Good Things Come… by James McClung - Short - High times on the lake hit a low point when two stoners learn a lesson about instant gratification. 10 pages - pdf format

Writer interested in feedback on this work

Hmm, I wanna be nice.  But --(SPOILERS) the whole unseen creature thing has always annoyed me.   I suppose that's no fault of your own.   Definitely a way to keep the budget down though.

My major gripe with this script is too much dialogue and a bit overwritten in parts.   Other than that, formatting is pretty spot on.

I liked how the creature is fishing.  Seems you might wanna make it a twenty instead of a one.

For some reason I was expecting a large "Merman" (Cabin in the Woods monster) to appear.

Hey James, was this a submission for Root of All Evil?  That dollar bill is pretty prominent throughout this short and it's the first thing I thought of.

That, and the force/presence reminded me of Evil Dead.

Not much else to say.  Silverback mentioned a few things I agree with -- too much dialogue, the creature "fishing."

I like that ending... sort of like that draft of Silver Bullet that Stephen King wrote... where the werewolf cracks open a beer and guzzles it down after killing the dude.

Otherwise, I wasn't really big on this one.

Thanks for reading, guys.

Indeed, this was a submission for The Root of All Evil. Big thanks to Michael for the incentive to write this and also thanks to Johnny (oJOHNNYoNUTSo) and Will (albinopenguin) for their help with the script/logline.

I knew the dialogue was going to be a point of contention. Initially, I wanted to keep the story at the lake but sort of went off in a different direction once I started thinking about the characters. I was really concerned that the amount of dialogue would take away from what's going on in the woods (and perhaps that's what's happening now) but the initial comments I received were more about the actual content of the dialogue and less about how much of it there was. Still, I tried to keep it to the point and I think there's a lot going on between the characters as far as arcs and the like are concerned so it's not completely frivolous.

I think the two scenes at Gideon's apartment could possibly be collapsed into one but other than that, I figured I'd just post the script and see what can be cut. I'm still at a point where I do most of my cutting and simplifying in rewrites as opposed to getting it right the first time.

Everything else I think chalks up to taste. I like the "unseen creature," cliche as it is. It's always worked for me, at least in the classics. I also opted not to show them for budgetary reasons. Anything more than the "finger" I expect would be cost prohibitive.

A merman would've been cool. I always liked it in Cabin in the Woods (the script and the movie). But that's for another script.

Hi James,

You've been a tremendous help to me in the past, so I hope I can pay some of that back in this post.

Like you, I am a fan of the "unseen horror" feature. I studied psych horrors at school last year and through that I developed an intense admiration for film makers who have nailed it in the past. Perhaps it seems cliche now, because it is so incredibly difficult to get right, but to me, when handled well it does the trick. Australian horror film "The Tunnel" is a fantastic display of the ambiguity that you use in this one.

I liked this. You've created some decent horrific images which would work in a film. You, in my opinion have handled the "unseen creature" quite well. You give us just enough detail to see our own monster, but not enough to ruin it. I'll admit, the "big yellow eyes" seemed a little childish. Maybe add another adjective to properly describe the terror that should be inflicted through that description. At the moment, I'm imagining a pissed off kitten... Not that scary. Other than that, the horror images created are effective and, in some places, creepy.

Where I think this short lacks is with motive and lack of detail with this unseen creature. At this point I would leave your descriptions as is, but give the creature a motive. To me, it's not clear why this creature attacks. Why it uses this specific hunting method? Clues that could give insight into these sort of details could help flesh out the screenplay, if that is what you are wanting to do. Random killing is fine and looks great on film. However, to me, it misses the mark. I usually find that when the creature has a motive it adds to the terror of the film. Maybe the creature you have described here is just territorial and doesn't want other people in it's territory? If that is the case, a reference to that would give this script a purpose, a theme and a motive for this creature killing. That's how I see it, at least. You're free to disagree.

