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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Reviews    Movie, Television and DVD Reviews  ›  Black Swan Moderators: Nixon
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  Author    Black Swan  (currently 2815 views)
James McClung
Posted: December 5th, 2010, 11:13am Report to Moderator
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THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, DARREN ARONOFSKY!!!

FINALLY!!!

The first film this year that is actually as awesome as it looks. 2010 has been the worst year in film I can remember and although Black Swan can't make up for a whole year's worth of mediocrity, it can at least make up for some of the disappointments.

Where to begin? I suppose the best place would be Natalie Portman. The best performance this year by far. One of those rare roles that near makes the film, much like Daniel Day Lewis in There Will Be Blood. As Nina Sayers, a ballerina desperate for perfection, Portman seems so fragile, she could snap at any moment. The people and situations around her certainly don't help but if she weren't who she was, it wouldn't be as bad. Right from the start, you can feel her pain and it only gets worse.

Speaking of pain, this film's got lots. It's one of the most cold, grating and uncomfortable films to border on mainstream in years. You won't find the warmth of the Wrestler here. This is a deep, penetrating dive into the abyss. Straight darkness and insanity all the way through.

That said, the film does have a lot of similarities to the Wrestler. The loose camera work, the detailed minutia and behind the scenes of a demanding sport (if you can call a ballet a sport - once you see the closeups of Portman balanced on her toes, you might consider it)... but most of all, that visceral feel. Those cringeworthy moments. If you don't like damage to fingernails and cuticles, steer clear. I thought the worst were the shots of ballerinas warming up; I can't believe there's dancers who do this every day!

But the film's really got more in common with Requiem for a Dream than anything. No matter how beautiful the film looks, the feeling is always grim. So how does Black Swan stand up to that one? Well, quite frankly... it's just as good. I think to say it's better would be a stretch but really. It's fantastic.

But there's plenty new here as well, of course. Most notably horror elements. They're actually quite prominent and become more so throughout. So anyone who's been hoping Aronofsky would make a horror movie, well... this is probably it. That said, I actually thought these were the weakest elements of the film. They were rather conventional. Certainly wouldn't be out of place in a Ring or Dark Water. But they are very effective. I just thought the drama and character elements were the film's most potent assets.

So forget Inception. Even if you liked it. I liked it. See 127 Hours later. Did you hear True Grit is PG-13? Yeah...

See Black Swan. If you don't, do yourself a favor and quit watching movies. This is one that'll get under your skin, stay there and rot. You won't forget it.


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Colkurtz8
Posted: December 6th, 2010, 7:00am Report to Moderator
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Only skimmed your review, James but gathered enough to know you dug it which is great cos I've been hoping this would redeem a very poor year. Really looking forward to it now...


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Scar Tissue Films
Posted: December 6th, 2010, 7:29am Report to Moderator
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Is it Requiem grim?

I can't watch another film like Requiem, no matter how good it is.
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Colkurtz8
Posted: December 6th, 2010, 8:49am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Is it Requiem grim?

I can't watch another film like Requiem, no matter how good it is.


Ha ha, I felt cleansed after that film, an effective cautionary tale if ever there was one.

One of my favourite films of the last decade in fact.


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James McClung
Posted: December 6th, 2010, 10:39am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Is it Requiem grim?

I can't watch another film like Requiem, no matter how good it is.


I hated Requiem the first time I saw it. After finishing it, I felt ill and resentful. Almost hurt. I thought about it all day and for the days to come. Granted I was 15 or so but that's how I felt. My feelings have since changed; I think the film's really excellent.

At 24, I came out of Black Swan feeling completely overwhelmed but it the best way possible. One of those films where everyone's quiet at the theater when the credits roll, amazed that anyone could create something like that. Not like they want to go home and kill themselves.

So I would say no. I think the grimness is much more internalized in Black Swan. It's much more psychological and the story revolves around the character, not the gutter world the characters of Requiem find themselves in. The horror elements are overtly not real and the use of the original Tchaikovsky soundtrack give it an operatic quality that it wouldn't have otherwise. Not to say it's light or hokey but definitely more fantastical and I definitely wouldn't say it's as... aggressive as Requiem was.

So I'd say you're good to go. I just meant to say that having seen all of Aronofsky's films, I was reminded of Requiem the most.


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Scar Tissue Films
Posted: December 6th, 2010, 11:03am Report to Moderator
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Requiem was an incredibly powerful piece of filmmaking, but it was traumatic to watch. Far too close to the bone.

I'll give this a go at some point if it's not quite so horrific.
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vinny
Posted: December 10th, 2010, 1:03pm Report to Moderator
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oscar worthy eh?
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Heretic
Posted: December 12th, 2010, 2:56am Report to Moderator
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I'll just say outright that I think this is Aronofsky's best film, and certainly the best I've seen of this year.

