The Secret War by Stewart Wadwell (macduff) - Drama, Historical, Fantasy, War - British and German forces search for a girl who possesses supernatural abilities that could help turn the tide of World War 2. 112 pages - pdf, format

This was one of my favorites from the OWC. I think I voted for it, in fact, but it seems so long ago. I'm 10 pages into it, Mac, and it's still fine work.

I am taking extensive notes for you, particularly on the dialogue. There are a lot of areas where things can be shortened. That's typical for a first draft. I will email you the PDF with the notes. They are just my amateur opinion, hopefully they help.

If I don't find your email, I'll put on dropbox and post the link here.

Another thing I note is something I've had trouble deciding on in my own work. And that is the use of contractions when it comes to characters that we want to sound foreign. By contraction, I mean 'there's' instead of 'there is'. I forget if contraction is the word. Maybe it's conjunction. You know what I mean, anyway.

You don't use them at all. I assume that's because you want them to sound like they have foreign accents. I'm really not sure what's best, but I would argue it might be better to use some, to reduce the formal sound of things.

My notes will be more extensive for the first act, as I think that's the most critical part of a spec script. After that, I will focus on story, and it make take me a couple of days.

First ten pages are very solid.

I'm not sure if you care about structural elements, such as inciting incident and act turns. I will only mention any of these things if I happen to notice them.

Thanks Don!

leitskev - thanks for quickly jumping on this, greatly appreciated.

Ah, yes - contractions. You are quite correct and it was intentional. It may be one of the things that gets altered in the subsequent drafts. You may notice the dialogue flow a little better as the script goes on.

I am interested in any and all comments and I really appreciate you taking the time to go through it and make notes!!

As I don't really send out first drafts, I'm a little nervous on the feedback for this. I usually dedicate the first few drafts to action sequences, pacing and structure. Once I'm happy with those elements, I start working on character development, story layers and then dialogue. I am concerned a little about a few of the characters, but I'll let the readers see what they think.

Again - much appreciate the read.

Stew

Hi Stewart,

I started reading your story and got immediately sucked in. I've read already 20 pages, didn't take notes - want to finish reading to give you overall impression first. So far - I'm very much interested.

SPOILERS
I do have one question which seems like an important one - why Helen didn't do her magic before nazis started the killings, but will be looking for the answer in the pages to come. I did notice she pleaded to her mother - so I think the magic doesn't work all the time perhaps, but let's see. Don't tell me just yet

I'll add further comments to this post here.

I'm almost done - on page 90.
I  liked your first 35 very much. I'm also very fond of the idea for this story.
You posed many questions - the chant of the witches, Anna pleading to her mother instead of getting rid of the soldiers right away, what exactly their plans for her mean. --these are good questions, they added to the plot, I was anxious to get to the answers.
I don't think you answered all of them. THe witches - I know what they were about. I think the witches made it more on the fantasy side and made it less believable. I'd probably consider getting rid of them.
Maybe the Nazis could say something about capturing the others, getting them together and... - I want to know what for. Because even now, I don't clearly understand their plans for her. Probably you have a very good idea for it, but chose not to go into it, thinking that it's clear to all - not to me. Or maybe, I missed it.
on p34 (and actually throughout) I had hard time believing that Ewan will tell someone "I'm on a mission". I think Andrei could learn about it easily if he saw Ewan killing a Nazi soldier.
Ewan also says "I'm a British soldier. I've got a job to do. Secretly". -think you should look for another way to let Andrei know who he was. Maybe someone else sees Ewan killing a german soldier and tells Andrei after Andrei captures Ewan?
on p37 he shares that with Helen.
p40s I don't understand why Ewan is helping Andrei with his rescue mission.

She sounds a bit irrational when wanting to revenge just one man. I don't understand that. And Ewan changes suddenly. He wanted to take her to Britain and defeat Germans and now he wants her not to kill (p82) - that was a bit confusing.

