Need by Curtis Rainey (ambitioniskey - Short, Drama - A young woman craves love, but as her story plays out from present to past, tragic events warp her view of what the word really means. 11 pages - pdf, format 8)


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Brought a tear to my eye. Thanks for sharing.

Hi Curtis,

I really liked this.  Crisp writing, interesting characters - I found the present to past a fascinating choice of narrative.  Not much to critique on but man, what a depressing read.

One thing – I thought this line sounded a bit funny:
KRIS
I thought her car was broke?

I did see Mark having an affair coming – I was thinking for an alternative that he could possibly die, making the love of her life vanish from her life that way, but then again – that’s not the direction you were going for with the other interwoven back-stories of Francine’s life.

Nice short, Curtis.

Curtis,

I like your writing style, very smooth and visual.  While I don’t think this is overwritten, I’d say there’s some room to trim without losing the core of the story (which if anything could make this a little easier to film).

Some of the ‘walking in on the affair’ on p.3 could be shortened. The dialogue here was a tad stock “...this isn’t what it looks like...”.  You might not even have to open the bedroom door. The scattered clothes, giggles behind a closed door etc. -- Francine’s reaction here could tell us all we need to know.

p.6 - I wouldn’t use RETURN TO SCENE here.  A mini-slug to show Mark’s location should do.  Maybe even stay in the playground and just have him intervene -- that would keep the scene flowing and save the move in location altogether.  Again, think about trimming the fight scene -- a simple punch from Mark could get the point across just as well.

A few lines that stood out:

p.4 - ‘Kris comes to a haul...’  &  p.6 - ‘ACROSS ON A THE STREET’

Not entirely sure what a ‘Hollywood wannabe’ would look like.  

p.8 ‘Lester walks in, looks over his shoulder, before he closes
the bedroom door as gently as he can.’ - Read awkwardly to me.

Not sure about the ending.  Feels like something of a disconnect between the set-up and pay-off with the sudden leap forward and assertion that it all just happened to work out. The last time we left Francine she was a damaged, drunken prostitute without any hope.

Francine’s playground reference to what she’d like to name her daughter goes some way towards this; but I’m left wondering how Abby came into the picture, how Francine died and who was the man, after all she went through, that finally gave her hope?

Hope this is of some help.  At ten pages I’ve no issue with the length, just think the story could be tightened here and there. Good luck with it.

Steve.

@Dustin

Thanks, man,  glad to hear it.  I hope that wasn't sarcasm, it didn't seem like sarcasm.  You see, I'm Sheldon Cooper when it comes to stuff like this.  But I'm sure you meant it seriously, so I'm real happy about that. :)

@Oney

Hey, dude.  Thanks for the feedback.  Glad you liked the short.  Yeah, this was my first screenplay (short) where I've written not in chronological order.  I thought it'd be an interesting way to lay the story out.  I thought the ending offered a little bit of hope, I didn't mean for it to be so depressing.  The message I wanted to present that no matter how bad life is, there is always hope.  

SPOILERS

And in this story, the hope Francine found was a child.

Yeah, Mark dying wasn't the way I wanted to go with this.  I thought it would be more tragic to have him sleep with Francine's best friend and her witness the love of her life, after all she's been through, throw it away.

Glad you enjoyed it overall, though. :). I wrote this in thirty minutes last week.

@Steve

SPOILERS

Hey Steve, glad you liked the writing.

I agree that the affair thing could be shortened.  I actually love your idea of Francine hearing everyone beyond the door.  It could save time, but still have the same effect, if not be more emotional.  I shall really consider this when doing rewrites.

I see what you're saying about the ending, too.

I wanted to leave it up to the reader to decide how Francine died.  I also wanted to leave it up to the reader to decide who the man was.  I wanted people to get the impression that maybe it was Lester, or maybe Francince found love with another man.

Thanks for the read. :)

-- Curt

PS: Oh, and thanks to Gary (hawkeye) for putting me on the right path with the log-line.  Cheers! :)

Hey Curt,

So, I had a few issues with the story as well as the writing.

Now, overall, it wasn't too bad. Depressing? Yes. Very. But I didn't feel that was much of a problem.

I liked how we kind of backtrack 7-8 years at a time, though it may be hard to convey the changes in years unless you include a SUPER each time we jump back. Between ages 18 and 30, appearance doesn't change too much, so it could be difficult to show the lapses in time without the SUPER.

My main problem was with the ending. After the final, heartbreaking flashback (when Francine is a little girl being molested), we are brought to what seems like the future when Francine is dead.

Now, her daughter Abbey -- was she a product of Lester? Or was she a product of Mark?

And the grave stone reads WIFE and MOTHER - though at age 25, I believe she's engaged to be married - she throws her ring on the floor after catching Mark with a girl, so we assume that relationship was over.

I guess I was a bit lost. How did Francine die exactly? Did she commit suicide?

We start the story in the present (her at a street corner tricking) and then we go back 3 times (7-8 years back each time) and then we cut to her grave. I felt like there was a LOT missing here.

I get that her sense of hope was her daughter, but the daughter comes so far out of left field, it feels really forced. Even with the necklace on her neck.

The ending kind of messed up the flow of the story. It felt so abrupt and forced. We are left, as an audience, to assume too much information. I'm not saying to beat us over the head with the story in a super obvious way, but provide us with some info. Maybe even have a visual of Francine with Lester lying in some cheap motel bed (after all the flashbacks in time) and have both of them dead (maybe the scotch was poisoned, I don't know, just spitballing). Then cut to the cemetery.

And also, if her daughter was a sense of hope (I can't help but assume Francine killed herself) then why would she be dead (or why would she kill herself if she had a daughter).

And the father at the end (Abby's father) - he's obscured here, we don't know who the father is. A reason behind that? Sorry, I was just thrown off by the ending and confused.

Now, onto the writing. I noticed that you CAPITALIZE a lot of things that shouldn't be. I guess you can capitalize some things to draw emphasis, but they were just random objects or actions that don't really have any significance to the overall story (I can see capitalizing the necklace at the beginning, but everything else I'm not so sure).

Also, you have way too many one-sentence paragraphs. I'm not sure why they're separated the way they are. Unless one sentence takes us to a whole another visual (or camera shot) or action, then the sentences should be together in a two to three sentence paragraph.

And if there is a beat in the action, then just use a period or a comma. You don't need to take us to another paragraph. Here's a few random notes, a few of them will show some examples of what I'm talking about.

Page 1: No need for the LATER mini slug. Intro her as she walks into the streetlight, sipping scotch, her eyes puffy from crying. Suddenly, that half of the page becomes a paragraph or two without changing a thing.

Lester's description is over written. I'm not against prose in description, but it sounds like you're trying to be too clever with the prose (which should play second fiddle to the actual story). And the prose in his description about the chins comes off as comedic, when your story is anything but. I know it's only description, but it affects the tone when reading it.

You could have just written:

The window rolls down.

LESTER (50) peeks his head out. Not exactly well put together to say the least.

Or something like that. The fact that he's picking up Francine and paying for sex all ready tells us enough.

Page 2 (top):

FRANCINE: After a few of these, we won't care. Everything will be numb.

It reads awkward. Maybe just "drink this" would say the same thing. We get that she's depressed - she's been crying and she's roaming the streets with a scotch bottle. Though with that "numb" comment, she's speaking about herself, it's not needed.

EXT. BRIDAL SHOP

Once again, no need to separate each sentence into a paragraph. And no need to CAP her name again. She's all ready been introduced. Just mention five years earlier somehow (maybe in a SUPER).

Here's what you have:

EXT. BRIDAL SHOP - DAY

FRANCINE (now 25) - exits a grimy bridal shop.

She looks much better here. Younger. Happy.

She walks down the street with a bouncy stride.

Nothing can ruin her day.

Far too much white space. There doesn't seem to be a purpose to separating these sentences into their own paragraphs. Here's how I would write it:

EXT. BRIDAL SHOP

Francine (25) exits with a smile on her face. Younger. Happier. A bounce to her step.

