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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Discussion of...    Getting to know you, getting to know all about you...  ›  Are you too nice? Moderators: Administrator
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Kotton
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 2:32am Report to Moderator
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The subject of this thread is;

Do nice guys really finish last?

I recently had an episode with a producer who said that I was too nice, that I was not edgey enough. Basically to market my script they needed to market me.

Then, this morning I watched a segment on the Today Show that said, Nice guys are the most successful. What gives?

View points are what I am after so if you have one give it, if not, SHUT UP!

Okay I tried it and it didn't do anything for me so someone shed some light, please.

And yes, I know the difference between a pushover and a...

Kotton

PS. So yes this is screenwriting related.


A spoon does not know the taste of soup, nor a learned fool the taste of wisdom.
                                                                    

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Kotton  -  September 22nd, 2006, 3:10am
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Steve-Dave
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 2:57am Report to Moderator
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It's to my experience that @$$holes rule the World. As in the producer who told you that was an @$$hole.

My advice is key his car, in big letters that say, "see, I'm edgy". And after that, I bet he'll be so impressed that he'll market your script. Either that or he'll have you arrested. But something'll happen damnit! and that's the moral of this story.


"Picture Porky Pig raping Elmer Fudd" - George Carlin
"I have to sign before you shoot me?" - Navin Johnson
"It'll take time to restore chaos" - George W. Bush
"Harry, I love you!" - Ben Affleck
"What are you looking at, sugar t*ts?" - The man without a face
"Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death." - Exodus 31:15
"No one ever expects The Spanish Inquisition!" - The Spanish Inquisition
"Matt Damon" - Matt Damon
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guyjackson
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 3:00am Report to Moderator
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Wow.  I learned something today.  Screenwriters are actually marketed themselves.  That's interesting.

As far as your query goes, I do think nice guys finish last.  In any situation the "nice" guy is all about pleasing the other person.  Whether it be a producer, a girlfriend, a teacher, you have no personality when you are nice.  You  just alter yourself to please the opposing party.  And that gets boring after a while and uninspiring.  I'm sure there will be the people out there that will say that the nice guys will make out in the long run, but that's a crock.  Business is cut throat, there's no room for a passive businessman/seller.  Everyone loves a challenge.  What keeps you trying to sell a script even though people say no?  The challenge of actually selling it.  Why do girls ogle over movie stars and rock stars?  Because of the challenge of actually being accepted by them.    

Now with a script and the writer, I don't really see why the screenwriter's personality should have anything to do with the sale.  I mean as long as you pitch the story well enough, who cares if you are nice or not?  But if you recieved the feedback from a producer it must be legit, so I won't argue with that.  

Haha, so I guess after all of this I really don't have a suggestion for you, but as far as being too nice, it's definately true.  I'd have that producer elaborate on what exactly is "too nice" about you and see if it is possible to tweak it to the desired personality level he demands.      
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Kotton
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 3:29am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Steve-Dave
It's to my experience that @$$holes rule the World. As in the producer who told you that was an @$$hole.

My advice is key his car, in big letters that say, "see, I'm edgy".


The great thing about this reply is that I spelled edgy wrong, I think it's "edgey" but anyways, the fact still remains that some a**holes have really made it and some nice people were left behiind because they didn't force themselves.

When I write, I hope the story does the talking for me, then comes along a producer, (agent for some) that say...Stated above.

Right now I am being vindictive because I'm scorned but I know there are others out there feeling the sme way.

I am probably acting like an a**hole now so I'm learning. Any other SS a**holes want to help in my progress?
I want to do some "shout outs" but they might be offended.

-Kotton

BTW, The term a**hole is an affectionant term and is not meant to offend anyone. Wait that is being nice, damn it!(I know I mis spelled affection...damn it who cares you all know what I mean!





A spoon does not know the taste of soup, nor a learned fool the taste of wisdom.
                                                                    
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Steve-Dave
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 4:48am Report to Moderator
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Nope, edgy was right and affection was right. Except it's affectionATE, not affectionANT. But I think you have a right to be vindictive.


Quoted from Kotton
I am probably acting like an a**hole now so I'm learning. Any other SS a**holes want to help in my progress?


First, you go out and the first baby you see, you smack the shit out of it. And then you go and rob an old lady. That outta do it for starters.


"Picture Porky Pig raping Elmer Fudd" - George Carlin
"I have to sign before you shoot me?" - Navin Johnson
"It'll take time to restore chaos" - George W. Bush
"Harry, I love you!" - Ben Affleck
"What are you looking at, sugar t*ts?" - The man without a face
"Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death." - Exodus 31:15
"No one ever expects The Spanish Inquisition!" - The Spanish Inquisition
"Matt Damon" - Matt Damon
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rpedro
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 5:11am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Steve-Dave
And then you go and rob an old lady. That outta do it for starters.



And don't forget to kick her when she's down!


