Thank You Anna by Stephen Brown - Short - Pete is remembering how me met his wife of 38 years. He relives that night again on a very emotional day. 9 pages - doc, format 8)

Stephen,

I thought this script was pretty OK. Your formatting is the big area you need improving on. There are some great writing programs out there. If you're going to keep on writing, they come in pretty handy.

There were also a few descriptions that don't belong in a spec script, such as use of things like "we see" or "we hear". Rewrite these sections.

As far as characters and dialogue, I thought it was pretty well done for the most part. A couple of lines really bugged me, like the line about Pete knowing Lisa for so long they're like brother and sister. Pretty cheesy line. But you had some good ones in there. I liked Pete teasing Alex about his pants and the interaction with Anna towards the end was very nice.

In fact, I think that's where the biggest room for improvment lies. The entire story is about Pete's reaction to Anna; but she's only in about a page of the script. I woudle extend it to include her more. You could write their conversation as Pete walks her home (possibly end it with him asking her on a date?)

Overall, it's not a bad script. It could be better though.

Hope this helps. ;D


Matt.

Thanks Chism. This was my first go at writing a script for around 10 years. Had the idea of the start and end scenes pretty much sorted straight away, the middle was where I had to think. I've learnt what you mean about the 'we hear' and 'we see' lines since doing this so won't happen again.
Also, since doing this one I have downloaded Celtx but Don doesn't want it posted in that format. When I paste it onto word it changes all the format.
Thanks again for the advice.

I always submit my scripts in pdf and Don has never said a thing to me. You must be doing something wrong.

~Zack~

Sounds like you're submitting the celtx file itself.  Convert to pdf (you'll need to sign up for a free celtx account to do so) and submit it that way.  Should be fine.

Thanks Shelton, just done that so gonna submit another one I've done.

Hey a Geordie!

Thought I'd check out your script Ste.

Matt covered the format issues and also I have to agree with him that you should extend this.  We don't get to know Anna's character so although we feel pain for Pete it would be more heart felt if knew more about his wife.

I liked the joking between Pete and Alex and you nailed that kinda awkward situation of a friend trying to cheer up his newly dumped mate.

Not sure I totally got the same suit thing though.

This was good but extending it would certainly improve the emotion.

Good stuff.

Oh by the way I live near Middlesbrough.  Dunno if your a footie fan but there's a nice big game on Sunday (not the Super Bowl), shame I don't actually support the Boro.

Thanks Alffy, I'm going to spend the next week or so expanding one of the 3 shorts I've done into a more complete story and will post it back on. I've submitted another short I've done yesterday, black comedy called 'you can keep the dog!'.
I'm a big Toon fan by the way mate so looking forward to tomorrow. Good to meet someone from nearby on here, small world and all that ;o)

Hey Stephen,

I get what you were trying to do with this, but I'm not so sure the execution was pulled off as well as it could have been.  For instance, to me, it comes off that everytime Pete looks at a picture of Anna, it reminds him more of going out and partying with his goofy friend Alex than it does of the night he first met his wife.  You spent so much time with Pete dancing in front of his mirror, making fun of Alex as they karaoke'd in the car, ordering the beer from his almost sister and making fun of Alex's dancing.  Then, when he meets Anna, he just says hi and walks her home.  I don't mean to sound cynical, but in the half-page Anna was in the story, she almost literally came off as an easy hussie who smokes and was looking for someone to take her home for a quickie.  :-)

Of course, because of the scene with Pete getting emotional over the picture, I know it's not the case, but the flashback didn't do anything to make her stand out as a person we should be sorry to miss.

Don't get me wrong.  It's not that I think the story was bad at all. I did feel sorry for the old Pete because his wife had just died.  I think it has the ability to become a heartfelt memorial short.  I just think a lot of focus was lost on Anna and more focus spent on trying to get a couple chuckles in the story through an almost irrelevent character.

Honestly, I have to say, Stephen, I think you have an awesome chance to put a genuine twist on this story.  The sad story works well as it is, but I thought I'd just share a thought with you.  Open with Pete, dressed in a suit and tie, staring at the picture of Anna and wiping away a tear.  Then, show the flashback of how he meets Anna, (don't forget to focus on her so we feel for her and feel pity for Pete).  Then, when Pete is old again and his son walks into the room and sees him staring at the picture, his son puts his hand on Pete's shoulder and both stare lovingly at the picture.  The son says something to the affect of "She really means the world to you, doesn't she, Dad?"  Then Pete answers "She's the only woman I've ever loved."  The son tells Pete the car is waiting outside.  Pete sets the picture down, wipes another tear, and they walk outside.

