I recently skimmed the surface of a thread entitled: "To Copyright or Register".

There is so much controversy here and I do have to agree that the WGA probably does rake in the bucks and for what. (Was that a question?)

The topic came up about plots and no, you can't copyright a plot because I think only a dozen plots exist.  Maybe a couple dozen if you include some mixtures.

What had occurred to me not too long ago, was the fact that if someone has been working on Simplyscripts for say five years and they have many people who have witnessed the development of their work, wouldn't the people who critiqued and saw the writer's work and developments serve as witnesses?

Add to that the online logs and personal messages, one could gather a lot of evidence.

Additionally, each writer has their own personal flavor which we as writers/critiquers get to know.  After being exposed to a certain writer's work over a period of time, we start to become familiar with them and their style.  We may not always be right, but we are often able to make good guesses as to who wrote what.

We do need to be firstly concerned with raising the quality of our work to such a level where we actually NEED to be concerned about plagiarism, but there is definitely a gray area when we are the little guy: We have little money to register and pay for expensive copyright procedures and even if we go the poor man's route, it means little.

So what?  We mail ourselves a copy of something worked on for three years.  If the idea is stolen, we don't necessarily have the money to secure a high power attorney.

I really don't have any solutions to this dilemma.  No wonder the last thread is pushing 150 replies.  It gets very muddled no matter how you try and resolve the questions.

I think that the important thing is for us to help each other develop the craft and hopefully, we won't run into too many thieves.

Sandra  

Just thought I'd add my two cents worth.  

Here's an entry from my blog:

http://theworkingscreenwriter.blogspot.com/2007/01/they-steal-ideas-dont-they.html

From my website:

Q:  I want to make sure my script is protected.  Which should I do, WGA registration or register my copyright with the Library of Congress?

A:  People get so worked up over this.  I personally don’t think script theft is that much of a problem.  I certainly wouldn’t get paranoid about it—and I wouldn’t let it prevent me from sending my scripts out to production companies and studios.  WGA registration and registration with the LOC are both relatively inexpensive.  I suggest you go to the following websites and do some reading.  

Writers Guild of America (www.wga.org)

U.S. Copyright Office (www.loc.gov)

But definitely do one or the other, or do both, and forget about it.   Also, there’s no need to rush out and register your copyright on the first draft of your script.  Only register your copyright/work when you decide to send the script out to consultants, contests, agents and/or prodcos.  If you do substantial rewrites thereafter, go ahead and re-register your copyright/work.  Other than WGA and/or LOC registration, the best way to protect yourself is to keep a paper trail.  Keep all correspondence (emails, etc.) and a written log of all individuals and prodcos you contact.  Also keep all your notes, outlines, and drafts.  Should it become necessary, this material can go a long way to proving your case in a courtroom.

The “Poor Man’s Copyright”: For those of you thinking about putting your script into a sealed envelope and mailing it to yourself: DO NOT DO IT.  IT DOES NOT WORK.  IT WILL NOT HOLD UP IN COURT.  One more time: DO NOT DO IT.  IT DOES NOT WORK.  IT WILL NOT HOLD UP IN COURT.  

Quoted from Sandra Elstree. What had occurred to me not too long ago, was the fact that if someone has been working on Simplyscripts for say five years and they have many people who have witnessed the development of their work, wouldn't the people who critiqued and saw the writer's work and developments serve as witnesses?

Supposing ten people, here, have reviewed your script.  And then you sue someone for plagiarizing it, are you going to fly those ten people in to testify in court?  I don't think that this website, itself, will carry that much weight as evidence.

Quoted from Sandra Elstree. We do need to be firstly concerned with raising the quality of our work to such a level where we actually NEED to be concerned about plagiarism, but there is definitely a gray area when we are the little guy: We have little money to register and pay for expensive copyright procedures and even if we go the poor man's route, it means little.

Several people, here, have had their scripts plagiarized already.  We are at that level already.


Phil

Quoted from dogglebe Supposing ten people, here, have reviewed your script.  And then you sue someone for plagiarizing it, are you going to fly those ten people in to testify in court?  I don't think that this website, itself, will carry that much weight as evidence. Phil

I don't think you would need to fly the ten people in. You could just print out the thread with the reviews. It has the date on it. Judges have used e-mails as evidence in court.

Still it is best to have it registered, but if you haven't done that yet and someone does take your script, I don't see why it wouldn't be admissable.
Cindy

Quoted from CindyLKeller I don't think you would need to fly the ten people in. You could just print out the thread with the reviews. It has the date on it. Judges have used e-mails as evidence in court.

I think Don could change the dates on all the threads to the 1950s if he wanted to.  Given this, this website wouldn't carry that much weight (sorry Don).

If a judge had to decide between this site and actual people in the courtroom, he would mostly likely opt for the witnesses in the courtroom.

Coincidentally, the people at GimmeCredit found another plagiarized copy of 'Not Even Death' on Youtube.  The plagiarism continues....


Phil

One thing this place is good for though is that people do read scripts that are posted here. There have been several instances where people have seen a film or video on the net someplace and realized that they had already read that script some time ago. Those people often come back here and alert the writer of the script that they've seen the film without them being credited as the writer.

