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Thanks for the read, Dan. Many of your points I have addressed in the rewrite/revision. Now, as for the term "retrocausality", it is simply a situation where the effects appear before the cause.
Make sure you keep that title - it was the main reason I wanted to read the script - i.e., hmmm - interesting - what is retrocasuality?
Oh, you can bet I kept the title. I almost hurt my head coming up with a simple, yet descriptive title. Now as for what constitutes 'retrocausality', for those of you curious about the science behind it, here is an article that might help: http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/causation-backwards/
Excellent script, man. There is something about this script that was missing in your others -- the ones with the reporter and Bigfoot! Lol. But here, you weave a good story coupled with really good visuals. The prose in your action is kept at just the right levels to avoid being overdone. Nothing much more to add really except to say great job.
I agree with Dustin in that this might be expensive to film, but maybe you'll find the right producer who'd care to take something like this on because it would look pretty damn cool onscreen! Good luck and well done.
Thanks, Steve. I almost put Lorraine in there as the cause of the "accident," but there were a few reviewers that already were rolling their eyes at her earlier scripts. Still, it would have given her an opportunity at a serious role, but...
“Soft moonlight shines on mud-brick buildings nestled among narrow, dusty, and deserted streets. Scattered torches flicker as insects BUZZ over the WHISPER of a gentle wind. At tree-top level, there is a FLASH like the flick of an empty cigarette lighter. Suddenly a flat-black, rugby ball sized
PROBE hangs in the air, indistinct and nearly invisible. After a moment, it silently glides over a shimmering ribbon of water towards a dark mass of large buildings.”
- Funny, I'm reading a lot of Arthur C. Clarke at the moment and this scene of future technology coming into contact with an ancient culture could've come straight out of one of his books.
“The scientists part like schooled fish fleeing a shark.”
- Good visual.
GALANG No. It could affect our timeline if we lose the probe back then.
- But why couldn't they have gotten a color picture with the probe that just came back? Why does it have to be black and white.
GALANG Don't care. Look, gather around folks...
- Shouldn't he want to hear what McGill has to say whose suggesting they can go back in time and explore without the risk of effecting the future? Wouldn't that be very useful to know?
GALANG Argue about that later!
- Jeez, this guy is short tempered!
“The scientists relax slightly as Galang exits.”
- I would've liked to gotten more of an idea what was on the USB. Is it a map, thermal imaging or what? You could've imparted a lot more information with some visuals there? Why be so sparing on them? Aren't we going to see it on screen if this were ever filmed?
Also, my understanding is that they have spotted some energy source in Mongolia which may or not be a nuclear reaction or meltdown of some sort. First off, so what, nothing too surprising about that? Its presumably the Chinese up to their usual shenanigans Secondly, why do they have to go back in time to check it out, are they hoping to prevent it from happening? That a very un-American sentiment, to help out Mongolia which is so closely linked to China.
JACOBS (low) A hundred ten percent.
- Missing "and" between "hundred and "ten"
JACOBS This one's on our timeline. Whatever we do...
- Ok, so they're not going back in time at all, they're just using the probe to check out this anomaly in the present day, right now? What a waste of this technology! Typical short sighted government thinking.
GALANG A calculated risk. We need to see what caused the event just before it occurred. Since it happened in the daytime, that's when we go back.
- Oh, so they are actually going back in time...just a little bit. How will they be able to calculate when it happened though? They don't even know what it is yet.
“EXT. MONGOLIA - IKH KHORIG (1227) – DAY”
- Eh, why go back so far? Did the anomaly reading suggested it was caused a man made object, a modern invention? Given the date and location I'm expecting Genghis Khan to make an appearance any second now
MAGILL Remarkable. We are watching what happened eight hundred... Jacobs! The doorway is at ground-level. Stuff can get through.
- Cue Genghis!
JACOBS These are the coordinates they gave me. Besides, as if birds couldn't get through before.
- Again, I don't understand why they selected this particular time? Plus, in relation to McGill's previous "This is our timeline" line, how could it be? It’s nearly 800 years ago! Also, on that note, how are “parallel” or “our” timelines/dimensions determined?
GALANG Enough! Jacobs, pan around and let's see where we are.
- As I’ve mentioned, I'm baffled by Galang's complete disregard for the mechanics and implications of what they're doing. I know he's portrayed as corporate all the way, dutifully following orders, etc but shouldn't he be questioning why they have a live video feed and the very real repercussions if people were to pass through.
GALANG Recall it... now!
