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Flashback/Fantasy/Dream Sequence(S) (currently 5994 views) |
dangeroussamurai |
Posted: July 12th, 2004, 3:38pm |
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New KOF rules!!
LocationAtlanta Posts62 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Personally, I think the flashback is important, but most think they make you look like an amatuer when used to frequently. What if thats the only way I can get the point across? Half the story happens whle the main character is knocked out for 10 years so I gotta have a few flashbacks to make stuff make sense.......my point being, how can I avoid flashbacks but still make the story logical? |
| The End of the World: Two Starbucks, right across from each other. You get your coffee, go out of one, look across the street and say "HOLY SH*T! There another one!!!" Its like your stuck in some alternate dimesion...... |
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baltis |
Posted: July 12th, 2004, 4:23pm |
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That would mean he was in a coma.
Anyway, yeah the "FLASHBACK" is a bit of a hit and miss in screen writting. Do you use it all the time? No. Why would you?
I think a "FLASHBACK" used effectivly is a great thing, but you toss it in to many times and it loses it's effect, quickly turning it into a defective part of your script.
I think if the story calls for several FLASHBACKS then it's the only way to do it, however if you can get away without using them and come up with a new and inovative way of implementing them... do it that way.
I've never used one in a single one of my screenplays and I've wrote over 60 now.
If a FLASHBACK isn't needed, it isn't needed.
That's my rule of thumb. |
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dangeroussamurai |
Posted: July 12th, 2004, 4:54pm |
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New KOF rules!!
LocationAtlanta Posts62 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
But if I dont use flashbacks, the whole thing would be a lot more confusing to understand. Is that good or not? DO people want to know 'everything or nothing?' (yeah, accidental James Bond advertisement.....) |
| The End of the World: Two Starbucks, right across from each other. You get your coffee, go out of one, look across the street and say "HOLY SH*T! There another one!!!" Its like your stuck in some alternate dimesion...... |
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baltis |
Posted: July 12th, 2004, 7:30pm |
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Less is better. It gives us all more to go with actually. It lets us use our heads and minds more. Did This happen or did that happen? Is this what was intended or was that what was intended?
Those are always the best movies. Movies that let the viewer interact with them and piece together what "THEY" think it's all about.
MUHALLAND DRIVE was a great movie that challenged the viewer this very question.
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EsKayEye |
Posted: July 13th, 2004, 9:10am |
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Posts52 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Memento was a great movie that relied on flashbacks the entire picture.
Res Dogs also used flashbacks throughout much of the film, but they also revealed plot information through dialogue. Your character could reveal what you need the audience to know about his past through conversation. |
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sheepdogg_plankton |
Posted: July 13th, 2004, 3:21pm |
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The flashback is really a hit or miss, but if you use a Flashback too much, it gets annoying and signifies writing weakness, especially when you're trying to reveal character backround.
Memento was pretty good, I loved it on the DVD when Christopher Nolan recut the movie so it wasn't backwards anymore, that was genius.
Resevoir dogs did a good job with flashbacks, I always wondered why Tarantino can always break the rules and yet new writers are told not to... curious. |
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Alan_Holman |
Posted: July 13th, 2004, 4:32pm |
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In my opinion, flashbacks only suck when they re-use film from earlier in the same movie. If the flashback presents new material, it's alright. |
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R.E._Freak |
Posted: July 13th, 2004, 7:20pm |
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Quoted from sheepdogg_plankton, posted July 13th, 2004, 3:21pm at hereI always wondered why Tarantino can always break the rules and yet new writers are told not to... curious. |
I've always wondered about that. I've wondered too why scripts are supposed to follow such a rigid structure and format. No wonder all the Hollywood movies are the same garbage. |
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Old Time Wesley |
Posted: July 13th, 2004, 10:44pm |
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LocationOntario, Canada Posts2908 Posts Per Day 0.38 |
Maybe they're not supposed to but people actually listen to what there fed like drones or robots, flashbacks are important in one form or another depending on what type of screenplay it is
I doubt they'd matter in a dramatic tear jerker as much as it would in an adventure story that you need to get a character across without alienating the whole plot
Maybe, maybe not. |
| Practice safe lunch: Use a condiment. |
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dangeroussamurai |
Posted: July 13th, 2004, 11:06pm |
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New KOF rules!!
LocationAtlanta Posts62 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
look peoples, this is my problem. My story is an epic. TOO epic. Its got to much compicated alien race battling and most of it happens HUNDREDS of years before I have a main character. Which leads me to my second problem. Its really confusing, and I could only explain it through LONG mono parts or (lengthy) flashbacks. Shoud I just cut the crap outta my story and make it straight forward or what?! |
| The End of the World: Two Starbucks, right across from each other. You get your coffee, go out of one, look across the street and say "HOLY SH*T! There another one!!!" Its like your stuck in some alternate dimesion...... |
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EsKayEye |
Posted: July 14th, 2004, 10:30am |
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Posts52 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Quoted from sheepdogg_plankton, posted July 13th, 2004, 3:21pm at hereThe flashback is really a hit or miss, but if you use a Flashback too much, it gets annoying and signifies writing weakness, especially when you're trying to reveal character backround.
