I'm late to the party but I've finally found the time to get to this. Pretty impressive story you have here. I've scanned over the previous comments but there are too many to read them all so excuse me if I repeat anything.

I have no problems whatsoever with the gore level here. I thought the scalp idea was kind of cool and is the type of thing that other horror writers should be beating themselves up saying "Why didn't I think of that?". Really, top marks for that one.

Major creepy scene when Logan lifts the arm of the corpse in a waving motion. Also the bit when he mimics Kaylee with a little girls voice. Very creepy stuff that would look great on film.

Another great visual, the Glasgow Smile. I can honestly say I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. Brutal stuff.

There is definite shades of "Fade to White" in here. The slow build with lots of talk, then the crazy stuff starts. I would agree with previous posters that it is fairly obvious that Logan is a killer right away because of the Logan/Tyler name confusion but if this was on film and I knew nothing about it before watching, it would work really well. While I am normally a fan of slow build ups, I wasn't with this. I think the reasons for this was because I knew where the story was going with Logan and I just wanted to get to the violence already.

I would have liked to have seen more of Maia. More time is spent with Emma than needed. I liked the twist with Maia but it would have more of an impact if you spent more pages showing Logan with Maia acting like a normal girl.

I didn't have any problems with Emma running off with Logan. Not all girls act the same way so there is every chance some would fall for Logan's act. I did have a problem with Emma's friends. Surely they would have reported Emma missing and described Logan's appearance to the police. Logan picks up Maia at the exact same spot as Emma. Maybe even showing a police sketch aritist impression of Logan as a poster on a wall in the area would be enough to tell us that Emma's friends did all they could to help her. Right now, they are like a loose end.

That's all I can think of right now. Impressive script with some neat visuals. I enjoyed reading it. Well done!

Brian

Key To my heart...

Lambeau Field...the Frozen Tundra...Hallowed ground.  Like the details of the loyalty to the local brew...

Does the fact that Logan (Tyler? Tyler Logan?) drink a Miller light say something about his character? Could be...

I’d like a brat. Suggest defining it as ‘bratwurst” in a description to clarify if a reader is uncertain of the term.

Nit-pick, but should it be ‘Sconsin, since it’s abbreviated?

Right on the bay of Green Bay, Tyler says. Redundant.

The turn of conversation by Madison and Emma to spring board off Logan’s horror writing feels un-natural. Might be something they’d talk about amongst themselves, but not with a handsome guy they are all flirting with.  Suggest Logan bring it up, as , being a horror writer, it would be logical he’d be following more closely than the girls.

pg. 7...green and yellow clad fans...Getting a little redundant. We know we are in Packer country...Where are the cheeseheads? Someone has got to have a cheesehead in this script....Phew! Madison and Melissa save the day.

Emma would not leave her Packers in the third quarter if Brad Pitt were hitting on her. The team NEEDS her... To be going on an away trip with a dude she just met to meet his parents seems like a big stretch, too...It’s a big step for a couple that just met  three hours ago (with a serial killer who abducted two girls from there in the past few weeks)...Meeting the Parents = Commitment. I think that happened to Elaine on Sienfeld once.

Pg. 12. Oh dear. It appears things are going to go badly for poor Emma. Explains the Tyler/Logan naming thing.   Didn’t know the other girls were dead, which raises a question; presumedly no actors would be playing those parts, they would be props (puppets, actually, waving and such.) Would they still require a formal introduction?

Not really buying the schizo Tyler/Logan thing, as it seems like he can turn it on and off...As it is, Logan is just his exuse to be a psycho and kill and torture women. Perhaps if he came in and out, like a real schizophrenic would do- that could be really chilling to see what his alternate personality were doing...

Pg. 18. OK, so know we know Tyler’s M.O...Is Maia gonna kick his ass? Hope so.

I don’t think the dialogue/intro scene needs to be repeated. Once he tosses the football and introduces himself, we get the idea, up to the point where he pulls up to the cabin. It’s reasonable to assume that all the other stuff, including the key, would have happenend in a similar manner.  

