 - 434
Dreamscale
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 12:14pm Report to Moderator
Guest User




Quoted from Max
Yeah but if I was to criticize one of Dreamscale's scripts or whatever, I know in the back of his head he's probably thinking "Who is this scrub? What has he written? Show me!"

I kind of feel as if my perspective would be wasted in cases like this, I'm not saying he or anyone else thinks like that but still...


No, Max.  Mr. Simon is correct and I do agree with him 100%.

I literally always say that any feedback is good feedback, and I truly beleive that.  It doesn't matter where or who it comes from.  It doesn't matter if it's accurate, even.  In fact, as I also always say, each and every writer needs to learn who and who not to listen to when it comes to feedback, based on teh feedback they give on a routine basis.  Here are numerous peeps here in SS who have literally no clue what they're talking about and their feedback is what makes that obvious.

Feedback is an opinion, and everyone should make their opinion clear.  It does also help when you may think something is wrong or just not right, and the writer or someone else chimes in to correct you, you definitely learn something.

Logged
e-mail Reply: 351 - 434
AnthonyCawood
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 1:12pm Report to Moderator
January Project Group



Location
UK
Posts
4319
Posts Per Day
1.14
When I started on SS I had a similar attitude to Fenigus, but think it was Dustin who nudged me to provide feedback and get involved... good advice, because as Simon and Jeff say you can always subjectively state what you do and don't like in a story... and why.

You could be the intended audience for the film, so your input could be really helpful to the writer... even if they are an old hand.

Agree with Jeff too that you need to work out who to listen to and also to remember to listen to your inner voice and stay true to what you believe.

I think the OWC is great for demonstrating this, if you check any script out, mine included, you'll see some contradictory feedback given, so you can't really incorporate both elements as they're in opposition. So you as the writer and owner of the story have to chose.

Anthony


Anthony Cawood - Award winning screenwriter
Available Short screenplays - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/short-scripts
Available Feature screenplays - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/feature-film-scripts/
Screenwriting articles - http://www.anthonycawood.co.uk/articles
IMDB Link - http://www.imdb.com/name/nm6495672/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1
Logged Offline
Site Private Message Reply: 352 - 434
JSimon
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 1:33pm Report to Moderator
New


Posts
105
Posts Per Day
0.03
One thing for new writers to watch for: there is no other place like Simplyscripts that I'm aware of, so that's great...but be careful to not have this as your only source on writing. Get your hands on pro scripts and read as many as you can. You don't even have to read the whole script, just read the first act on most of them. But read a lot of them. Not old-timey scripts, I'm talking about scripts from recent years, especially spec scripts. Then make up your own mind on what is "correct" or not, and what works best. You owe it to yourself.
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 353 - 434
eldave1
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 2:18pm Report to Moderator
January Project Group



Location
Southern California
Posts
6874
Posts Per Day
1.95

Quoted from JSimon
One thing for new writers to watch for: there is no other place like Simplyscripts that I'm aware of, so that's great...but be careful to not have this as your only source on writing. Get your hands on pro scripts and read as many as you can. You don't even have to read the whole script, just read the first act on most of them. But read a lot of them. Not old-timey scripts, I'm talking about scripts from recent years, especially spec scripts. Then make up your own mind on what is "correct" or not, and what works best. You owe it to yourself.


True that.

I read the King's Speech last week - it violated several screenwriting "conventions" - I thought it was brilliant.

Also interesting to read scripts for movies that you loved for movies that you didn't. I loved the script for The Fault in Our Stars - hated the movie.  Conversely - I loved the movie "As Good as It Gets - found the script a haphazard bore. Teaches one that things do not always translate from paper to film and vice versa.


My Scripts can all be seen here:

http://dlambertson.wix.com/scripts
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 354 - 434
DanC
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 2:38pm Report to Moderator
Old Timer


Killing villains since 1980!

Location
Buffalo NY
Posts
1131
Posts Per Day
0.34

Quoted from DustinBowcot


Actually it's a time factor. I haven't got time for people I do not know. I know Dan and like him, so decided that I should elaborate as to why I was out on the first page. If you notice, my notes are only about page 1. I'm not going to get that detailed for everybody.