Memento was pretty good, I loved it on the DVD when Christopher Nolan recut the movie so it wasn't backwards anymore, that was genius.
Resevoir dogs did a good job with flashbacks, I always wondered why Tarantino can always break the rules and yet new writers are told not to... curious. |
because taratino used his own money he made from selling A SPEC SCRIPT to produce his own film...he was in a unique situation with lawrence bender, and by chance harvey kietel came on board and they made Res Dogs as an Independant Film. Indy films dont adhere to conventions or traditions, so the filmmaker does whatever he wants. But QT DID sell True Romance to finance Res Dogs, and it was sold as a SPEC script. |
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EsKayEye |
Posted: July 14th, 2004, 10:42am |
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Posts52 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Maybe they're not supposed to but people actually listen to what there fed like drones or robots, flashbacks are important in one form or another depending on what type of screenplay it is
I doubt they'd matter in a dramatic tear jerker as much as it would in an adventure story that you need to get a character across without alienating the whole plot
Maybe, maybe not. |
Its not a case of brainwashed drones, its a case of a unionized industry. Hollywood IS ran a specific way, and many movies ARE made specifically to make money and not for artistic "love of cinema" reasons. With all these union regulations, it is difficult to make a large budget film without using union workers. Everyone is unionized in hollywood. So as it is, to make money in this industry, the highest probable way to make money (which is still great odds in and of itself) is to deal with unions. You CAN be black balled by a union, like the WGA is you sell a script when the union is on strike. And this becomes a serious career matter. No union person will work with you. You are painted into a corner. So if you want to SELL a screenplay and actually make money, you have to adhere to the standards and formats of the industry. They require these formats, because the volumn of applicants if you will. Many directors/producers recieve countless amounts of unproduced scripts to read. If they arent in format, many will not read them. Heres an example. You have an international writing contest. You recieve thousands of entries. The best one, might be written in korean, but you'll never know, because you dont speak korean, and you dont have time to learn. The people reading your scripts dont have the time to sort through a convoluted structure or "on the fly" format. QT does it how ever he wants because he MAKE THE FILMS HE WRITES. And the films he wrote but did not direct NATURAL BORN KILLERS and TRUE ROMANCE are formated properly and written in industry standard. And guess what? He sold those for thousands and now he makes his own films however he wants. |
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EsKayEye |
Posted: July 14th, 2004, 10:46am |
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Posts52 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
look peoples, this is my problem. My story is an epic. TOO epic. Its got to much compicated alien race battling and most of it happens HUNDREDS of years before I have a main character. Which leads me to my second problem. Its really confusing, and I could only explain it through LONG mono parts or (lengthy) flashbacks. Shoud I just cut the crap outta my story and make it straight forward or what?! |
perhaps you should consider writing a book instead of a screenplay. Have a look at epics like LOTRs and starwars ect. The characters are introduced early and the plots and developments occur in the same ACT structer as traditional films. Maybe writing a book first would help get everything out of your system, then you could write a screenplay based on the world you created, but with structure to make it a feature length. Ie 120 pages. |
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dangeroussamurai |
Posted: July 14th, 2004, 10:57am |
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New KOF rules!!
LocationAtlanta Posts62 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Actually, I am doing the book. This is for the book. But even as a book.........I fund it hard presenting all the material in a manner that isnt flashbacks----without making occasional boring parts. I will make a script of it though, but THAT wont make ANY sense, believe me. |
| The End of the World: Two Starbucks, right across from each other. You get your coffee, go out of one, look across the street and say "HOLY SH*T! There another one!!!" Its like your stuck in some alternate dimesion...... |
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EsKayEye |
Posted: July 14th, 2004, 11:30am |
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Posts52 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
why dont you try just writing it linear and then only use flashbacks where they are important to the story. Instead of your character having a flashback, just write that scene first so he doesnt have to have it later in the story. Once its linear, then you can chop it up however you want and put it in whatever order you choose. |
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dangeroussamurai |
Posted: July 14th, 2004, 4:23pm |
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New KOF rules!!
LocationAtlanta Posts62 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
YES. Thats one of the problems Im having. I've written 3 different outlines, every time trying to figure out the best way to present the story and back story. I think I've got it now though (on the 4th draft) that A: It should be slight comedy, so the narroration and explanations are entertaining to read, and B: have action, then no action, then some action, etc. So you dont get bored. Currently its an alien invasion and conspiracy, slight comedy (I've been reading a lot of Douglas Adams). |
| The End of the World: Two Starbucks, right across from each other. You get your coffee, go out of one, look across the street and say "HOLY SH*T! There another one!!!" Its like your stuck in some alternate dimesion...... |
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Chilli |
Posted: July 24th, 2004, 4:44am |
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New Kirk to... Spock, please... warp factor... five!