- Oh now he gave a sh?t. Too late methinks.
“The scientists look at each other in disbelief, then brace themselves and plunge into the distortion.”
- Ha, that made me laugh. Their dedication to the cause, or more accurately their fear of Galang, knows no bounds.
GALANG What the hell are you talking about
- Man, this guy is totally oblivious to clear and present danger, isn't he?
MAGILL That was... is Ghengis Khan's funeral procession. They killed all witnesses to hide the location of his tomb.
- As my notes suggested I knew he was going to get a mention in somewhere and although this is true and the location of his tomb has long been a source of mystery, I think it’s fair to assume the Mongols would try to kill the scientists regardless of it being Genghis's funeral or not. They were, how shall I say, an "act first ask questions later" bunch!
“working the reactor controls and pierces the control panel up to the feathers.”
- I know it’s a bit silly to question realism here but would an arrow be able to do that?
MAGILL Too late. It's going to detonate any second... We were the cause. [Gasp] The doorway will spew gamma rays into the past and we'll be stuck in a never-ending time loop of retrocausality...
- Wow, that's a lot of assumptions to make. I don't fully grasp the scientific consequences behind time travel so I can only take your word for it here, or should I say, Magill's.
I know my notes asked a lot of questions and I did have issues with the logistics or it (all within the context of time travel of course) as well as some of the decision making by the characters. Still, I can also appreciate that time travel is a minefield for paradoxes and plot inconsistencies, especially the suggestion that the anomaly they were checking out was in fact their own reactor. I mean, how could it continually explode in the past because then it could never be built in the future in order to explode in the past...and so on and so forth. That event would’ve inexorably altered the course of these scientist's lives and a lot else besides... but let’s not get into that or, to quote “Looper” “we’ll be here all day making diagrams with straws
Anyway, all that aside, I actually did enjoy this overall. It’s a fun concept to play around with it and I’d be lying if I said the image of an army of Mongols spilling into a tech facility full of fleeing white coats didn’t bring a smile to my face.
Where to begin? Well, first, thank you for taking time to provide such detailed feedback. It appreciated. I hate to say it, but just last night I uploaded revision #3. It should post soon. In it, I have addressed some of your concerns. However, you do pose some new ones.
Babylon... well, I chose that place partially because I was actually there in 2003. It was an incredible experience in retrospect. At the time, however, I was not as appreciative since I was there under less than ideal circumstances and competing priorities. I have read Clarke, but I was more a Niven, Simak, and Chalker kind of reader. Simak was actually a part of the inspiration (see Mastadonia).
The whole parting like a school of fish... well, that's part of what I am going for in all of my writing. I am really diving into the visual portion using as little description as possible. Instead, I am using analogy and examples to illustrate what I seek to portray. The problem with that is some of my descriptions may not cross cultural boundaries, even in English speaking countries. I am striving to use analogies that are as universal as possible. Example, "The probe bounces into the facility like a bad football punt." (pg. 7) In the rest of the world, football involves the use of a round ball. In the U.S., a football is shaped like a rugby ball and involves a bunch of guys beating the hell out of each other. Actually fun to watch, but I digress...
Color vs. B&W... that's simply because the laser lights used by the probe were like radar in that they scanned the surface of the gate and were not photographing it. Even so, at night, true color is not obtainable. It was more of a side-scan sonar image without color, but in exacting detail.
Galang dismissal of Mcgill's protests were just his singular focus on new orders. He wasn't concerned with temporal archaeology (Did I just coin a new term? If so, you heard here first folks!), but executing his new mission.
Yep, Galang is short tempered and driven, which is part of the reason he is feared.
Visuals of the USB files - Yep. I shortchanged you all on that one. Note for revision #4.
As for the radiological source in Mongolia, it a sparsely populated country with a harsh climate. I have an idea that may better explain the event in a certain context that makes sense within this storyline. Yep, revision #4. Note: Mongolia is not so closely aligned with China as many people think due to their history.
"A hundred ten percent"... vernacular. Some Yanks, even educated ones, speak in this manner. Just capturing some of the speech.
Timeline question. Yes, it is on our timeline... in the past. The previous mission to Babylon was on a parallel dimensions timeline. The problem I have is describing BOTH time travel and travel between dimensions. So, in the first mission, they cross dimensions and go back in time. What they saw was not exactly from our past, but close.