Some of it was a bit easy - Weiss conversing with Ewan (p86 onward)- I don't think things like that happened and even if we can invent those - doesn't seem believable to me.

The good thing is all of it can be fixed. You also can take it many different directions. I'd think that you better try big changes and see how it plays out (but it's your call)- like Helen gets captured. Or maybe Andrei gets captured - he's Ewan's friend now, will Ewan go with the mission, or ask Helen to rescue Andrei.
Captured mother is a good turn for the story, but a bit not exciting (--might be just me!).

I think the beginnings of a great story are there. And I really liked how you got British search for her and fight for her with Nazis.

The double agent is a good twist. Thinking we should start suspecting earlier. And also, the dialog on p95-96 is a bit heavy-handed for me. The thing is Andrei learns everything about Ewan from dialog, so do Helene and Ewan eariler - and I already made a suggestion about it. Just a suggestion though

Well, everything I said just one person's opinion, I did enjoy the read and if you rewrite this and want another, please let me know.

It's a good question, Khamanna. This was how I understood it: Helen is really just learning how to use her power. It's not the kind of thing that could be used to fight yet. And she only is able to call on it when she's desperate.

I've read around 10 pgs.

In regards to what khamanna asked, this was one of the many problems I had with this script in the owc. I suggested that Macduff establish Helene's problem early on before the nazis' come. However, Macduff chose to continue to do it. He has his reasons; I respect that. He is overall the writer.

Also, I think you introduced many German characters. Not sure what role they play in but I will continue to read onward.  

Gabe

Hi all,

Thanks for the quick replies. Yes, there are some issues - I'm hoping the feedback will help determine what changes need to take place.

SPOILERS

Gabe - I did give a lot of thought to opening with Helene, but I didnt like that sequence. There is a conversation later in the script that references this omitted scene.

Again,
Thanks for the feedback!

Stew

Stew

Got to about page 30 so far. I have extensive suggestions on the PDF I'll send when done. Hope some of them prove useful. I find it worth putting in the time for this script, based on the potential.

Keep in mind as always my opinions are RANK amateur, and use accordingly.

I just ran into a big story issue which will need to be fixed. I'll get to it in a moment.

First, I want to discuss the writing. There are times that it feels pro, including the dialogue, and it's exciting to see that! I read a lot of pro scripts, so when I see that here, I really do get pumped up by it.

But then I do run into areas where things slide back towards what I would describe as competent amateur. I would guess that much of the explanation is that this is first draft. My notes will only involve dialogue and story. Action lines I don't care about. They're generally very good here.

The scenes in Britain were handled particularly well. Those felt pro.

The scenes in Germany need a bit more work IMO. I think we have to always be careful in these stories not to make the Nazis too cartoonish. And I would suggest promoting this sergeant sent to find the girl. Maybe a colonel. I mean, it's been explained to us that this girl is worth more than all the armies in Europe. She's worth sending a colonel to track her down.

The biggest issue pops up at what I will call the end of act one, where Anna is rescued by what appear to be Russian partisans. The problem is this story takes place in 1940. The Germans and Russians were allies at that point. They had signed a pact where they agreed to divide up Poland. It was not until June of 1941 that the Germans surprise attacked the Soviet Union. There would have been no Russian partisans in Poland or in the Soviet Union fighting the Germans at the time.

If you switch the year to 1941, that will cause other problems in your story, such as the Dutch landing of Ewen. That could be easily adjusted. But I'm not to sure about Russians and Poles working together at any time of the war. Russians and Poles have been mortal enemies far longer that Russians and Germans. Many centuries. Even after the Germans invaded the Soviet Union, the Russians oppressed and killed Poles whenever they could.

Also, there is a pretty big country between Russia and Poland, I believe: the Ukraine. At the time, it was part of the Soviet Union, but Ukrainians are not Russian.

I'm not sure where things go since I'm only at page 30. Maybe you could just have it be Polish villagers rescue her? Maybe even Jews who have escaped?

