Quoted from Alffy I had a bit of problem with the will though.  It was funny but would Mickey really just accept something that clearly wasn’t a real will?  Or was it, if it was, I think it would be more believable if it read more like a conventional will.  In fact I think it could work better if it read formal and professional with a few added japes included.

A few people had a problem with the will scene, but my problem is that the answer is the 2nd episode and i was trying not to put every detail in the pilot, as it is series.... the fact that Mickey accepted it was done to trusting his mother so much.
I'm actually in the middle rewriting the pilot completley and moving this to episode 2... driving myself crazy, but trying to create more of Mickey's world with his mom, before jumping right in.

Quoted from alffy I felt some of the dialogue didn’t always flow and was a bit forced.  An example of this is when Mickey meets Sally for the first time.  Sally rambles on about other shops in the town but Mickey responds with asking her where she came from.  This leads on to another joke about  birth control, which is quite funny, but naturally I think Mickey’s response might be something like ‘what the hell are you talking about?’

Something to think about thanks

Quoted from alffy This might be a British thing but our pet shops don’t sell cats and dogs, or none that I’ve ever been in.

Might be... When I lived in Ireland I don't remember dogs and cats, but they're in every pet shop in America I have been in.

Quoted from alffy Why does Chad put on an accent to Jimmy when he knows him?  He calls him Jimmy having not been told who he is, so I’m guessing he knows him?  Also, at the beginning Mickey doesn’t seem to recognise Jimmy, Peggy tells him it’s uncle Jimmy, yet Bob, Brad and Chad seem to recognise him.  Maybe I’m mistaken here?

Yes everyone knows Jimmy, he's just kind of messing around as Jimmy was always a local... Not much else too it... Mickey only jumped back and yelped as he wasn't expecting anyone to be lying on his couch when he woke... Obviously Peggy knew different.

Quoted from alffy Sally tells Mickey she was left as a baby on the doorstep of a church and then the Weston’s but a few moments later Mickey asks if her parents could help her?  I thought she didn’t know her parents?  Is he talking about the Weston’s?

Yes her parents as in the Westons who raised her as a baby.

Quoted from alffy I like the ‘Police’ line lol but I don’t think you need the line pointing it out as the band. Why does Frankie want to destroy the Pet Shop? I thought more of the story would have taken place in the Pet Shop but I’m guessing it may feature more in subsequent episodes.

Thanks I could change it.
2nd episode
It's more back and forth between the bar and pet shop

Quoted from alffy Overall I enjoyed this.  There were some very funny gags and one liners.  Some things bothered me, see above, mostly Jimmy’s age.  Bob and Brad were incredibly stupid and initially I thought too much but they grew on me.  Chad was great too.  Mickey and Sally’s relationship has great potential for more laughs, with her suicidal tendencies.  I breezed through it and will take a look at episode 2 in the next few days, Mark. Good read and enjoying it so far.

Thanks for the read Alffy
I'm gonna start Pub Lunch today

Mark

Hello Mark,

I remember giving the first episode a read a while back. Thought I'd crack the second one open.

I think this one is much funnier than the first. I haven't read the rewrite of the first episode, but I'll get around to it.

I see you have established an opening intro scene per episode. I like that, nice touch.

I haven't read any other comments, so forgive me if I'm repeating typos or issues which may have already been pointed out.

Page 11: A couple of you're & your mixed up.

Page 18: I don't understand the Weston video on TV? How does the home video show the blind father holding a camera? Is he holding a still camera and someone else is doing the video? Maybe I'm just not getting it.

Page 20: I don't know if Sally was in the first episode (new draft) but the relationship/exchange between her and Mickey just seems a bit surreal. Things happen too quickly. I get where you're going and what the characters are about, but this need to be played out longer, maybe over the entire episode, rather than a few pages.

More notes to follow.

Page 23: Okay, I see what you're going for here, but the exchange between Sally and Bert, it's just too on the nose. Comedy relies on other dialouge devices to express humour, not everything needs to be explained out aloud. Use a little sub text, word play, puns and misinterpretations. I think you could trim along of the dialouge in places and still achieve more of a punch.