Oh, man...she’s a monster. Why does it have to be monsters? I figured that she was going to prove to be as sick as he was, giving him a taste of his own medicine, but as  a really kick ass human woman (Like Uma or Lucy Liu)  The monster thing disappointed me...kind of popped out nowhere, like there was no other way to get the villian defeated.

Characters. Would have liked a little more depth. What drove Tyler/Logan to this level of cruelty? Should be more than a bored rich guy. Why was Emma, Kaylee and Haylee so eager to run off with this guy? Perhaps the key held a magic spell (which would correspond and establish the possibility of  the coming of the demon in the end).  

Tanis pulling the key out of the heart in the end was extremely cool.

Overall, very good attention to detail, some excellent gruesomeness in the descriptions, but would have liked to see a  more human oriented outcome.

Hey T Joe, thanks for the read and comments.

Probably right about ‘Skonsin.

As for “right on the bay of Green Bay”, that’s how my Dad always describes its location.  They’ve been living up there for 15 years now.  It does sound a little funny, though, doesn’t it?

Never fear, the cheeseheads are here!

The reason Emma would leave the game early, and why Logan planned his “sunset cruise” was because the game was against the Lions…an easy win, and in this case, it was a blowout by the third quarter.

As for the formal intro for the dead girls, I think it makes sense to use all CAPS.  There were other drafts in which they actually were intro’d alive.

Logan is the psycho, Tyler is the nice guy.  I don’t think he’s turning it on and off, per say, it’s just that when he’s in killing mode, it’s Logan, and in picking up mode, it’s Tyler doing the work.

I personally like the repeated events with Maia…kind of shows that he’s done this before, and has it down quite well.

She’s a demon…a good demon, a protector of innocent women.  Sorry you didn’t like what Maia was…you are not alone.  I really like it though.

Actually kind of like your idea about the key having magical powers.  I actually briefly toyed with that, but threw it out because it completely gave things away, way too early.  It is a possibility though for sure.

Glad it worked for you in some ways, T Joe.  I appreciate your thoughts, man.  Thanks.

Hey Jeff.

Right, I’ve read it. I’ve also read all of the reviews – and then I went back and listened to the iScript, reading it through again as I did so. I’m not sure how much there is left to say about what is, ultimately, a 26-page script written within certain parameters that is ‘finished’ in the sense that it has already been aurally produced. Still, you asked me to give you feedback, and since you’re a very active member of the community (and I know you to be a good writer), I have no problem obliging. So here I am.

Like I say, this has already been produced, so in a way it seems a bit pointless to suggest making changes now. The other thing is that I know you’re very set in your ways and confident in the decisions you take in writing – while your self-assuredness is a positive quality, it does limit the value of any feedback I give you. I will, however, make a couple of points:

- I didn’t actually have that much of a problem with Emma disappearing with Logan. It definitely COULD happen, and wasn’t unbelievable in my book. An eyebrow-raiser, certainly, and clearly a stupid decision even without the whole ‘he’s a sick serial killer’ thing, but not so implausible as to sink the script, at least for me. One thing I would say is you need to be clearer about who exactly this guy is, and how much of what he’s telling us is true. Does Logan ACTUALLY own a yacht? If he doesn’t, if this lie is part of his M.O.  – which I assume it is, since he uses the same lines on Mia – then I’d have liked to see him have more in the way of proof. Some faked photos of him on his yacht, a sailor’s hat somewhere in the car where Emma is bound to pick it up and comment on it...just some little detail that makes it clear Logan has put some effort into this deception. At the moment, the problem isn’t that Emma goes with him, it’s that she believes his bullshit so easily.

- I think you might remember in my review of Fade to White that I said I didn’t buy some of the ‘death scene’ dialogue. That kind of dialogue can very easily come across as false, or repetitive (“oh my god oh my god, please no etc.”). There’s a LOT of it here because this has a long torture scene. The visuals are suitably gory, but the dialogue isn’t at a par because I think it’s virtually impossible to write good, interesting death scene dialogue. There’s only so much variation you can put on someone begging for their life, you know?