Scripts :
- Hot Road (short)
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- Listen Up (short)
- Dawn (short)
- One Day (short)
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Pedro Chaves
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Steve-Dave
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 5:37am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from rpedro
And don't forget to kick her when she's down!


Right, how could I forget that? That's the best part. ...Because it's funny to watch them cry and squirm around on the floor


"Picture Porky Pig raping Elmer Fudd" - George Carlin
"I have to sign before you shoot me?" - Navin Johnson
"It'll take time to restore chaos" - George W. Bush
"Harry, I love you!" - Ben Affleck
"What are you looking at, sugar t*ts?" - The man without a face
"Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death." - Exodus 31:15
"No one ever expects The Spanish Inquisition!" - The Spanish Inquisition
"Matt Damon" - Matt Damon
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Old Time Wesley
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 9:46am Report to Moderator
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Maybe what they meant is that they have to market you to the company and they do not want to sign unstable dicks with egos so big they will fight with billionaires over stupid things. (Troy Duffy)

Frankly half the time they pay writers and that man/woman goes away and we never see them again until they show up on some obscure indy or bad B horror picture.


Practice safe lunch: Use a condiment.
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Helio
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 10:25am Report to Moderator
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Better to die with vodka than with tedium!

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I'm not, Kotton! Are you seen all sucess I'm doing in here? So I'm not!

Nice guys never succeed. They serv just to be the main characters of silly stories!
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Kotton
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 8:41pm Report to Moderator
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Thanks all that replied to this thread, it calmed me down.

Sorry to anyone who I might have offended, (srynows) .

Wesley may have a point. I was just thrown back by the email that the producer sent me. He stated that if I wanted to make it I had to become a hard a**. Be more excitable, or reactive. The thing about me is that I am willing to hear ideas and I don't dismiss them during the process of writing but I do when I finalize things. So it threw me for a loop.

But thanks again for the comments and allowing me to vent.

-Kotton


A spoon does not know the taste of soup, nor a learned fool the taste of wisdom.
                                                                    
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Steve-Dave
Posted: September 22nd, 2006, 10:29pm Report to Moderator
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??? You didn't offend me Kotton.


"Picture Porky Pig raping Elmer Fudd" - George Carlin
"I have to sign before you shoot me?" - Navin Johnson
"It'll take time to restore chaos" - George W. Bush
"Harry, I love you!" - Ben Affleck
"What are you looking at, sugar t*ts?" - The man without a face
"Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death." - Exodus 31:15
"No one ever expects The Spanish Inquisition!" - The Spanish Inquisition
"Matt Damon" - Matt Damon
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Takeshi
Posted: September 23rd, 2006, 11:29pm Report to Moderator
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I'm definitely too nice. Even my probation officer says so. Lol.
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Doc
Posted: September 24th, 2006, 7:10pm Report to Moderator
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Now that all have calmed down and can focus. Remember that most executives are only as good as thier support groups. Or therapists. I find that if a writer can not be as expressive in life as he or she is in words, What's the point? Be the character, hard a**, great lover, pioneer, etc. We are all actors in the on going screenplay known as "Life". So in front of the camera or behind it should not matter. You can act the harda** when needed without being untrue to yourself. Date an actress for one night and learn quickly what others take lifetimes to master.

When the moment calls for it. Hand it to them on a platter.

Suck it up and write on.


Doc

The prescription is wriiten...Hope it helps.


********************************************************
Projects in Motion

Nightlife: The Eternal Order
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George Willson
Posted: September 24th, 2006, 11:48pm Report to Moderator
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So let me get this straight...a producer turned down your writing on the merits of your being too nice? Oh please... Let's translate. Your script did not fit their needs at this time. I honestly wish people would say what they mean. This probably means this producer is too nice and didn't want to risk offending you by a straight turn down. Hey, we're writers. We get turned down a lot. This doesn't mean your script was bad, mind you. It just means that they're looking for Vampire Lesbians and you wrote a script about Gay Eskimos. Nothing personal.


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Shelton
Posted: September 24th, 2006, 11:54pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from George Willson
Gay Eskimos


"The Inuits Get Into It", starring Benjamin Bratt and Danny Trejo.

I'm the only gay eskimo-o, in my triiiiiibe.

That song has to be on the internet somewhere.

Anyway, how were they able to assess that you're too nice?  Did you meet them in person?


Shelton's IMDb Profile

"I think I did pretty well, considering I started out with nothing but a bunch of blank paper." - Steve Martin
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eljefedetonto
Posted: September 25th, 2006, 11:50pm Report to Moderator
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Of course the Today Show will tell you that nice guys are the most successful; it makes the audience feel better.

Typical 'nice guys' absolutely do finish last. Pushover types.

But that's not to say you should go out and be a total asshole.

The key to success is to strike a balance. Know when to be good-natured and kind, and know when to stand up and fight back. Know your strengths as well as your weaknesses.

Does that make sense to you?


Beginnings - It's high school all over again. Seriously. (now fixed and cleaned!)
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