It's not necessary to say "nothing can ruin her day". We see she's happier. And it's just as heartbreaking when she goes from happier to catching her fiance cheating on her.

Also, no need to mention BRIDAL SHOP when it's mentioned in the SLUG. As for the "grimy" description, I'm not sure how one would picture that.

More of the same here:

INT. HOUSE - HALLWAY - CONTINUOUS

Francine enters the house.

She slips off her jacket.

She looks into a nearby mirror which hangs on a wall.

With a quick shake of the head, Francine fixes her hair.

Then, in the B.G, her eyes spot something on the stairs --

A pair of jeans...

There's really no purpose to separating these into separate paragraphs. As I've mentioned, if there's a beat in the action, a period or comma will suffice. And the action of focus doesn't seem to change enough to take us to a new paragraph.

And you don't need to tell write "She enters the house" if we all ready know we're in a house through the SLUG - INT. HOUSE - HALLWAY - CONTINUOUS. Once again, it's redundant.

Here's what I would have written:

INT. HOUSE - HALLWAY - CONTINUOUS

Francine enters and slips off her jacket. She glimpses into a nearby mirror and fixes her hair with a quick shake of the head.

But she stiffens, something catching her eye through the mirror. She turns and spots something on the stairs - a pair of jeans.

I'm not quite sure why you CAPITALIZE the word BLANKETS or THE DOOR OPENS. You draw enough emphasis on it just by writing it. Now, if the DOOR CREAKS OPEN or makes a noise, then you can CAPITALIZE it (it's kind of a rule to CAP all noises not human, eg. objects).

And then you CAP verbs like SHOVES and PULLS. I don't see the significance here.

Page 4: Not sure about the Hollywood wannabe line of description. It's not general enough to paint a clear picture IMO.

Page 5: Why cap GRABS?

Page 6: Why cap KNEES and PUNCHES?

Page 8: Again, the one sentence paragraphs.

KITCHEN

Where she pours herself some more Scotch.

Francine watches, decides its best she leaves.

So, she hops off the sofa and exits the living room.

As she walks away, her arms sway back and forth.

They’re riddled with bruises...

No sense in keeping these separated. And when Francine leaves the couch, she is in the act of deciding to leave. So there's no need to tell us "Francine watches, decides it's best she leaves" - and then you take us to a new paragraph which is only a continuation of her action.

KITCHEN

She refills her glass with Scotch.

Francine watches and grows uncomfortable. She hops off the sofa and leaves. Black and blue bruises marking her arms.

See, when the action changes or we are focusing on something else THEN move onto the next paragraph.

INT. FRANCINE’S PARENTS HOUSE - FRANCINE’S ROOM - CONTINUOUS

Francine’s room is tiny and less than basic.

Just a bed and a TV and a box filled with clothes.

No need to say "Francine's room". We know we're in there.

Tiny. Nearly empty. A bed, TV and a box filled overflowing with clothes.

Francine is asleep in bed when THE DOOR OPENS.

Lester walks in, looks over his shoulder, before he closes the bedroom door as gently as he can.

He takes off his coat, it falls to the floor.

He stumbles across to Francine’s bed. He takes a seat at the edge.

Francine lies sound asleep.

A sliver of light peeks in as the DOOR CREAKS OPEN - Lester sneaks in and quietly shuts the door behind him.

He removes his coat and drops it to the floor as he tiptoes to the bed. He plops down onto the edge, beside Francine.

Overall, it wasn't bad, though I felt the writing could improve and the story needed more answers to things. The ending feels so random and unearned.

Looking forward to checking out a re-write as I think the story is strong enough to merit a rewrite.

-- Michael

Hey there, Michael.  I'm ONLY just after commenting on your most recent short, and you did on mine?!  It was fate, fate I 'tell 'ye!  Or maybe just my Irish luck or something or, yea... lol.

I'm glad you didn't mind the read was depressing.  I, too, don't mind it.  

I personally believe that between the ages of 18 and 30 appearance changes a lot.  People gain weight, they change their appearance themselves... I didn't want to "SUPER" all this information of jumping backwards.  I, personally, like it when a writer leaves it up to a reader to decide certain things.  You mentioned, I think, that I left to many things open.

Maybe I need to work on that.  Work on leaving things up to the reader to interpret too much, it's just something I do.

SPOILERS

Okay.  The ending.  This is the way I wrote the ending.  I wrote the ending, purposefully, to be ambiguous.  I wanted people to get two vibes.

The 1st) Francine found love again with someone new.  She had a daughter.  Gave the daughter her dream name.  And eventually died.

The 2nd) Abby was the product of rape from Lester.  Lester was the "voice" off-screen.  And even though Francine found hope from Abby, she still could not bring herself to live in a world attached to Lester.

That was how I imagined it.  That is how I interpret it.  In one of those ways.  Maybe it was too silly or selfish of me to expect an audience to make those assumptions regarding the story.  I don't know.  I value your opinion, though.

I shall fix the CAPS thing.  I tend to CAPS things that I would want a camera to focus on, if this were to be shot.  There's no need for it.  So, I shall work on it.

Ah -- lines and paragraphs.  See, this is where style of writing comes into play.  For the short few years I've been interested in a career in screenwriting (I'm only 16) I have somehow developed this thing where I write in lines, rather than squish things into paragraphs of block writing.

I don't know.  The three users before you who commented didn't pass comment on the lines being out on there own.  I guess, it's just something I am so USED to doing.  I have been writing like that for ages, and it's something I can't shake.  I'm not sure though, whether it is incorrect formatting/layout in the world of screenwriting.  We'll just have to agree to disagree on that one, it's just the way I write.  If this gets more reads, and more people point it out, then maybe I'll have to rethink my whole style of lay-out/writing when it comes to writing screenplays.

I agree that some of what you pointed out can be shortened and there are some redundant lines that would be cut, so if I do rewrite this (which won't be anytime soon because of school exams and work and other stuff) I shall deffo consider everything you've pointed out in the review.

Hope I've replied to everything, and glad you didn't hate it.  Thanks for the review! :D

-- Curt

You're only 16! Wow, kudos to you, buddy, when I was 16, I was high on who knows what lying in a pile of my own filth while playing video games :) I was working on scripts here and there, but you're light years ahead of where I was at. Good for you, dude!

I'm not saying what you've written needs to be written the way I would do it, but I just feel the way a script is written and formatted (down to minor details such as the one's I have mentioned) need to have some kind of purpose.

I, myself, hate big chunks of action blocks, but one sentence paragraphs provide too much white space for personal taste. I get what you're saying with seeing things as a film, a series of shots (I like to write my action like that too, but differently obviously)... but yeah, agree to disagree I suppose.

I've been through so many phases as a writer over the years, especially with writing action. After writing for a few producers who wanted me to write more prose and be more descriptive, I sort of adapted that style for awhile... and then some other producers told me that I wrote too much prose and it makes for a longer read (which is a no-no when a busy producer/investor with a short attention span gets a hold of your script).

IMO there is a basic set of rules, but everything else is flexible depending on a writer's style or what is requested by a producer/director/investor. So, I'm not saying your way is completely wrong, but I do however respectfully disagree with it.

Thankfully, you're not a habitual over-writer (though some things are redundant and can be trimmed) which makes for an easy read.

Cheers buddy.

-- Michael

Yeah, you should have seen me at 13/14!  I was writing Scream and Friday the 13th fan-fiction on Microsoft Word, hadn't got the slightest clue about writing screenplays, lol.  

I understand what you're saying.  I agree that the way a script is written and formatted need to have purpose.  Hopefully I learned more as I read and grow.

I also hate big chunks of writing, too.  Maybe that is also where my line writing stems from?  I don't know, I personally don't see a big problem with the white and the way it's laid out, so I guess maybe it does come down to person opinion on that matter.

Ah, that must be hell!  I used to write screenplays filled with metaphors and, basically, like novels or something.  But yea, more basic now, haha!  I agree also that every bit of space on the page is valuable to a producer and there's no point wasting it with lots of prose.)

I respect that your respectfully disagree with it, at least we have a merry understanding! :D

I used to be a habitual over-writer, but then I found this site, and I've learned from it.