LocationAylesbury, England (Nr. London) Posts43 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
If used properly they can work well. Look a Memento or Kill Bill for good examples of this. Ian |
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vkonstant |
Posted: July 27th, 2004, 12:14pm |
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Memento doesn't have flashbacks - it has scenes repeatedly shown through someone else's POV - not the same thing.
And Kill Bill is awful. |
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sheepdogg_plankton |
Posted: July 27th, 2004, 2:47pm |
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Yes, the flashback in OUATITW was good, but I had to rewind it, i didn't even realize it was a flashback originally. What I would do is spread everything out on a timeline, then decide about the flashbacks. |
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dangeroussamurai |
Posted: July 28th, 2004, 6:52pm |
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New KOF rules!!
LocationAtlanta Posts62 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Did somebody just say Kill Bill is awful? I just watched it for the fourth time yesterday! I do think the flashbacks werent very good-----almost unnessasary at some points. |
| The End of the World: Two Starbucks, right across from each other. You get your coffee, go out of one, look across the street and say "HOLY SH*T! There another one!!!" Its like your stuck in some alternate dimesion...... |
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sheepdogg_plankton |
Posted: July 29th, 2004, 1:55pm |
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Kill bill is not awful. I hope quentin tarantino honors his original intentions and cuts the two films seamlessly into one on DVD, it'd be cool to see if it works or not. |
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Chilli |
Posted: July 29th, 2004, 2:02pm |
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New Kirk to... Spock, please... warp factor... five!
LocationAylesbury, England (Nr. London) Posts43 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Kill Bill is a great film.
I'm using flashbacks in my current script. I find they work well if necessary in the parameters of the story. |
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sheepdogg_plankton |
Posted: July 29th, 2004, 3:34pm |
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I have to have flashbacks in my script i'm owrking on right now, because it has really crappy pacing if i don't put them in at the right spots. |
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Arcadio |
Posted: September 14th, 2004, 5:09pm |
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I'm not sure if anyone's mention this but "Gothika" has loads of flashbacks in the screenplay which you could get an idea from. The script is up on the site. Hope this helps you |
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Chilli |
Posted: September 17th, 2004, 5:27pm |
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New Kirk to... Spock, please... warp factor... five!
LocationAylesbury, England (Nr. London) Posts43 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Flashbacks work if they are skillfully used to further the plot.
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CindyLKeller |
Posted: September 21st, 2004, 9:26pm |
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Old Timer
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I was told by a producer that they knew that some producers didn't like flashbacks, but they thought flashbacks were an essential part to the story, to give a backstory into why things are happening the way they are.
On another note, what did you think about the flashbacks in 21 GRAMS? They made my daughter nuts, they made me nuts, but I still had to keep watching. Cindy |
| Award winning screenwriter Available screenplays TINA DARLING - 114 page Comedy ONLY OSCAR KNOWS - 99 page Horror A SONG IN MY HEART - 94 page Drama HALLOWEEN GAMES - 105 page Drama
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Paula-Hanes |
Posted: September 21st, 2004, 10:12pm |
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I think flashbacks are fine if they are needed. The real virus is VOICE OVER. It is overused and the sign of a lazy storyteller. There are exceptions of course, but I refuse to use it if I can tell the story another way. |
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dogglebe |
Posted: November 12th, 2004, 11:46pm |
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I just wanted to get this thread started again because my script, 'The Burnout' has seven of them.
I've used flashbacks in my script because, while the story takes place in present day, events in the past are important to show how the main character got into the situation he's in. By using the flashbacks, the viewer learns about the character as I want him to.
I can't go into detail without spoiling the story, but if there was no other way to explain his past, short of one character telling another "Why is he like this? Well, it all began twenty years ago..." That, and most of the flashbacks are going through the main character's head and no one else's.
My two cents' worth....
Phil |
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jquest |
Posted: January 24th, 2005, 4:17pm |
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I have been switching the beginning of a screenplay around till I'm blue in the face.
In scenario one:
I introduce protag., then antag., then they meet in the inciting incident. THEN, flashback to a scene of antag. as 12 y.o. boy. Move ahead 6 years to see the antag. as 18 y.o. man. THEN ahead to present immediatelyafter inciting incident.
In scenario two:
I begin with antag. as a 12 y.o. boy. Move ahead 6 years to see the antag. as 18 y.o. man. Then move ahead 14 years to the present. Introduce protag. Introduce 31 y.o. antag. and THEN inciting incident which occurs on page 9.
--------------------------------- I like scenario one because it introduces the protag. immediately. Downside: a 20 year flashback, followed by a scene 6 years later. Then back to the present. It reads well to me. The flashback immediately after the inciting incident seems to work.
