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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Unproduced Screenplay Discussion    Comedy Scripts  ›  State School Moderators: bert
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  Author    State School  (currently 1837 views)
Don
Posted: March 4th, 2010, 8:14pm Report to Moderator
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So, what are you writing?

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State School by John Patterson - Comedy - Two college-bound best friends, about to be separated for the first time, end up at the last minute at the same college where one does every outrageous thing he can think of to sabotage the other from finding love and moving on to the college of his choice. - pdf, format


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Ledbetter
Posted: March 5th, 2010, 9:58pm Report to Moderator
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John,
First of all, good job on writing a full length comedy. That’s not easy. I want you to know I got to page 23 then stopped. Not because of the technical issues (and there are a few) but because this script seems to have been done so many times before. Not exactly- but the over all feel of it was just to repeated.

I did like the Wackentosh line. It was very funny.
The technical stuff is easily fixed. Things like the parenthetical (), the -WE SEE, the BEAT, the large blocks of action and the "telling and not showing" And the camera angles. All of which is not needed in a spec script.

All in all, you did well. I hope to see more of your work.

Shawn......><
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jap313
Posted: March 14th, 2010, 9:58pm Report to Moderator
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Shawn,
     Thanks for the post.  Although the guys-go-to-college theme is overdone, if you finish reading the script, I believe you’ll find that the comedy is very original.  No matter how original a comedy’s plot is, if it’s not funny, then it’s no good.  I tried to write a funny movie.  However,  I can see how you wouldn’t want to see another American Pie, but if you finish reading, I think you’d find that State School has a lot of originality.
     As far as the technical issues go, I formatted State School off of Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg’s Superbad.  I don’t know if I should have done that or not.  I do see that not many writers use (beat) and WE; is there an authority on formatting that I don’t know about?

Thanks,
JP     
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rogerooni
Posted: March 22nd, 2010, 2:16am Report to Moderator
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JP,

wow what can i say.  you are a comedic genius.  I laughed through the entire script, the jokes were superb.  Your use of (beat) superb, seriously you have a gift with dialogue.  The only problem i had with state school is the central storyline really doesn't have any urgency.  A lot of times while the stuff happening on screen is hilarious it didn't really move the story along.  if we compare with american pie ( state school is MUCH funnier by the way) the protags in that had a goal to get laid with their specific girl and there were obstacles in their way.  in state school the goal is really vague.... is it getting money to repay the bills? not really.  its not eric going to gilchrist and its really not like john planned to keep eric at state.  so in the middle of the script i kinda lost a little momentum.  Also the goat scene is really strange in that it is way too morbid for a comedy?  I'm not sure how it will be presented on screen but maybe make it so gerald doesn't slaughter the thing?

ps. I really wanted you to extend the flag football scene with the church frat.  that woulda been awesome.

so some editing things
pg 44 exists-> exits
89 americans->american
103 by->buy


H.S.P  Sci Fi, Fantasy - When a splinter group instigates a desperate plot to prevent the extinction of their species at the expense of human life, a jaded Doctor and an FBI double agent is caught in a struggle between their own people and their humanity. 119

Revision History (2 edits; 1 reasons shown)
rogerooni  -  March 22nd, 2010, 5:05pm
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jap313
Posted: March 22nd, 2010, 7:06pm Report to Moderator
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Thanks, Roger.  That’s a great compliment.  I’ve always thought that comedy is best when it’s dialogue driven.  I’ve never been a fan of fat-guy-falls-down stuff, and I have to say, just because a Chinese guy says something in a funny voice doesn’t make it funny.

I’m glad you commented on me using (beat).  I seem to use it a lot more than other writers, but I’ve always felt that it was necessary to get timing down.

I know what you’re saying about the screenplay not having a sense of urgency.  It always annoys me when I see comedies that have outrageously corny plots.  I’ve always felt that a movie didn’t need a great hook if it was just funny (i.e. the un-funny American Pie movies).  However, in trying to avoid a corny plot, I seemed to have made one that is very vague and ambiguous (that’s why the logline really sucks).  It’s a hard point to defend, but I tried to justify the vague plot to myself by saying State School is a snapshot of life, sort of like Y Tu Mama Tambien.  I know it’s a weak explanation, but I would say that in the end Eric learns about true friendship.  