- The whole ‘repeating everything exactly the same way’ thing that happens when Logan meets Maia...I understand what you’re trying to do, you’re trying to create tension by letting us know what Logan’s doing and wanting to say to Maia, “stay away from him!” But I don’t really think it works, unfortunately. It just comes off as repetitive, and not really in a good way. We know how things are going to turn out with Emma, and as you yourself have said you make no effort to conceal that. So when you ask us to go through pretty much the exact same sequence again, albeit a truncated version with a different girl, it does feel a little redundant. The dramatic irony doesn’t really come across. There’s a sequence in Pia’s 7WC script where the killer snoops around the morgue with a goth girl. That sequence works really well because we know what’s going to happen, but the dialogue is written in such a way that it becomes painful just how oblivious the girl is to the danger she’s putting herself in (it’s the best bit of her script, IMO). I don’t really know what changes you could make, just thought I’d say that it didn’t work for me.

- You don’t make enough of key revelations, instead glossing over them with throwaway lines of dialogue. Logan killed his parents, but you only briefly mention this. Maia is some sort of demonic Buffy type, a protector of innocent girls (although she has missed three separate killings), and yet again you pay no attention to this. Because you don’t weave these details into the script and instead just outright give them to us at seemingly arbitrary moments, they make the reader stop and go, “Wait, what?” I know you said this isn’t a character study, but if you don’t intend to explore these details all they are is distracting.

- How would Logan not have been picked up by the time Maia arrives? He’s done exactly the same thing three times, clearly in exactly the same location. Emma had two friends with her – would they not have reported her missing? That, to me, is a far greater believability issue than whether Emma would go off with Logan in the first place. I remember having similar reservations about Fade, too.

[DELETED TEXT]

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EDIT - 7/02/2010: after giving it some thought, I've decided to retract the second half of my review. Not because I'm worried about hurting your feelings or anything like that - I know you're an adult about criticism - but because I've come to three conclusions:

1) it's not for me to tell you what to write or how to write it.
2) I've only read two scripts from you, which isn't enough to draw a definitive opinion about your overall work as a writer.  
3) Dec and Andrew made the point I wanted to make, so there's no point in me flogging a dead horse.

You asked for feedback on what you DID write, so I've kept that. Hope some of it's useful, see you around.

Jon

Hey Brian, much better late than never…I always say.  Sometimes, you cum late, you get the pick, of the litter.  Sorry…I’ve been drinking…again!

Hey, cool, thanks…glad someone likes this…and I mean that.  As I’ve said before, I really was happy how this turned out, but most really dislike it.  Oh well…give me your address…I’ll send you a Christmas card in 10 months!

Awesome…I too loved the “self scalping” idea.  I came up with it on a treadmill at the gym, after 8 or 9 other ideas didn’t pan out.  Thanks…glad it worked for you.  I’ve sure never seen it, and I think it’s quite a visual…as well as a cringe worthy thought.

Again, thanks, man, so glad that stuff worked for you.  I was laughing my ass off with the “little girl’s voice” and I too really think it’s disturbing and works.

Yeah, I’m afraid (afraid cause most in here don’t seem to like it) that I definitely have a certain style that some will like, and some will hate.  I love a slow build, I love lots of talk, and I love LOTS OF ACION, and crazy shit, and…I guess…Deux es Machina, late entry character.  I guess I honestly can’t help myself.  That’s what I like, that’s what I want to write.

Yeah, I hear you, Brian…I purposely telegraphed the set up and I actually did it for a reason…a reason that few seem to like.  I totally understand you and everyone else’s criticism here.  It was a choice I made, and for me, I like it.  Problem is , as I’ve said before, is that with this simple genre I went for, any attempts at “shielding” the true “plot” is just about impossible.  I actually wanted you to “know” (or think you knew) what was going to play out, and then I wanted to shock you with the intensity of how it actually did play out.  You know, as graphic and brutal as this may be, until page 22, there’s almost literally no onscreen violence. Yes, there are dead bodies, and yes, there is a rather graphic “nipple bite”, but other than that…nothing.

Again, with Maia, IMO, if I tried to set her up as just someone else, it would have been painfully obvious…way too many movies try to do this.  I wanted to stay away from that.  I wanted you to have an inkling that maybe…Maia would be different.  Yeah, maybe, again, bucking that fucking system, and introing a Deus Ex Machina character too late for the books, but IMO, completely seriously, it flowed in with the very linear plot line perfectly.  