Thanks Dustin, that was nice of you.  I appreciated the feedback too.  


Please read my scripts:
http://www.simplyscripts.net/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?b-series/m-1427564706/

I'm interested in reading animation, horror, sci fy, suspense, fantasy, and anything that is good.  I enjoy writing the same.  Looking to team with anyone!

Thanks
Dan
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 355 - 434
Max
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 2:40pm Report to Moderator
Been Around


Ain't nobody write like that, bruh.

Location
UK
Posts
578
Posts Per Day
0.10
Dan is the man, did me some mad favours.
Logged
Private Message Reply: 356 - 434
DanC
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 2:43pm Report to Moderator
Old Timer


Killing villains since 1980!

Location
Buffalo NY
Posts
1131
Posts Per Day
0.34

Quoted from Max
Yeah but if I was to criticize one of Dreamscale's scripts or whatever, I know in the back of his head he's probably thinking "Who is this scrub? What has he written? Show me!"

I kind of feel as if my perspective would be wasted in cases like this, I'm not saying he or anyone else thinks like that but still...


Max,
     That's the wrong attitude.  Here is why:  We all have something to offer.  As others have said, you might be the intended target for the movie.  You might have insight into a problem.  You might spot a typo.  You might spot something.

You might spot something or think of something that opens a door for the writer to take the script to new heights.  But, if you don't say it, then the writer never knows.

For my script, Tales of Horror, Mark Renshaw said what if you made it more about her hating hunters?  And I went OMG that's AWESOME.  She hates the hunt, I establish that in the story.  If I follow through on it, I can add others to her wrath.  And I have a feeling if she was real and she came here, she'd be really pissed off b/c hunters today don't take risks.  They don't hunt.  They massacre.  The stuff they hunt has no real chance.  

If he's too shy to say that to me, IF I decide to do a followup, I never get that idea.  And it goes away.  

We are all here to get better.  We are all here to help others get better.  Any thought might be the one that allows the writer to achieve a dream.  So, who cares if you think you aren't worthy.  The worst you could be is wrong, and that's not a big deal.

The only harm is if you think your advice is infallible.  But, I have yet to see a person who suffers from that.  

Dan


Please read my scripts:
http://www.simplyscripts.net/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?b-series/m-1427564706/

I'm interested in reading animation, horror, sci fy, suspense, fantasy, and anything that is good.  I enjoy writing the same.  Looking to team with anyone!

Thanks
Dan
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 357 - 434
DanC
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 2:46pm Report to Moderator
Old Timer


Killing villains since 1980!

Location
Buffalo NY
Posts
1131
Posts Per Day
0.34

Quoted from Max
Dan is the man, did me some mad favours.


Thanks Max,
      Just trying to help.  One thing a lot of us newer peeps might not realize is, everything we do, read, write, critique, etc, all helps us become better.  I am not good at dialog.  I read a script and said wow, is that on the nose.

A week ago, I NEVER would have made that observation.  EVER.  

Learning is what we can all do.  It's the only hope we have if we are to ever achieve our dream of getting movies done that we thought of.  


Please read my scripts:
http://www.simplyscripts.net/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?b-series/m-1427564706/

I'm interested in reading animation, horror, sci fy, suspense, fantasy, and anything that is good.  I enjoy writing the same.  Looking to team with anyone!

Thanks
Dan
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 358 - 434
DanC
Posted: June 2nd, 2015, 3:06pm Report to Moderator
Old Timer


Killing villains since 1980!