Portman, Cassel, and Hershey are brilliant; Mila Kunis was the most inspired casting I've seen in a long time.  The film is grim, painful, and intensely visceral.  The ballet -- and I don't like ballet -- is so beautifully shot it defies description.

There were moments of horror that didn't work for me and took me out of the film, partly due to some dodgy CG, but this is a small gripe in the face of what the film achieves overall.

If you're looking for a nice vicious slam right in the guts, this is the film for you.  I'd say more, but I think James covered it -- just wanted to add my recommendation.
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James McClung
Posted: December 12th, 2010, 4:09pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Heretic
Portman, Cassel, and Hershey are brilliant; Mila Kunis was the most inspired casting I've seen in a long time.


Seconded. Over the past year or so, I've learned there's a distinct difference between great acting and great casting. Portman, Cassel and Hershey are all great actors. Kunis isn't a bad actress though she's certainly a lesser one compared to her co-stars but she's perfect for the part she plays. Her strength and confidence is a formidable force against Portman's vulnerability.

That said, all four are perfectly cast.


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Electric Dreamer
Posted: December 26th, 2010, 10:04pm Report to Moderator
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My biggest complaint about Aronofsky's past effort is inconsistency.
I felt much of his work, albeit powerful, was underminded by a strong narrative.

And now, twice in a row, he's really pulled it off with sterling.
I watched Black Swan today and what a meteor of a picture.
I was riveted from the get go and was never board for a moment.
All the scares and jolts had nothing to do with spiked music, all genuine.
I was never confused for a moment by anything I saw in the film.
Despite its complexity, its an easy film to understand, hence its success.
By no means is it simple, but its very easy to grasp the concept and feel the effects.
Of course there are many more layers, but you don't have to dig to get into it.
And that's why this film will have some broad appeal.

I wonder if Aronofsky can now save the X-Men franchise?

E.D.


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Andrew
Posted: January 8th, 2011, 3:09am Report to Moderator
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Not sure about 2010 being a bad year for film - overall output? Maybe. However, there is a strong body of work to rival that of any other year. 'Black Swan' is one such film. I recall stating that I felt last year was poor and was met with condescension from Rick, so I send that message to you guys... watch more films. 'Cos that must be the reason you don't like this year in film. Or not.

Truly mesmerising piece of art. Nina's straddling of sanity and the rampant paranoia that plagues her was a sight to behold. Portman is sensational and stole the show. Of course, there were other performances to elevate this film but Portman's deserves unique praise.

This film enjoyed pulling your emotions and perceptions all over the place. It was completely intoxicating and one that I need to digest more fully before being able to articulate my feelings as it will certainly stay with me.

This is simply a film you must watch if you are serious about a career in filmmaking. You may hate it, you may love it, but watch it you must.


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wonkavite
Posted: April 4th, 2011, 9:39pm Report to Moderator
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YES.  Finally a new film that I like!!  Caught Black Swan finally, two weeks ago.  

Very, very good.  

A streamlined tale - not too many characters.  

And not wholly original - after all, how many films are there out there about people slowly going mad, blurring the line between fantasy and reality?  Hell, two of my favorite films of all time (in general, not just in the genre of horror) are based on that very theme - The Shining, and Jacob's Ladder.

But Black Swan just did it very, very well.  Classy, tight story telling.  Good psychological horror.  And the visuals were equal to that task, too.  The pictures in the mother's room were beautifully done.  (Just to mention one example.)

Kudos to this film!  (And from what I hear, Portman actually had to fight to get this one made...)

And yes - this *is* a film that'll get under your skin and rot.  Now I want to see Requiem!!
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Scar Tissue Films
Posted: April 4th, 2011, 9:47pm Report to Moderator
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One of the greatest films ever made in my opinion.

So dark that I almost couldn't watch at times, but thankfully it never went the route I thought it was going.

Probably the first film I've seen since I was born that I'd call a masterpiece.


BTW did anyone else pick up on the weird Monarch programming symbolism that was going on?

This is what I mean:

http://vigilantcitizen.com/mov.....ge-on-show-business/
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Sandra Elstree.
Posted: April 4th, 2011, 9:54pm Report to Moderator
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I absolutely loved this masterpiece. To me, it was like being at the theatre. Perhaps for me, I have a love and sensibility more for live performances on stage and maybe it has something to do with that, I don't know.

What I feel drives this piece are the emotions and characters. I would bet that much of this was written from truth in a person's own life and then embellished.

I can't speak highly enough for this film.

Sandra



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dogglebe
Posted: April 4th, 2011, 9:55pm Report to Moderator
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It was hot!


Phil
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wonkavite
Posted: April 6th, 2011, 12:10pm Report to Moderator
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You know, it's funny.  