A limo waits outside.  Pete and his son walk towards the limo.  Pete says "There she is now."  Anna stands outside the limo, waiting for them.  Pete and Anna give each other a loving embrace and warm kiss.  Pete looks at her and says something like "Now, you're sure people our age still renew their wedding vows?"

I know you were going for a melancholy feel to the script, but I just thought this would give the reader a pleasant surprise, and all those sad thoughts we had thinking Anna had died will wash away.  Of course, you might have to rework the title some for that ending, but it's only a suggestion.

The story still works just as well with the sad ending.

I see people have already told you about the formatting issues and you're going to have those cleared up, but there a couple other things you might have to look at, also.

If you call a character by a certain name throughout the story, never introduce them as Guy or Girl.  Just state their name right away.  For example, when you introduce Anna, it works a lot better if you refer to her right away as Anna and not 'Girl'.  This stops any confusion of Pete having a conversation with a Girl, and then Anna interrupts them.  I'm not saying that it did happen when I read the script, it's just kind of a good protocol.

There's a few more things I noticed, but I'll wait until the .pdf version is posted and check to see if that was the cause of the rest of the problems that I saw.

All in all, not too bad of a little story here, Stephen.

- Mark

Thanks Mark, some good advice there. I'm going to be rewriting it tonight so look out for the revised version next week sometime on here. I'm thinking of maybe changing it to a blind double date. Alex is meeting his gf and Anna is his gf's friend. Might be able to get more depth to her character that way. Good suggestion for the twist ending but I don't wanna copy off you haha I think I like the sad ending aswell. It's not based on a true story or anything just thought it would make a sweet little short for my first go.
Totally off topic, but a few people on here have said I shouldn't use 'we hear' and 'we see' in actions, but having read a few produced scripts they're all over the place. Any thoughts on that? Just watched Barton Fink on Tuesday and read the script yesterday, class!

Quoted from stebrown a few people on here have said I shouldn't use 'we hear' and 'we see' in actions, but having read a few produced scripts they're all over the place.

Yeah, that's kind of a tough thing, being the newbie.  It gets kind of hard to tell who the experienced writers are from the people who are just beginning on the site.  Not that you should be prejudiced in whose scripts you want to read, but it's important knowing whose scripts are properly formatted and whose aren't, to kind of use as a guideline for what to do and what not to do.

The main thing I recommend is to take a look at some of the replies to stories, and see who gives a lot of advice on the formatting and what not, and if they sound like they know what they're talking about.  Then, check out some of their work for a little bit of guidance in formatting your own scripts.  For instance, Shelton (Mike Shelton) and bert (Robert G. Newcomer), I could tell have been writing for a while and their scripts are well formatted.  And the stories I've read from them are interesting, too, so I'd recommend reading some of their stuff for what to look for and what to avoid.  ('Some Place Nice and Dark' and 'Paramour's' by Robert G. Newcomer and 'The Caper' by Mike Shelton are some of my favorites from them, though I haven't read everything they've written, yet.)

As for the 'we see' and 'we hear', those aren't used in spec scripts, simply because those are camera directions and we're not the director, so it's not up to us to figure out where the camera is going to be.  That's the director's job.  Our job is to simply get the story across.  In a novel, the author never says 'We see Kate knitting in the corner' when he introduces a character, does he?  He simply says 'Kate sits in the corner.'  It's the same principle, here.  Don't tell us what we see Kate doing in the scene.  Make Kate do the action in the scene.

However, in a shooting script, which is written by the director, that's when it's okay to give camera cues and POV's and that sort of thing.  But that's for the director and how he wants to shoot it.  You want to tell the story and not let the reader get mixed up in how special of an angle you want to shoot it, it detracts and gets in the way of the main story.

On a similar note, while you plan on doing the rewriting tonight, try and remember to put all your sentences in present tense.  You have a lot of it written in a passive state.  For instance, here is your first action description:

"60ish year old man is sitting in an armchair holding a picture frame with a tear in his eye. The man is wearing a black suit and tie, gazing into the picture. He wipes the tear away from his eye as a smile comes over his face. Closing his eyes."