Page 31: I'll give you full marks for out there comedy - not so sure what time slot this fits into.

Page 34: I dunno about the condom jokes, a little too schoolboy and been done to death, more fitting in a teen comedy.

Page 36: I'm no sexpert, but, given that they are having sex for half a page, I'd say she's most definitely faking it.

Overall, it's not bad, just needs a tidy up, spelling mistakes peppered through out, and address some of the dialouge.

Eoin

Eoin

How's it going, Irish across the pond.

You were the first to comment on Loserville episode 1, I thank you for that and yes episode 2 thanks again.

Quoted from Eoin Page 18: I don't understand the Weston video on TV? How does the home video show the blind father holding a camera? Is he holding a still camera and someone else is doing the video? Maybe I'm just not getting it.

Mr Weston is holding the camera, he isn't in the movie

Quoted Text Page 20: I don't know if Sally was in the first episode (new draft) but the relationship/exchange between her and Mickey just seems a bit surreal. Things happen too quickly. I get where you're going and what the characters are about, but this need to be played out longer, maybe over the entire episode, rather than a few pages.

Yeah I agree they maybe rushed into it, but she was in the first episode.

Quoted Text Page 36: I'm no sexpert, but, given that they are having sex for half a page, I'd say she's most definitely faking it.

Lol me too

Thanks again Eoin... What are you upto? have you been writing anything lately

Mark

Hey Mark,

Back to Mr Weston and the home movie, as the action description here is confusing. Mickey puts on a DVD. The description that follows is of the movie Mickey sees. So, why do you describe Mr Weston, if he is the one holding the camera, he won't be shown in the home movie. That's the confusion.

It would only work if the camera were on, we see him as described, he fumbles around and picks up the camera, then we know the following footage in the home movie is shot by Mr Weston, the blind guy we just saw throught the camera he now holds.

Haven't been doing too much writing. Still working on the same feature. Updated it in the work in progress section recently.

Eoin

Hey Mark

Loved the opening scene to episode 2, I chuckled out loud at Jimmy’s response ‘you think I was a little too hard on him.’  Should it end in a ? though.

I like the fact that Brad and Bob will phone Chad to find out what big words mean.  It’s quite amusing.

Liked Sally’s suicide attempt but Mickey’s reaction is a little odd.  He say’s ‘you’re alive’ but I’m not sure he knew she was attempting suicide?

When Bob quietly grabs the pen and not the gun, it reminded me of a funny ‘Only Fools and Horses episode’, don’t know if you know it?   The only thing about this scene is that Bob and Brad are stupid and often phone Chad for answers but they are amending the letter.  Maybe they should amend it wrong?

‘Do you have a fitting room?’  ha, good line.

When Chad chases off the two guys from his bar, he picks up his sword twice without putting it down.  Then Jimmy says if he threw out everyone as smart as him, he’d have no customers.  Should he say, if threw everyone who wasn’t as smart as him?

Over all I thought this episode was better than first.  The comedy seemed more subtle; like you didn’t spell out the gags.   The relationship with Mickey and Sally is good, maybe a bit quick but I think you could play that card later; them finding out more about each other as they become closer.  The only negative I have is that after almost two hours of screen time the story hasn’t moved very far forward.  I know that in a series you need to drag it out but so far we only know a little about Jimmy and Frankie and that seems to have been the last few minutes of each episode.  I don’t want to end on a bed note so I’ll say, this was decent and I hope you keep this going.

Good work, Mark.

Hey alffy thanks for the read.

Quoted from Alffy When Bob quietly grabs the pen and not the gun, it reminded me of a funny ‘Only Fools and Horses episode’, don’t know if you know it?   The only thing about this scene is that Bob and Brad are stupid and often phone Chad for answers but they are amending the letter.  Maybe they should amend it wrong?

I was waiting for some englishman to spot it..   I grew up on british sitcoms , Blackadder, young ones, only fools and horses and more. I call this my 'oasis' scene as in the band... They had a habit of nicking other songs and putting their own spin on them to make it theirs!!
RODNEY.