Would love to read the script, because I'm willing to bet that most people - if they read the script cold without having the benefit of having seen the film - would claim that it's too slow moving...and that "more action is needed!"
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rc1107
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For the past couple months now, I've had people (close friends) raving at me to check out 'Black Swan'.  That the movie was made explicitly for me and it'll be my favorite movie ever.  They said it's a heavy drama.  They said it's dark.  It's edgy.  It's smart.  It's psycho-sexual.  (Their words.  Not mine.)  But they said everything about this movie is right up my alley.

After hearing all that, and now finally seeing it a couple days ago, I'm wondering if it was just built up too much and that's why I didn't get the enjoyment that I should've out of the movie.

It was dark, which is how I like my movies.  It was very dramatic, which I loved.  It is edgy.  I guess it's psycho-sexual, since there were some creepy erotic parts in it that I did like.

The acting was outstanding.  Portman was awesome and Cassel (who I'm not very familiar with in the first place) got my attention with how he played his part.

But one thing that I really can't say about it is that it's smart.  I think it was smart how Aronofsky melded the ballet and the story together while filming it, but I can't really agree that the writing of the story was smart, because for some reason, (that I'm not too sure I can articulate very well right now), it felt kind of like a cheat.

I understood what was going on and everything, it's just seeing the shard of glass go into Mila Kunis, then showing Natalie Portman laying on the broken mirror, then drag herself into the shower, then showing the blood puddle up underneath the shower door and Natalie soaking it up and then all of a sudden gone again...  It's just the ending was too uneven for me to buy into everything 100%.  And everything with the mirrors, as beautifully shot and as haunting as they were, just felt too much like a gimmick for a cheesy horror film to me.  Let me rephrase that.  Everything with the mirrors I loved until towards the end, when the mirror ended up serving as more of a horror gimmick than anything.

And it's a shame, because the movie was beautifully shot, too.  It's just at the end, it sort of just fell apart to me and didn't remain consistent, I think.

I liked the movie.  I liked the movie a lot.  But it's not even close to being my new favorite or anything.  Actually, I never wrote a list for my top 50 movies ever, but I don't even know if it would crack that list.

It was still good and I don't feel I wasted my time watching it because there are a lot of positives going for it, it's just the ending knocked it down a couple notches for me.

- Mark


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Penoyer79
Posted: May 29th, 2011, 10:27pm Report to Moderator
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nothing will ever be as disturbing as Martyrs or Reqrium...

Black Swan does have its moments though
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Dreamscale
Posted: July 1st, 2011, 11:40am Report to Moderator
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Finally saw it last night for the upcoming Script Club.

As usual, I'm going to go against the masses here and say I did not like the film at all.

It was incredibly slow, dull, and downright boring for the first 45 minutes or so.  It did pick up at the 1 hour mark, and the last 45 minutes were much better than the first 45, which is always a good thing, but they weren't "good enough" for me to say I enjoyed this.

On a positive note, I agree that Natalie Portman did a great job in a tough and demanding role.  Vincent Cassel was good, but not great, IMO.  Barbara Hershey was very good, but her character was too over the top for me to take her 100% seriously.  BUT, the standout performance for me, was Mila Kunis, even though her role seemed so small early on.  She stole every scene she was in, IMO.  Her character and her performance came off as 100% believable for me...and she's one hot babe, which never hurts.  

You know, I've read and heard so much about how big and deep this movie is, but IMO, it really wasn't.  I found it to be rather small, actually.  I see many similarities to other movies, as well.  It took place in so few settings, also, which may create the small feel I got.  I don't know..it was all quite simplistic for me, even though it sure tried to be deep.

Finally, I have to admit, I absolutely hate dancing, as well as anythign involving dancing.  I actually get quite a kick out of watching someone embarrass them self by dancing, and I have nothing against watching hot babes shake it while scantily clad.  But ballet doesn't do anything for me at all.  I find it so dull, so unattractive, so completely over the top goofy, that it may have skewed my thoughts here.  Not sure.

Although slow, dull, and visually unappealing to me, I do see power here, as well as some great performances.  If you enjoy ballet, I understand there's beauty here. But for me, it was an ugly, hard to watch movie.

More to follow on Script Club...so maybe you want to join in and let me know the error of my ways and judgment.
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RayW
Posted: July 1st, 2011, 10:38pm Report to Moderator
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Watched it a few months ago and was pretty "meh" about it.
It was better to watch in subsequent viewings after it's rolled around in my brain for awile, but I don't think I'll be recommending it to anyone or buying a copy for myself.

(NOT DISCUSSING SCRIPT!) I think the first viewing go-round I found THOMAS' character to be much more manipulative and predatory.
Now,  I'm a little more lenient on the character's demeanor, although still recognizing him as a HR nightmare.

The film did a decent job of displaying the mother-to-daughter family history of illness.