"Cheers to 'ye too 'lad" as we would say here :)

-- Curt

Quoted from AmbitionIsKey Yeah, you should have seen me at 13/14!  I was writing Scream and Friday the 13th fan-fiction on Microsoft Word, hadn't got the slightest clue about writing screenplays, lol.

That is so funny.  I was the same way.

I won the Halloween: 25 Years of Terror DVD in a fan-fic screenwriting contest. haha

I also read "A Perfect Day" a while back and remember liking it, despite some flaws.

I opened this yesterday and browsed through it just to check out how it looked writing wise.  Looked clean, but I think I totally glanced over your name as the author and maybe that's why I neglected to actually read it in the first place.

I'll have to look at this soon.  Going out to shoot some pool for now....


Later.

Curt,

a part of what worked for me with this story is your ability to draw us into Francine’s world and in doing so make us care about her, and her future.  In some respects, leaving the audience to decide kind of robs us of the moment Francine 'discovers' that hope and turns her life around.  Feel like I was left with questions in place of closure.  

Anyways, just to say, I hope it’s not Lester.  I really hope it’s not Lester...    :-/

Steve.

@Reaper

Wow.  Really?  As cheesy as it sounds I'd still be real proud of that!  My fan-fictions never won anything, lol.  But yea, I wrote a Scream 5 and then a sequel to that Scream 6 and then a Friday The 13th remake.  I never tackled Michael Myers, even though I've always wanted too.  I've always wanted to write a sequel to Resurrection making up for how crappy it was, lol.

Yea, APD had a few flaws, I appreciate the read, though.  Any feedback is good feedback, right?

Hope you enjoyed pool, and anticipate your thoughts. :)

@Steve

I'm glad you thought I was able to draw you into Francine's world.  I'm already thinking of a few, better, happier endings that are less obscure that I could go with.  

Personally, I don't think it's Lester too.  I believe she found her happiness, and died a happy woman.

-- Curt

EDIT: (Just whipped together a graphic for this, seeing as I had some spare time before studying.) :)

Hey Curt.

It's a really neat idea here. and another good drama with a powerful, albeit depraved, story you've come up with.  (Yes, I understand the irony that I'm bringing up the issue of depravity.)    ********SPOILERS********  It's sick that a molested young girl grows up to continue to bang her step-dad and fall in love with him and have his baby.  Yes, it's depraved, but still powerful and I'll even go a step further to say that this has probably happened in real life.  (INSERT WOODY ALLEN JOKE HERE.)

But, even though it's a very powerful story, it's not going to be able to be pulled off onscreen as it is, and it's because of the time jumps.

There's nothing wrong with going backwards.  In my script 'God's Empty Acre' which got filmed as 'Girl(s)', (the link's in my sig), I do the same thing.  I tell the story backwards.  I even used the baby's name as a cool device to play with the time jumps.  :-)  I loved that part by the way, Francine about to say A- and then her future daughter is named Abby.

In your screenplay, it'll work fine because we the reader can see the ages and do the math and everything'll add up nice and tidy.  (It even adds up that Lester is the father, even though you tried to disguise that at the end.)

But, on film, the audience won't have that same connection.  They'll get the idea that the story's going backwards, but they won't know that Francine is 30 in the first scene and 25 in the next and 18.  And those ages are important to know because of the date on her tombstone at the end.

Like I said, I'm of the opinion that the script reads fine, but when this gets filmed you will lose and confuse the audience and you'll lose a lot of the power of the story.  I'm not saying exactly to put Supers in there or anything, but something needs to be done to get those exact time jumps done ONSCREEN.

And I'm not speaking as someone who just disagrees with the story.  You know that's not the case because I said I liked it.  I'm speaking as someone who's gone through this EXACT thing with my backwards screenplay.

Now, in 'Girl(s)', everything comes together and the audience figures it out at the end.  But it is a bit confusing in the first couple scenes and from what I witnessed with the audience who saw it, they were confused and those first few scenes, which were powerful as hell, the power was lost because they were trying to figure out what was going on.

I'm just warning you with my own experience...  it looks great on paper, but it will get confusing onscreen and you will lose a lot of the power with the audience in the process.


I guess another issue I could bring up is leaving the story up to the reader to decide.  As you see, in my response to you, Lester ends up being the love of her life.  That's just how it is.  Lester IS the father and the love of her life.  That's how, with all the dates and everything, I came up with the ending.  If you didn't want me to have that idea, you should've ended it yourself, or put in another scene when she's 36 and with somebody else.

:-)  As you can tell, I'm not a big fan of when writers let the audience finish their story for them.

But I liked this one a lot, Curt, save the issues I brought up.  It's a powerful story, and hopefully you can come up with a way to get this onscreen without a lot of the emotion getting lost in the confusion.

- Mark

Hey Mark, thanks for checking this out man, really appreciate it. :)

Glad you found the story powerful.  I agree that because of the time jumps this would be very difficult to pull off on screen.  Though it'd be nice to have this filmed, this was not the intention.  I wrote this, like, within an hour and took a few minutes to clean it up just last week.

Yes, this was my first attempt at playing something backwards (even though that's scene is a huge jump forward), I just thought revering the order would turn it into something different, and I enjoyed the way I did it.  And glad you picked up on the Abby thing, as if it was really that hard to decipher anyways, haha. :P

What about if, in a revised draft, every time we visit Francine it's one of her birthdays?  And I have a character mention her age, or maybe, for example when she's 10 I have her drawing a picture of a birthday cake with 10 candles on it, or something.  Just in every scene I do something physical, whether it be in the actions or the dialogue, so that the audience KNOW what age Francine is?  Do you think that'd be a good idea?

Yea, for some reason I like leaving the reader to deciding.  You think Lester was the father, and Francine found love with him.  But, I also wanted people to interpret the ending, that she found love with another man, had a baby, and died.  I understand entirely though that I can't just assume a audience will come to one of those assumptions and I already have a new idea on how to end this, with a much more solid ending.

Overall, I am real real happy you liked the story.  And I appreciate so much your feedback, regarding the filming thing.  I love how, at one point you stated, "...but when this gets filmed..." -- wow Mark, you have so much faith in me, haha. :P I was reading your comment thinking, "Wow, Mark thinks this is going to get filmed, he keeps mentioning it, he must have enjoyed it." :P

But, joking (or seriousness? Lol) aside, thanks so much!  My next short, "When It Was Bliss", which I am half-way done with, I'm taking much more time.  It has three people, it's a drama, and it plays out much more simpler and less confusing. :)

-- Curt

Nope I wasn't being sarcastic.

Well, thanks then Dustin, I appreciate the read.  If there's anything else you found about it, please let me know.

I think I have a solid idea for a re-write in my head now, it's just getting off my ass to stop being lazy to write it. :)

Still, hope to get more feedback with this version, mostly on the story.


- Curt

I would find the back-tracking from paper to film kind of easy to do -- and to understand.  Make-up, hair color -- plus the dialogue you have with Francine and Kris about Cindy right after Francine discovers the affair, helps a lot.  I think it would be pretty easy to convey.

I'm interested in the idea of this as a feature... it's definitely sad, depressing, and a real tale of someone getting the shitty end of the stick.  Are there ideas to expand or will it remain a short?

Hey Reaper,

I'm glad you think so.  I think so too, but I guess difficulties could arise, possibly, like Mark pointed out.  But I'm happy you think it'd be easy to convey on-screen.

Hmm.  A feature?  That has come to mind.

I wrote this just as an idea I had in my head, I was in the drama-writing mood for some reason.  It took me about half an hour, and then mayube an hour to get it fixed up.

I think this could work as a feature.  I think as a feature, it'd be powerful and easy to film.  Maybe when school is done I might consider turning this into a feature if it got enough positive feedback. :)

Thanks Reaper for the read, let me know if I can return it.

-- Curt

Well, I did have a thread up asking for exchanges.... where were you then? :P

Haha, it's cool.  I got feedback from some really great people here.  

I'm starting a new draft, and I'm submitting it to BlueCat.