In the second scenario, everything is chronological, but it begins by introducing the antag. instead of the protag, which might seem awkward because it sets up antag. background, then changes to the community of people around the protag. -------------------------------------
I'm reluctant to replace these two flashback scenes with dialogue because they establish the antag's humanity and why he turns bad. They also show him finding a special object that's a key element of the screenplay.
_______________________________
I suppose my question is... What's more desirable, introducing the Protag. immediately, then flashing back to antagonist history. OR Beginning chronologically even if that means introducing the antagonist first.
Thanks,
John |
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Higgonaitor |
Posted: January 27th, 2005, 8:22pm |
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Been Around
Location(40.717261, -73.600087) Posts934 Posts Per Day 0.13 |
Id need to know your characters to help you, mainly protagaganist: what is available to him? is he rich poor? any powers?
and for your antagonist: what happened to him 18 years ago? what happened to him six years from then? in what relation is he with the protag? what evil thing does he plan on doing?
answer those and I might be able to help |
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Oney.Mendoza |
Posted: July 11th, 2005, 1:36am |
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LocationBay Area, CA Posts190 Posts Per Day 0.03 |
Hey,
Say when you have a flashback/fantasy/dream sequence that extends for awhile and you don't want to let your "reader" know it's actual flashback...blah...blah sequences, do you when you come back to "reality" put something within the heading, ie: CONTINUOUS? Or do you simply have to add/imply by using something that it was only a blah...blah...blah?
Thanks to anyone who replies.
-ONEY |
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dogglebe |
Posted: July 11th, 2005, 6:52am |
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In regarding to formatting, you treat the flashback as if it was another scene. In regards to the storytelling part you have to convey that it was a flashback. My script, The Burnout, has several flashbacks in it. Phil |
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George Willson |
Posted: July 11th, 2005, 11:19am |
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Of The Ancients Doctor who? Yes, quite right.
LocationBroken Arrow Posts3591 Posts Per Day 0.51 |
Formatwise, you would end a flashback this way:
END FLASHBACK
However, I think I know what you mean by not telling the audience it is a flashback. This would be akin to Raising Cain where the movie went from reality to fantasy and didn't tell you which it was doing. In this case, you just tell the story how it would be shown to the audience. Give the reader the same information the theatregoing audience would have. You risk losing people because I'll admit that Raising Cain was a little confusing until it all came together at the end, but it's your story.
One way to do this so that those who pay attention would get it and those that weren't won't is to format your headings during the flashback like this:
EXT. BATTLEFIELD - NIGHT - FLASHBACK
INT. HOUSE - DAY - FLASHBACK
Normally here is where you would write: END FLASHBACK, but if you skip it...
INT. HOUSE - DAY
Of course, you risk getting the feedback that you forgot your end flashback tag... |
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dogglebe |
Posted: July 11th, 2005, 12:41pm |
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With The Burnout, I also number the flashbacks as I had five of them and used one twice (with some 'embellishing'). Instead of writing 'end of flashback' the next header included the word 'present' in it (I think). Phil |
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Oney.Mendoza |
Posted: July 12th, 2005, 12:42am |
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LocationBay Area, CA Posts190 Posts Per Day 0.03 |
George and Dogglebe, Thank you guys for the suggestions, now I have an idea |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 8:14am |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
Ok, I am not sure how to do this. I have a series of scenes which hop back and forth in time. Not time travel, just that one minute one scene will show the character aged 10, then 28, then back to 10 again. Are these flashbacks or scenes in their own right?
Would you put the year in the header part like this -
INT - GARDEN - 1986 -- DAY
OR, would you have to describe how the character looks each time you jump timezones to let the viewer know that it's a different year now?
I just have a few characters in these scenes, do I have to describe their ages and visuals each time for the reader, or can I rely on the date being put in the header bit?
Lemme know if this made sense or not, I'm struggling with this and it seems to be adding a lot of narrative each time by having to repeatedly describe everyone!!
Cheers, Andy |
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dogglebe |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 9:42am |
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They're flashbacks, Andy (you cheeky monkey). Your slugline is correct. When your characters enter the scene, introduce them as if it's your first time. Use upper case letter and include their age in parenthesis afterwards. INT. GARDEN. 1986. -DAY JOHN SMITH (15) enter the garden, dressed in his Sunday best. If you're going to have several flashblacks, you may want to number them. INT. GARDEN. 1986. -DAY (FLASHBACK 1) I use several flashbacks in The Burnout. Two of the flashbacks are actually the same flashback from a different viewpoint. Phil |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 10:17am |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
Thank you, kind sir |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 3:26pm |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
My script starts in the past but it's a flashback!! Should I just write it as a normal scene in the past and then later, when we leap back again, make that the flashback? |
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Roger Dodger |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 3:38pm |
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New "I'm just skin covering coffee..."