In regards to all that conversation at the start, I'm not against it, but I do believe that it needs something else to it. The way the dialogue is written, in itself, is great. I think that the start is where you can make the most out of  potentially boring situation. If you agree with my motive suggestion, this could be where you drop the hints. That way you wouldn't drop the tension build-up in the second half of the script and you would give the audience something to think about. At the moment, I think the dialogue at the start doesn't really add much to the script at all. I wouldn't get rid of it, but I would try and drop subtle hints as far as motivation for the creature go. You would also have to somehow tie that in with the jogger at the start. Perhaps a news broadcast of her disappearance that gives quick information on her background?

This is only my opinion. If it were my scripts, I would be applying the suggestions I have given above to the rewrite. However, it's not my script, so do with it as you wish.

See you around. Good job.

Dan

Hey, James. Thought I'd check this one out.

Writing in the first page is a little start and stop if you catch my drift but it's certainly not bad. She does this, she does that, gets a little repetitive but nothing major.

"personal effects" Effects?

Not a fan of monster scripts, even though I'm co-writing one right now! But I can't say this was bad, not painfully average like most shorts in this genre and I did like the characters but the ending kind of left a bad taste in my mouth. The monster seems cool but it's just that if they're going to die in the end in classic horror fashion, the script shouldn't be so long.

There's 12 pages here, mostly of two guys rambling about this and that and I think if you really wanted to, you could cut 5 and still make the story work. The scenes with the baking and then around three scenes explaining Felix' situation when only one could suffice. It just drags on a little and when the ending doesn't correlate with the character's problem, it feels left sided. I get the money part but money doesn't seem to be Felix's problem, at least that's how it came across to me. It's more of a respect thing so when he does indeed get massacred, it just doesn't feel right.

I thought the dialogue here was good though, nicely balanced with the exposition/casualness ratio if that makes sense.

Good luck!

Hey, James,

I try not to read too much into shorts, because they are what they are... just that.  

I like scare tactics...because if they are done right, will really scare the mess out of you.  But I prefer the psychological aspect, the stuff you can't see.   I mean, and in the end, why this worked for me..."the unknown" as soon as you can see what's stalking you, you can put a name to it, and it's no longer anywhere near as frightening.  JMHO.

The dialogue, to be honest, I didn't have a problem with it.  The only thing I might have done was get Gideon and Felix to the lake quicker.  But regardless, I would have trimmed about two pages off this, but... that's just me.

Good stuff,

Ghostie

"Contrary to popular belief, I think the line between being direct and being rude is not thin, and most people are fully aware of when they have crossed it."

There's a lot of "She does this. She does that. He does this. He does that." kinda stuff going on in the description. It gets a bit repetitive, but as this is only a short, it didn't affect the read too much. But here's an example.

Quoted Text A FEMALE JOGGER (20s) makes her way down the trail. She catches a glimpse of the bill. She stops and stuffs it in her pocket.

Quoted Text She sits up and moans. She reaches down and touches her leg. She brings back blood on her fingers.

Quoted Text INT. GIDEON’S APARTMENT, LIVING ROOM - NIGHT Felix lies underneath a blanket on a couch. Several boxes of personal effects sit on the floor around him. He hits a bowl of weed and sets it on a coffee table littered with empty Red Bull cans. He returns his attention to the laptop on top of his chest and types away. Gideon, very high, leans against a nearby doorframe in boxers and a t-shirt. He eats Chef Boyardee out of the can. Southern gangsta rap thumps in the background.

This is all fine, but if Southern gangsta rap is thumping in the background, we would probably hear this at the start of the scene.

I thought the dialogue was fine between Gideon and Felix from page 2-5. It sounded natural, but all that stood out there for me was the fortune cookie bit with Gideon swallowing his fortune. They talked about the same thing pretty much (Gideon thinks Felix is a good roommate, Felix is trying to get a chef job, thinks he's being a deadbeat roommate, etc), up until they mention the lake. You can probably fit that lake bit in much sooner, cut off a page or two and get to the story quicker (w/out compromising character establishment/establishing their friendship).

