Hey Mark,

This review is going to seem super short after that monster review you gave my script...

I liked this alot, a good revenge story with a disgusting, painfully brutal ending.

I actually had to go back and read the ending 3 times... even now... HOLY SHIT! Dude, that's seriously fucked up. I cringed... I'm still cringing...

Technically, it was very well written. The format was bang on and the story was very well paced.

I wasn't confused by the flashbacks, I was able to follow it pretty easily.

Overall, great job. It takes balls to write a script this brutally detailed. I look forward to reading more from you.

~Zack~

Hey Zack,

Thanks for taking a look at this.

At first, when you said you had to go back and read the ending three times, I was thinking to myself 'Crap, the ending's too confusing.  Now I have to go back and mess with the flashbacks to make it understandable.'

I'm glad to see that you just went back to read it just because it was so brutal.  It kind of puts a warm feeling in my stomach.  :-)

I'm also glad to see that there wasn't anything wrong with the formatting.

Thanks for letting me know what you thought.  I'm glad that you liked it and I feel a lot better about sending this draft out now, although I know before-hand it won't be filmed the way I wrote it.  (The guy interested in it said he won't show the unit in the ending, but he'll do his best to get the idea across.)  I usually try not to get hung up on how gory or perverse a story is.  I figure it like this:  It's my job to tell the story.  It's the director's job to film it as an R-rating.

Thanks again, Zack.

- Mark

Yeah, I don't see how the whole end scene could be filmed with out acheiving snuff statis... Oh well, still a damn good script!

~Zack~

Well, this one is also a bit perverse, isn’t it?  Haha -- after Maledori, I have to wonder where it is you draw your inspiration from.  If a girl wrote the kind of stuff you do I might suggest therapy.

You do have some odd dialogue scattered around here and there.  The waiter thanking Ellie for choosing the restaurant -- and saying the entire name -- rings a little false.  And in the hospital, Mom mentions somebody named Andrea that never appears anywhere.

And you do the same thing that bugged me so much in Maledori, with those repetitive scenes that you use verbatim.  Once you have established the scene -- and cut away from it -- you should return right were you left off.  Maybe you’ve stopped doing that now, but I am hitting that note one more time just in case.  Not only is it unnecessary to repeat yourself like that, it comes off as a bit lazy.  I know that is not the case, I am just saying.

When Vito is talking to the manager, and we see them talking but do not hear what they are saying, you would say something like "Vito and the Manager talk MOS" to make it clear.  The story for MOS goes that some old German director used to tell people to film a scene like that "mit out sound".  In actuality, MOS probably stands for something much more mundane -- but I like that version -- and it is a real term you can use either way.

A revolver would have empty chambers, not empty brackets.  Seems like she would have had it loaded beforehand anyway.

You do a fair job at presenting Ellie as a conflicted character, unsure of herself and her methods, but the effect is lessened a bit by her earlier behavior in the bathroom of the restaurant.  She seems so very committed to her plan early on that her reversal later is less believable.  I think you could tone the bathroom scene down a bit, making her more of a tease than a complete slut, and she could still get a scumbag like Vito plenty worked up. Her change of heart later would make more sense that way.    

I do enjoy the dark edge you bring to your work, and I think you have a good handle on the NC-17 market.  You are not afraid to take chances, but it comes off as less exploitative that other works I have read around here that go for the same effect. It is a fine line that you seem to tread comfortably -- seemingly unaware of just how hard it is to do that.  Take that as praise, as it was intended that way.

And thanks for the plug on Brown’s thread, btw.  I was planning to read this anyway, but that inspired me to read this sooner rather than later.  Yes, God help me, I am that shallow.

Quoted from bert Well, this one is also a bit perverse, isn’t it?  Haha -- after Maledori, I have to wonder where it is you draw your inspiration from.

Lol.  Just to set the record straight.  I promise that not all of my scripts have somebody's private holes being penetrated.  'Pearl Dive' and 'Meladori' were actually written several months apart, so Meladori wasn't just anger that was left over after Pearl Dive.    The inspiration from 'Pearl Dive' actually stems from a masturbation technique used over in Iraq.  Yes, that's right.  It actually is a masturbation technique to stick something sharp, (they usually use candle wax whittled down to a fine point) down inside their shaft.  That thought absoluted revolsed me and I knew I had to work that into a story somehow...except without a happy ending.  As for if it works, like I told Murphy, I don't plan on ever finding out.