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nybabz
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This thread is superb. I have learned a lot from your comments. In re this in particular as I have not SEEN BS in the traditional sense; I read it and LOVED it. My take on the script was it had Carrie and All About Eve beats here and there going on. Sounds as if I was pretty close. I think our simplyscripts 'audience' is probably among the most savvy critics out there. That brings to me the script itself; the scripts you pitch really must YANK or SEDUCE or INTRIGUE and TICKLE the reader from page one. Keep up the great work. This is a huge help I think to us all. HAPPY FOURTH to all! babz
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Scar Tissue Films
Posted: July 2nd, 2011, 9:25am Report to Moderator
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The script was excellent, but the film was that rare thing that was even better imo.

Amazing piece of work.
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nybabz
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Quoted from wonkavite
You know, it's funny.  

Would love to read the script, because I'm willing to bet that most people - if they read the script cold without having the benefit of having seen the film - would claim that it's too slow moving...and that "more action is needed!"


Hi there. Interesting comment. Having read yours I will tell you this; I have not seen BS but read it and could not put it down. This by the way, after hearing many critics say "eeeeewwww! save your money." For my money, it lacked for nothing. I read it cold, too. Know nothing about any of the parties involved, except the two female leads. I have read a few scripts this week from unproduced writers. Man, they are BAD. Just bad. Bad writing, super boring, I mean I don't know how you guys who write well (Phil and Ryan come to mind) do what you do, but honestly, it's magic when it works. And when it's there, it CAN'T be missed. A super read. bb
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RayW
Posted: July 2nd, 2011, 9:57am Report to Moderator
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B,
In all of your spare time and having read the screenplay for it, will you be particpating in the BLACK SWAN script review tomorrow and across the week?



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Sandra Elstree.
Posted: July 2nd, 2011, 12:35pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
The script was excellent, but the film was that rare thing that was even better imo.

Amazing piece of work.


This is one of the rare occasions where I saw the movie before reading the story, (in this case the script) and unless I'm mistaken, there are things in the script that don't occur in the movie, but I'm going to watch it again tomorrow since it's been awhile.

In regards to the opposing views:

People who love theatre and people who love more psychologically (as opposed to action) based entertainment will probably enjoy this film more. I guess it's kind of like people who enjoy chess more than skiing.

Interesting to note for me personally, is that I have learned that I enjoy more heady movies, ones based more on characters and psychology, but in life, I enjoy being more physically active if I can. Not that I don't like a fast-moving film. Bourne comes to mind. Loved those, but I don't require it. I think some people need that-- kind of works like a drug in some people I think and this is probably why some people might not enjoy this film. It's all about a person's individual perception.

If any of you haven't jumped on the Black Swan Script Club read yet, you might really enjoy it.

Sandra



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nybabz
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Here's is a pathetic truth; I have to see Super 8 and a couple of others first. (all for work.) and SEEING a film takes a back seat to reading scripts by working and or undiscovered writers and pitching time, but I manage to get it all done.  My viewing time has been cut into however SIGNIFICANTLY. But I look at this way; the folks IN THE FILM have made their money, and I am out to earn as much money as I can. Ed did remind me however; "Kid, see just enough, to stay sharp, and not be too influenced." now THAT is a fence which is hard to straddle. bb
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Sandra Elstree.
Posted: July 2nd, 2011, 8:33pm Report to Moderator
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What if the Hokey Pokey, IS what it's all about?

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Quoted from nybabz
Ed did remind me however; "Kid, see just enough, to stay sharp, and not be too influenced." now THAT is a fence which is hard to straddle. bb


The bullet of verisimilitude. The good side is that we can be discerning with what we choose to read and watch. More than ever, people see through thin veneers where all the p's and q's might be in place, but it's just a rip off of repackaging.

You can often get away with that for the younger crowd (ah heck that's where the money is so what am I saying) but people with a bit of wisdom desire more than movies that are like fast food.

Sandra



A known mistake is better than an unknown truth.
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nybabz
Posted: July 2nd, 2011, 8:51pm Report to Moderator
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so what's your point
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Sandra Elstree.
Posted: July 3rd, 2011, 2:50am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from nybabz
so what's your point


I'm not sure who the question is aimed at, but if for me:

The point is, that if you straddle the fence for too long, you might be inclined to high levels of agitation.

One must choose, I guess. Staying sharp has its price. Some decide to stay sharp in the here and now of the power and money and machines that are the latest and greatest of movies or whatever they're selling us; others choose to stay sharp in the place of their hearts. Whether we're talking movies or Grandma's ironed sheets, the heart is in the depth of feeling therefore:

His words of wisdom:

"Kid, see just enough, to stay sharp, and not be too influenced."

Strikes a chord with me. It tells me to try and stay somewhat current,
but remain true to myself.

Sandra



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nybabz
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spot on, Sandra. Spot on. Good thoughts, all. bb
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