I often see people here commenting on the use of 'we see' on threads around the sight.

I was just wondering, what the actual problem with using this technique is. I see it used in un-produced scripts as well as some produced, big screen scripts. 'The Debt' frequently uses it and it's no different with 'Blood Diamond.'

So if industry professionals can break this rule, why can't we?

Daniel

@Danbotha...

Personally I don't use we or we see because it's a movie - of course we see.  If I ever have too, I would, but... most of the time it's redundant and serves no purpose, and there is only so much room on a page.  I'd rather spend it on character and story and actions and other things that I believe are more important.  Now, there are times when "we see" is the right tool for the job - usually when the audience sees something that no other character sees.  Then use it.  Sometimes it ends up being the most elegant, effective way to write a moment in your script, but like all things...

1) Use it sparingly.  Do it for a reason - make a choice.   Be aware of when you use it, consider the alternative, and if you still prefer the "we see" then use it.

2) When in doubt, take it out.

Best advice I can give you.  If you'd like another example of it's efefctive use, let me know and I'll plug one in.

Now I'll be more then happy to ignore this thread and go off and die while this thread spins into oblivion... and it will.   Soon as the original OP acknowledges that there is no debate about this in the world of working writers: no one cares about "we see." Or "we."

And I'm quoting here...

Ghostie

Do not use 'We see' in scripts.  It's completely redundant.  'We hear' is as well.  Now we, itself, is not off limits.  Lines like 'We hover over the corpses' or 'We float across the meadow'  are completely fine.  But like Ghostie says, don't overuse them.  

Quoted from ghost and_ghostie gal @Danbotha... Now I'll be more then happy to ignore this thread and go off and die while this thread spins into oblivion... and it will.   Soon as the original OP acknowledges that there is no debate about this in the world of working writers: no one cares about "we see." Or "we." Ghostie

If that is the case, Ghostie, why do reviewers continue to make a fuss over it when they do see it? If there is no debate, why do people on simplyscripts jump on it as soon as they see it?

I get why people would rather not use it, but why, oh why would you make a big fuss over it?

Quoted from danbotha I get why people would rather not use it, but why, oh why would you make a big fuss over it?

Because it's redundant and therefore, bad writing.

Quoted from mcornetto Because it's redundant and therefore, bad writing.

Alright, fair enough. I can understand that.

Then my only problem with it is, how do industry professionals get away with it?

Does it not seem a little unfair to you?

Many industry professionals are writing on assignment.  Their scripts don't undergo the same type of scrutiny that a spec script does.  Plus they aren't trying to win contests or get comments from a screenwriting forum.   So, yes, slightly different rules do apply, not very different and certainly nothing you should emulate if it's bad writing.

And I'm almost sure that you are looking at shooting scripts where the director might have had some input and wanted a visual placed there.  It may not even be the original writer that wrote the line.  It's very much a director thing to think in terms of 'We see'.  And they aren't going to care about the quality of the writing, all they're going to care about is whether or not the DP will understand it well enough to get the shot.

Hope that helps.

It certainly does, Michael. Thanks a bunch :)

I've said what I wanted to say. Let this thread sink to the bottom, now ;D

Quoted from danbotha I've said what I wanted to say. Let this thread sink to the bottom, now ;D

Oh no.  That would be way to easy.

Actually, Ghostie and Cornie gave great examples and reasons to avoid using such garbage.  I want to add a little more.

It always amazes me how peeps look at something, like an actual movie or a script written by a Pro and think, "well, if they did it that way, why the fuck shouldn't I?  Why the fuck shouldn't everyone?".

Just because a Pro does something, it doesn't mean you should as well. Everything you do should be done for a reason, and that reason should be because it makes the most sense.

It's smart to listen to what peeps have to say and take in all the advice and expertise you can, but don't follow along blindly.  Don't do things that don't make sense.  It's OK to buck the system as long as what you're doing makes more sense and you believe in it 100%.