Quoted from bert You do have some odd dialogue scattered around here and there.  The waiter thanking Ellie for choosing the restaurant -- and saying the entire name -- rings a little false.

Lol.  Actually, that line came straight out of the TGIFriday server manual.  I used to serve there, damn, almost nine years ago now, and that's exactly what we had to say to our tables when we approached them.  I resorted to using that to show how Vito treats her like a regular customer at first, then, when she starts giving him the eye (I love it when I get the eye, :-)), he talks to her more confidently and intimately.  As for Andrea, she had a much bigger part in the short story I wrote first, but I decided to shove her out of the way for the script.  I don't know why I kept the line of her being in there.  I'll take her out completely.

Quoted from bert And you do the same thing that bugged me so much in Maledori, with those repetitive scenes that you use verbatim.

I did it on purpose just to tick you off and I'll keep on doing it just to tick you off until you start calling it 'Meladori', instead of Maledori.  :-)  On a serious note, though, in the first draft, I had the story open right away in the hospital, then to the restaurant, then to Vito's apartment.  In this draft, I wanted to maybe build a little bit of suspense as to why Ellie was going to the toilet with Vito, instead of coming straight out and saying what Vito did.  I guess I just like the thought of, if somebody read this again, or watched it again, they'd notice the little things that Ellie did in those deja vu scenes that they missed the first time, such as Ellie rubbernecking her head to see where Vito's section was.

It's not that I'm trying to defend myself.  I understand that technique might come off as awkward.  I just liked resorting to that technique because I enjoyed it in what few movies I've seen it used in.  And I guess I used it because I couldn't come up with a better way to portray Ellie's character arch, hoping that people would think she was a slut in the beginning, then they realize what she is doing may be just, then having her shine in the end by deciding in not going through with Vito's execution, but still getting her point in edgewise.  (Lol.  'Point in edgewise', I swear to God that was no pun intended.)

And I have read somewhere, a long time ago, about that 'mit of sound' thing.  I didn't either understand it at the time or just didn't pay any attention to what it was.  As soon as you mentioned the context of where to use it, I understand it now and it is a lot more effective than the way I have it now.  Thanks.  (And I still like that not capitalizing a character's dialogue when their voice is muffled.  I can't wait to use it.  I'm just biding my time until the perfect moment.)

Quoted from bert I do enjoy the dark edge you bring to your work... You are not afraid to take chances, but it comes off as less exploitative than other works that go for the same effect. It is a fine line that you seem to tread comfortably -- seemingly unaware of just how hard it is to do that.

I was hoping to hear that's how my darker stories come off.  I do understand that these past two stories you read are more vulgar for most people's tastes, and I do come dangerously close to overstepping the boundary of proper violence and just downright perverted, over-the-top exploitation, for lack of a better word.  I don't know if 'nihilistic' would fit.

I did do a lot of chopping at the end from the short story to the script.  The short story I wrote for myself and is horribly vivid and brutal.  However, although I feel it worked well in the short story, there's absolutely no way I felt it would ever work in the script.  For one, because yes, I feel it does cross the line.  But also, no matter how I tried to write it, it just came off as ridiculous, and pretty much downright humorous, yet cringe-inducing at the same time.  (Even Meladori was toned down at the end from what was originally in my mind.  Although, I might go back to the original ending when I get to that part rewriting the feature.)

It makes me feel good to hear that I've kept my balance on that line so far.  And, although I'm not going for the shock value, I'd be lying to say that I wasn't a little bit proud of the 'ouch, that hurt' reaction I've been getting from people's comments.  It's nice to see that after people have read script after scripts of violent, brutal acts, I seem to be catching people with their guard down.  I do have a children's animation in the works right now.  And, although it's still in its early stages, I can promise you can keep your guard down on that one.  :-)

Thanks for taking a look at this one and letting me know what you think.  Just when I was kind of happy with how this turned out, I have to go back and change the 'mit of sound' thing again.  And, I'm still thinking on how to improve without resorting to the deja vu scenes.  Hopefully, lightning'll strike.

- Mark

Mark,
        Just finished your script and I have to say it is one of the better scripts I have read on this site. Throughout, the story kept me intrested, and you added a touch of originality to a story that if written by someone else could have turned into a boring drama about a woman keeping a baby the result of rape.