You should re-write Need yourself and try for the shorts submission.  8)

Curt,

Pretty good read. I loved the structure and content. I'm a sucker for dark material. If I had to point out something that needs improvement I would say you may want to tighten up some of the dialogue and narrative description.

For the most part it's fine but I think you could shorten it a tad and get the same effect. Just seems like you're overreaching, but I still didn't find it to be that big of a deal.

Also, I noticed a few spelling errors. You may want to proofread.  

Again, good work. I look forward to reading more of your material. Keep at it!

@Reaper

Cool, well if you ever need a read, shoot me up. :)  Not literally though, that'd be sad, lol.

Wish you look with BlueCat.  I actually wrote this with the intentions of maybe submitting to BlueCat, I need to polish it up a little first though, maybe.  

@Corey

Hey Corey,

Thanks for the read.  Glad you enjoyed.  I guess I agree about some of the dilaogue, I could easily cut some of that down, thanks for pointing it out.

Hmm, I didn't notice any spelling errors...

Thanks, anyways, appreciate the read. :)

-- Curt

I've been contacted by a film-maker in France, regarding the possibility of filming and producing this!!!

He just wants to build his portfolio.  I've e-mailed him back, asked questions et cetera, and hopefully he gets back to me soon.  I've asked to see some of his prior film-work, if he even has any.  Hopefully this guy is talented.

Finally, maybe I'll have a writing credit!  Not getting my hopes up, though, trying to stay cool. :)

-- Curt

Congrats, dude! Crossing my fingers for ya!

-- Michael

Thanks man, I really hope this one works out.

I had someone contact me before about one of my shorts, but it was one e-mail, and then she never replied, which was sad, haha.  But you have to take it on the chin.

OVERALL this has been a really, really, really exciting week for me! :)  I owe it all to this site!

-- Curt

Story-wise, "for the writing of a sixteen year old" this is good.   A whole lot better than I ever could've done at that age.   It's got flaws, but what doesn't?  Might wanna consider cleaning it up and send it off to competitions.


Best of luck with it.

EDIT:  Figured I'd better calrify what I mean by saying it's got flaws.   In a nutshell, it's overwritten.   If need be, I can provide examples, but I'm willing to bet by looking at it in hindsight you can see where the problems are.

Hey Michael,

Thanks very much for the read, glad you thought it was good.  Yeah, I agree it has flaws; I’m going to work on a much shorter draft.  With less flaws.  The guy who wants to produce and film this says he really liked the ending so I think I shall keep the ending the same.

Since this is basically going to be produced by someone (not commercially) is it against rules to continue to submit it to competitions? (open question to everyone).

Anyways, thanks M.  Happy you liked it.

-- Curt

Ah, I didn't know it was getting produced.   Hopefully the filmmaker does a good job.   It's gonna take some serious skills.   Yeah, you can still submit it to comps.

Hey Curtis, I got to say I nearly stopped before I started on this when I noticed your email address.  Please tell me the mufc part isn't reference to man united?

Anyway the story...

I think you could trim a couple of pages off this by working on the format.  There are a lot of action lines that could and should be grouped.

Is Cindy that Francine talks about on the swing the same Cindy that cheats with Francine's boyfriend?  The age gap between the friends seems too big.  Francine is 18 and Cindy would be 12?  Plus you say Cindy drives so I'm guessing it's a different girl but having them with the same name is rather confusing.

I liked the story very much right up until the final scene which left me with a confused look on my face.  Francine died aged 44, so I'm wondering what happen from her being a drunken 30 year old to becoming a mother and wife.  I have to guess she got her life together but then I wonder with who?  I think if you ended with the previous scene it shows how Francine became the person you showed at the start and makes her meeting with Lester even more sickening.  It also concludes the story better than leaving it with questions of what happened to Francine in her final 14 years.

Good effort, Curtis.

Hey Curt,

Another solid job. The writing was good. Especially for sixteen. Damn good! It still needs a bit of a clean up in some parts that others have pointed out but it didn't take away from the story at all.

I liked how you went backwards in the story showing the struggles Francine endured. I see you mentioned that Lester was the father and he was the one who was with Abbey at Francine's gravesite. Could we have a part two coming our way. This time it's Abbey's struggle with Lester. Maybe Abbey seeks revenge for Francine's death. Just saying. Give the readers what they want! lol.

- Dirk

And Congrats on possibly getting this filmed! Well done!

@Allfy

The e-mail was made by me in 2005 by my brother, who supported that team yes, lol.  However, I have that e-mail registered to so many things that I don't want to create a new one, it'd be too much hassle, haha.  I myself don't follow football, or watch any sport really (tennis the odd time, but neve football.)

I have a new draft written.  The story is shortened up and a page was cut from the script, it's now down to 8 and a half pages.

Yes, that Cindy is the same girl.  In the new draft (which I will post Friday) the scene when Cindy and Mark get caught has been reworked and changed so it'd be easier to film, thanks to some suggestions from guys on here.

I wanted people to have their own opinion on the ending, so I am glad you enjoyed this overall. :)

@Dirk

Hey Dirk,

Thanks for the compliment.  I've been put down harshly in the past on other forums about my writing being childish and bad, so I'm glad that isn't the case on here.

Glad you liked the backwards idea of the story, it was new to me.  I didn't really mention that Lester WAS the guy at the cemetery with Abby... HOWEVER that is a possibility.  I also wanted people to come to the conclusion that Francince got away from Lester and that the man was different...

I think, however, making the guy Lester would be way more powerful story.

Not sure about a PART 2, since the ending is set in concrete on who the person is, but it is always a possibility... :)

Thanks so much for the read, really appreciate it.

And thanks!  Yeah, the guy David is going to shoot this in Orlando, so I'm hoping he pulls it off well. :)

-- Curt

A contract has been signed, and both I and the film-maker have come to an official agreement. :)

So stoked!

This is going to be filmed and produced! :)

-- Curt

Congrats! Great news!

Quoted from AmbitionIsKey Since this is basically going to be produced by someone (not commercially) is it against rules to continue to submit it to competitions? (open question to everyone).

While you may find an occasional competition that says otherwise, the answer is generally no.  Scripts that have been optioned, sold or are under production are not accepted in competitions.

Read the rules for the competition.


Phil

But it's not getting produced "commercially" as Curt put it.  Which I'm guessing means it's not gonna be much of a grand production.    It's better he shop it around to comps and get more irons in the fire, IMO.  

If it's being produced, it's being produced.  There's no wiggle room with this.  I had this problem with Not Even Death; I was nearly disqualified from the comp because it was produced by film students... without my permission.

Curt, read the rules of the competition.  If you have any doubt, contact the competition organizers.


Phil

Congrats Curt! Let us know how it goes.

Most competitions, from the research I did online, don't allow entries from screenplays that have already been produced.

However, there were some I seen that was not the case.

And thanks, Corey.  I'm so excited. :)

Just wanted to inform you guys an edited, revised version is up.  I was meant to post this three days ago, but slipped out of my mind.  I cut it down it down by one page, changed one scene for more emotional impact (make it easier to film), but overall it's still the same, only much tighter, more visual, it's sort of like a shooting draft, but not really.

The director likes this version and doesn't think it needs any more changes, so he's happy to shoot this version. :D

-- Curt

Hi Curt,

- I liked the story
- How you kinda tell it backwards
- I like Francine
- I would tell you that dead people don't talk, but then I remembered that in a script anything can happen.

Keep Writing :)

-- Chris

Hey Chris,

Glad you liked the short.  Thanks for the read. :)

-- Curt

Hey Curt,

I read this the other day, but unfortunately didn't get round to posting my feedback before I went away for the weekend.

As with your other work, this was a well written, emotion-evoking piece. And overall, I liked it.

My issues weren't with the story itself, but how you chose to tell it.

I've always viewed the reverse-structure as a little cliched, because I've seen it used numerous times by filmmakers as a way to merely break the rules for the sake of it, and the reverse-structure adds nothing to the story; in fact, the story could hit the exact same emotional beats had it been told conventionally.

I have also seen it used successfully.