Some people are afraid to post their scripts online for fear of someone stealing it, to me you're better off the more people that read your script. The chance of someone noticing if it get plagiarized gets bigger.

The best sample of that might have been that short of Martin's that a legitimate filmmaker entered into the "On the Lot" competition and then there was a another guy using the same script, without permission entering the same TV show only that guy had credited himself as the writer. He even had the nerve to in his video bio talk about writing the script. Many people here came to Martin's defense and jumped on that guy. I think it will be a long time before that guy will be taken seriously.

When it comes to feature length scripts though, I think it is a good idea to copyright it. Even if it costs $75. Think about all the hours spent on writing it. Take those hours and divide by $75. Doesn't come out to very much does it? Maybe everytime we sit down to work on that feature we should put a quarter into a cup and maybe by the time the script is finished there will be at least $75 in that cup for the copyright. That way the fee won't seem so steep if that is a concern.

Plagiarism is a big problem. There is the belief that anything that is posted on the internet is up for grabs and so almost any script worth making will be stolen by the Youtube crowd.

Copyrighting it brings a little piece of mind, if nothing else.

I heard on the news yesterday that Paul Hogan is suing Adam Sandler for copyright infringement.  Apparently, 'I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry' is a rip off of 'Strange Bedfellows.'

From IMDB:

Two straight, single Brooklyn firefighters (Sandler, James) pretend to be a gay couple in order to receive domestic partner benefits.

and

Two 'very straight' old timers (Hogan and Caton) have to learn how to pass as a loving gay couple after falsely claiming same-sex status to take advantage of newly leglislated tax laws.

Incidentally, in Strange Bedfellows, Hogan and Caton play firefighters.

If it can happen to produced movies, it can happen to us.


Phil

If you're looking to digitally chart copyright you should use monolith-owned MySpace or Blogger where you can have records subpoenaed.  It doesn't matter what your anonymous internet friends say but you can prove copyright with corporate records.  

Blogs are a good way to chart where you've sent stuff and as long as you don't edit the entry it will keep the original posting date locked away forever. Copyright lawsuits hinge just as much on the material as proving that the person who you think stole your thing had access to it.

But as proof at how hard copyright cases are to pursue "Chuck and Larry" was written in 1997 and in its first go-round at the studios was a Dreamworks film with Will Smith attached.

Quoted from dogglebe I heard on the news yesterday that Paul Hogan is suing Adam Sandler for copyright infringement.  Apparently, 'I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry' is a rip off of 'Strange Bedfellows.' From IMDB: Two straight, single Brooklyn firefighters (Sandler, James) pretend to be a gay couple in order to receive domestic partner benefits. and Two 'very straight' old timers (Hogan and Caton) have to learn how to pass as a loving gay couple after falsely claiming same-sex status to take advantage of newly leglislated tax laws. Incidentally, in Strange Bedfellows, Hogan and Caton play firefighters. If it can happen to produced movies, it can happen to us. Phil

I didn't see Strange Bedfellows, but I did see Adam Sandler's,  I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry, and it was awful. I hope the other one was better.  ;D
It's a shame if it's true.

AND what's this about another rip off of your script?
Geesh.
Did you ever get the situation with the other guy taken care of?

Hope it all works out,
Cindy

I just came across this on a UK site. It seems like a fairly inexpensive way of protecting your scripts.  

Quoted Text The Script Vault - http://www.thescriptvault.com - Deposit costs just £10 per script. Your script will be date stamped upon arrival and you'll be sent a registration certificate. It will then be deposited unopened in our Script Vault for 10 years. When the 10 years have elapsed you can either renew the facility or have the script returned.

The WGA doesn't just serve as a means to copyright, though it is one of the cheapest means out there. I personally would like to register Cielo and for the reason that I'd like to see that sold. I know there are six writers on board and that copyrighting it may prove difficult, but the last thing I want to do is see someone left uncredited or unpaid because their name is not part of the registered script. Also, just for protection I'm not going to throw a unsolicited and uncopyrighted script into the market. That's unwise.

Posting on SS, I don't think it needs a copyright. I'm not concerned with that at all. In fact we've been shown that people in SS will stick up for those whose work is stolen. However, out in the market, that's a new ballgame.

Quoted from Chris_MacGuffin The WGA doesn't just serve as a means to copyright, though it is one of the cheapest means out there. I personally would like to register Cielo and for the reason that I'd like to see that sold. I know there are six writers on board and that copyrighting it may prove difficult, but the last thing I want to do is see someone left uncredited or unpaid because their name is not part of the registered script. Also, just for protection I'm not going to throw a unsolicited and uncopyrighted script into the market. That's unwise.

You can register a script through the Library of Congress with multiple writers.  I imagine it's pretty common.

Quoted from Chris_MacGuffin Posting on SS, I don't think it needs a copyright. I'm not concerned with that at all. In fact we've been shown that people in SS will stick up for those whose work is stolen. However, out in the market, that's a new ballgame.

One of the people who plagiarized Not Even Death was a Simplyscripts member.  I can only guess that he realized that he wrote crappy zombie scripts and figured he was better off stealing other people's work.

And there was another SS'er who stole someone else's script and, IIRC, optioned it.

The moral here:  Don't trust people with your work; register it.