I'm enjoying the story, which is the main thing. Scriptwriting is hard work, and this is a great start for one.

Hey Stew (apologies for calling you steven first time around!),


I enjoyed this and it has a nice feel to it, old fashioned in some ways, in the sense it reminded me of films like where eagles dare, a lot.

SPOILERS

My notes as i went along are below, nothing good detailed. I have to say for a first draft it is generally sound work.

Like Kevin above i have raised some date issues but i'm sure its nothing that could be adjusted. Standing back i would raise a couple of issues;

1] he finds her too easily and without any information that we know of
2] the twist in act 3 is fine but in some ways lacks some realism. I think this could be easily adjusted.
3] Ewans character varies. From decent chap to almost needless killer - on balance i would tone him down and make his rescue of her personal, add emotion. why does he do what he does?
4] we see nothing of the British Majors until the end. Films like "eagles dare"  have scenes back in the command centre and it is effective for tension between mission, belief in the character (maybe they could express doubts about his ability to escape)

good effort

cheers

bill


The Secret War - feedback
Before starting i accept this is a first draft. I wouldn't let a soul near one of my first drafts so i respect this situation.
P1 black-gloved hands - i thought they were someones else�s at first Black eyes - ? what are these
P2 how did oscar feel/react after two were shot?
Small point - had they started to gather jews in 1940?
P7 mountain castle - i think this would be better with a name, even if made up. along with the following scene i immediately think of where eagles dare - the castle the main room with table etc. Not saying thats bad, just brings back a memory/comparison.
P8 needle in his arm? Hand? needs full stop as well.
Three orphans on one page ! dont show jeff!
P10 age of Mj Barnes?
P11 after jesus, there seems a great opportunity for a flippant line, �No, but close.� Majors - wonder whether it is clearer using barnes and Smith rather than major in the character slugs?
P12 - dialogue again similar to opening scene (in office ) of eagles dare - just saying, plus it has a major smith!
P13 slug already states command centre
Setting - i accept this is a military compound but just wondered if you could have the reval somewhere unusual, like a church crypt
deep underground - then a fire place roars? also - could it be argued that deep underground could affect their ability to connect. probably not, just thinking out loud.
P14 evil purposes - perhaps a better phrase could be used?
P15 - perhaps the girls could offer ideas of what the girl does, what they feel, give us a tone, make him wonder what he will face.
At this point i�m just reflecting on who�s story this is. This seems to be a catalyst moment so i assume the story is as much about Ewan as helene. time will tell.
P17 - take her to dungeons? Maybe �take her away� or �lock her up�
P17 �Win the war� - perhaps a more sinister suggestive description??
P21 Car - i feel as there needs to be a pass word or some check on who ewan is
P23 �the british are aware� wonder how he knows this
P24 - character titles German Jeep Soldier and passenger , seem a bit long
P28 just a thought but if this is so important why didn't they fly him to poland or switzerland rather than running the risk through france?
P29 parachuting into forest is extremely risky as the SAS will tell you - just saying
P30 do we need to know how he finds this house/secret place - ie the intelligence he was given.
p31 how would he know to take the photo of anna?
p34 british ID when behind lines?
P36 i promise i wont go on about orphans but bottom of p36 you could eliminate the extra line by using �he sense someone behind.� (drop him)
P37 nice line - re tug
P38 reference is made to what they do to them in the camps - in 1940?
P39 bottom line - i think instructions or orders are better than funding
P40 no needs to trail off after Hilter i think
P44 i think OC is off camera and more used for television - i think? OS would normally be used, until someone corrects me of course
P45 is it meant to be �Ok, then we need to bury our friends� if not do you need the then? P48 wasn�t wholly sure about vogel going off on one
p54 nice scene with razor blade
p58 Ewan is obviously a good solider and brave etc but he also comes across as a decent bloke so the various kills slightly jar. Yes, he kills if attacked but the kills into the tower maybe unnecessary unless he is sold as a darker character
P59 broadsword to dannyboy...aka...greyfox to foxhole. ilke that kind of stuff
Maybe with the communications tower he could be more subtle, sneak in, drug them ?? so no fire or killing. Read next page ,see why you did that.
The rebel soldier finding them like that seemed a bit easy
P66-67 decent scene with combinations of tension and surprises
P68 - Ursula - she obviously has decent powers which makes me wonder quite why she is at the mercy of the germans. i feel her power is almost too much
P75 nice reversal girl going dark - again the clash with ewan decent character is required so i refer back to his killings at the tower
P80 - you have taken nearly three pages to make himmler put pressure on weiss - i think they could be quicker?
P80 helene dark side - you maybe about to use this but i wonder about her taking her anger out on a rebel that mucks up rather than a german
P84 nice, a twist with ewan which play will this play out
P95 the switch by Ewan having got the rebels into the castle in the dungeon just feels a bit far fetched. could he not have spared them and agreed for them to be waiting int he shadows outside, ready for his signal?
p102 not sure why weiss would call himmler - ok see that later
p105 nice touch with the clairvoyant cavalry appearing
p110 i like the end with her, decent way out