Location
Buffalo NY
Posts
1131
Posts Per Day
0.34
I wanted to add:

I didn't always have a thick skin.  Luckily, I played a game called Magic the Gathering for over 20 years.  And magic is a lot like writing.  You build a deck (write a story) and you and your buddies have some fun (or read it).  You are the best at magic (or the only writer amongst your friends, or you're all about the same level) and you mistakingly think you're good.  Then you take your act on the road and enter a tournament (submit to a contest or join a site) and you get destroyed.  At that point you have 2 options:

1.  Quit. Just play amongst your buds (write for your buds or local contests)

2.  Get better by getting a thick skin and listening to advice, especially by those who are better.  In one event, I played this kid.  He sat down and said to me that he felt bad for me b/c his deck had never lost and he was gonna mop the floor with me.  He told me don't get too upset, he was the best amongst his buds.  I was a seasoned vet by this time.  My buds refrained from cracking up too hard.  We played and I crushed him, badly.  It was his first tournament.  

I tried to offer advice, but, he actually thought I got "lucky" and stormed off.  A few hours later, he comes up to me and asks if the offer of help was still there.  He hadn't won a game yet, much less a match.  I said sure.  

IN MY OPINION  You MUST have a think skin to make it at writing.  I remember people who hated Silence of the Lambs.  Hated it.  Not everyone will like your story.  However, if 2 (or more) people say the exact same thing, you should take notice.

When Dustin and Dreamscape were harsh, I wanted to know why.  I wasn't angry or upset.  I wanted to learn.  And I did learn something from them.

Now, you could construe them saying I'm out on page 1 as being a bit dickish, after all, the story could pick up.  But, that's their right.  I know in a story I wrote, a person hated the first 5 pages, thought it was gonna be terrible, then proceeded to like the next 60.  No issues.  That can happen.

I admit, I care more about story then I do the "rules" and I have to work on that.  No one will ever read the story if they toss the script aside.

Remember, you could have the best story in the world starting on page 4.  If no one gets past page 2, it doesn't matter.  Everything counts.  Every page counts.  Every word counts.  

One of the biggest differences from writing a novel and a screenplay is that novels are often paid by the word.  You can write a 500 page novel.  You can NOT write a 500 page screenplay.  Hell, you can't write a 300 page screenplay.  And how many 200 pagers are there?  5?

So, every word matters.  every single word.  If you choose to have an aside or unfilmable here, you lose space elsewhere.  That is why people say write when they can shoot.  

How many know about the orphan word rule?

I didn't.  The orphan word rule is never have a word (or even 2 small words) on a line by themselves.  Pro writers and readers hate it b/c it SLOWS THEM DOWN.  How many times do we hear that?  

If you are Speilburg, you can write a 120 page screenplay and have the first 40 pages be boring.  We can't.  I have read we have at most 10 pages.  AT MOST.  

Taking advice is the only way we can learn.  Even if you give reasons for dropping out on page 1, perhaps just skip that and stop the advice when u stop reading.  Does it matter why or when you drop out?  You dropped out.  By stopping with the advice on page 1, I think we can assume you didn't finish it.  I can handle that I dropped out.  Some, might not be able to.

I'm still new and I guess I have more tolerance.  Hell, I read halfway in that awful Santa and the Pole Dancer story.  

So, perhaps we should have a post on here where all people can ask what counts as being a dick and what counts as being honest, but, harsh.  

Oh, Dustin, you know I like you and don't want to offend you, but, your one comment did hurt a bit.  I'm not hurt anymore, but, at the moment, it stung.  You said (when u didn't know it was me) that I wasn't even trying.  Clearly everyone who posts something is trying.  I can imagine some thinking that would be a dickish comment.  Again, I'm fine and I hope you offer me advice on my stuff.  Guys like you and Jeff are people that I need to get me technically in shape to have my stuff read.  

That's my 2 cents.

Dan


Please read my scripts:
http://www.simplyscripts.net/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?b-series/m-1427564706/

I'm interested in reading animation, horror, sci fy, suspense, fantasy, and anything that is good.  I enjoy writing the same.  Looking to team with anyone!

Thanks
Dan
Logged Offline
Private Message Reply: 359 - 434
 Pages: « ... 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29 » : All
Recommend Print

Locked Board Board Index    Questions or Comments  [ previous | next ] Switch to:
Was Portal Recent Posts Home Help Calendar Search Register Login

Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post polls
You may not post attachments
HTML is on
Blah Code is on
Smilies are on


Powered by E-Blah Platinum 9.71B © 2001-2006