It might read a little more crisp like this:

"An elderly man, who wears a black suit and tie, sits in an armchair and gazes into a framed picture he holds in front of him.  He wipes a tear away from his cheek as he gently closes his eyes.  A warm smile washes over his face."

Notice how all the passive action '-ing' words have been replaced with present tense actions.  While it may not seem like a huge change, it makes the story a lot crisper, and a faster read in the long run.  And although it didn't save a lot of space in that instance, it will eventually cut down a lot of unnecessary words you won't need.  If you'd like some more examples of this, just let me know and I'll pick out a few more instances in the script where the action has to be put into present tense and not passive.

I hope this helps you out at least a little bit, understanding why camera directions aren't needed.  If there's anything you need me to explain in more detail, or something you didn't understand, let me know.

- Mark

Thanks again Mark, spot on advise. I quaff my hat Sir.

Had to read that part about passive tense a couple of times to make sense of it. Think I've got it.
Passive - "Joe is walking through the door, holding a shotgun in his hands. Shooting everyone inside the house."
Present - "Joe walks through the door with a shotgun in his hands. He shoots everyone in the house"
Yeah? Does read better and gets the reader more involved.

Should I stay clear of describing camera shots completely then? A dark comedy I submitted should be on here soon. I've used P.O.V on that just because that's an important part I thought. I'm wanting the reader to see the guy from the dogs eyes (don't ask haha).

One of the main things I've picked up I think is how to transfer between locations. I'm almost finished 'The Burnout' by dogglebe, think that's a very good one for learning formatting.
INT - HOUSE - DAY
John carries Jim over his shoulder and runs, he crashes through the window. He lands on his feet on-
EXT - TOP OF TRAIN - CONT.
with a loud thud. John kneels down and lays Jim on his back.
Didn't know you could do that before reading that script and helps out a lot.

Said alot here but really appreciate your advise, and many others on here. I've read a couple of scripts by Shelton, top stuff. Will have to read some from bert aswell as ya own.

Quoted from stebrown Should I stay clear of describing camera shots completely then? A dark comedy I submitted should be on here soon. I've used P.O.V on that just because that's an important part I thought.

Yeah, in spec scripts, it is pretty universal to avoid as many camera shots as possible.  As for the POV, well, asking that question just might open a can of worms because I think everybody might have a different opinion on that.

Personally, and I'm not saying that I'm right, but I don't use POV's because of the simple fact that they are a camera direction and you're telling how the film should be shot.  However, alot of people, even experienced been-around writers, use POV's simply because it might add a certain atmosphere to the script.  And, honestly, I feel some rules, even formatting, should be broken if the script calls for it.  That's why I didn't say anything in 'Goodnight Anna' when you had Pete look at the wedding picture and used his POV.  (Although I do know that's not how a POV should be formatted.)

I guess the main thing to remember about POV's is to go back and reread the scene, and as long as the POV doesn't distract or take away from the pace of the story, I don't see any problem using them.

As for advice on how to properly format a POV, I can't really say, since I don't use them and never really bothered to pay attention to them, even in shooting scripts, so you might want to bring that question to the discussion board and ask.  I'm sure somebody will know the proper format for POV's there.

Hmm.  I wonder.  Looking at the scene through the eyes of a dog.  I wonder if you would have to film that in black and white and make the foreground distorted and flat, kind of like the opening credits of Star Wars.  Isn't that how dogs see everything?  I thought I read that in an article somewhere.

Quoted from stebrown I'm almost finished 'The Burnout' by dogglebe, think that's a very good one for learning formatting.

Yeah, I've recently heard good things about his scripts, too.  I'm still pretty new to the site myself, so I haven't gotten around to checking out any of his stuff, yet.  That'll change over the weekend.