The times the reverse-structure has been used successfully has been in instances when something at the end of the story (well, I guess it would actually be the 'beginning' of the story; but the I mean when something is revealed in the final scene) which then changes the whole story. For example, the whole reveal in Memento about what Guy Pierce has actually been spending the whole movie doing.

Now, whilst I think you are on the right lines with the whole step-dad reveal, I think you need to find a way to make this pack more of a punch. Maybe if you show a scene where Francine tries to leave Lester, tries to make him stop, and he says something like “no-one else will ever love you.” I feel that if you do something like this, it will make the fact that she ends up with Lester again at the end that bit more emotionally poignant.

I also felt that the ending of this was a tad bit too ambiguous, as it left more questions than answers.

But all in all, as I said in the start, I liked this one.

I'd just rethink the story slightly, as I feel that you can further exploit how you have chosen to structure your story.

And how is These Dysfunctional Summers coming along, as well? I look forward to reading the rest of that when you're done.

All the best, man.

Toby.

Hey curt,

Fantastically depressing story you've written and written it well I may add.

I liked the fact the story is told backwards and you really drew me into Francine's world.

I would have liked to see the guy at the end as the last image I got of her life on page 1 was Lester, I'd hope she did a lot better.

Congrats on getting this produced as well.

Michael

Toby,

The reason I chose the reverse structure was because it was something I had never attempted and I personally believe it is a very artistic way to tell a story, and so also didn't want Lester's relationship with Francine to be revealed right away.

Obviously though, some people aren't going to love the reversing aspect but I wanted to give it a try.

And since I no longer own full rights to the script, I cannot make changes to it without the directors approval.  I'm glad you liked the script overall.

Hey tricky,

Thanks for the read!

And the comments.  Understand what you said, but I like the ambiguity of the ending, even though I know it might not be enough for some. :P

-- Curt

Wow curt, powerful stuff here. Loved how it went back in time. Neatly written, crisp short and sweet descriptions. you paint a fairly sour picture here, which of course was your intention. Really good piece, maybe your best.
The only line I didn't like was when Cindy says "don't tell francine" don't think you needed that.
-Gav

Hey Gav :)

Glad you enjoyed the backwards telling of the story. It was my first attempt at telling a story backwards fully (not including the end scene, which is a big jump forward).

The intention was indeed a sour one.  I don't consider this a rather happy story, but one that does need to be told, because sadly this story mirrors the lives of many woman/little girls out there.  I would also consider this my best writing.

Will consider the advice regarding the line Cindy speaks, thanks though for the read, really appreciate it.  

-- Curt

Hey Curt, surprised I never saw this before,a s you've gotten a ton of feedback...which I haven't really read, so apologies if I rehash anything.

I'll just comment on your writing and the story and try to keep it simple.

The most simple comment I can make is that I liked both the story and the writing, although both can use alot of improvement.

Story

It works in an odd way, actually.  It's an interesting and aggressive approach to tell this tale the way you did.  For me, though, it's one of those situations where it's overblown at every turn - it's too dark, too depressing, and just too many ugly things at every turn.

Are we really to believe that Lester, her Step Father was first molesting her, then paying to bang her when she's walking the streets, and finally married to her and the father of her daughter?  For me, that's going too far.

The end was definitely ambiguous and I appreciate that kind of move, but I'm not sure it fit in with the feel you had going throughout.

Writing

Pretty good most of the time and you do show a flair or talent in some ways that you write, but for me, there are lots of easy to fix issues.

You have a tendency to repeat your Slug in your opening line, which is always a waste.  You also have a tendency to use too many words, or really, many of your sentences should end 2 or 3 words before they actually do.  I also think you use too many descriptors or adjectives.

I think you could very easily tell this exact same story with identical dialogue and shave off at least a full page.  No big deal, but it's often the little things that set scripts and writers apart.

So, all in all, I did enjoy this for what it is.  I think it can be cleaned up quite a bit and if I were you, I'd rethink the ending.

Good job, Curt!

Quoted from Dreamscale Hey Curt, surprised I never saw this before, as you've gotten a ton of feedback...which I haven't really read, so apologies if I rehash anything. I'll just comment on your writing and the story and try to keep it simple. The most simple comment I can make is that I liked both the story and the writing, although both can use alot of improvement. Story It works in an odd way, actually.  It's an interesting and aggressive approach to tell this tale the way you did.  For me, though, it's one of those situations where it's overblown at every turn - it's too dark, too depressing, and just too many ugly things at every turn. Are we really to believe that Lester, her Step Father was first molesting her, then paying to bang her when she's walking the streets, and finally married to her and the father of her daughter?  For me, that's going too far. The end was definitely ambiguous and I appreciate that kind of move, but I'm not sure it fit in with the feel you had going throughout. Writing Pretty good most of the time and you do show a flair or talent in some ways that you write, but for me, there are lots of easy to fix issues. You have a tendency to repeat your Slug in your opening line, which is always a waste.  You also have a tendency to use too many words, or really, many of your sentences should end 2 or 3 words before they actually do.  I also think you use too many descriptors or adjectives. I think you could very easily tell this exact same story with identical dialogue and shave off at least a full page.  No big deal, but it's often the little things that set scripts and writers apart. So, all in all, I did enjoy this for what it is.  I think it can be cleaned up quite a bit and if I were you, I'd rethink the ending. Good job, Curt!

Hey man!

As for your comments regarding the story, I see where you're coming from.  I do agree that when you look at this as a whole it may be a little too contrived in places.  However, I think it works, for me personally as the writer.  I'm in a contract with the director and I no longer own full rights to the short, so I'm unsure on whether this far into it I can change things now.

As for your comments regarding the writing --

"You have a tendency to repeat your Slug in your opening line, which is always a waste." -- I totally agree with this.  I've actually noticed this, I don't think it's a HUGE deal, but deffo something I could work on.  

About the adjectives, others have also pointed this out to me, but I think that's just my own personal style of writing.

Glad you enjoyed this as a whole, though.  My aim was just to write a short indie-feel, dark drama.  I hope you stick around and check out the movie whenever it makes it to screen.  Really appreiciate your feedback, so thanks for taking the time to read!

-- Curt

So, just found out the director will be filming this on a Canon T3i.  So the quality shall be amazing and be real film quality! :)

-- Curt

Curt,

The T3i is a very decent camera indeed. Do you know how much stuff the director has shot before on DSLRs? The reason I ask is because from my own experience, filming on DSLRs is a completely different kettle of fish than filming on bigger models. If he hasn't used DSLRs much before, direct him my way and I'll point him towards some information that really helped me and my friends out when we first started using a 5D.

But that being said, one of my favourite YouTube filmmakers does amazing things with a T3i (I'll PM you the link), so I'm looking forward to the results your guys can get.

Any news on a production schedule?

Shit.  Just retread the message.  I got it mixed up.  His last camera was the t3i, and now apparently he's shooting using a Canon 2 5D.  This is all gobbledeegoook to me lol.

He owns his own company and he shoots weddings, videos, short films, features.  He's currently working on something to do with a runway show and from th images I've seen on his Facebook page it looks great!

I've also seen one of the music videos he's produced in Haiti.  And the quality blew me away because I wasn't expecting it to be that good, but it was.  And apparently that video was shot with a the t3i so I can only imagine what Need will look like on his new stuff. :)

As for production, he's pretty busy at the moment with the runway fashion shoot thing he's working on.  He says he's aiming to begin shooting at the end of July, when the weather is nice and perfect in Orlando.

He also plans to cast soon.  He lives in a part of Orlando that is in the black community. :)  He says it might be hard to find a white actress, he shall be looking for white actors first, and if not then black/dark skinned.  Which I don't mind.  I didn't give any of th characters a specific skin tone and I have no preference as long as the acting is okay.

-- Curt

Hi Curt,

It seems you've come quite a way in your short time here on SS. Your hard work is paying off. We're starting to get some incredibly powerful and thought-provoking stories from you, which is great to see. Keep up the good work.

I was always going to like this, no matter how it was written. I tend to go for stories like this and I regret not getting around to it sooner. What a brilliant little story you have going on here, told in such a perfect little way. Love the non-linear structure, travelling backwards in time. The way you reveal subtle aspects is perfect and almost everything is relevant to the story. You foreshadow like a master.