Finally someone agrees with me about Emma and anyone else taking off with someone they just met.  It really does happen way more than most realize, I guess.  In my world, it’s no big deal, but most just don’t agree.  As per Emma’s friends, they definitely did report her missing, and yes, they also described Logan as best as they could remember.  The thing about a Packers football game is that everyone kind of looks the same when everyone has on a packers jersey, and alcohol is involved. In my rewrite, Logan will have a different car the 2nd time and also pick her up at a different location.

Thanks again, Brian, totally appreciate your feedback.

Hey Jeff,

Gave a listen to your script.  I've been doing all of these via the iScripts because they are there and the most visible rendition of what you have created.

I thought this was a really good iScript.  The guy that read it did a great job, especially with Bert's Tanis.

Your prose is definitely improving.  Some parts of this were beautifully written.   I think this was in your own style of storytelling and therefore a great addition to the Soulshadows series.  

That being said I thought the story was pretty predictable. And I think you needed to add some more suspense toward the beginning.  Even if it's just a mutilated body flopping to the floor.  

Mix it up a bit more with the boys - maybe more than one of the characters go home with a boy and  not just Emma.  If another one of her girlfriends did something similar then that would sort of justify what Emma did.  Follow both Emma and the other girlfriend so we don't know which is going to get it.  

Maia needs more than just weird teeth.  I'm not sure what, just more.  And furthermore her appearance and behaviour was incongruous to her function.  

And while it was a good script, those are my thoughts on where it needs improvement.

Hey Jonny, sorry for the late reply.  I had it half finished and lost it somehow…then I saw that you retracted a bunch of your comments…wish you would have left them in there, as I appreciate any and all feedback, and love giving my take back on it as well.  So, let’s go!

Really glad to hear that you read it twice and also listened to it.  That’s totally cool. I think the reader for iscripts did a pretty good job.  Although it may be a “finished” script, there’s always room for improvements, and I’m already pretty sure what corrections will be made to get this to where I think it needs to be.

Although I may not always agree with others critiques of my work or any other work, I always listen and take everything in.  Differing viewpoints are what make the world go round…and round…and…

Glad you could buy into Emma’s decision to go with Logan, as well as the other 2 girls who did the same thing, and made that fateful decision, which ultimately, lead to their demise.  I’m still very surprised so many couldn’t understand it or buy into it.

As to who Logan really is, we don’t know that, and I didn’t want to go into any greater detail.  For the record, pretty much everything he told the girls up front was a lie.  No, he does not own a yacht, but then again, he never said he did.  He said it was his Dad’s.  Yes, it is definitely his M.O., and IMO, it’s quite effective.  He doesn’t go around bragging about himself in any way.  He says things very innocently…and differently.  The way he plays up his parents and their relationship is something that you don’t see too often…especially in a first meeting.  Kids today don’t act like it’s cool to be close with their parents, and because of this, people (girls) tend to trust him and believe what he’s saying, as he just comes across as being “different”.

As to “death scene” dialogue, you’re probably correct.  That’s probably because in a scene such as this (or any such death scenes) these are the things that are most likely going to come out of the victim’s mouth.  Cliché?  Repetitive?  Maybe so, but realistic, IMO, as well.  So, yeah, I hear ya here for sure.

You are obviously not alone in not liking the “repeating” meeting with Maia.  As I have said a few times, in an earlier draft, Emma actually didn’t die, and survived long enough for Maia to rescue her. So, yes, I didn’t try to hide what was most likely going to go down with her, but by not showing her actual death, I did want to leave things open until we got back down to that basement.  I understand what you’re saying and why it didn’t work for you.