Throughout most of the script the dialogue is fine and fluent. Your formatting is perfect, characterisation good. My only quarrels are with when you repeat these scenes to convey more information about what was happening. I liked the idea but just the fact I was having to read it all again numerous times was a little tedious.

However, I liked this script, it is the first I have read from you and you can count on me reading a lot more.

Hey Robert,

Quoted from RobertSpence My only quarrels are with when you repeat these scenes to convey more information about what was happening.

Whatever.  Why don't you and Bert just go get married already?  ;-)  Lol.  I'm just kidding.  I do understand what you are saying and I have to admit, it's not the best way to reveal Ellie's character arc.  I suppose I just like it so much because, seeing it  play out in my head, it only takes a couple seconds for her to take her ring off and check out where Vito's section is.  I never really thought about how it takes up 3/4's of a page and how tedious that would be to read all over again.  I really have to work on a better way to show what I want to without resorting to that method.

:-)  On a similar note:

Quoted from RobertSpence it is the first I have read from you and you can count on me reading a lot more.

I may have to apologize in advance if you come across 'Meladori', another short of mine.  Although it's my favorite that I've ever written, please forgive me as I use a little bit of the same technique.  Although written nowhere's near the same time I wrote 'Pearl Dive', it just seemed to fit for this story.  So I'm sorry in advance.  :-)  And I promise that'll be the last time I use it.

Are 'Platform 22' and 'Spilled Milk' the only stories you have posted on SS?  I could have sworn I had read something by you before, but I don't think I've read either of those.  I will check them out tomorrow night, though.

Thanks for taking a look at this and I'm really glad you enjoyed it.  It makes me smile to see it's one of the better ones you've read.

- Mark

P.S. - I like your avatar.

Hi Mark, thought I'd give one of your scripts a read after your comments and advise on mine.
The story flowed really well, which for the amount of time jumps is a big achievement. I take it this is the final draft? Would be interesting to be able to read the other draft(s) to see where the improvements were made. Just as someone starting out would find that helpful.
I loved the flashback to the start with a little more detail. Reminded me a little of 'Liar' with Tim Roth, just how that gradually shows what's going on with ever expanding flashbacks.
The ending is painful to read. I would have had the same problem trying to think of a way to describe how Vito reacts. Think the one sentance is perfect - leave it to the director and actor to work with.
Anyway, will look out for your other scripts and if your friend who the Ellie character is based on visits England anytime, tell her to try Newcastle ;o)

Ste

Hey Ste,

Thanks for checking this one out.

Quoted from stebrown I take it this is the final draft? Would be interesting to be able to read the other draft(s) to see where the improvements were made. Just as someone starting out would find that helpful.

Umm.  Hmm.  Not too sure if it's the final draft quite yet, as I feel there's still a few things that can be tightened up here and there, but I'm very happy with it for now.  I'm one of those people who feel that the writing process isn't over until the director says 'Cut' for the final time.

The very first draft was on an old computer that kind of went ka-put, but I do have a printout of the draft I submitted in June, (the one that people had first commented on).  I'll transcribe it onto my computer now and e-mail it to you so you can see the changes..  It's twelve pages, and I wanted to cut it down to ten or so pages, and I did cut out some things, but I somehow ended up adding another eight pages and it read a lot smoother for some strange reason.

Quoted from stebrown I loved the flashback to the start with a little more detail.

Lol.  I used this method in another story, also.  Both times it has gotten very mixed reactions.  People either love it or hate it.  I'm at a loss for what to do about it because, personally, I love it.  But I am trying to find a way to convey the same idea so that everybody likes it.

It's funny, I've never heard of the movie 'Liar' with Tim Roth before, until just a few days ago.  Lol.  Strange that you just mentioned it again.  I'm on the lookout for the movie because it does seem interesting.

Quoted from stebrown if your friend who the Ellie character is based on visits England anytime, tell her to try Newcastle ;o)

Lol.  Yet another coincidince.  I was just talking with Tricia (the squirting friend), and we are going to take a little trip this summer if I'm able to get a few legal things in order.  We're going to spend a little time in London, which I'm not too sure how close that is to Newcastle, and then I always wanted to visit Pompeii, so we're going to spend about a month there.

Anyway, thanks again for taking a look at this, Ste.

- Mark

pg. 2
Your server'll be right with
you.

I'm not sure if that is an Americanism (I'm English), but generally I'd use the term waiter or waitress.