Regarding how they figured out when the event occurred, I need to flesh that out... in revision #4. You're making me really work here, which is good. The story will be that much stronger and credible. For example, radioactive materials decay at a very specific, known rate. So, radioactive markers can be used to fairly accurately date things. Now, the fiction in SciFi is having a viewer or something that allows you to pinpoint something in time. I need to work on that particular plot hole... eh, crater.
Live video feed... yep, as written he takes it for granted. Should be something to tie it in... and his sudden concern to recall the probe. His lack of understanding about the Mongols is simply igorance about how they were.
You are correct about the medieval Mongols and their rapacity, however, I felt the need to have some powerful inciting event or cause for them to really ramp up their ferocity. Protecting the location of their mythical leader's burial site was simply the vehicle.
And to address the arrow in the control panel gag... that was simply an attempt to show how big events can happen through unlikely and seemingly trivial causes. Think of a newly crowned, highly capable leader of a nation who had the potential to do great things only to die of bloodpoisoning from an infected cut from shaving. Apparently, I am exceeding the bounds of incredulity even in a SciFi short. Something else I need to think about.
And finally, the consequences and logistics of time travel... yep, you nailed that point. Even to the greatest minds of our day (Hawking, Higgs, Kaku, Dyson, etc.), this is fraught with inconsistencies and ambiguity. I am but a rank amateur that struggles to understand the complexities while simplifying them to the point they can be framed in a short story/script. That is my dilemma.
Anyway, I wax quasi-poetic and a little existentialist. Hopefully, that did not include some rambling as well. I may be a closet nerd fighting to get out. In which case I embrace my nerdom.
Thanks again for the read, Col. You have reinterated some points a few other reviewers brought up and raised some very good new ones as well. Well, onto the next revision. This is one of the those I feel compelled to see through to the end. The irony is, as Dustin pointed out, this is one that would be expensive and difficult to shoot.
Hey Ian, I opened up your latest draft, and want to try and give some advice. Take it as you will, but I mean to help.
Immediately, I see huge overwriiting going on. Now...don't take that as an overly negative comment, cuz, it reads well, but it's just too much...too much for a spec screenplay., whether or not it's a short, but when you get to a feature, this kind of overwriting is a killer...an instant killer, cuz it will suck the pages right out of you.
You tell us in your Slug that we're in 2250 BC, but understand that your viewers won't have a clue of that. If it's important, you need a SUPER, and there's just no way around that.
Your 2nd passage is 5 lines long...that's too long, and there's an obvious break here - the last sentence which states there's a break in time. You have to break this up with a new passage.
When you decide to use a POV. you obviously have to also RETURN TO SCENE, but also understand, only use this when it's extremley important, and never start it with an eleplsis. "RESUME SCENE" is not the way to do this, and when you choose to CAP and BOLD this stuff, understand it doesn't work this way.
Then you give us a "PRESENT" in the Slug again, but your viewers are clueless of this - if it's imperative and necessary, you need a SUPER.
Whenever you intro brand new characters, you must use all CAPS, whether or not you actually give their names.
Watch out for goofy asides/analogies...they usually come off poorly.
When you use an elipses to end a line, you better use one to come into your new line too.
Remember to break your passages based on new thoughts/shots/ideas. Don't continue passages on new "things".
No worries about taking advice or recommendations personally or in a negative way. It is appreciated and that is the whole purpose of posting for others to read, i.e., to get feedback.
Now, spot on re the supers. I am loathe to use them, but in this instance, I see that it is unavoidable.
As for the five line passage, hmm, missed that one. Four max, three preferable.
RESUME SCENE - My intent was to show the probe POV for a variety of reasons, but I will rework the transition.
New characters - yep, missed that one.
Goofy asides - have to look for that one. My wife would agree with you.
Elipses noted.
Continuity of ideas? Hmm. I'll check on that one too.
It does help. We all need those outside viewpoints or we miss the obvious. It is appreciated.
Babylon... well, I chose that place partially because I was actually there in 2003. It was an incredible experience in retrospect. At the time, however, I was not as appreciative since I was there under less than ideal circumstances and competing priorities. I have read Clarke, but I was more a Niven, Simak, and Chalker kind of reader. Simak was actually a part of the inspiration (see Mastadonia).
- Ya, I got why you would go back there as its one of human’s earliest civilizations. Must’ve been a fascinating place to visit too. Ya, Clarke deals with time travel a lot of in his stories, at least from the ones I’ve read.
The problem with that is some of my descriptions may not cross cultural boundaries, even in English speaking countries. I am striving to use analogies that are as universal as possible. Example, "The probe bounces into the facility like a bad football punt." (pg. 7) In the rest of the world, football involves the use of a round ball. In the U.S., a football is shaped like a rugby ball and involves a bunch of guys beating the hell out of each other. Actually fun to watch, but I digress...