Quoted Text EXT. FOREST TRAIL - DAY A missing person’s poster of the female jogger hangs from a tree trunk. A twig slips underneath it and tears it O.S.

I get what you mean, but the way it's worded, it sounds like the twig actually tearing the poster is happening O.S. Probably better off just saying "A wind gust blows the poster off the tree, out of frame" or something like that. Difficult visual to visualize (twig slipping underneath the poster and somehow tearing it... when I read twig, I picture an itty bitty piece of wood from the tree).

Some nice visuals with the dollar bill and the severed foot... digging that.

Saw some slight overwriting at parts, but nothing that hindered the read:

Quoted Text EXT. LAKE - DAY Felix and Gideon sit with their hooks in the water and pass a blunt back and forth. Felix finishes off a beer and deposits the bottle in a garbage bag beside the box. He glances inside an adjacent plastic cooler. Two plump catfish sit on ice inside.

Just some unnecessary details, everything is very exact. But if you left out some things, we'd probably get a very similar visual anyway, but quicker.

"Felix and Gideon pass a blunt back and forth, their fish hooks in the water. Felix kills a beer and tosses the bottle into a garbage bag. In a nearby cooler, two plump catfish sit on ice." They're in a boat passing a blunt, it's safe to assume they're sitting, so no need to mention that, etc. I'd probably include BOAT in the slug, too.

The dialogue between Felix and Gideon is good, but can probably be cut down as you're merely touching on the Felix being the expert cook thing (with the mac and cheese)... however, if you cut down the earlier dialogue in the apartment between them, the boat dialogue works much better.

I did like the exchange about Gideon being a lucky guy... sensing this luck comes in handy later in the story?

Quoted Text Gideon extends the lure box toward Felix. Felix takes it. Out of nowhere, he yelps and drops it into the boat. Felix stares with stoned eyes at a spot of trees beyond the shore. Gideon follows his friend’s gaze.

The jump scare would work better if:

"Gideon hands Felix the lure box. Felix catches a brief glance of something moving in the trees beyond shore -- he gasps and drops the box to the floor."

Or something like that.

Nice... dig that you didn't use that "luck" thing with Gideon... cool kill scene with the fish hook. And I thought back to the "Shit happens" fortune cookie. Good stuff.

Dig the irony, how this creature studies these guys and then mimics (as later with the beer guzzling at the end). And I LOVED how you used the dollar. A lot of the tales I've received merely have a dollar appear for a split second. But you make it relevant to the story -- not only how this creature lures these kids in, but money is an issue with Felix (through dialogue)... so it fits well.

Would have liked one of them to live though. And, I dig never showing the creature completely, though, for the end, I'd have maybe his clawed foot visible as he sits against a tree (all we see is the tree though), legs out in front of him... maybe see him extend for a nearby beer and guzzle, burp, etc.

Nevertheless, this is one of my favorite submissions for the anthology I've read so far. Right now, I'm actively pursuing more submissions -- cutting them down to 13 tales by mid February, so I'll let you know. But excellent job, man. Enjoyed this one.

-- Michael

As I go...

Although "one-dollar bill" may be technically corect, it doesn't rad well or sound good as worded.  I'd relook at it, just because it's the very opening image and you don't want to turn your readers off out of the gate.

I think by naming your female jogger, you'd do away with a number of issues in the sentences that follow.  Without a name, you're stuck with "her", "she", etc, and it reads very repetively, especially with the sentence structure you chose to use.

Although the opening is a bit unclear or lacking visual detail, I actually like it and can see it, but I have to really try and imagine exactly how this plays out.

2nd scene - a bit repetitive with box(es) being used back to back as well as the SLug xontaining kitchen and then using kitchen table right after it.

No description for Gideon?

The opening dialogue exchange doesn't work for me at all, sorry to say...reads false, a bit on the nose, and just unnecessary...or amybe uninterreting.