Sorry you felt that some key revelations were nothing more than distracting.  I don’t really understand that, but if that’s how you felt, then that’s how you felt.  IMO, these revelations are what they are, and nothing more needed to be said about them.  When Logan tells Emma that he killed his parents for their money, he’s merely letting her (and the readers) know that he’s definitely whacked and is capable of anything…other than probably remorse or mercy.  As to Maia telling Logan what she is, it’s kind of the exact same thing, only the opposite…she too is not going to be concerned with remorse or mercy, when she’s doing what she does.  Maia comes right out and tells Logan that “she’s not always on time, but God knows, she tries”.  I would pretty much sum this up by saying super heroes, cops, doctors, anyone involved with “saving the day”, aren’t always going to be able to actually save the day, every day, every time.  She may be superhuman, but that doesn’t mean that she’s always successful.

In my rewrite, Logan will be in a different car, in a different spot, when he picks up (or is picked up) by Maia.  Kaylee and Hannah were picked up alone, so there weren’t any witnesses at all.  No bodies have been found and really, no signs of foul play.  The first and only witnesses at all are Madison and Alyssa.  As I’ve said a few times, when everyone is wearing the same thing, and there are literally many, many thousands of people all doing the same thing, and lots of alcohol is involved, describing what someone looks like isn’t going to be very exact.

I remember reading your post before you chose to delete this next section, but it’s vague in my memory.  Something about always wanting to buck the system makes my writing suffer because of it?  Not sure, but I wish you would have kept it so I could respond.

So, on to your 3 conclusions…

1)  Agreed, we all get to make that call on our own.  Sounds like you don’t like what I choose to write as well as how I choose to write it.

2)  Agreed again, but I think you’ve actually read at least 4 scripts from me.  You can draw any conclusions you think makes sense, Jonny.  That’s your call and we all call ‘em as we see ‘em.

3)  Well, I’ve responded to Dec and Andrew, and I think we’re all clear on where we stand and why we choose to stand there.  Many writers follow the advice of those they believe in, and that makes perfect sense.  Others just aren’t followers, and I think that’s cool as well.

Appreciate your honesty here, Jonny, and don’t ever feel that you can’t say exactly what you’re thinking to me or about me.  I have no problems with it at all.  As always, your feedback is very helpful and I appreciate all of it…the good, the bad, and the fucking ugly.

Thanks, man.  Take care.

Jeff

Long time since we talked. I haven't been on the boards for quite awhile. Heard that you had a new script in Soul Shadows. I really, really liked Key To My Heart. Well done, lad!  I both read and listened to the script -- both times very enjoyable. Terrific work.

I looked at some of the comments on the discussion board, but have not been able to read all 80-something comments and your get-backs.

I liked the entire underlying idea of the story, the set-up and ending bookends, the character development of Tyler and all the girls, the Tyler/Logan surprise and very natural and convincing dialog.

Regarding the dialog: I noticed that some comments described the dialog as a bit cliched, but I didn't really hear it that way.  On screen it would play more as a part of Tyler's slick and smooth scam. Also, when your head is nailed to the wall and somebody is carving their initials in your breasts -- I think the victim would say things that are pure and simple outbursts, "you mother f'er!" Doesn't need to be clever, just true to the situation.

I do have a few story beat suggestions that may be worth your consideration, such as:

-- Rather than Emma falling so hard and so fast for Tyler, let her resist the temptation at first and have some concerns while her girlfriends reinforce her instincts.

-- Have her tell her friends if she's not comfortable leaving the restaurant with Tyler, she'll call them to pick her up.

-- But, let the turning point be in the restaurant when he gives her the key to his heart and that melts her resistance and makes her comfortable to finally gush a little.

-- When Tyler is talking to his father on the phone, let him say that his father (a cop) mentioned they caught the kidnapper.  At this point we have no reason to believe that he isn't actually talking to his father and telling the truth.

-- When Emma is in the dungeon, let her almost escape or kick Logan in the balls so he passes out, and when he comes to his vengeful and more extreme torturing of her would further heighten the tension and make us squirm even more.

-- When it's payback time, why have Maia cut Logan's face? If Logan mutilated the girls' breasts how about cutting off his balls, even if we don't see it.  She could humiliated him even more by showing him his balls.

-- Maybe even take it up another notch:  with three tortured girls, so far the payback is only 2(balls) to 3 dead girls. That leaves one more thing to remove to settle the score, 3-to-3. Wonder what that could be?

Once again, Jeff, nice job with Key To My Heart.

Over and out.