- I have that problem too. I’m Irish where our frames of reference rarely leave our shores, except the fact that we like to indulge in an alcoholic beverage or two. At least being American you have more cultural exposure than practically any other country on the planet. I get what you’re saying about the football confusion though and was pleasantly surprised to see you namedrop rugby. It’s a very popular sport in Ireland.
Color vs. B&W... that's simply because the laser lights used by the probe were like radar in that they scanned the surface of the gate and were not photographing it. Even so, at night, true color is not obtainable. It was more of a side-scan sonar image without color, but in exacting detail.
- My issue was more to do with how Galang responded. In that he indicated that color imaging was possible but that we wasn’t going to risk putting the probe back through the portal again. So my thinking was why didn’t they just try to obtain colour footage in the first place? They surely have the technology for it. Anyway, it’s a minor detail and I understand you’re technical reasoning behind it. I was just a little at a loss when reading it.
Galang dismissal of Mcgill's protests were just his singular focus on new orders. He wasn't concerned with temporal archaeology (Did I just coin a new term? If so, you heard here first folks!), but executing his new mission.
- Ha, patent that term now! It will be a legitimate job title at some point in the future. Yeah, like I said, I get that Glanag was a company man but his ignorance was a infuriating at times and stretched plausibility. I questioned how could a guy so wrong headed and belligerent be given such an important job? Then again, it is the government after all...
Mongolia is not so closely aligned with China as many people think due to their history.
- True but their history is inextricably connected with the Chinese. Plus, they were under Soviet rule for a time which were close allies with China. Basically, even the ever intrusive American military industrial complex would have trouble justifying getting involved with a Mongolian radiological situation. Still, I can dig that you wanted do get Genghis in there. Who doesn’t!
Timeline question. Yes, it is on our timeline... in the past. The previous mission to Babylon was on a parallel dimensions timeline. The problem I have is describing BOTH time travel and travel between dimensions. So, in the first mission, they cross dimensions and go back in time. What they saw was not exactly from our past, but close.
- Yeah, that plot point is all a bit hazy and convenient for me. It’s purely speculative science fiction or theoretical physics if you want to make it sound more respectable
Regarding how they figured out when the event occurred, I need to flesh that out... in revision #4. You're making me really work here, which is good. The story will be that much stronger and credible. For example, radioactive materials decay at a very specific, known rate. So, radioactive markers can be used to fairly accurately date things. Now, the fiction in SciFi is having a viewer or something that allows you to pinpoint something in time. I need to work on that particular plot hole... eh, crater. .
- Yeah, I’d imagine that will be the first question on most reader’s mind. How would they know to go back to that date. As you say, it can be done with radioactive dating but we get no hint of that during the script. I know you don’t want to hit us over the head with exposition but these kind of technical details aren’t exactly common knowledge.
I think this is a knock-on effect from the vagueness of the USB files. First we get very little on the actual occurrence they are checking out...and now we’re getting virtually nothing in regards how they know which year to travel to in order to do said checking out.
Live video feed... yep, as written he takes it for granted. Should be something to tie it in... and his sudden concern to recall the probe. His lack of understanding about the Mongols is simply igorance about how they were.
- Yup, that Galang is just an all around clueless basta?d
You are correct about the medieval Mongols and their rapacity, however, I felt the need to have some powerful inciting event or cause for them to really ramp up their ferocity. Protecting the location of their mythical leader's burial site was simply the vehicle.
- I enjoyed that historical tie in. It was a great touch. I should’ve made that more clear in my note. I was only making the point that the Mongols would be a formidable lot to contend with any day of the week.
And to address the arrow in the control panel gag... that was simply an attempt to show how big events can happen through unlikely and seemingly trivial causes. Think of a newly crowned, highly capable leader of a nation who had the potential to do great things only to die of bloodpoisoning from an infected cut from shaving. Apparently, I am exceeding the bounds of incredulity even in a SciFi short. Something else I need to think about.
- It’s only a small thing, no big deal. There many other ways you can get that control panel destroyed in order to serve your story. If you are going for something more inadvertent and random there is a lot you can play around in that respect too.