LocationUK Posts126 Posts Per Day 0.02 |
This did my head in when I was writing my script for college... It started in the past, jumped forward to modern day and then bounced back and forth in time... I almost wept trying to put it together... I'll be finding out on Thursday if I've succeeded... |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 3:44pm |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
Ian, that's exactly what I'm stuck on. Now I wish I approached this script differently, but I'm a bit too burnt out now to do a new re-write. I started the scene as a regular scene, in 1986, then jumped forward to 2005 and then when I went back to 1986 I made that flashback 1 - then I went back to 2005 and went back again to 1991 as flashback 2. I think that makes sense!! I hope so, I'm so confused now. I hope you got on ok too by the way, let us know hon |
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Roger Dodger |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 3:48pm |
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New "I'm just skin covering coffee..."
LocationUK Posts126 Posts Per Day 0.02 |
I will do... I spoke to the lecturer about how to format flasbacks in screenplays and he advised something different from your slugline example above, so now I'm confused again... |
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dogglebe |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 4:23pm |
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There is no one correct way to format a script, but as long as it's relatively the same as the others (and consistent), then it's okay.
How did your teacher say it should be?
Phil |
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Roger Dodger |
Posted: July 17th, 2005, 4:32pm |
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New "I'm just skin covering coffee..."
LocationUK Posts126 Posts Per Day 0.02 |
Well, he pretty much advised to leave anything out of the slugline that wasn't the usual int/ext - place - night/day Everything else was to be bunged into the description... He said to just be as honest as possible as to when the scene was to take place... The structure of mine was pretty complex as I placed a lot of scenes out of order and this did my head in when trying to figure out how to present this, I'm not too sure I did it too well... He's giving me feedback on Thursday so I'll find out what he says then... |
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Mr.Z |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 7:55am |
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Been Around
LocationBuenos Aires - Argentina Posts743 Posts Per Day 0.11 |
I don´t use timezones in sluglines. In my opinion, every information you put on your script should be able to be noticed by both: the reader, and the audience (for those lucky bastards who have their scripts produced).
So, when you put "1986" in your slugline, the reader knows which year is, right. But what about the audience? Unless you use a SUPER, the audience won´t be able to tell the year in which the scene takes place. Therefore, I think the timezone in the slugline is not needed. The audience will only be able to know which year is because of how you write dialogue and action (i.e. your main character is younger, one of your characters takes a look at a calendar, etc)
The same with flashbacks. When you watch a movie, you don´t have anyone telling you that this or that scene is a flashback. You just know it because of how the story flows. Therefore, I think the reader of the script should not be told in sluglines wether the scene below is a flashback or not. If the script is well written, the reader would gather it´s a flashback. |
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Martin |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 8:24am |
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Been Around
LocationFrankfurt, Germany Posts607 Posts Per Day 0.09 |
I think using flashback in the slugline is okay, as long as your description that follows backs it up.
You're right that the "1986" is redundant although it is accepted (according to the screenwriter's bible)
Here's the way I'd do it:
INT. GARDEN- DAY (FLASHBACK)
INT. GARDEN- DAY (PRESENT DAY)
You can use the character description to suggest how far back we have gone. We don't need a date but it's helpful to state in the slugline that this is a flashback.
If you flash back to the same location in a different time, describe how it's different. Same with characters, how much younger are they etc.
Incidentally, flashbacks are widely regarded as a cheap device for easy exposition. That said, it'll be interesting to see if anybody can takle Dogglebe's game without using flashbacks.
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dogglebe |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 9:03am |
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When I wrote the flashbacks to The Burnout, I simply said how old the characters were during the flashback. The exact years were not important. Phil |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 12:08pm |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
Ok, I've read everyone's comments and this is what I think I will do.
I will not put the year in the slugline nor will I write flashback. I will just re-introduce the characters with their appropriate age to that specific scene and when they've aged or become young, I will re-write the new age and give them a new phyiscal description to reflect the change. As Phil said, write them as if the first time.
I will see in my feedback how this approach goes down!!
I agree with what Mr Z had to say about if you can't see it, don't write it. I think that's a general rule of thumb.
Thanks everyone! Andy |
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dogglebe |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 12:30pm |
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I think you have to indicate it from the beginning, somehow. Putting 'flashback' in the slugline just seems to be the easiest way.
Phil |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 12:35pm |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
LMAO!! I'm soooooooo confused!! I just want to get the format right and not get slammed too much for doing it wrong I think that I'll split this approach in half. No dates in the slugline, just flashback only. I have just 2 and I think the description each time indicates clearly that we're in a different timezone and that the characters look different too. I hope so anyways. I'll try not to get too hung up on this as I know it will be a learning exercise once people have read my short and I can learn from their feedback too. Seems like we're all learning a bit from this game, Phil! I do look forward to hearing from Ian when he gets his script back just to see what his teacher had to say on the matter. Andy |
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dogglebe |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 12:48pm |
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I'm merely saying that if your slug line states that it's a flashback, the story will be easier to follow.
EXT. FAIRGROUNDS. WINTER. DAY -FLASHBACK explains things pretty better than explaining that your main character suddenly is fifteen years younger.