Hey Michael, thanks for the listen and feedback…much appreciated.  Sorry for taking so long to reply, but the OWC has kept me busy.

Glad you liked it…thanks!  I agree that the iscripts guy did a god job with the read and the majority of the dialogue.

Yeah, some have said that I ventured out of Soul Shadows territory, but IMO, each writer should bring their own style into the series.  Glad it worked for you.

As to the predictability factor, I hear what you’re saying, and others have said the same thing. I wasn’t going for any misdirection in terms of Logan or even Emma.  What I wanted to do was deliver things a bit differently than you probably were expecting, in terms of violence, brutality, and shocks.  Also, if you caught it, there wasn’t any onscreen violence until Maia shows up, which is a bit different for this type of genre.

I have toyed with the idea of starting out in the basement with Kaylee still alive, but not show anything else…other than the terror in her eyes.  I decided against it because I thought it telegraphed things a bit too much, and I wanted the initial basement scene to hit hard and come without any foreshadowing.  Hostel did this and it worked well, but using it again, IMO, would be a little too close to home.

I hear what you’re suggesting with the other girls.  The first draft had info that told us that Madison and Alyssa both had boyfriends already and Emma was very single.  It got axed due to page constraints as well as it running too long in background and chatting. Makes sense though for sure.

Not sure what you mean exactly regarding Maia.  Basically, she’s just beautiful evil, personified.

Thanks again, as always, your advice is solid.

Not in a position to stick around the boards and offer reviews to people n' stuff but I had a couple of your scripts sitting on my desktop for sometime and needed to get to them... Granted this one wasn't one of them but a read is a read and a review is a review.  

So, I liked the flow and set up to the story.  I'm a sucker for old EC comics and this defiantly had that vibe to it.  A little more Tales From the Darkside maybe... All the same.  But with those, both comic and adaptation alike, you're subject to a slew of hit and miss material and stories that seemingly don't go anywhere.

It's a fine line to walk when dealing in shorts...  Out of the 120+ screenplays I've written, 85% of them are short stories.  30 - 40 - 60 pages in length.  So I relate well with what you've done here.   I see you've had 6 pages of reads and reviews and all that but truthfully none of their opinions really matter to me so I seldom read the opinions of others... Unless it's of my work and that's usually just to tell them they're wrong if they didn't like it and right if they did.  

Moving along, I'm not at all familiar with "Soul Shadow" or the series it represents... I see that it has a radio read but don't have the time to sit back and listen to it.  Basically, I'm going into this missing the 1st one, I suppose, and not knowing anything at all about it. So to me, and forgive me if credit isn't distributed equally, this is your script.

As far as stories go... This isn't one I'd be keen on watching.  I have a huge distaste for exploitation films and the like.  Coffee, Last House on The left, The Hills have eyes, Don't Mess With my Sister, House On the Edge of the Park, I spit on Your grave... And a slew of others, hell... even Toxic Avenger ranks among these.  And moving into newer territory are the remakes of LHOTL and HHE and so forth and so on... Saw, Hostel... none of those movies interest me.  Torture movies aren't my thing, basically.  

So I'm going to look at just the content and the writing.   As always you write very clear... Even with the "we" and "moving through" stuff, it's never a distraction.  Even with the "super" of the title... none of it screams clunky and is well laid out.  So, while I personally wouldn't use them, you've shown that you can use them effectively.  That's good.

The dialouge was tight and cohesive throughout.  Each character, Logan, of course, had their own voice.  The weakest being Mia, unfortunately,..  The reasons for this are, she's a demon and well... Demons can be very tricky to write for without going into Wisconsin Cheese land "no pun intended".  An amalgamation of a slew of iffy dialouge led me this disicion, by the way.

for instance... And Logan even gets a little Homoerotic here.

LOGAN
Yeah, it is. Maia, you're gorgeous.
I can't believe how much I'm attracted
to you. I'm not usually very good
at this stuff...seriously.

Maia takes a swig of her beer, licks her red lips.