- Mark

Hi, this is the revised version of an earlier script I did. Thought I'd give it a bump upto the top of the page ;o)


[Bert's Edit:  Bumping up rewrites is fine, Steve, as they can sometimes go unnoticed.  It is the slackers who "bump" for no good reason who are frowned upon...]

hey, i never read your original draft, but this was really good.  seriously.  i will say there were a few typos, but i'm not really picky about that sort of thing.  one thing that was slightly confusing (i understood) was on page 5, "he sees a gorgeous..."  that should say "pete says..", because otherwise it's not completely clear who the pronoun refers to based on the previous sentence.  also, on page 7, i thought it was too fast for them to be holding hands considering they had just met and weren't drunk.  i think if they are just walking together it would still be romantic and more effective (because my initial reaction was everything else prior to that point had been paced so well, and now they're already holding hands so that seemed a bit fast).  also, i thought it was funny, how he didnt realize how he would get home, but i'm not entirely sure how that could come across.  and then i really really liked the twist at the end, that was very satisfying-you didn't go for the obvious, meldramtic ending.  this is a good, tight, solid script.  nothing felt rushed, you had the comedic stuff with alex's character, and then a great end that was earned and satisfying.  i think this script is done (other than my minor quibble about the holding hands).  oh, and the title for me doesn't work at all.  sorry to say that, but i still think you can do much better.  but thanks for the satisfying read

Thanks for the read dkw208, credit has to go to Mark for the change in the ending. Didn't go with exactly what he suggested but took his idea of giving it a happy twist.
I wasn't happy with the title either, but wanted a title that didn't give away the ending.
I can see what you mean about the holding hands but they both felt a strong connection straight away and felt comfortable with it.
I think maybe for the not knowing how he could get home he could just stop and look around, arms out wide. It was just a comedic part though so if that got lost don't think it would take anything away.
Pleased you enjoyed it anyway.
I'm currently working on a short(possibly a feature) a little closer to the kind of films I like to watch. Gonna work on it alot before posting it though so Mark doesn't have to correct my errors haha
Sorry for any typos, I read it through a few times and spell checked it so thought it was all clear.

yeah, i agree, holding out arms would will read i think

Wow.  Tons times better than the original, and I even liked the original.  (Lol.  And it's not just because of the change in the ending, either.)

I could definately tell you put some thought into this one now.

In the first draft I read, a lot of the funny parts were very forced, almost like the sitcom 'Saved by the Bell'.  Just regular same old  jokes that would have only gotten a laugh out of a twelve year-old.  But I honest to God laughed from my gut when I read this version.  There was some very true humor here.  When Pete told Anna "I should have thought of that to shut her up" when he saw some stranger kissing the blonde, was my favorite part.  I even stopped and played it out in my mind after I read that.

And you managed very successfully to bring Anna up from a one-night stand to a prim and proper, and ultimately, very likable and well-rounded character.  Even Alex was likable now because he wasn't forced upon us.

Excellent job on the formatting, also.  It flowed really well and breezed right through it.

An amazing rewrite with this, Stephen.

- Mark

Hey Stephen,

I don't know how the first draft ended (but going through the replies here I'm guessing it ended at a funeral instead of a wedding - forgive me if I'm wrong).

Having just read You Can Keep The Dog I thought this script here is much better written. Okay, my formatting notes on You Can Keep The Dog still goes, but this worked much better cos' you had a really good build up and then pulled a major twist in the end. About the twist though, it did seem a little too melodramtic that Pete cries on the day of his son's wedding - that's usually reserved for the mothers  ;D - and because of this the twist seems a bit forced.

I think it would work better if the story was about Anna and how she met Pete, and not vice versa.

My 0.2

Cheers
Rob

Cheers Mark/Rob for the reads. This one is probably the one I'm most happy with so far, although the one I'm doing now is a proper idea.
Rob, Pete is a new-age kind of guy and very sensitive lol real men can cry too ya know lol I take your point tho.
My scripts at the moment are just at a level where I'm trying to nail formatting, structure etc so if the story is a good one then it's a bonus.
Mark, I liked that line too. Seemed easy to write that situation, think I've been there too many times haha

I was just wondering if my use of 'cut to' and 'continued' is wrong in this script? Just been reading the forum about proper formatting and it seems I'm still making mistakes. Cheers for the help.

Generally the use of 'cut to' and 'continued' is frowned upon... but it's not really breaking any rules.

~Zack~

Also, the CUT TOs are redundant cos' the writing itself should clearly show whether it's a new or a continuating scene.

Thanks you two. I've had a look at the options on celtx, so should I take it off for dialogue and scene breaks (the continueds i mean)? The CUT TOs being redundant was what I gathered from what I read.