Phil |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 18th, 2005, 1:01pm |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
I added 'Flashback' to two scenes and just put the age in brackets as an opener again and a brief physical description of the character. Only takes a line to re-address.
If I haven't made it clear, I'll learn from you guys when my script is posted.
Looking forward to seeing how everyone adapted your concept now, Phil!!
Andy
Cheers to all for the help! |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: July 22nd, 2005, 4:40pm |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
Hey Ian, I wondered how you got on with your script this week? I remember you said you would be getting feedback on the whole timezone thing. If you have a spare minute, can you share with me your lecturer's advice please if you think it will be of use? Cheers hon, and have a great weekend |
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Roger Dodger |
Posted: July 23rd, 2005, 7:43am |
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New "I'm just skin covering coffee..."
LocationUK Posts126 Posts Per Day 0.02 |
Well, my lecturer did have some issues with my script, however the 'presentation' of the flashbacks and timezone shifting wasn't one of them as I stuck to his advice.
I'll paste the slug-lines and opening description from four scenes which should give you an idea of what I was told... I'll probably post the whole thing at some point in the future. The first 3 scenes below are the 3 opening scenes, the fourth appears later on.
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INT: JOE'S OFFICE - DAY
We open in 1988, and we are in a comfortable looking home office.
On one side of an expansive wooden desk sits JOE DELANEY, 55, an imposing and serious looking man. On the other side sit CHARLIE MARX, 45, wiry, and JOHN RICHARDSON, 18, a fresh-faced and handsome guy who is looking ill-at-ease.
As we join them Joe is addressing Charlie.
[snip]
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INT: WAREHOUSE - NIGHT
We move to present day 2005 and John, now 35, is in a large darkened warehouse, illuminated only by a dimmed portable electric light on the floor. John is using a mallet to furiously whack at an object we cannot see. The sound of a VICIOUS THUNDERSTORM can be heard outside when the METALLIC SOUND of John's STRIKES die down.
[snip]
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INT. JOE'S OFFICE - DAY
We now see a scene from earlier in the day. We are back in a room that we can recognise as Joe's office, but the decor is obviously more modern - yet still classical.
John is sat across the same desk from Joe Delaney, now 72. Neither man looks happy.
[snip]
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EXT. JOHN'S HOME - DAY
We jump to a scene which follows the one in Joe's office.
We see John's home, a detached house in a pleasant looking neighbourhood. On a neatly cut lawn we see an Estate Agent's 'Sold' sign, and on the driveway there are two vehicles - a family saloon car and a small removal van.
Even from outside we can hear the raised voices of an argument underway in the house.
[snip]
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So, nowt but the basics in the slugline and then everything else in the description along with very clear notes as to where in the tieline the scene is suposed to appear...
I hope the above has helped some... |
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Mr.Z |
Posted: December 26th, 2005, 9:31am |
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Been Around
LocationBuenos Aires - Argentina Posts743 Posts Per Day 0.11 |
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Reply: 54 - 102 |
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punch drunk cookies |
Posted: February 22nd, 2006, 9:06pm |
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New
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What if the majority of my story is actually a flashback to tell the plot and the story comes to the present sometimes? How would one write that? Do I have to write "flashback" in most of the headings or no? |
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James McClung |
Posted: February 22nd, 2006, 9:16pm |
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Of The Ancients
LocationWashington, D.C. Posts3293 Posts Per Day 0.48 |
There're a lot of films that have done this. I think you could just write flashback for the first scene and then continue on normally. If you came back to the present, you could just do it again. I think the reader would presume it was a flashback in any case. |
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punch drunk cookies |
Posted: February 22nd, 2006, 9:18pm |
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Thanks, but could you show me an example? |
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dogglebe |
Posted: February 22nd, 2006, 9:26pm |
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You start the flashback with FLASHBACK in the heading and then use PRESENT DAY when you bring it back. Cheap plug department: My only feature script The Burnout includes several flashbacks, including one flashback that was used twice and embellished a little the second time. Phil |
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punch drunk cookies |
Posted: February 22nd, 2006, 9:29pm |
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New
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Cool. Thanks. The first scene is going to be present, and then it goes to a flashback for a long duration. That's still workable with what you just said, is it not? |
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George Willson |
Posted: February 22nd, 2006, 9:31pm |
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Of The Ancients Doctor who? Yes, quite right.
LocationBroken Arrow Posts3591 Posts Per Day 0.51 |
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dogglebe |
Posted: February 22nd, 2006, 10:40pm |
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With the exception of about five minutes, 'No Way Out' is one long flashback.
Phil |
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Alexander |
Posted: February 28th, 2006, 9:27pm |
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Regarding flashbacks and dreams, I always tag such information at the end of the sluglines. For example:
INT. HOSPITAL - DAY (FLASHBACK) or EXT. WOODS - NIGHT (DREAM)
But I also like to think that when writing a script, one's goal is to create, for the reader, what the audience of the movie would see (in extreme moderation, of course), therefore if the plot would consist of a dream sequence that the audience thought was in real time, would you label it as a dream after the scene or before it?