Thanks for the review.  Hopefully, I will finish this other comedy soon; it’s got a better plot, and I think it’ll be just as funny as State School.

JP
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adrew6677
Posted: April 7th, 2010, 1:12pm Report to Moderator
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ok I am new to this but let me try. First off great job I injoyed your comedy. Second sorry for my spelling, butI will try to give you my view point though.
pg 15 "my friend could lose his scholarship." drop the "for college at the end.
pg 22"thats what she said." is played out.
Pg 23 Condom wrapper brenda found. What is the point of this?
Pg 35-40 is a little slow.
Pg 56 this mtv scene is a little confusing.
Pg 58 "pretty rad" nobody talks like this anymore.
The scenes at the movie and bar with ashley on Pg 69. It seems more important to the story. you need more dioulouge and action here maybe several pages worth.
pg 73. Jims diolouge needs broken up. to hard on the eyes.
pg 75 goat scene is too weird. I would say keep the goat alive and leave more to the imagination.
106. action is to long, I would break it up somehow.
107.that's what she said overplayed.
Over all I injoyed your script alot. I think there are times you could show a little more phyiscal humor to break the diolouge up. But I get what you said in your post about being diolouge drivren. I think you did a good job. I
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jap313
Posted: April 7th, 2010, 5:32pm Report to Moderator
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Thanks for the review adrew.  I’m glad you enjoyed it.  You have some helpful comments.  I’ll just go through some of them.

Yeah, I believe the line does read better without “for college” at the end.  

As for the “that’s what she said,” I can’t agree with you more.  That’s-what-she-said jokes are definitely played out; that’s why I used it.  I didn’t want the line to be funny as much as I wanted it to define John as a person.  John’s the type of guy that says played-out, crass jokes all the time.  In the end, I had Katie say a that’s-what-she-said to show in a way that she and John are very alike – sort of soul mates.  

The condom wrapper thing was just a joke.  I brought it back a couple of pages later.

What specifically is confusing about the MTV show?

Thanks,
JP
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adrew6677
Posted: April 16th, 2010, 9:58am Report to Moderator
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sorry been working a lot. I get the played out thing with jhon I agree it works but that line that's what she said may turn off people who may be intrested in your script. It's something that you might have to see on film to get the full emotion of what your trying to acomplish, wich may not be good in the short term.  I get the MTV show except for the INtroduction of the show. It makes since in the end but I think you should take a look at intoducing the first episode better, or maybe it's just me. I just feel like it is very distracting to the rest of the script. I like the Idea over all though.  Like I said I'm new to this so you may want to get a second person to take a look at it, before changing anything.   I do like the script though.
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adrew6677
Posted: April 16th, 2010, 10:01am Report to Moderator
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o and the condom wrapper latter on is good when you bring it back but It's just a little weird when it's first shown to us. I was waiting for a big joke when we first see it and I didn't get it so it left me a little confused.
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Dreamscale
Posted: May 19th, 2010, 7:20pm Report to Moderator
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Hey JP, I got through your script, as promised.  I wish I had good news for you, but that’s not the case at all.  This was seriously one of the toughest chugs I’ve ever been through.  I’m going to give it to you straight up though.  You seem like a cool guy and I want you to know I hate writing negative reviews…I really do, but other than you actually completing a feature length script, I don’t have anything positive to say.

Let’s get to it…

There are so many problems/issues/mistakes/typos/grammar errors/technical errors/awkward phrasing/crazy asides and unfilmables/HUGE blocks of text/HUGE blocks of dialogue/talking head syndromes/camera directions/we see’s/we hears/we do whatevers/attack of the wrylies and beats/passive verbiage/incorrect SLUGS/lack of SLUGS/incorrect character intro’s/underlined words and phrases/name dropping/poorly constructed passages/almost impossible to follow story line and plot/insane over writing and over describing/and just crazy leaps in logic and story.

Honestly, I’d bet that in this 100+ page script, there are at least 1,000 mistakes…probably closer to 2,000.  I’ve never come across so many different things going on in a single script.

I tried taking page by page notes for you, but had to stop early on…there were just way too many.  At least the notes I did take should help get you on the right track.  Read lots of scripts in here from respected writers.  Read all the info you can on screenwriting (in here in the Screenwriting Class section, as well as any and all you can find on the internet).  Hell, get yourself a good Screenwriting book...it can’t hurt.