And finally, the consequences and logistics of time travel... yep, you nailed that point. Even to the greatest minds of our day (Hawking, Higgs, Kaku, Dyson, etc.), this is fraught with inconsistencies and ambiguity. I am but a rank amateur that struggles to understand the complexities while simplifying them to the point they can be framed in a short story/script. That is my dilemma. Anyway, I wax quasi-poetic and a little existentialist. Hopefully, that did not include some rambling as well. I may be a closet nerd fighting to get out. In which case I embrace my nerdom.
This is one of the those I feel compelled to see through to the end. The irony is, as Dustin pointed out, this is one that would be expensive and difficult to shoot.
- Yeah, as I said, it’s a fun concept for sure. It might be more suitable for animation, if that were more feasible. I’m not up on the going rate for animators
When you upload the new version, let me know and I'd love to read it again and give my feedback. You can PM me or send me an email at dancam1@yahoo.com.
It was really good, so, I'm excited about where you take the rewrite.
I'm interested in reading animation, horror, sci fy, suspense, fantasy, and anything that is good. I enjoy writing the same. Looking to team with anyone!
You know... only another writer would recognize the pitfall and challenges of creating worlds and events from our imagination. Every story we write is a part of us in some way. This one was something that popped into my mind in a moment of inspiration and onto the page in a burst of energy. I had thought I would simply set this one aside and continue with the feature-length script I have in the hopper. Instead, something keeps calling me back to see it through. Thanks for the feedback and I am working on the revision as soon as I set log off SS.
Dan,
Yep, not a problem. I have learned a great deal from other writers as they revise their scripts and repost them. I highly recommend this approach.
Wow! awesome script. You sure have some really creative ideas! This would make a great film despite the hight budget lol. Cool visuals! I love the ending even if its a slight paradox, but its' time travel and science fiction, so it works really well. ! Awesome work!
Hey Ian, I just noticed that you have posted a new version of this and Blank Canvas. I plan to read both.
Good luck bud. Here goes:
1. I think you overdo it at the very beginning. Just a bit much. I found it to be really wordy and it didn't flow for me. However, if no one else says that, ignore it b/c it might be the meds talking...
2. I already noticed a few changes. The version I read had them in an alternate universe at first. You took that out. I think it was a good call. I like them being able to just see into their past.
3. You also introduce that others are working on the time displacement ideas b/c you say the Chinese have a facility too. Again, good move.
4. I'm on page 5. I know what's gonna happen. I don't remember you kinda giving that plot point away so early in the story. I almost think that's not good. Let the reader think they will be okay.
5. Also on page 5, shouldn't you give us an exact day and time? After all, you said the info was good, give or take one hour. So, wouldn't we know the exact day and time when the attempt is?
6. Pretty sure this isn't a complete sentence: Rolling grasslands under a cloud spotted August sky. I think you forgot to add something there like a verb or something.
7. Another change. You don't mention why the Mongols are there. I actually don't like that change. I liked that it was for Khan's funeral.
8. Okay, now you state that. How would Mabry know that and the others didn't? I think we need some sort of clue as to how he discovers that info. Also how he knows they killed all witnesses to hide the location of the tomb. You have them still carrying Khan by oxen at this point, so, he isn't buried yet.
9. On page 9 now. I still wonder why a bunch of soldiers from 800 years ago wouldn't freak out upon crossing into our time. I also wish you had a reason to get them really upset. Like the probe shot one of them, or crashed into one of them, something. It's one thing to get a bee angry, it's another to crash into the hive. I think in order for me to believe that the mongols are so angry that their flight mechanism stays squarely on fight that they need to be enraged before they step through.
Imagine if this was you. You are running through a portal and end up on a ship. Your first instinct would be to stop and turn around. So, you need to get a mob mentality within them first. At least that's my opinion.
10. Since Galang is a soldier, wouldn't he have sent for help before it got to this point? I mean, even in Stargate, they had soldiers on deck at all times. They are playing with time travel. It'd be easy to kill them off, I just think it'd be more realistic. Soldiers of today would crumble at the ferocity of the mongols of yesterday.
11. Also on page 9, you say bowmen looses several arrows. Is that the best verb for this? I'd rather see hurls, launches, barrages, bombards (as a few examples)
12. Nice tie in at the end.
It's better, I'd just like to see it be a bit tighter. That's just my opinion Ian. I love this story and think it's a really cool idea.
I'm interested in reading animation, horror, sci fy, suspense, fantasy, and anything that is good. I enjoy writing the same. Looking to team with anyone!
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Secondly, why do they have to go back in time to check it out, are they hoping to prevent it from happening? That a very un-American sentiment, to help out Mongolia which is so closely linked to China.
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