I don't want to spoil the "surprise", so to speak, that the scene is a dream, so putting this in the slugline would defeat the effect for the reader, I think. How then could I accomplish this? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
The dream sequence in particular is the same as the following scene, just with different events (the dreamer imagines an event to occur a certain way, but awakens to experience it happening another), so something too subtle might be confusing. |
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Stephen Wegmann |
Posted: February 28th, 2006, 9:31pm |
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New huh.
LocationThe Americana Posts78 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
Don't say it's a dream at all if that'll give something later away. If you've writtten your stuff good enough those fragmented "dream" scenes will all make sense at the appropriate time. Also, that is what the viewer would be seeing, and so that's what it should be. |
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George Willson |
Posted: March 1st, 2006, 2:07am |
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Of The Ancients Doctor who? Yes, quite right.
LocationBroken Arrow Posts3591 Posts Per Day 0.51 |
Really, the only time you would label anything as a Flashback or Dream is when you want the moviemakers to know that the audience is supposed to know it, and so they'll film it accordingly. If you're doing something like Raising Cain where there are multiple storyline variations and one of them might even be real, label nothing. If the audience is supposed to be confused, confuse the reader too. The key is to "show" your movie in the script. |
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dogglebe |
Posted: March 1st, 2006, 8:44am |
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Really, the only time you would label anything as a Flashback or Dream is when you want the moviemakers to know that the audience is supposed to know it, and so they'll film it accordingly. If you're doing something like Raising Cain where there are multiple storyline variations and one of them might even be real, label nothing. If the audience is supposed to be confused, confuse the reader too. The key is to "show" your movie in the script. |
In regards to the flashback, it would simply be easier to put the year in the header if it's in the distant past: EXT. MAIN STREET. DAY (1979). This way you don't have to explain that everything you see is from the period. Phil |
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Alexander |
Posted: March 1st, 2006, 12:38pm |
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New Oh yeah.
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Quoted from George Willson Really, the only time you would label anything as a Flashback or Dream is when you want the moviemakers to know that the audience is supposed to know it, and so they'll film it accordingly. If you're doing something like Raising Cain where there are multiple storyline variations and one of them might even be real, label nothing. If the audience is supposed to be confused, confuse the reader too. The key is to "show" your movie in the script. |
I think I've decided to do this, thanks for confirming that this would be acceptable.
Quoted from bentley_trails I've seen this within : Fades to : , Fades of : ...Etc |
I've used fades and such for known dreams and flashbacks. but for this particular scene, it might come off as too obvious (of a flashback).
Quoted from dogglebe In regards to the flashback, it would simply be easier to put the year in the header if it's in the distant past:
EXT. MAIN STREET. DAY (1979).
This way you don't have to explain that everything you see is from the period. |
I thought about this, but again, felt too obvious. Thanks for the suggestions - think I've figured it out. If the audience is confused, then my goal will be complete. |
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George Willson |
Posted: March 1st, 2006, 6:12pm |
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Of The Ancients Doctor who? Yes, quite right.
LocationBroken Arrow Posts3591 Posts Per Day 0.51 |
If the audience is confused, then my goal will be complete. |
I believe a greater goal will be instilling confusion during the story, but bring order to the confusion once the story is complete. |
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Alexander |
Posted: March 1st, 2006, 6:44pm |
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Right - wouldn't want to leave anything unanswered or misleading.
It's becoming a more difficult thought-task than I anticipated - that is, coming up with a way to explain something confusing without dumbing the audience down and coming right out with it. |
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George Willson |
Posted: March 1st, 2006, 7:03pm |
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Of The Ancients Doctor who? Yes, quite right.
LocationBroken Arrow Posts3591 Posts Per Day 0.51 |
I would to ensure it is fully explained first. If the explanation is too much then you'll either notice it on rewrites or someone will catch it on a read. Priority one is for the story to make sense. |
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Old Time Wesley |
Posted: June 15th, 2006, 1:14am |
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LocationOntario, Canada Posts2908 Posts Per Day 0.38 |
If you start a screenplay in a flashback of the character at a younger age do you need to describe hair and stuff or will that only matter when you see them at the age where you will follow them through the adventure? |
| Practice safe lunch: Use a condiment. |
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tomson |
Posted: June 15th, 2006, 1:29am |
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You need to desribe what we see, it doesn't matter what time in the script it happens. If it's a young kid for example, he'll probably look totally different than the older character. |
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guyjackson |
Posted: June 15th, 2006, 1:37am |
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From the script V for Vendetta written by Larry and Andy Wachowski
FADE IN:
INT. SUBURBAN HOUSE
A young Evey sits on her father's lap, combing her Barbie's hair.
EVEY (V.O.) I was born near the end of the millennium, the year 1997. My father used to say that people were so afraid that the world was going to end that they were willing it to happen.
