James, you crack me up.  Thanks for the kick in the nuts...always appreciated.

Obviously, this is not the forum to discuss orphans or anything of the sort, nor did I even mention the little guys anywhere in this thread, but, I'm not against shameless plugs and bumps on my scripts, so I will respond briefly.

I have said repeatedly that if you write a good sentence, and it happens to end in an orphan, oh well...no big deal.  The problem is when orphans pop up routinely, when they don't need to.  If page length is an issue (as in a constraint or just that your script is running long), getting rid of unnecessary orphans and the like can make a seriously big difference.

Going back to the latest Script Club, I think I noted that based on a ridiculously HUGE amount of orphans, wrylies, and asides, the 119 page script included some 15 "extra" pages of wasted space.  This did not even take into account how many wasted pages there were based on over written prose.

Orphans obviously don't change the way a script would be shot or how it would turn out on film, but in terms of good writing, they have no place on any page, and if you can easily do away with them, you should definitely do it.

Orphans ain't bad every once in a while.  They can can actually create some nice white space on the page when you need it.

Jeff, I wish I'd gotten to this before the big reveal but for me it's like once you hit about the 25 mark or so with reading and critiquing scripts, it begins to feel like you're saying the same thing over and over and need a break.  Besides, you can't really complain when you also enter a 12 page pisser that I did leave a review for.  

I wish you had, too, Ryan.  It's a fatal flaw in the OWC how scripts are posted.  If it's based on when the scripts are completed and turned into Don, it would make sense how they're posted, but that wasn't the case here. Several of the first 2 batch scripts were actually completed on Friday.

If it were up to me, I'd like to see them all available at the same time, or at least within a few hours of each others.  The first batches get all the reads, and as you say, by the time the final batches are posted, several days of reading have passed.

Oh well, what can you do?  Thanks for at least looking at it after the fact, Ryan.  It's always appreciated.

And in response to your orphan comment, again, as I always say, there's nothing wrong with a few here and a few there, but when you start adding pages to your script because of it, it's time to give it a closer read and edit.

Re: the small print on this script -- for real, it couldn't be made normal size, on my screen, I guess some others had this problem, too.  
I waited to find out who wrote it because if the author had been someone unknown to me I wouldn't have wasted eye-strain on it.  
As I said in my comments, it was well worth the effort, to read it.

Thank you for reading, Catherine.  I appreciate it.

I used a different PDF software tool to hide the usual look of my scripts.  I actually didn't know it was going to open up the way it does.  When I open it, I have an option to "not allow it to go to 100% screen size", which then allows me to increase the text size, but apparently, that's not the case with everyone.

Sorry about that.

This was good Jeff.

Nicely written, with believable setting and dialogue. Like Kev said, nice to see you attempting to deal with themes...iyt was unexpected. I must admit I almost thought we were going to go into pisser territory because I couldn't believe you'd stick at it!

I did share some slight concerns with others about the raping of his sister and the way the gun seemed to come out of nowhere. There's probably a way to make it slightly more acceptable without changing the actual action. Maybe with the rape make it seem a bit more opportunistic, rather than like it's a regular thing.

I also feel it needs a little something extra, but don't really know how to define it. I wasn't really left with something..a question, a thought, an emotion deep or profound enough to really effect me and make me consider the age old question in a different light.

I can give a suggestion, one that is perhaps a little twee for your tastes and perhaps the tone of the this script, but may trigger something:

Forget the cops, and have the house start burning so we get to see the hellish flames..the burnng agony of reality, then pull away to the smoke and sparks of ash floating into the night sky.

That way you get kind of a nice contrast of the hell of reality and the idea of the possibility that their souls are returning to their heavenly source and the question of whether God answered their prayers by releasing them all, or whether it was a simple human tragedy.

Nice work though.

Thanks for the read and feedback, Rick!  Always appreciated.

The "raping" of Maria by Santi is not an everyday occurrence, but it appears it's happened before.  One has to wonder if Maria even knows what's going on...or cares.  It's a bit brutal and ugly, but keep in mind, it's merely implied, not shown in any way.

As for the gun, there was originally some backstory here, but I decided it wasn't necessary.  Originally, Santi gave the gun to them for protection in their shitty apartment, in a bad part of town.  My thoughts on it are that many such families have firearms in the house and are also the cause of many such tragedies.  I just didn't want to waste space and time, showing Hector actually pulling the gun out of a drawer or closet, or using a Flashback.

I always find the word "twee" quite funny.  I didn't know what it even meant until one of you guys clued me in a couple years ago.

I wanted to stick to an ultra low budget here and keep everything very manageable for an easy shoot.  A bigass fire would be an issue for sure, but I do like what you're saying.

Actually, Katia's final line waffled back and forth between what it is now, "God, are you there?" and "God, where are you?"  I decided on the cops O.S. breaking in to show that Kat is going to be saved, and thus, as she hears this, in her state of mind and condition, maybe she thinks it's actually God coming to her rescue.  May be a stretch, but wanted to leave things open to different peep's personal interpretations.

Thanks again, Rick!