Quoted from leitskev The biggest issue pops up at what I will call the end of act one, where Anna is rescued by what appear to be Russian partisans. The problem is this story takes place in 1940. The Germans and Russians were allies at that point. They had signed a pact where they agreed to divide up Poland. It was not until June of 1941 that the Germans surprise attacked the Soviet Union. There would have been no Russian partisans in Poland or in the Soviet Union fighting the Germans at the time. If you switch the year to 1941, that will cause other problems in your story, such as the Dutch landing of Ewen. That could be easily adjusted. But I'm not to sure about Russians and Poles working together at any time of the war. Russians and Poles have been mortal enemies far longer that Russians and Germans. Many centuries. Even after the Germans invaded the Soviet Union, the Russians oppressed and killed Poles whenever they could. Also, there is a pretty big country between Russia and Poland, I believe: the Ukraine. At the time, it was part of the Soviet Union, but Ukrainians are not Russian. I'm not sure where things go since I'm only at page 30. Maybe you could just have it be Polish villagers rescue her? Maybe even Jews who have escaped? I'm enjoying the story, which is the main thing. Scriptwriting is hard work, and this is a great start for one.

Hey Kev (it's Kev, right?),

Thank you so much. This is a very big oversight on my behalf and you are entirely right. There would be no such Russian partisan presence in Poland.  Switching the dates do change things - especially the travel and scenes within Holland - I think that was my original concern (as I needed Ewan to be able to get to Switzerland, etc).

I think you are right - the easiest solution would be to change them to displaced Polish villagers. Infact, I really like the idea of making them Jewish, it sort of fits with the thematic elements with Helene. I like it.

Cheers,
Stew

Quoted from leitskev The biggest issue pops up at what I will call the end of act one, where Anna is rescued by what appear to be Russian partisans. The problem is this story takes place in 1940. The Germans and Russians were allies at that point. They had signed a pact where they agreed to divide up Poland. It was not until June of 1941 that the Germans surprise attacked the Soviet Union. There would have been no Russian partisans in Poland or in the Soviet Union fighting the Germans at the time.

First, Germans and Soviets were never allies. The German-Soviet non-aggression treaty you are referring to was, for the most part, a standard treaty that many countries had with Germany. The countries that had that pact included Poland, Latvia, Great Britain, Denmark, Estonia, etc. All were attacked later on. Were they German allies?

And second, why wouldn't Russians be in Poland in 1940? It's like saying that Canadians can't be in the US because US isn't a part of Canada. There's no problem here, it makes perfect sense.

Quoted from MacDuff This is a very big oversight on my behalf

No oversight, in my opinion.

I added more notes to the earlier post.

Vaultman, ahh, no.