The story got to me. I've noticed I've been becoming a lot more sensitive to stories recently (I cried with Monsters Inc. for crying out loud!) so maybe that's why I enjoyed this so much. It's a story about real people, with real issues and real resolutions. And hope. Those are the stories that work and yes, bring tears to the eye. I've discovered a new-found respect for your writing. Outstanding potential in this short.

So I haven't read through all the comments, so I apologize if I am beating a dead horse and repeating anything that has already been said. The writing could use a little improvement in a few places. It mostly comes with the dialogue, where I think the phrasing of the words could come across a little better. I understand this is being filmed, so maybe what I have to say is a little redundant.

"You know what, I'm sick of this." - I see this sort of thing all the time and I've never understood why people write some lines like this. I understand how you might want the line to come across, but I would word it like this, just to make it come out a little clearer: "You know what? I'm sick of this." Perhaps it's just me.

"You're spending too much time with Cindy, what am I now?" Same issue as above. Combining two sentences into one just doesn't work for me. I know where you're trying to go with impact, but these sort of lines fall short with me.

"I've went through enough shit." - Perhaps try "I've gone through..." You might be trying to show that she's not exactly educated, but even so I've never heard anyone talk like this.

Some minor things come with some of your description as well. I know you're getting produced, so you can't change them now, but for future writing there are a few things I would suggest.

"But Mark throws another stronger punch" - I don't know it just reads weirdly to me. Perhaps try "Mark throws another strong punch" or Mark throws a stronger punch." Those suggestions are just to make it read a little better.

There are places where the writing lacks consistency. Again, this is nothing too serious, but your use of italics and underlining kinda annoyed me. Is there any reason why you used both techniques? If not, I would suggest sticking to one or the other. Using both suggests that there may be different connotations to words underlined as opposed to those in italics. To me, they both emphasize what the character is saying, so why not just use one?

The ending for me was a little abrupt. I know you're getting this produced so what I have to say won't be worth much, but I thought I may as well throw some suggestions at you, just in case. I'm a little confused as to why you would end with this ABBY girl? I've had a quick look at some comments and she appears to be the daughter of your protag. While ending with Abby, you have essentially opened your potential audience up to a lot of confusion. Guaranteed they are going to wonder who this girl is and how she has any relevance to the story. Perhaps you could have revealed the gravestone with a name on it? That would set up for a little clarity.

I also think stories like this need a definitive sad or happy ending. In this one, it's a little on the fence. Did she find love, or not? It's all just a little too vague for my liking and I know it would nag at me for ages if I had watched the film. Perhaps I'm the only one who didn't get it. Who knows.

All that put aside, I'll reiterate what I said at the start of my review. This story is enough to have me sold on your writing ability. It truly is a touching tale, that deserves its recent recognition. Congrats on getting an offer on this one. That's great to see.

Cheers,

Dan

Quoted Text Hi Curt, It seems you've come quite a way in your short time here on SS. Your hard work is paying off. We're starting to get some incredibly powerful and thought-provoking stories from you, which is great to see. Keep up the good work.

Aww, thanks Dan.  That means a lot.  I hope my hard work is paying off!  So many good things have happened to me as a result of this board, I cannot thank the site and the community here enough!

Quoted Text I was always going to like this, no matter how it was written. I tend to go for stories like this and I regret not getting around to it sooner. What a brilliant little story you have going on here, told in such a perfect little way. Love the non-linear structure, travelling backwards in time. The way you reveal subtle aspects is perfect and almost everything is relevant to the story. You foreshadow like a master.

Wow, thanks again, Dan.  Means a lot that you liked it that much.  Yea, this was my first time using the non-linear structure, and I'm glad people like it!  Glad you caught the foreshadowing!

Quoted Text The story got to me. I've noticed I've been becoming a lot more sensitive to stories recently (I cried with Monsters Inc. for crying out loud!) so maybe that's why I enjoyed this so much. It's a story about real people, with real issues and real resolutions. And hope. Those are the stories that work and yes, bring tears to the eye. I've discovered a new-found respect for your writing. Outstanding potential in this short.

Glad the story got to you.  I'd say out of all my shorts this one handles the most dark emotional subjects that deffo leave you affected.  It's a story that needs to be told, and sadly, this mirrors a lot of people's real lives.  Don't be ashamed either, I cried at Monsters Inc. too!  Poor Boo!

Quoted Text So I haven't read through all the comments, so I apologize if I am beating a dead horse and repeating anything that has already been said.

Apology not accepted!!!!!!  Haha, lol I kid.  Poor horsey :(. Anti-animal abuser here!

Quoted Text The writing could use a little improvement in a few places. It mostly comes with the dialogue, where I think the phrasing of the words could come across a little better. I understand this is being filmed, so maybe what I have to say is a little redundant. "You know what, I'm sick of this." - I see this sort of thing all the time and I've never understood why people write some lines like this. I understand how you might want the line to come across, but I would word it like this, just to make it come out a little clearer: "You know what? I'm sick of this." Perhaps it's just me. "You're spending too much time with Cindy, what am I now?" Same issue as above. Combining two sentences into one just doesn't work for me. I know where you're trying to go with impact, but these sort of lines fall short with me.

I see what you're saying about the sentences.  I've been working on that a lot, hopefully you notice in my latest short as you're not the first to point it out. :P

Quoted Text "I've went through enough shit." - Perhaps try "I've gone through..." You might be trying to show that she's not exactly educated, but even so I've never heard anyone talk like this.

People here in Ireland would talk like that, haha.  Either way, I'll let the director know that this line is to be changed, as I do want the dialogue to come off as realistic.

Quoted Text Some minor things come with some of your description as well. I know you're getting produced, so you can't change them now, but for future writing there are a few things I would suggest. "But Mark throws another stronger punch" - I don't know it just reads weirdly to me. Perhaps try "Mark throws another strong punch" or Mark throws a stronger punch." Those suggestions are just to make it read a little better. There are places where the writing lacks consistency. Again, this is nothing too serious, but your use of italics and underlining kinda annoyed me. Is there any reason why you used both techniques? If not, I would suggest sticking to one or the other. Using both suggests that there may be different connotations to words underlined as opposed to those in italics. To me, they both emphasize what the character is saying, so why not just use one?

I noticed the italics/underlined thing too in the dialogue at times.  Consider it fixed.  Will be sending a slightly cleaner version now to the director, even though I don't think it'll make a difference on screen, but anyway...

Quoted Text The ending for me was a little abrupt. I know you're getting this produced so what I have to say won't be worth much, but I thought I may as well throw some suggestions at you, just in case. I'm a little confused as to why you would end with this ABBY girl? I've had a quick look at some comments and she appears to be the daughter of your protag. While ending with Abby, you have essentially opened your potential audience up to a lot of confusion. Guaranteed they are going to wonder who this girl is and how she has any relevance to the story. Perhaps you could have revealed the gravestone with a name on it? That would set up for a little clarity. I also think stories like this need a definitive sad or happy ending. In this one, it's a little on the fence. Did she find love, or not? It's all just a little too vague for my liking and I know it would nag at me for ages if I had watched the film. Perhaps I'm the only one who didn't get it. Who knows.

You're not the only one who was iffy on the ending.   Lots of people liked it, others didn't.  It's the part of the script that's given me the most hassle, but in the end, the director told me the ending and ambiguity was his favourite part.  And I personally lovr the ending too.  However, I appreciate your feedback on it, Dan!

Yes, you're right, Abby is her daughter.

I think most will get that she's Francine's daughter, because of her dialogue, and the foreshadowing in the middle about Franince and what she wanted to name her daughter.

In the first draft of the script, I had what the gravestone said.  But the draft your reading is a more of a shooting draft.  And the director can't afford to have a headstone engraved, so we agreed to have the headstone shot from behind.