Story-wise, this was just a complete mess, I’m sorry to say.  It really has very little to do with your title, and the direction I think you wanted to take this.  All the stuff involving the TV show was show was literally almost impossible to follow and comprehend.  None of it was properly formatted, which really added to the difficulty of the read.  So many random things were going on.  Everything skipped along at crazy intervals.  You spent a few pages setting up scenes, and then just ended the scene before anything even happened, leaving us with nothing but dull dialogue.

Buried somewhere inside all this stuff, I do see what you were aiming for…but it’s such an old, clichéd plot/story/theme.

There were numerous situations here that just screamed out “wrong”.  It was very offensive in many ways, at many times….and I don’t mean like raunchy humor.

Really wish I could be more positive here, JP, but I can’t.  I have to be honest, even if it all sounds harsh.  Hope this helps, though.  Take care.

Page 1 – OK, let’s get right into it with your first passage – these are issues that will most likely be running rampant throughout your script, but I’ll only bring them up once, right here.  First sentence has a bunch of issues, and you just can’t start off a script like this, because people will assume that these mistakes will be continuing throughout.  Please note that many of the things I’ll be bringing up are open for debate and many Pro writers do this stuff all the time…BUT…that doesn’t mean it’s right or acceptable for unproduced writers.

Missing a comma after “view”.  I’m a stickler for correct punctuation.  IMO, it’s very important and shows that a writer takes his work seriously enough to edit these things out.  I have a feeling that there will be many, many instances of missing commas, but I’ll only bring them up when I see a new situation involving incorrect or missing punctuation.

You want to be careful when using camera directions (bird’s eye view), as it’s pretty much frowned upon and gets annoying quickly.  I tend to really appreciate these sorts of angles, and they really can set a scene nicely. It’s just tough when you start out this way, and I suggest trying to stay away as much as you can, unless it really helps the scene.

You don’t want to go over 4 lines in a passage…you start off with a 5 liner, and again, this is all stuff that will turn readers away right off the bat.

You need to stay away from anything involving “we”.  “We see”, “We follow”, We hear”, “We pan”…whatever.  There’s just no reason for their inclusion in a script.  Every action you write in a script is something “we see”.  Every sound you include is something “we hear”.  And so on.  It is assumed, and obvious…you don’t want to include these phrases…ever!  It is a waste of space, it increases the read time, it’s annoying, and it comes off as amateurish.

Stay away from passive verbiage whenever possible (verbs that end in “ing”).  These are usually preceded by “is”, which you don’t want to use.  Scripts show action and movement.  Passive verbiage is static and does not convey action.  Once you get it, it becomes very simple to avoid this way of writing.  I don’t want to tell you that you never can do it, but don’t start your script off this way, because it’s a red flag again and you don’t want people looking for these types of things right from the get go.

You’ll want to CAP a character’s name when they’re first intro’d, but not until they are actually on screen.

Avoid using words like “begins to”, or the like.  It either happens or it doesn’t happen, so stay away from this verbiage.

Also, watch out for sentences starting with “while”.  It’s just not a good way to begin a sentence, IMO.

When describing a character’s age, you can use the actual number, as opposed to writing it out…it saves space and reads easier.

Note your 6 line passage here.  There are numerous problems going on inside it…most that have already been addressed above.  A new issue is over describing, or over writing.   We rarely need to know what a character is wearing unless it comes into play, or gives characterization.  Just be careful of how much unwanted info you throw out.  Also, try and group your passage based on what’s happening in the “shot”.  This passage should be broken up into at least 2, if not 3 passages (1- his description, 2 – a longer shot with him in front of the kids, and 3 – the posters on the wall).

Page 2 – A huge pet peeve of mine is over use of wrylies.  You’re already going wrylie crazy here.  It’s a form of direction and you should do it very sparingly, only when important.  Same with the “sotto” stuff…look how annoying it gets.  You’ve got 7 wrylies on this page and 2 beats…WAY too much!  Same deal with the beats…IMO, they should really only be used when necessary in speech.  Basically, based on your wrylies and beats on this page, you’ve used an additional 10 lines that you didn’t need to.  Be wary of these!

“vagines” – “vaginas”

Page 3 – “John is weirded out by the proposal. He shakes his head no like "it's cool don't worry about it." – Another pet peeve of mine…asides.  Many use them, but IMO, they are unnecessary, annoying, and a waste of space again.