The new scene on page 3 just doesn't sem to be worded, or presented correctly.  You say Felix lies underneath a blanket on the couch, then we find out there's a laptop on his chest he's typing on.  Gideon's very detailed description doesn't seem to have any place in this throwaway scene.  And then, we find out that "Southern gangsta rap" plays, which is something we'd be aware of immediately - WTF is SOuthern Gangsta Rap, anyway?  

Dialogue excahnge that follows again doesn't flow naturally for me at all.  Either some of the words are out of place or I'd say it needs to be rethought completely.

Also, IMO, the dialogue excahnges so far are overblown, overly long, and not at all interesting, and I can't quite put my finger on why that is, but that's how I feel.

Page 4 - new scene - as said earlier, I really think you need to name the missing jogger as it will help here too.  Also, I don't quite understand about the twig slipping underneath it and ripping it OS - if it's OS, how do we know what's happening?

"jeep" - "Jeep"

Page 5 - I like the severed foot visuals - nicely done!  Impending doom working well.

"A dollar bill..." - much better this way.  I'd rewrite the opening to read this way.

Page 6 - James, for some reason, the dialogue exahnges aren't working for me at all.  Just really dull conversation about stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything and also doesn't give either Protag any real life.  They both seem very...uh...dull, I guess is the best word I can come up with.

Page 7 - Don't like the "PRESENCE P.O.V." - reads very awkwardly and just doesn't seem to stay in line with how this tale is being told.

Page 8 - typo - "...right a catch one..." - a should be I, I assume.

I think you cold work a much more effective scare with the yellow eyes thing and the dialogue that follows.  As written, not effective at all, IMO.

Page 10 - typo - "...lets a rip" - ????

"Said eyes..." - very, VERY awkwardly phrased - rewrite!

I was really hoping this wouldn't be another cliche creature fishing idea, but it appears to be.  I don't know about you, but I've read this story and seen this short film many times over the years.  The fact that you chose an actual hook and line is a little odd, IMO, as I just don't see that working.

His "septum ring"?  As in nose ring?  Did we know he wore one?  I don't think so, and obviously, it's a very important detail that was neglected early on.

Last line on Page 10 is also awkwardly written - almost as if his knees disappear.

Not a fan of the finale eitehr, sorry to say.

I love the premise, but I've seen this way too many times and the filler here isn't engaging, nor are the characters.  It also sems like maybe you wrote this quickly, as much of the sentence structure is very basic and dull.

I wish I cuold be more positive but maybe I just expect more out of you, James, as I know you're a great writer and storyteller.  This one's not for me, sorry to say.

Take care, bro.

I don't like this. I found myself bored reading it. The story lacks flow, which is unusual for you James. The characters chatting goes on for too long, the dollar bill is never fully explained as far as I can tell.

I know there was a comp' somewhere where a dollar bill had to be in the story and I'm guessing that this was hastily written for that. Not your best work, mate.

For me the problem was a lack of ups and downs in the character arc. I did like the steady crumbling of Felix's resolve, and I think it was well handled, but it was that, steady, rather than having any dynamism to it. For so small of a character arc to carry this page count is not inherently a problem to me, but it becomes a problem if the stakes don't really change that much. Once they were out, I guess, I would have liked to see something stronger pushing Felix back towards being responsible, and similarly, to see Gideon having a less stable relationship to that change. I guess what I'm saying is that I think there is more room to push the conflicts already in here, without losing the pleasant quietness of the short as a whole.

As well you are correct that the two scenes in Gideon's apartment should be one.

Overall I would enjoy watching this, but I wouldn't revisit unless there were a bit more to be gotten out of Felix's story.

One more thing to throw out, James...

For me, everything played out exactly as one would expect it to, with no survivors and no real reason for al the cooking and other friends banter, that we never saw.

It's just too linear, with no surprises, and no conflict, so to say.  Our 2 Protags, chat about one's recent loss of job, and getting out to enjoy teh nice weather.  then, they go fishing to a place that we know someone recently got killed, spend the day fishing and talking abotu making dinner for friends with their "catch", get back to land, and both get killed, rather quickly.  And that's basiclly it.