Quoted Text All that put aside, I'll reiterate what I said at the start of my review. This story is enough to have me sold on your writing ability. It truly is a touching tale, that deserves its recent recognition. Congrats on getting an offer on this one. That's great to see. Cheers, Dan

Yes!  Dan is sold on my writing ability!  Yes yes yes!  Woo, glad to hear that let me tell ya!

Glad you found the story touching and you enjoyed it overall.  Excited I could win you over!  And thanks!  It begins filming at the end of July, so I'm looking forward to seeing how this does!

-- Curt

Hey guys,

So, this starts filming towards the end of July, which is really exciting!

And the director has made a Facebook page for the movie!

Come Visit The Facebook Page HERE!

-- Curt

Hey buddy.

Gave this a read. This is where your writing is most effective. You seem to hit it right in all the big places. The truly emotional stuff is really good. Really.

At first I loathed the backwards telling of the story because it's a device I'm not a fan of, with the exception of Memento. That said, I think if this was linear, start to finish it just wouldn't have the right effect. Going backwards allowed for some really nice (bad in real life terms) surprises.

I wasn't a big fan of the scene with the girl Abby, Francine's daughter I presume? Then again the ambiguity adds a bit of extra food for thought.

The most impressive trait you have is the ability to say a lot in very little. A little on the nose at times but every piece I read is an improvement over the last. Good work!

PS. Psyched for you. Getting produced? Awesome! How did that come about? PM me. :D

Quoted from StevenHarvey PS. Psyched for you. Getting produced? Awesome! How did that come about?

Proof that SS gets a lot of attention from producers. Keep the writing up, folks :)

Quoted from StevenHarvey Hey buddy. Gave this a read. This is where your writing is most effective. You seem to hit it right in all the big places. The truly emotional stuff is really good. Really. At first I loathed the backwards telling of the story because it's a device I'm not a fan of, with the exception of Memento. That said, I think if this was linear, start to finish it just wouldn't have the right effect. Going backwards allowed for some really nice (bad in real life terms) surprises. I wasn't a big fan of the scene with the girl Abby, Francine's daughter I presume? Then again the ambiguity adds a bit of extra food for thought. The most impressive trait you have is the ability to say a lot in very little. A little on the nose at times but every piece I read is an improvement over the last. Good work! PS. Psyched for you. Getting produced? Awesome! How did that come about? PM me. :D

Thanks for the read, Steven!  Nice to see you back online mate!

Yea, I actually had a friend read this at the weekend and he said if the story were told in the linear way then there would be no element of surprise, and some things wouldn't be as shocking.

Yes, Abby is her daughter.  In the first draft the gravestone had an engraving with Francine's name on it, but to save on production costs I've just SHOWN a gravestone from behind.

Glad you liked it!  I'll make sure to PM you!

@ Dan

I totally agree.

Just broke 100 likes on Facebook not too long ago!  People are being really supportive, and that's just in the past four days!

CASTING for this is too start soon.  The director informed me that the casting director was "brought to tears" by the script, which... like... woah.  For a writer, that is a huge compliment.

Also might have HUGE news about the future of this, but can't say anything just yet!  Shall continue to keep the thread updated!

-- Curt

This is all awesome news Curt. Looking forward to seeing the finished film.
I liked on FB

-Gavin

Ahhhh, so it all makes sense!  Haha, thanks Gav!

-- Curt

Curtis

This was ok. I write generally bleak stuff so I have a certain bias towards these type of stories. I admire the ambition to really ramp up the emotional dimension of the story too, each scene is loaded with affliction or hurt or betrayal with punctuations by occasional glimmers of, as Francine mentions at the end, hope.

Writing wise, it’s not so bad and from a technical level, the format seems pretty solid.

However some of the prose feels a little over written (but that will improve with practice) while the dialogue felt a little stale at times, recycled and lacking subtext. Try to refrain from being so direct and literal.

MARK (O.S.)
Jesus, Cindy... I love you...

More ROCKING...

CINDY (O.S.)
Don’t tell, Francine.

- What, that you love me or we’re carrying on behind her back? ;) Seriously though, I think this dialogue is much too pointed. Feels too contrived that they would have this exchange right when Francine is outside the door.

I thought for a minute that Francine was a lesbian with Cindy actually being her lover, could work as a nice twist perhaps.

In hindsight having finished the script, Lester’s abuse of Francine could have turned her off men from a young age. Then when Cindy betrays her with a man, she turns away from women, and (presumably) sells herself over to men.  Maybe something to consider should you rewrite this.

“Francine’s hair is died BLACK”

- Should be “dyed”

The scene with Kris and Francine felt very heavy handed, really bludgeoning that message over the reader’s head. Why would she even look sideways at someone like him, he’s a total cu?t. To your credit though, we do see later on that Francine has come from a bad place herself (initially I thought it was being cheated in by Mark that sent off the deep end) she had her own trauma which made her gravitate towards destructive people like Kris.

Having said that, it still felt overdone. For a character to be so belligerent, obnoxious and unreasonable and only get one scene where we perceive only one side of him is an uneven, and perhaps unfair, portrayal. If this scene is representative of Kris’s character then we got to ask ourselves why the protagonist is with him. As a result, I can’t help losing some degree of sympathy for Francine. Here, Kris just came off as one of those one-note, caricatured a?shole boyfriend’s you only see in the movies.

It’s become such a cliché now that it’s played for laughs but here it’s done dead serious which I find it hard to buy.

“MARK (now 19) - looking almost identical to his 26 year old
self,”

- How do we know what he looked like in the earlier scene, his lines were off camera?

“Even when you’re young, and you
feel free and you’ve got all the
problems of the world on your
shoulders...”

- Contradictory?  Being burdened with all the world’s problems doesn’t sound very free to me.

A chillingly, depraved twist at the end but what are we supposed to take from this? Are we to believe that Francine would just give herself back to Lester like that as (again, presumably) a working girl and he the customer? If so, what does that say for your central character? I know she has had her heart broken and came from an abusive relationship and of course  an abusive childhood but for her to go back in such a manner to the root cause of her problem is unthinkable and carries deep implications for what you are trying to say here.

Of course, the counter argument is that human being are capable for the moist base, defiled acts, my head isn’t in the sand, I’m just unsure at what you are tackling here, if anything at all. Or is it just another commentary on the circle of violence/violence feeds violence type of theory. If so, it lacks the subtlety or nuance to separate it from the millions of others.

The reverse timeline is used appropriately but an added twist or surprise to colour the tonal palette may enrich it as I have issues with the Lester revelation as its written.

Oh and congrats on the production, best of luck with it.

Col.

Quoted from Colkurtz8 Curtis This was ok. I write generally bleak stuff so I have a certain bias towards these type of stories. I admire the ambition to really ramp up the emotional dimension of the story too, each scene is loaded with affliction or hurt or betrayal with punctuations by occasional glimmers of, as Francine mentions at the end, hope. Writing wise, it’s not so bad and from a technical level, the format seems pretty solid. However some of the prose feels a little over written (but that will improve with practice) while the dialogue felt a little stale at times, recycled and lacking subtext. Try to refrain from being so direct and literal. MARK (O.S.) Jesus, Cindy... I love you... More ROCKING... CINDY (O.S.) Don’t tell, Francine. - What, that you love me or we’re carrying on behind her back? ;) Seriously though, I think this dialogue is much too pointed. Feels too contrived that they would have this exchange right when Francine is outside the door. I thought for a minute that Francine was a lesbian with Cindy actually being her lover, could work as a nice twist perhaps. In hindsight having finished the script, Lester’s abuse of Francine could have turned her off men from a young age. Then when Cindy betrays her with a man, she turns away from women, and (presumably) sells herself over to men.  Maybe something to consider should you rewrite this. “Francine’s hair is died BLACK” - Should be “dyed” The scene with Kris and Francine felt very heavy handed, really bludgeoning that message over the reader’s head. Why would she even look sideways at someone like him, he’s a total cu?t. To your credit though, we do see later on that Francine has come from a bad place herself (initially I thought it was being cheated in by Mark that sent off the deep end) she had her own trauma which made her gravitate towards destructive people like Kris. Having said that, it still felt overdone. For a character to be so belligerent, obnoxious and unreasonable and only get one scene where we perceive only one side of him is an uneven, and perhaps unfair, portrayal. If this scene is representative of Kris’s character then we got to ask ourselves why the protagonist is with him. As a result, I can’t help losing some degree of sympathy for Francine. Here, Kris just came off as one of those one-note, caricatured a?shole boyfriend’s you only see in the movies. It’s become such a cliché now that it’s played for laughs but here it’s done dead serious which I find it hard to buy. “MARK (now 19) - looking almost identical to his 26 year old self,” - How do we know what he looked like in the earlier scene, his lines were off camera? “Even when you’re young, and you feel free and you’ve got all the problems of the world on your shoulders...” - Contradictory?  Being burdened with all the world’s problems doesn’t sound very free to me. A chillingly, depraved twist at the end but what are we supposed to take from this? Are we to believe that Francine would just give herself back to Lester like that as (again, presumably) a working girl and he the customer? If so, what does that say for your central character? I know she has had her heart broken and came from an abusive relationship and of course  an abusive childhood but for her to go back in such a manner to the root cause of her problem is unthinkable and carries deep implications for what you are trying to say here. Of course, the counter argument is that human being are capable for the moist base, defiled acts, my head isn’t in the sand, I’m just unsure at what you are tackling here, if anything at all. Or is it just another commentary on the circle of violence/violence feeds violence type of theory. If so, it lacks the subtlety or nuance to separate it from the millions of others. The reverse timeline is used appropriately but an added twist or surprise to colour the tonal palette may enrich it as I have issues with the Lester revelation as its written. Oh and congrats on the production, best of luck with it. Col.