Finally, don't think for a minute that all Pro writers are great writers, or can do no wrong.  Don't watch a movie that "everyone loves" and think you have to love it as well.  March to your own beat and dance to your own tune...but do it with 100% conviction and belief in why you're marching to that beat or dancing to that tune.

Quoted from Dreamscale don't think for a minute that all Pro writers are great writers

Never a truer word spoken, Jeff.  I certainly don't think myself a great writer but I sometimes watch a movie and think, who the hell wrote this, it's complete nonsense!

Quoted from jeff but do it with 100% conviction and belief in why you're marching to that beat or dancing to that tune

I'm  going with acid or shrooms

Mark

I got slapped on the wrist TODAY infact for using the dreaded 'we see'. I dunno why but sometimes when I'm writing, it just jumps out and onto paper!

I'm trying to 'fix'. When I am reading though, 'we sees' don't bother me unless I see a lotta we sees :) tongue twister!

Anyway, I try try try to follow the rules...

For amateurs, I wouldn't recommend going down the We See road.
You're an unknown quantity, blast that cold reader with your talent, not lazy words.

That being said, when it's a paid assignment...
The guy footing the bill doesn't care if you're redundant, just good!
Besides, they'll have their own pack of pet peeves you have to adhere too! ;D

Regards,
E.D.

You're probably reading shooting scripts, Dan.

Remember you're writing a spec script and the story is key. You trying to sell that story to someone. They don't want to be taken out of the story by something like "we see" and it's redundant which others have mentioned.

On the other hand, it is possible to use when it's the best method to get your story across. There is a ton of tools out there to use to bring your story to life on the page. Its choosing the best time to use them that is the hard part, and something that most writers like myself are still trying to learn.

I don't think I've ever written "we see", but at the same time, I think only studio readers get hung up on that. From what I've been told, story is king, not your writing style...unless, a studio reader is who reads your script.

Btw, Lions Gate read my 2nd draft found footage vampire script...and they liked it!!!!!!

Quoted from Grandma Bear Btw, Lions Gate read my 2nd draft found footage vampire script...and they liked it!!!!!!

"We hear" what you're saying. ;D

Congrats. :)

Quoted from Grandma Bear Btw, Lions Gate read my 2nd draft found footage vampire script...and they liked it!!!!!!

Great news! :)

Thanks to everyone for responding to this thread. I think I fully understand why I shouldn't use the dreaded 'we see...' as well as information on how and why pros get away with it.

Thanks

It's like this -- amature writers need to avoid using "we see" because amature writers have yet to prove themselves as great writers; writers who can sell a million dollar script and have it turned into a multi million dollar film.  The amature writer must prove they can be as visual as descriptionally possible without taking shortcuts.

The pro writer can afford to be lazy for the same reason your everyday average boss is probably more lazy than his employes -- he's earned the right.

99% of the time, removing "We see" fixes the problem.

"We see a large ship hovering above the city" becomes "A large ship hovers above the city".

"We see a lightning bolts expose a decrepit mansion" becomes "Lightning bolts expose a decrepit mansion".

"We see a YOUNG GIRL running through the field" becomes "A YOUNG GIRL runs through the field".

Easy fixins, y'all. I actually can't think of a reason where you can't fix it by removing "We see".

We see them run past the field. :-)

I read or heard somewhere that the reason you see camera directions or "we see" in produced scripts is because they are getting produced and have reached that point where the director/actor is involved.

I usually don't pay it any mind except when it's used repeatedly or coupled with other phrases that tell.

"we see you in the theater with popcorn watching this movie I'm telling you about."

BLB

Quoted from Grandma Bear Btw, Lions Gate read my 2nd draft found footage vampire script...and they liked it!!!!!!

Well done Pia. Hope this goes all the way to an inked contract.

Quoted from Eoin Well done Pia. Hope this goes all the way to an inked contract.

The ff script is in pre-pro, but another company is producing it. There's a good chance there might be two sequels...   8)