Hey Jeff,
After noticing the money transfer made it into my account, I decided to give this a read. I was tempted to read the reviews both before and after I read this and decided not to so If I mention some things others may have said then, sorry.

This is tragically more than likely depicted everyday life across cultural lines more than we would care to venture. Truly the dirty side of the pipe.

I found the religious tone refreshing and it was used with restraint. I have many devout Mexican catholic friends and co-workers who follow rigorous adherence to prayer and indeed to some degree as a tool.

Your characters were well developed and believable. Knowing the page constraints, it’s tough to get the plot up and running and your characters introduced in a way where you feel like you know them. You did very well in that regard.   I do feel like you should have gone ahead and used that last page to finish a couple of things out.

What about the boy? I know the uncle fell on top of him but what happened to him. Also, I think the use of Heroin may be a better choice of drugs for the mom to use. It’s a small thing but crack doesn’t take you down like that, but the horse, oh yeah!

Besides (and no one bitch about this) but the Mexican culture has more of a pre-disposition towards heroin than crack. I make my living on border towns and they always seem to lean to tar.
One thing that would make that last moment really tragic (and I love tragic) is instead of the mom’s hair catching on fire, she sets up on the couch oblivious from the drug use, with smoldering clothes, and reaches for her pipe, as the door is kicked in.

By the way, you had me squirming with the little girl about to be raped. The use of God and sexual assault was demeaning and on the dark side. That IMO was one of the best moments in writing that I have seen you do. Ever!

I also want to know your thoughts behind the silence of the mom. If I remember correctly, not a word from her in the entire script except the scream at the end. Sometimes, images have power. Was it your intent to hold her as an abstract reflection of deprivation? As a symbol of cracks decay? Not having her say a word is risky.

I have to say that your writing has evolved in a way that makes the reader watch it in the minds eye as it unfolds.

If I had any gripes about formatting it would only be on page 8. I know you adhered to keeping your action down to a few lines per block but maybe instead of the amount of blocks (being 14 deep), create a FADE IN-FADE OUT Montague with a character or two saying something to break it up a bit.  

Great Job Jeff! You really met this challenge head on and produced a piece of work you can be proud of.  

  
Sorry to say that I cant review many of the OWC this time around. I have been extreamly busy.

**But if anyone does want a read on theirs, just PM me and I will be happy to give it a go.

Shawn, glad the money finally showed up.  $1,000 was enough, right?  

Hey, man, thanks for reading this.  Glad you seemed to like it.  As for Hector, a few seem to be unclear about his fate.  He accidentally shot himself, when Santi, fell into him, as we hear the gun go off a third time, and then we don't see any movement from him, underneath Santi.

Anyways, we missed you in this challenge, and hope you're gearing up for next week's big Halloween OWC.  No excuses!!!

*Spoilers*

I've got mixed feelings about this one.  A lot of mixed feelings.  It's cleanly written; nicely streamlined technically.

And the beginning of the story did grab me, interested me in the characters.  So kudos there.

But the story lost me about halfway, once Santiago tries raping Katia.  Anyone who knows my writing is aware that I have no problem with gritty violence, or sexual elements in a story.  But the degree of violence felt over the top to me.  Throwing in alcoholism, crack, raping the mother AND the daughter?  Kind of like when there's an crime movie and the evil drug dealer rapes little kids, kills puppies and throws a cute kitty off the roof.  IE: just tooo much - esp. for a short story!  Better to make it more subtle, even given the raw topic.

Then there's the religious sub-text of the story.  As an atheist, I actually agree with the implication (ie: where is God, when he allows such things to happen?).  But in this story, it felt forced.  It could conceivably work, if there was further focus on the piousness of the family, early in the story..and a few of the grittier elements are dialed back a notch.  But as it is...there's no subtlety.  It just doesn't feel *organic*, which is always important.

Still, kudos on the script.  I did care for Katia and Hector...and that's a good thing.

Well, hello there, Janet.  Thanks for giving this a read and feedback.  I appreciate that very much.

A number of peeps seem to feel the same way you do.  The "too much" or "over the top" comment has reared its head numerous times here, which really surprises me, actually.  Here's my take on it...

I understand completely when something goes too far, happens too often, just doesn't come off as believable because of the magnitude or volume of the events taking place.

You know, take some loser as he walks to work, and gets mugged first, gets sprayed by muddy water by a car next, knocks himself out by walking into a sign, wakes up nude, then finally falls into an open manhole, where he's attacked by rats, when he escapes the rats, he walks into the open jaws of of 35 foot alligator.  Yeah, definitely, way too many things happening in a row and over the top cartoonish.

For me though, here, I don't see any of this as over the top, or a scenario with too many horrible things going on in a small time line/story.  Here's why...

The Aguilar family is what it is and has been for awhile.  Maria is a mess and not a good mother.  Katia is the one taking care of Hector as best as she can, and she definitely cares and tries.  Santi is not a good person. Although we don't know how often he comes round and how far he takes it when he's there, but from both Katia's and Hector's reaction to seeing him even in the apartment, it's clear there is history and it's not good. When you've got drugs, alcohol, and bad people, a number of other things come into play as well.  Same as when a child gets a gun in his hands, good things rarely come of it.