MAIA
You're not, huh? I don't know about
that. But I've got to say that I'm
pretty attracted to you, too.

c'mon... Really?  Well, when in Wisconsin I suppose.   But more importantly some of her actions towards the end really had me on the fence... It's one thing to do something with a swift decisive action but once the one liners start to fly it gets very, very janky.

It flaps up and down, as he tries to speak.

MAIA
What's a matter? Cat got your tongue?

Blood flows freely down Logan's convulsing body. His eyes
blink, scan back and forth, left to right...wide with terror.

MAIA (CONT'D)
You gave me the key to your heart...I
want to see if it actually fits. Or
were you lying about that, as well?

And there were more instances... I guess every since Freddy, a demon so to speak, started spouting out one liners things went down hill very fast for me and demons in film.  No fault of your own, believe me.  It's a tough sale to write good convincing dialouge for a tounge in cheek being at times.

As far as descriptions go... ACE.  Everything is nailed down here and permant.  There is no rocking back and forth when speaking of the foundation you build your scripts on.

The gore was plenty.  The depictions were vivid and the pain was felt... I guess for a script of this magnitude, one that isn't trying to change the world or set it on fire, you succeeded well.  And, let's be honest here, not every script has to do those things.  Some of the best scripts in the world are ones that walk a path, tell their story and let it ride...

Jeff,

I liked this, but I think you took it too far in some aspects such as the gore, and not far enough in other aspects, such as Logan and his personalities.

I also thought we didn't need to see the whole pick up thing done for so long with Maia. We know Logan does the same routine with lot's of girls, we don't need to see it all again.

I know this is supernatural, but I would have liked Maia to be human and have planned to take Logan out for a while now, after one of her friends got tortured by him.

In terms of getting this made... you don't have many characters which is good, but there is lot's of gore and it pushes the boundaries, so I reckon if it was made, some stuff would have to be taken out (which you would hate, obviously).

Writing is fine as usual, dialogue natural, and with a rewrite would be a really good script. Good stuff.

Big Lew, what up, bud?  Sorry for being so late in my response.  Thanks for the read and feedback. You make a lot of good points as always.

Glad you liked this and I appreciate the read and listen.  It’s funny how differently things come off when you listen to them as opposed to reading them…or both at the same time even.

Thank you for the compliments on the story and dialogue.  Some didn’t like the dialogue at all, but I’m with you here, brother!

All your ideas are good. I especially like the one about Logan telling Emma that the killer has been abducted.  That makes a lot of sense!

I didn’t want Emma to make an escape.  I wanted it to play out as plain old brutality, with little hope of any escape.  I hear you here though.

I considered Maia taking off Logan’s nads, but thought it was a little bit cliché, as it was done this way in Hostel 2.  I went for something you don’t see very often and thought it was more effective and horrific.

Thanks again, Lew.  Hope to see you around these boards more often.  Take care!

Hey Balt, thanks for popping in and giving this a look.  Your feedback is always appreciated and respected.

Soul Shadows is basically an anthology, much like Tales from the Crypt.  Tannis is our Crypt Keeper, and she begins and ends each episode.  Bert writes all of the Tannis parts, based on the script that is submitted.


I hear ya about this genre not being your cup of tea…many feel the same way.  I, on the other hand, love Hostel and Hostel 2.  Most of the torture porn genre from there got very weak and were basically all plays on the same theme.  I tried to change that up here and give it a fresh face, and a few (hopefully) unexpected twists.

Thanks for the compliment on clear writing.  The “we see” and other such stuff is from Bert, and all his Tannis parts are written this way, going back to the inaugural episode of the first season.


Glad the dialogue and characters worked well for you.  I definitely tried to give everyone their own voice and quirks.  Many have not liked Maia at all, and I agree she’s a tough character to pull off.  I didn’t want to develop her anymore than I did, and my intent was to keep her rather ambiguous and mysterious.

You’re right about throwing out some 1 liners from Maia in the end.  I don’t know…maybe it goes all the way back to Freddy Krueger, who IMO, really started them up.  I thought they were effective, but many don’t seem to like them, so point well taken.