Quoted from Alffy When Chad chases off the two guys from his bar, he picks up his sword twice without putting it down.  Then Jimmy says if he threw out everyone as smart as him, he’d have no customers.  Should he say, if threw everyone who wasn’t as smart as him?

Ill look into it.. Thanks

Quoted from Alffy Over all I thought this episode was better than first.  The comedy seemed more subtle; like you didn’t spell out the gags.   The relationship with Mickey and Sally is good, maybe a bit quick but I think you could play that card later; them finding out more about each other as they become closer.  The only negative I have is that after almost two hours of screen time the story hasn’t moved very far forward.  I know that in a series you need to drag it out but so far we only know a little about Jimmy and Frankie and that seems to have been the last few minutes of each episode.  I don’t want to end on a bed note so I’ll say, this was decent and I hope you keep this going.

Thanks Alffy, I do agree that maybe Mickey and Sally are moving a little too quickly, I might have to rewrite this episode a little.
I just finished the 3rd episode while at the same time writing a new pilot!!! yes complicating things.
I wanted to get more into Mickey's world before Jimmy arrived... His relationship with his mom and stuff and the lack  of success in the pet shop and also showing Jimmy getting out of jail. Also I created more of Peggy's character, a very devout catholic mother, while Brad is an atheist and created tension between those too.

I will post the 3rd episode soon

Thanks again

Mark

i know there are a couple of versions so these notes are from “Loservillen2n” in case there’s a newer draft. In which case i’m writing for nowt. (Just checked, this f/b IS for the pilot in the original post of this thread) -->

It’s a good premise, the pet-shop isn’t a context i can remember any comedy shows taking yet (dead parrot sketches don’t count lol) but i gotta say for me the script as is is a little patchy overall.

There are some individual moments that made me laugh but these are padded out with scenes and dialogues that for me weren’t so strong. The difference is in the unexpected. Taking the scene with the kid buying a bunny for his snake. This got me proper good, from the moment he walked in to the final pay-off line (although I take FREAKING EXCEPTION to “the Irish problem”!)(Oim Oirishish). Blatant (and incorrect I’ll have you know) racial stereotyping aside, what made all the jokes here work was their unexpected nature. The kid turns out to be more worldly than we assumed, and it’s the surprise that gets us.

Some of the ‘banter’ between Mickey and Jimmy, it’s not so unexpected to be fair. That’s not to say the lines are predictable, but the direction of them is. Mickey jokes about Jimmy’s drinking, Jimmy jokes about Mickey’s weak character. Left me cold, personally.

Same with bits of the sally getting bit scene, the moments where she does/says the unexpected are the winning lines. The bits where she lives up to our expectations are less so.

So I stopped about half-way through, exactly at the reveal of Chad’s bad Japanese accent turning out to be fake – have you seen that series called Faith, with Johnny Lee Miller, about a lawyer who gets a brain tumour? Ok. The pilot has that exact dialogue in it between him and his Japanese reiki teacher (I think it’s reiki). The exact same lines. If it’s a homage, then ok but to be fair it needs to be a homage with its own unique twist, like it’s an English guy doing an English accent that turns out to be fake, and he’s actually Indian/Japanese/etc.

Finally... the opening scene was a problem. Luckily I carried past it to get to the good bits, but it was too disorganised and chaotic for me to follow easily.

I know I’m amateur but I’d almost always suggest starting a pilot with a major transition for the person about to be the central characer, and Jimmy ‘appearing’ in Mickey’s life isn’t quite there. The will suddenly appearing, also not quite there.

As a suggestion, if I could edit – perhaps open with Mickey in the shop, alone, immediately after his dad’s funeral. He’s talking to the animals/himself about what he’s going to do to change things round here (more food, bigger cages, better muzak) now he’s the owner. Then Ma comes in with the shock news – the will’s been read out and it leaves the shop to Mickey’s dead-beat uncle etc.

It would set up everything we need to know about the premise and the main characters in 60 seconds.


I’m really sorry if it’s not the greatest feedback, but it’s one of those where I’m only saying it because I think it’s worth saying – I can see how with a rewrite or two it’s going to be a proper funny show all through. If I didn’t think it had the strong bones of a good show, I’d not have bothered. Plus comedy is something that it’s WAY easier to critique than write.