My point is this - I personally don't view all these horrible things taking place as a series of blows like in my example above.  I see this first of all as their reality, as it is for many such unfortunate souls.  But secondly, I see it as a snowballing effect - Santi didn't leave the apartment early enough - Katia caught on to what was going on - Santi was crazily and dangerously fucked up - Santi grabbed Kat and threatened to abuse her - Hector tried to defend his sister - shots were fired, and peeps died or got fucked up.  Not one event after another, but a series of tragic events that all happened because of each other.  The sofa and Maria's hair catching on fire, I can see as going a bit too far, but I really wanted that bitch to suffer.

BTW, I'm a believer, but lately I find myself in Hector's shoes, asking why God isn't stepping in when He "should", for those who "deserve" and need His help.  I actually tried to end this on a positive and possibly uplifting note, mirroring the classic "Footsteps in the Sand".

Thanks again, Janet.  Hope to see you in the upcoming Halloween OWC!

hey Jeff,

my apologies for the late review. some family shit went down, causing me to miss an entire week of work, social life, etc etc

however i promised to read this one, and i wanted to make sure i fulfilled my word. this was the first script i've read upon my return to the boards. so what did i think about this one?

well, for starters, the writing's very strong. i like the orphans and am going to try to incorporate them into my own work. they make the script flow really nicely. but i digress. the writing was strong and the characters were accurately portrayed. maybe not in the "real life" sense, but very typical of what you'd see in the movies or the picture box. furthermore, you fused Katia religious beliefs with her heritage seamlessly. religion is a big part of latino culture and i think you picked the perfect demographic for your characters.

however, this one left me feeling...unattached. sure, the restrictive page requirement has something to do with this, but overall i just couldnt feel for any of the characters. therefore, i really didnt care about them or what happened to them. did it feel a bit too heavy handed? perhaps. however i actually liked the fact that the uncle was fucking his sister. but when he went after her daughter? maybe that was a bit too much. if i were you, id go with one or the other. having him do both, seems, well exhausting (even for a perverted uncle)

as far as the religious themes go, they seemed too subtle at some points and then too obvious in others. i'd try to keep them in the background a bit more so the audience isnt constantly bombarded. the last line didnt quite work for me nor did the title really stand out. however im glad this one ended on a positive note. if it didnt, then i would have called you lars von trier.

a mix bag for me but ultimately wins out due to your intellectual writing.

Hey Will, thanks for the read and feedback.  Sorry for the late response. I've been travelling, as you know, but wanted to thank you on the thread.

Not sure what you man about the orphans here, as you should know I'm against the little guys.

Glad you enjoyed it overall.  You are not alone in feeling it's heavy handed or too much at times.  As for Santi "trying to rape" Katia, I think that's something that people are reading in.  He definitely made some completely inappropriate comments and aggressive actions towards her, but then again, in this type of messed up family, it's not uncommon for olderf male family members to try or actually do such horrible things.  I don't know, maybe it's just me.

Anyways...thanks, man!

Hello Jeff. Thought I should give my thoughts on the revised draft  

Dayum, was this a freaky tale. This has to be one of the most depressing shorts I've read  . I didn't seem to understand the message though? Was it pro God or the other way around? I feel as if it says God is never there for the people who need him the most but in a way, it also says that you have something to believe in when life isn't going your way.  

At the end, Hector does die but maybe because of God Katia survives. So, if you think about it, there is some hope to this story.

Overall, very well written it seems like you put a lot of time into this.

Mohammad

Howdy, Mo.  Thanks for the read and comments.

This is indeed a dark, depressing story, and purposely so.  I was going through some rough times when this OWC rolled around.

I wanted to write a religious themed script that kind of summed up the way I was feeling at the time....and many others have been feeling based on the way the world has been lately - is God really there, and if he is, why doesn't he do anything to help those that believe and ask for his help?

The theme can be taken several different ways, as you astutely pointed out.  In no way was I trying to preach to anyone this or that.  I wanted to leave it up to each individual to take from it what they wanted.

Two things I want to point out...

First, I usually like to use a title that can be taken several different ways, and this worked perfectly for me and what this story is all about.  Although Katia's world is truly horrific in so many ways, she's one of those people that stays positive and sees only the good in the world...or at least tries to.

Back to the religious aspects, what I wanted to hint at is the classic religious poem, "Footsteps in the Sand".  If you're not familiar with it, basically it's about a man walking along the beach with God, which represents his life, being and his dedication to God, leaving 2 sets of footprints.  At times, there are only 1 sets of prints, and the man realizes that these are the difficult and low times of his life.  He asks God why he abandoned him when the man needed his help the most.  God replies that when there were only 1 set of prints, it was because he carried the man on his back during those troubled times.  A number of ways to take that message,, both religiously and thematically, but 1 is that although things may be bad and bleak, they can always be worse.  Somewhat the message I was going after here in a nutshell.

Thanks again, man. I appreciate your input.