The German-Soviet treaty made them allies of a sort. Friends? No. But the deal was more than non-aggression. The Russians were required to ship substantial amounts of resources, food and raw materials, to the Germans every month. In fact, even after Stalin was warned by spies that the Germans were planning an attack, he insisted on continuing the shipments to Germany in hopes of avoiding an attack. The Soviets had purged much of their officer corp, and were not ready for war.

Standard agreement? Were there any other countries that worked out a deal to divide Eastern Europe? No. The Soviets not only received part of Poland, but the Baltic states as well. Economic cooperation, secret deals to support each others territorial ambitions...that makes them allies.

I didn't say there would not be Russians in Poland. I said there would not be Russian partisans. You know, groups of armed militia fighting the invaders/occupiers. And there certainly would not be.

To my knowledge, there are no Canadian partisans fighting in the US.  Except during hockey season!

edit: from Wikipedia

The Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact is commonly referred to under a number of names in addition to the official one and the one bearing the names of the foreign ministers. It is also known as the Nazi–Soviet Pact, Hitler–Stalin Pact, German–Soviet Non-aggression Pact and sometimes the Nazi–Soviet Alliance.

Stew

I think the Jewish partisan angle could work quite well. Did such groups exist at that time in Poland? My guess is probably not. But that doesn't matter, because it's very plausible. So if it fits the story, yeah, I like it!

I'm a rank amateur when it comes to scripts and films. History is another matter. Glad I could help.

Quoted from leitskev The Russians were required to ship substantial amounts of resources, food and raw materials, to the Germans every month.

In exchange, they received German machine tools used to produce shells that were somewhat superior to what Soviets could produce themselves. That's more like trading. Everyone traded with Nazis.

Quoted from leitskev In fact, even after Stalin was warned by spies that the Germans were planning an attack, he insisted on continuing the shipments to Germany in hopes of avoiding an attack.

He received warnings almost every day, every time showing a new date. Naturally, when a real date popped up, it was very difficult to tell whether it's the real one. There is evidence suggesting that the Soviets waited for the attack. It wasn't a surprise.

Quoted from leitskev Standard agreement? Were there any other countries that worked out a deal to divide Eastern Europe? No. The Soviets not only received part of Poland, but the Baltic states as well. Economic cooperation, secret deals to support each others territorial ambitions...that makes them allies.

For example, Poland had a non-aggression pact with Germany and when Germany invaded the Czech Republic, Poland occupied the Cieszyn Silesia part of it. So Poland itself was not quite a lamb it tries to look like.

This is not to say that the Soviets tried to ally with Great Britain, France, Poland and other countries of the future anti-Nazi coalition, before signing any treaties with Germany. All their attempts faced s brick wall: this is too radical, this is too early. From everyone, including Poland.

And by the way, are you suggesting that these Polish should have been given to Nazis? That they would have been better off under SS battalions?

Quoted from leitskev I didn't say there would not be Russians in Poland. I said there would not be Russian partisans. You know, groups of armed militia fighting the invaders/occupiers. And there certainly would not be.

There is only one Russian in the screenplay, from what I've read so far (approx page 60). A Russian who happened to be in a Nazi occupied part of Poland. What should he do? Hide in a basement or join the Polish partisans? Absolutely reasonable and logical, in my opinion. He could be a Russian citizen of Poland. There's a reason why I defend his character so much: I think there could be a lot of tension between him and Ewan due to the language barrier. I wrote more on that in my notes to the author, but I haven't finished them all yet.

Quoted from leitskev edit: from Wikipedia

Wikipedia as a source? Seriously? It is quite biased, for understandable reasons.

Dear Moderators, we have digressed from the script itself, but only a bit. Please, don't delete this, since it has to do with the reality of a certain character being where he is

leitskev, this is an interesting topic for discussion, but this probably isn't the right place to talk about it. You could PM me, though, if you want to continue the discussion (unless it has to do with the script, then posting here would be more appropriate and would help the author).