ELLIE
Me? No. But you better make it
worth my wild so I come back
again.

Just a spelling mistake there. wild to while

pg.4
CUT TO BLACK:
ELLIE: (V.O.)
First of all, in my defence; I'm
not a brunette.

that was a nice line. that scene beforehand seems over the top, maybe gratuitous, unless you're going for that, especially the pre-cum ending.

pg7.

the conversation here works for the emotions you are trying to put across, but it just feels adn reads too unnatural. Try getting a female to read over that and make some suggestions on their actual speech patterns, because it feels a little forced.

pg9.

ELLIE
But they still didn't do
anything to him when you told
them you said 'no'?
JENNA
He said I instigated it. No
bruises or bleeding, no rape.
It's only my word against his.

That part, it's obvious what they are talking about, and I think it would add a bit of drama if you didn't have the character's use the word rape. I think the audience will still get it.

Was there a reason Ellie kept the baby? It seems a bit strange with all this contempt, or was it just because she wanted something good to come out of the situation? I'd try to hint towards this a little more possibly, or I guess you could leave it up to the audience.


----

Ok, so overall I liked it. Here are my major overall criticisms:

- The ending seemed comical too me, it was a change that wasn't really coming, and seemed out of place, almost like you were teasing with a seriousness that never came in the end. It's a twist ending, but I just think it seems far too funny as you are waiting for him to try it.

- The two flash back reveals are slightly annoying in a short script, because it's the same technique being used twice. I think for the first one, don't flash back, just try and reveal everything in that first shot. Obviously we as viewers won't realise why she's doing what she's doing, and if the director's good enough and you write it to be subtle enough the audience won't be trying to figure out what she's doing until you do the reveal a little later on. And with a short script, it should still be fresh in their memories.

- The dialogue after the birth seems a bit unnatural, but I already spoke about that.

Beyond that, I like it. It was one of those "Ohhhhh, that's what she's doing" feelings when you see the reveal, and it's easy to get into it. But you get into it because of the "thriller" aspect, and the seriousness of how it plays. So the way the comical ending comes about feels a bit cheap. (If I'm the only one that finds that funny - not haha laugh out loud funny but just not serious enough - then probably ignore that).


Hope this helps!

Hey Mark

I think this is the first of yours that I've read and I was impressed. The cringe ending worked very well. Goes to show that you can do a "gruesome" script but attach a real story to it. Just a couple of quipes, most have probably been covered.

Felt the two voice over lines were unnessecary. While I don't mind voice over, I think you have to commit or not at all. While it work initially when she says she's not a brunette, I'm reading it, waiting for more voice over that ain't coming. And it's not like you had her saying something we wouldn't have found out.

I would like to see a little more of a conflict in Ellie's behavior. A married woman confront her sister's rapist, I would think, would have at least a few more jitters. Maybe she almost over plays her hand and has to cover.

Not really a fan of the flashbacks, especially the first.

That's about it. I thought it was really good and I'll have to check out your other stuff sometime.

Good show

Tim

Hey Hass,

Thanks for checking this out lastnight.

Quoted from HassOE I'm not sure if that is an Americanism (I'm English), but generally I'd use the term waiter or waitress.

You sexist chauvenistic pigs!  This ain't the 1980's anymore!  You probably still call flight attendants stewardesses, huh?  :-)  Lol.  But yeah, the correct term and expressed very clearly in most restaurant manuals is to refer to both waiters and waitresses as servers, so you're not segregating the sexes.

Quoted from HassOE ...wild to while...

Actually, I've seen this go both ways several times and I was never sure which way was the proper way to say it.  I do like worth my while better, I just wasn't positive if it was correct or not, but I knew wild would definately get the point across.  Thanks.  Now I know.

Quoted from HassOE Try getting a female to read over that...

Lol.  I'd love to hear a woman's perspective on this, actually.  Trouble is, not too many hanging around that I see.  Hopefully one day, though, a woman will peruse through and be drawn in.  Half of the reason I labelled it as a 'drama', but it didn't work too well.

Quoted from HassOE Was there a reason Ellie kept the baby?

I know I didn't get into the controversial element too much, but it is kind of a high-tension issue about keeping fetus' or aborting them when the fetus is from a rape.  There are pro-lifers who feel the baby must be carried to term no matter what, despite the mother's situation.  I wanted to spend more time on the payback and revenge rather than the religious and political views of Jenna, so I opted to just show that Jenna was a pro-lifer.  Personally, I'm halfway between both sides.  I do feel the baby should be carried to full term and be put up for adoption if the mother doesn't want it, as there's a lot of sterile couples out there who would make great parents and are waiting for the opportunity, but I ultimately believe the decision should be left to the mother to decide.