Hey Col, thanks very much for the read. :)

I've submitted a third draft of this, improved, also with a NEW ending, to Don, so hopefully it's up soon.  Many people made comment that the ending was too bleak and depressing.  The ending, I think, many more people will enjoy and it was a joint-agreement between me and the director.

The director wanted to undo the non-linear structure of the script, and there was a big hoopla regarding it, so he changed his mind.  In return, I had to include SUPERS and a scene with a new character Nicola, to point out who Lester was.  Otherwise, I don't know what would have happened and we would have continued our argument.

I address most things you pointed out in the new draft.  The direct dialogue, the contradicting V.O too.  

I have to make changes now with the directors agreement, and he's now finally happy with the final version, so I don't ip think story wise things will change.  The scripts message was a sort of commentary on how desperation can twist people's lives, how low people can sink (but more importantly) that even when you're life tragic, there is always a light at the end of the tunnel.  Or hope, in Francine's case. :)

Curt

Hey guys.  :)  

NEW UPDATED version of the script is up.  This draft is our final shooting draft.

CHANGES:

-- The director felt like we needed clarity for Lester, so I included a scene at his request with another character called Nicola.

-- The director was pretty clear that he wanted SUPERS to be involved in the script so we know exactly "when" the scene is taking place.  So, at his request, I included them.

-- The ending.  It's been changed drastically.  Some people liked the original ending, some people thought it was too harsh, others felt it was too ambiguous.  I liked the original ending, but personally, Francine deserves a clear happy ending, so it's been updated.  And it's back by the director, as he felt the ending should've been much more hopeful too.

-- And it's been tidied up a little her and there (action, dialogues etc...)

I like the final draft.  I'm excited to see where it goes from here onwards.  Casting is being taken in and auditions for out characters are being held on the last day of this month, which isn't too far away.

Thanks everyone for the continued feedback and support. :)

Curt

Much better, IMO.

I actually think the slugs confuse something which wasn't confusing to begin with... because, if the final scene is present day, and Abby is 13... when are the slugs "____ years from"? Because it can't be from present day, because in the playground scene, which is 12 years earlier, Abby obviously hasn't been born yet. So they're "___ years" from the initial scene, which is already in the past, right?

Decent stuff, regardless dude.

EDIT: The issues I had with the supers was that I perceived the first scene to be in the present, so I viewed all the "___ years before" slugs to be x number of years from that first scene. And this then confused me, when I found out the final scene was in fact in the present, as I then perceived the "___ years before" slugs to be from that point, which then messed up the chronology of things. But whilst I'm guessing the slugs are "___ years before" the first scene (and not the present), the first scene is also in the past? If this makes sense, lol?

Toby, please don't confuse the fuck out of me before I read this new (and final) draft.  
Thank you.   :P ;D

After discussing this with Toby some more, I agree, he's right, lol.  Fuck.  That means another draft for Don to upload. :P

Will fix soon.

Basically, what he's saying, is that a super in the last scene "PRESENT DAY" is confusing because the scenes at the start were considered present day.  Shit.  Okay, I need to fix this and talk with the director -- this should go well. :P

Curt

Curt,

I think I've read your work, I think.   I might have started this one a while back, but never finished it because I don't remember reading the end.

I enjoyed the story, paced good.  I felt Kris over-stayed his welcome, but then he got the shit kicked out of him, so it made up for it.  That call back to Lester *the molester* was a good twist, what a tool.  But it really says a lot about your writing, and that your not afraid throw an option out there for the sake of good storytelling.

This piece felt organic, and that's awesome because it aligns itself with the tone.  I had one gripe with the ending, Francine talking about hope.  It didn't jive with me, but sometimes you have to let the characters say what they need to say, lol.

Good one, I'll get around to reading some more from you soon.

Johnny

Quoted from oJOHNNYoNUTSo Curt, I think I've read your work, I think.   I might have started this one a while back, but never finished it because I don't remember reading the end. I enjoyed the story, paced good.  I felt Kris over-stayed his welcome, but then he got the shit kicked out of him, so it made up for it.  That call back to Lester *the molester* was a good twist, what a tool.  But it really says a lot about your writing, and that your not afraid throw an option out there for the sake of good storytelling. This piece felt organic, and that's awesome because it aligns itself with the tone.  I had one gripe with the ending, Francine talking about hope.  It didn't jive with me, but sometimes you have to let the characters say what they need to say, lol. Good one, I'll get around to reading some more from you soon. Johnny

Hey Johnny,

Glad you enjoyed this as a whole.  Was my first short on the site.  I'm glad you enjoyed the organic-ness of it all.  As I've had people tell me the first draft was too contrived.  So thanks!  The original ending had Francine die but now she's alive, a more hopeful ending, so I wanted her to talk about it.

Anyways, glad you enjoyed, let me know if I can return the read.

Having so much problems with the director behind this.  One of my shorts just finished filming and it was so easy and breezy and this has just caused problems.  He's now telling me the script "might need to be changed" because it's hard to find actresses that look similar because of the different scenes.  Which is bull.  I'm not a casting guy, I'm a writer guy, I write.  And the director should have thought about that before he even considered contacting me.

Hope you check back in for updates. :)

Curt

Hey Curt

Really liked this one. I especially like the way that each time we went backwards, the scene got more traumatic for Francine. That added and overall heavier dept to the story

The flashbacks mixed with breaks of V.O's, I thought you balanced very well.  The story had a message, and a good one. Even though it was shrouded in a dark tale.
Which actually is what drew me to read it.

As for your ending...It was good. It worked. But I thought it was gonna go a darker route. There was such a build up of these tragic events, to have an ending where the audience is asking questions rather than feeling the emotion of the last scene, I think steals away the sentiment you established.

But your message was definitely felt throughout the script.

So overall,  really liked it.

Good job man

Hey Reel,

The original ending actually had Francine die.  Instead, Abby stands at her mothers grave and a male voice O.S tells her it's time to go (leaving the audience to assume the identity if said male.)  It left a few questions unanswered.  However, the majority felt it was too ambiguous and too depressing so in this version the ending is much happier, and more realistic, IMO.

Plus, after the tragic life she went through I thought Francine deserved some happy ending, as cheesy as it sounds. :P

Glad you got the message, though.  This begins filming in a few weeks.

Francine's actress has been cast and I'm a very happy with who we have!

Thanks for the read Reel, will return soon. :)

Curt

Folks,

This has been filmed:

Brilliant my Belfast buddy :D

Nice production and very effective.

Well done Curtis.

Mark