Again, each and every time you intro a new character, you have to CAP his name…even when it’s “KID 1”, or whatever.

Page 4 – “vagine” – “vagina” again – I won’t bring this up again, but look out for them.

Most will say not to write anything about inserting a title or rolling credits.  IMO, there is a time and place for it…I’d say this is not either…especially since you haven’t properly set your scene with a SLUG (and it’s obviously a new scene).

OK, look at the passage under the new SLUG (JOHN’S VAN).  Every single sentence has “is” in it and every single one of them is passive.  Let’s do a really quick rewrite…”John drives.  Eric sits next to him.  A dolphin ornament hangs from the rearview mirror.  Eric browses through songs on an iPod, hooked up to the radio.”

Page 6 – Another pet peeve of mine is when writers underline or bold certain words.  Not really necessary and it gets quiet annoying when it’s frequent. If you really need to draw attention to something, it’s cool, but not here for sure.

General note – That’s a very long scene in the car with nothing but dialogue going down…no visuals whatsoever.  Be careful of this kind of stuff, as IMO, it wasn’t funny or necessary, but we’ll see where it goes.

Page 8 – “Uncle Lester lives in a trailer in a pretty rough looking neighborhood. The trailer is a run-down, meth cook-house. There are pots lying around and dogs barking. John pulls into the driveway.” – Lots of issues in this passage again.  No reason to start out with “Uncle Lester lives…”. Also, you’re telling us that this place is a meth cook house…you need to show us…would we know by seeing pots lying around?  I highly doubt it.  Finally, again, I don’t think you are breaking up your passages properly. The last sentence should stand on its own, or at least not be part of the description of the place.

The next huge block of text takes place (for the most part) INSIDE the place, so a new SLUG is needed to intro the fact that we’re changing into an INT scene.

Page 9 – a “national chain”?  Huh?  No need for these types of comments at all!

Page 10 – “stripers” – “strippers” – very unintentionally funny!

Page 11 – “se” – “see”

Page 12 – You have the exact same SLUG twice in a row…you can’t do that.  If you want to show that times has elapsed, just use a mini SLUG – “LATER”.

“A few moments pass” – again, you cannot do this type of shit in a script.  Are you seriously saying that we witness a couple of minutes of the exact same thing?  No way…doesn’t work at all like this.

General note – this is way too slow and boring, IMO.  The writing is very poor with so many problems, it’s really beginning to be a chug.  I’m going to have to stop taking such detailed notes at this point.

Page 16 – Using “NEXT DAY” in your SLUG will not translate to film. If you want or need us to know this, you’ll need a SUPER.

Page 17 – Same thing with “WEEKS LATER” in the SLUG.  You’ll need SUPERS…if not, don’t include this info at all.

Page 19 – “my my”

All this dialogue is nothing more than talking heads in a bland setting.  Not working at all.

Page 26 – “to” – “too”

Page 31 – Oh boy, this isn’t working at all.  $300 fine?  C’mon…these boys would be in a world of hurt, even in a comedy.  IMO, you need to lose the vast majority of these first 31 pages, as they aren’t going anywhere, they’re not funny, and everything is hugely over written.

Page 50 – You’ve got this huge scene about the football game and then you just move on before the game is even played.  All that shit was dialogue, no action, nothing. You’re half way through the script and like nothing has happened at all.  Think about the movies you are obviously trying to replicate…think about all the visuals that made them what they are.  Your script is seriously almost all dialogue, and it’s just going absolutely nowhere.  Sorry.

Page 54 – “UFC 97” – OK, that’s definitely dating this script, and you don’t want to do that.

OK, JP, dude…oh man…this isn’t working at all. This TV show thing is so off…it’s all formatted incorrectly, it’s impossible to follow and it was never set up properly.  You keep jumping forward in time and you have to understand that without SUPERS, no one will know this.  This is a serious mess!

Page 58 – “(BFD is short for Big Fucking Deal)” – Dude, this stuff is just awful.

Revision History (1 edits)
rogerooni  -  May 19th, 2010, 9:48pm
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jap313
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Wow, I hate that you didn’t like it.  I guess it wasn’t your type of humor.  

I’ll admit that I did have some typos but nothing to make it unreadable.  To say that I have around 20 mistakes every page is a little over dramatic.  Honestly, I modeled the format off Goldberg and Rogen’s Superbad.  They used WE and BEAT rampantly, also.  I feel that the use of beat sets the timing for jokes.