So overall, pretty good potential. Even though you disrespect my tribe (for which you will answer to God who, as everyone knows, was born in Cork).

Marriot  thanks for the read.

Quoted from Marriot This got me proper good, from the moment he walked in to the final pay-off line (although I take FREAKING EXCEPTION to “the Irish problem”!)(Oim Oirishish). Blatant (and incorrect I’ll have you know) racial stereotyping aside, what made all the jokes here work was their unexpected nature.

Born and bred Irishman myself, the first 22 years of my life in Derry opposite ends...I chose the big apple and you chose London I'm  guessing

Quoted from Marriot So I stopped about half-way through, exactly at the reveal of Chad’s bad Japanese accent turning out to be fake – have you seen that series called Faith, with Johnny Lee Miller, about a lawyer who gets a brain tumour? Ok. The pilot has that exact dialogue in it between him and his Japanese reiki teacher (I think it’s reiki). The exact same lines. If it’s a homage, then ok but to be fair it needs to be a homage with its own unique twist, like it’s an English guy doing an English accent that turns out to be fake, and he’s actually Indian/Japanese/etc.

One Irishman to another I have never seen Faith, so for me to have wrote exactly the same lines, I promise you it wasn't on purpose it is just a freak thing... If I pay homage I will tell you, like in episode 2 that Alffy mentioned above to Only Fools and Horses.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001538/    I just looked up Johnny lee Miller and could not find anything about "Faith" or you sure it was him or is it another name.

Quoted Text As a suggestion, if I could edit – perhaps open with Mickey in the shop, alone, immediately after his dad’s funeral. He’s talking to the animals/himself about what he’s going to do to change things round here (more food, bigger cages, better muzak) now he’s the owner. Then Ma comes in with the shock news – the will’s been read out and it leaves the shop to Mickey’s dead-beat uncle etc. It would set up everything we need to know about the premise and the main characters in 60 seconds.

I have already started the new pilot, as I wanted to create more of Mickey's world before his uncle came in... So this episode will be number 2 and number 2 will be 3...

Quoted Text I’m really sorry if it’s not the greatest feedback, but it’s one of those where I’m only saying it because I think it’s worth saying – I can see how with a rewrite or two it’s going to be a proper funny show all through. If I didn’t think it had the strong bones of a good show, I’d not have bothered. Plus comedy is something that it’s WAY easier to critique than write.

Marriot, this is a great feedback and I see exactly were you're coming from, i'm glad that you think it has strong bones.
It will be rewrote and I like the idea of starting with a funeral..Its' only been done once as i know.. fawlty towers.

Quoted Text So overall, pretty good potential. Even though you disrespect my tribe (for which you will answer to God who, as everyone knows, was born in Cork).

Lol my tribe too and you know God was born in Dublin(Bono) or so he tell us

Did you end up reading the whole script? If you didn't its ok.. If you did great, there is a 2nd episode attached if you want and again there is no pressure to read.

Slan

Mark

hey irish eyes, i gotta admit i'm a first of my family born in uk and by then the folks had left london for the north. i wish they'd picked nyc though, boy do i!

Might have got the name of the series wrong - google says i did... but what it means is if you got the same idea, it shows it's a good idea. ... the pilot of this series was pretty good (after that it tailed off fast lol)... aha, just found the series was called "eli stone". It had a big set-piece in this high-powered-lawyer-firm's high-rise office lobby with the real george michael (yep, the man hiself) singing faith, which is what confused me. (And come on, if they'd carried on with that attitude, the whole series would have been a freaking legend).

I've got a weekend of naff all on, so I'll sit down with a few caff-pows and read through both episodes. and i have to repeat this - i'm commenting on your comedy when i know i couldn't do it myself... it's the hardest thing to be funny, so getting belly laughs is big respect man. (i'm paranoid about sounding arsey, when i know it's easier to say than do.)