Thanks for taking a look at this.  I was really hoping not to get a comical reaction.  At least I don't think.  But I have to admit, I smile and laugh, too, everytime I reread this.  But, at the same time, I think it's also a grotesque and rightous payback.  At least he won't be violating anybody anytime soon.  I'm not saying I agree with the 'eye for an eye' commandment, but in this case...

Thanks again and I do know I need a little work on the 'sisterly' dialogue you had pointed out.  I can see where some things ring false.

- Mark

Hey Tim,

I'm glad you were impressed and thank you for taking the time to read this.

First off, I have to ask, where did you get the name 'Souter Fell' from?  I like it.  It's kind of catchy.  It has a nice ring to it.

Quoted from Souter Fell Goes to show that you can do a "gruesome" script but attach a real story to it.

Whew!  Makes me feel good, warm and fuzzy on the inside to read that.

You know, I never realized how only having that one line of Voiceover would sound.  That's something I never thought of.  I just thought it would make a smooth transaction to explain the hospital scene was a flashback.  Although I like the ring to it, I guess it is kind of pointless.  Thanks for bringing that to my intention.

Quoted from Souter Fell Not really a fan of the flashbacks, especially the first.

Yeah.  I've gotten mixed reactions about using the flashback technique.  When I first posted this, I had the story going straight through, from the hospital scene, to the restaurant scene, to Vito's apartment and I kind of caught hell for not hiding Ellie's intentions until later in the script.  Hence, I came up with the flashback.  I'm still not sure which way I personally like better, so this is something I'll be focusing a lot on in the very near future.

Anyhow, I thank you again for your time and I'm especially glad to see that you liked it.  I'll be seeing you around.

- Mark

Quoted from rc1107 You sexist chauvenistic pigs!  This ain't the 1980's anymore!  You probably still call flight attendants stewardesses, huh?  :-)  Lol.  But yeah, the correct term and expressed very clearly in most restaurant manuals is to refer to both waiters and waitresses as servers, so you're not segregating the sexes.

Nothing to do with the script, but that just seems a bit ridiculous. If you were to refer to both men and women as waiters, or both as waitresses then maybe, but by giving each a name that's not sexist at all. Surely that's just the same as me calling a man a man and a woman a woman, it's not degrading in anyway, it's just saying what they are. A flight attendant would be a flight steward or stewardess, depending on the sex. Certainly not chauvinistic, as both are given acceptable terms of address.

Goddamn, Mark, this is definitely not for the squeamish.

This is really a great little revenge story, one that completely held my attention from start to finish. I thought the way you played this out was totally believable, even if it is quite hardcore. I think that what took this to the next level, the thing that made it stand out was the fact that Ellie doesn't go through with the killing - that is so much more believable than just turning the story into a big tale of torture porn (though there's certainly elements of both here - but you know what I mean). Ellie is about as cunning as they come, but she's also human and I think that her reason for wanting to kill Vito is as good as her reason for ultimately not killing him. I thought the flashbacks worked really well, especially with the way you started the story. I didn't have any trouble following the end - though, at first, I thought she only got Vito fired (which would have been a weak ending) but then you laid the Coup de grâce on him and that totally nailed it!

The writing was very provocative and I'll give you serious props for that. It was definitely an eye opener. Actually I can't think of another script I've read that have both that and an excellent story. But it also might just be the script's biggest downside, and by that I mean you'll probably have some trouble finding someone willing to produce it as is. But I liked it.

Two things bothered me about the script though:

- In the hospital, Ellie asked Jenna who had raped her. I found it a little hard to believe that she didn't ask before. I mean, why wait for 9 months?

- What exactly is it that stops Ellie from killing Vito? Since she kisses her wedding at that moment, I'm thinking it's either her love for her husband (the fear of losing him when she goes to prison). Or is it something else, something deeper?

- Why do Vito go into the bathroom to put on the condom? Why not just have Ellie put it on him? I know why you had to get Vito into the bathroom (to set up the ending of course) but it seems a little odd in any respect.

Okay, that was three things.

All in all, a very captivating script. Kudos.

Cheers
Rob