Funny, I really like the, “What’s a matter?  Cat got your tongue?” line, but it has been brought up before.  I like to use old clichéd idioms and the like, but I always try and use them in a fresh way…or disturbing way.  Can’t seem to help myself…

Cool, glad the descriptions and depictions worked.  Funny, your comment “…and the pain was felt” is something I was really going for.  I wanted this to be brutal, real, and intense, but I didn’t want to go over that fine line that most horror flicks go over…just too over the top and out of place.  The only real onscreen violence starts when Maia gets her hand skewered by Logan’s knife.  From there on out, I went for it all the way…no holding back at all.

Thanks again, Balt.  I’m glad this worked for you even though it’s not the type of script you usually appreciate.

Take care, man!

Hey Tommy P, thanks man, I appreciate the read and comments.  Sorry to be so late in getting back to you, but a lots going on, including a big move in less than 2 weeks from AZ to WA.  As always, I want to respond to your feedback, and give you my thoughts and let you in to what I was after here.

Glad you liked this.  I purposely took it as far as I possibly could in terms of brutality and the like. The gore is actually fairly minimal, and only comes into play in the last few pages.  I know it doesn’t seem that way, but it’s something I consciously strived for.  The entire purpose here is to take things to another level. I really wasn’t that interested in exploring Logan as a character, in terms of the why’s.

Many are in agreement with you about the near duplication of the “pickup scene”.  But again, I wanted to nail it down, that this is how he rolls, so to speak. There are some subtle differences, and they’re actually meant to give you a little heads up that this isn’t going to go down the way it has in the past.

Originally, Maia was going to be human, but I decided that I needed a supernatural element, and I also liked how this played out.

“In terms of getting this made”, I would only want it made for what it is, and that’s a brutal, horrific gore ride.  It always surprises me when people say certain things can’t be filmed in a hard R movie.  They can.  They push boundaries, and that’s what I’m always after.

Thanks, Tommy, as always, your opinion means a lot to me, and I’m glad you seemed to like this overall.

Hope all is well, my friend!  Late.

Jeff,

I liked a lot of this script.  The insidious traps the killer sets, the graphic death scenes, and ultimately, the payoff in the end.  It did come at the cost of predictability, however.  This script was sort of a trade off of chills for hardcore gore.

Very clever setting and perfect hunting ground for a serial killer.  A tailgate at a packers game.  Everyone's drinking, everyone's happy and Packer fans are generally regarded as the most harmless in the NFL.

I did spot a couple of passive sentences right from the get go:

Tailgate parties of all sizes are in full swing.
Traffic is at a standstill for miles around Lambeau Field.

I'm not sure if you needed three girls at the beginning.  Because they all looked and sounded(even dressed) alike.  I think two might have worked better there as you could have given more personality to the characters.

It's always risky to intro a main character so deep into a script.  Maia appears a full 16 pages in.  I was a little fuzzy on what she actually was.  When I read the line "She smiles, exposing sharp white, canine teeth",  I immediately thought, Holy sh*t she's a werewolf!  So, I'm still a little fuzzy on what she actually was.  She says she is a protector of girls, so is she superhuman?  Aside from the teeth, it was hard to tell.  You say she frees her hand from these shackles with a powerful thrust, so I'm guessing she must have incredible strength.  But if this is the case, you might want to make that more clear, like the metal shackles shatter from her sheer power, or something.

I did like how you got inventive with the bondage.  I don't recall ever seeing superglued hair and scalping put together like that.  That was something.  

The main problem with the script, IMO, is the lack of surprises.  Immediately, when we read that the character's name is Logan, and he introduces himself as Tyler, we know this dude is a killer.  So, the bonk on Emma's head just didn't have the same dramatic shock it would have if it came totally out of the blue.

You repeat the exact same paragraphs on page 12 and 21, only with a name substituted:

To her right, KAYLEE, 24, lies on the concrete floor, naked
and bloody.  Savage, blood clotted wounds are all that are
left of her breasts.  Her hair and scalp hang from the wall
above her....Dried blood streaks down to the floor.

I would have liked a little more distinction and description to Emma's death.

Overall, I did like this.  I think it could be improved if you disguised Logan's true identity better, and if you spent less time on Emma and more on Maia.  Maia is the truly interesting character here, and I wanted to know more about her and what exactly she is.

Good read.