“Story-wise this is a complete mess, I’m sorry to say.”  This is over the top.  I mean, I’ve had many people read the script, and they were able to follow along easily.  I didn’t format some slugs correctly, but it shouldn’t have thrown you off too much.

You say: “I just don’t see how anyone would appreciate this, yet you seem to have some positive reviews, which just amazes me, so who knows.”  Great comment.  That’s very helpful.  Actually the people who did completely finish my screenplay said they enjoyed it, so who knows.  You’re obviously an older guy who’s out of touch with the young humor.  You said that my dialogue is dull while another says that I’m a “comedic genius” and “have a gift with dialogue.”  Different sense of humor I guess.

I can tell it’s not your humor because you kept correcting my spelling of vagina.  (vagine is a slang term)  

“$300 fine? C’mon these boys would be in a world of hurt…”  They were caught with beer and a small amount of marijuana, and they were obviously first time offenders.  Do you think they should go to prison or something?

Some of your comments are helpful.  I’m going to get a book to correct the format.  However, it’s obvious that we’re on two different wavelengths when it comes to humor.  

Thanks for the read!
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sniper
Posted: May 20th, 2010, 6:59am Report to Moderator
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Hey John,

I haven't read your script but I just wanted to comment on something you said:

Quoted from jap313
Honestly, I modeled the format off Goldberg and Rogen’s Superbad.  They used WE and BEAT rampantly, also.  I feel that the use of beat sets the timing for jokes.

It's funny, isn't it? On one hand, people are telling you to read scripts but then when you use the format from a produced script, you get told that the format is all wrong. I don't know if this is your first script so I excuse me if I come off as some wiseass but when reading produced scripts, you really need to know what to look for and what to filter out. Established writers, like Rogen and Goldberg, can pretty much put a script together any way they want to - we fledgling writers can't.

The "standard script format" is not cut in stone but there are generally accepted rules that you should definitely try to follow. The Screenwriter's Bible by David Trottier is a good start-up book. It won't tell you how to come up with a great story but, at the very least, it should enable you to write a script that looks and reads good.

Nothing Jeff (Dreamscale) said in his review about the format is wrong. You can always argue which rules can be bent or broken (because they can) but the WE SEE, WE HEAR are some of the biggest No-No's in a spec script. Lose 'em. Fast. The same thing goes with overtly directing the camera. It's not up to the writer to dictate which lense, camera, dolly system the DP should use. He/she knows that a hell of a lot better than we do.

That being said, there are plenty of ways of directing the camera covertly though.

The advise about reading a lot of scripts is still good. Do it. Read as many as you can. Not only will you pick up a lot of pointers but it'll also help you stay up to date with the techniques used because, believe or not, the "art" of screenwriting is not static.

Anyway, good luck with it.

Cheers
Rob


Down in the hole / Jesus tries to crack a smile / Beneath another shovel load
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Dreamscale
Posted: May 20th, 2010, 11:06am Report to Moderator
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John, now you're being a little cry baby whining vagine.

I told you I would edit out the comment, "I just don’t see how anyone would appreciate this, yet you seem to have some positive reviews, which just amazes me, so who knows.”, and I did. Yet, for some stupid-ass reason, you throw it right back in on your little bitch session.

Dude, at some point (hopefully soon) you'll come to the realization that your script is downright horrible. In many ways, the quality of writing is close to such gems as "The Cabin" and "Chris Halverson's Cannibal".  I actually tried to pick my comments carefully and be as nice as I could because I thought you seemed like a nice guy.

Remember, you came to me, and you based that decision on other reviews of mine you had read.

BTW, I went over your first page again, just for the fuck of it.  I found 34 errors on it alone. Once you get into that blatant Laguna Beach ripoff reality TV show garbage, I'd seriously bet you're running at well over 50 mistakes per page.

Get a clue, dude. I was trying to help you.  I obviously wasted my time.

Maybe Sniper will give it a read and provide some nice, loving, friendly type review for you...don't count on it!
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jap313
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Thanks Rob for the comments.  This is my first script, and I really didn't know how to format the thing besides looking at other scripts.

I actually ordered the Screenwriter's Bible last night.  When I get it, i'll go through it and learn how to format properly.

Thanks,
JP
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