If nothing else, IMO, 1 of these 2 dudes needs to eitehr live or at least put up a fight, so we're unsure how it's going to end.

So as not to leave anyone hanging...

A lot of feedback here. Sorry not to have gotten back to everyone sooner. I've been working on this, the OWC, and preparing for a trip tomorrow among other things. I'd like to get back to everyone individually at some point but for now, I'll leave you with something more general.

The general consensus seems to be that the script is too long for what it is and that there's too much dialogue. I totally agree.

So... I'll be posting a rewrite soon. I've already knocked the script down two whole pages since I received the first few comments here. The majority of the cuts were dialogue, mainly from the first three scenes, which have since been condensed to two (I kept the kitchen scene for the fortune cookie bit alone; all the exposition comes in the living room). I've also made some cuts to the descriptions and fixed some of the minor nitpicks that've been brought up here (e.g. "A twig... tears it O.S."). There were a couple lines I cut that didn't affect the page count in anyway but will hopefully still quicken the pacing a little bit.

There've been no major changes to the story or characters as of yet, such as a motive for the creature or making Felix's situation more relevant to what happens in the end. I still need to mull these over some. I may post the new draft as a strictly condensed version of what's already here while I try to figure all that out. I use Dropbox now. I figure one of the benefits of that is you can post the quick tweaks right away while you work on the bigger things.

Also, I can see why this would seem like there's not much to it. My approach was less story-oriented and more of the classic setup/payoff that's used in a lot of shorts. I guess with both guys getting killed off at the end, the setup seems kind of irrelevant.

The idea was that basically the whole time, these guys are trying to do everything without having to work for it. Felix wants to wait until he's got a stable situation to go have fun and also uses a worm to fish instead of one of Felix's lures. Gideon's only interested in instant gratification and through the course of the story, he totally corrupts his friend.

In the end, they both get killed. The idea was they're being punished for their cutting corners. My favorite bit of irony here is that the tree creatures are basically waiting patiently on shore until these guys come back and inevitably take the bait laid out for them. The idea was to use a sort of Aesop's Fable/parable structure for the story. Perhaps there's a better way to end it all though.

Unfortunately, it probably wasn't the best idea to use waiting, an inherently un-cinematic concept, as a theme for the story here. Admittedly, I think most Aesop's Fables have a lot more going on than this one. I don't know.

Will get back to you guys in more detail when I can. In the mean time, I'm hoping a tighter script will make this go down at least a little better.

So obviously I read an earlier draft of this screenplay. Therefore, I mainly concentrated on the dialogue. It's much better this draft. However, there's a few bits here and there that could be tweaked. This time around, I realized that the first scene between Gideon and Felix is pretty much unnecessary (except for the chinese food). I think I liked the set up in the first draft better. Furthermore, I would change Felix's reaction to Gideon being a good luck charm. Instead of flat out calling him a good luck charm, why not have him show a tinge of resentment for being so lucky? I don't know, I might even changed the dynamics on the boat. Felix wants to leave the entire time because he needs to get back to the job hunt. Just think a bit more conflict might do you well (plus say something more at the end).

Regardless, I still dig the concept and like the ending. I don't want to get too in depth since you're writing another draft. Let me know once you post it.

Hey James;

Not a big gore fan... but I gave this a go based on the logline.

I read some of the other posts as well, including yours... going into depth about all the various elements of the story that do, and do not work, so I'm not going to inject any more complication, until you plow through all the other feedback.

I will say, however, you nearly lost me in the middle somewhere... but I kept going... heads up, the ending made me want to puke <-- read that as awesome.

You have a very graphic, clever use of adjectives that makes 'dying' at the hands of these... whatever they are, somewhere between cool, and disgusting... if that makes any sense what so ever.

Regardless, whatever you do to this script... keep the maul scenes intact... they're freakishly disturbing.

Take care...