-- and I couldn't remember fawlty starting with a funeral, must be ages since i've seen them. too long in fact. [note. talking fawlty and other britcoms, can i ask what sort of a 'feel' you're aiming for with this? it sounds vague, but is it going to be an anarchic fast-paced smack-line after smack-line show, or more quiet characters-with-killer-lines? either way it's gonna work, but the feedback might change depending on the direction you wanted to take it. 'feel' is the best way i have of describing it...]

Thanks for your kind words Marriot

Quoted from Marriot and I couldn't remember fawlty starting with a funeral, must be ages since i've seen them. too long in fact. [note. talking fawlty and other britcoms, can i ask what sort of a 'feel' you're aiming for with this? it sounds vague, but is it going to be an anarchic fast-paced smack-line after smack-line show, or more quiet characters-with-killer-lines? either way it's gonna work, but the feedback might change depending on the direction you wanted to take it. 'feel' is the best way i have of describing it...

"The kipper and the corpse" is the Fawlty towers episode

My sitcom always gets compared to "Always sunny in Philadelphia" I don't know if you get it over there, it stars Danny DeVito.

It's kind of a mixture of the two... Fast paced smack-line and also 1 or 2 characters with killer lines... Sorry I can't really narrow it down to 1...


If you do get a chance on line maybe you should check out "Sunny" it's really funny... DeVito joins in the 2nd season.

Thanks again for the read

Mark

hey Mark - ach, my bad. I didn't mean to ask which one of the two (although that's what I did) - I meant to ask where on the spectrum between them, or sort of what other shows would it be most like in the ... only word I can think of is 'feel'.

Not seen Always Sunny in Philadelphia, not even heard of it (which is a bummer because the state of britcom right now is - unmentionable in places. So we could do with some good shows).

I'll look up on a [popular video hosting site] if the [corporate advertisement vehicle - I mean popular video hosting site] allows the copyright through.

Quoted from irish eyes It will be rewrote and I like the idea of starting with a funeral..Its' only been done once as i know.. fawlty towers.

I had to jump in, I would advise against this as it's very difficult to pull off especially if you're attempting to give this scene emotion to go with the comedy. I mean doing too much comedy and avoiding the sadness/grief that Mickey is going through wouldn't work for me.

On the other side of the coin, if you give this scene too much emotion and avoid the comedy then although giving Mickey some great depth as a character, you're going into drama territory unless that is the direction your heading for.

Also Fawlty Towers never ever started with a funeral, in fact there in no funeral in the show period. The episode your referring to is where a guest dies in his room during the night and they try to hide body until the undertakers arrive...very funny episode let me add.

If you decide to go with this then I would direct you to a show mentioned on a previous post. Only Fools and Horses and the episode strained relations. This episode started with the funeral of their beloved grandad and it was handled with perfection by the writer John Sullivan. It delivered the emotion of such a tragic event but also gave you most unexpected laugh - just well executed.

It would be a tricky scene and would need to handled with care but if you get right then it could prove to be an excellent opening. Like I say though, it needs to have the right mix of both emotion and comedy because this isn't just some random dude, it's his father and you would expect him to be upset.

Good luck with it, buddy.

p.s good result at the weekend, mate. At least we only lost 1-0.

Having read CoopBazinga's post I have to admit I agree - it's too much emotion. How about an [x]-th anniversary - motivates the quiet opening scene, Mickey talking to the animals - but it's revealed there was a clause in the will that if Mickey hadn't like turned a profit say, by that anniversary then ownership went to Jimmy?

(I'm doing the 'ego' thing from the 5 types of bad screenwriter thread and it's for a suggestion I made on someone else's work. Is there some sort of special badge for that? )

Thanks Coop and Marriot
From memory and that's a few years, I thought it started with a funeral.

I do remember the Only Fools and Horses episode that was a classic. John Sullivan is a legend and one of my favorite writers. If I could write half as good him I'd be happy

I said I liked the idea, but I'm not going that way... It's already half-way through and i'm creating more of Mickey's relationship with his mom... Before his uncle got released and also Jimmy in prison with Frankie.... So when I finish hopefully it will roll into the pilot that you both read which of course will become episode 2.

Gonna clean up episode 3 tonight and submit it.

Thanks again

Mark

p.s Coop, it ended on a sweet note with the scum losing to Everton