(A few pages later)
EXT. EVEY'S APARTMENT
There is a radio on a small makeup table.
FATE (V.O.) -- that Braxton and Streathon are quarantine zones as of today.
Evey is now a young woman. She slips into a dress that is little more than a nightgown. She tries to adjust it, pulling it down at the hem, pulling it up at the thin shoulder straps, but it is like trying to hide behind a lamppost.
From what I see it really doesn't matter. The Wachowskis are more credible than anyone on here and this was a "spec script" because they weren't even the directors. I don't think I have ever described a character's appearence in more than one line. It's a personal choice, I think. Some people here think that is more important, but I really don't. A young character is a young character. Unless his/her appearance is absolutely necessary for the progression of the story, who cares? That's how I write.
Then again, nearly everyone on here is a Nazi when it comes to "proper formatting" anyway so maybe I'm wrong. |
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dogglebe |
Posted: June 15th, 2006, 7:35am |
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If you start with a voice over, stating it was twenty years ago, or simply with SUPER: TWENTY YEARS AGO, you don't have to describe everything. It's understood that everything is within that period of time.
You may want to describe a character in a way that we'll know it's him/herself later on. In the second, or third Indiana Jones movie, it opened with a flashback trying to recover a stolen artifact and how he first got that hat of his. The hat is used as a transition to present day (his present day, anyway).
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alffy |
Posted: September 18th, 2006, 3:34pm |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
Any help here would be helpful.
I have two main characters, one with a scar on his forehead. During my second act I have a flashback scene involving two young boys. These are the two main characters as children, and ends with one suffering a head injury.
My question is, do I use character names like 'Young ....' or use their 'name' from the outset. I ask this because I it isn't clear to the viewer who they are during the flashback until its conclusion.
This has baffled me for some time and I keep going back to it and changing it.
Hope I explained it well enough. Any help please... |
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dogglebe |
Posted: September 18th, 2006, 3:54pm |
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Young Bob and Young Steve would be fine.
Phil |
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alffy |
Posted: September 19th, 2006, 5:04am |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
Cheers for the response phil.
I wasn't sure if I was supposed to keep it a secret from the reader as well as the viewer until they work it out for themselves. |
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Vanstein |
Posted: September 19th, 2006, 2:08pm |
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New Go deep inside this mind of mine
LocationArgentina Posts8 Posts Per Day 0.00 |
how do i introduce a flashback? |
| [b][/b][face=Sans-Serif][/face][color=red][/color] VANSTEIN |
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Nixon |
Posted: September 19th, 2006, 2:17pm |
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Old Timer
LocationWashington Posts1395 Posts Per Day 0.24 |
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| Though earth and man are gone, I thought the cube would last forever. I WAS WRONG. |
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George Willson |
Posted: September 19th, 2006, 10:46pm |
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Of The Ancients Doctor who? Yes, quite right.
LocationBroken Arrow Posts3591 Posts Per Day 0.51 |
It actually isn't necessary to specify that they are young in the character names. The description should be sufficient as well as the information given that we are in a flashback. If you describe the characters as 10 (or whatever) and then indicate that we've gone ahead a few years and now they're 30, then it'll be obvious. The key is to use the same character name for every character all the way through. Only use the YOUNG designator if the script continually flips back and forth between present and past and it is needed to be clear. But even in The Butterfly Effect (script that is online) Evan is always referred as just Evan regardless of his age. |
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alffy |
Posted: September 20th, 2006, 5:29am |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
Cheers for the advice. I've read over many posts on this subject and there are many opinions on what is right and what is wrong. I read one that seems to suit but unsure if its acceptable. It said its good to let the audience AND the reader to work out who people are for themselves. I dont want to tell viewer OR reader the young characters are the two main characters, i want them to work it out at the end of the scene. It SO confusing!! At the moment I have no indication its a flashback and the characters are introduced as two young boys. When they have dialouge its OLDER BOY and YOUNGER BOY. |
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alffy |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 10:35am |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
Sorry if this has been asked before but I did search the forum but couldn't find an answer.
my question is;
I started my script with two characters in their twenties, then have a flashback but I haven't indicated it as being a flashback. The two characters are now younger but again I haven't introduced them as being the same people until the end of the flashback when their names are used. Is this wrong?
Also after this short flashback I continue with the characters being in the twenties again. How do I make it aware that they we are now back to their older age/
this may read as complicated but I wanted it to be a surprise that the children were the two characters. Should this not be a surprise to the reader also?
Hope someone can follow this and offer some advice. |
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dogglebe |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 11:29am |
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If you don't want the moviegoer to know until the end, you should write that way for the reader. Just make sure it's clear when you're done.
And don't include FLASHBACK in the header.
Phil |
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alffy |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 11:51am |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
cheers phil, thats what I was going for. I just dont know how to continue when i jump forward again. the characters are now older again so should i indicate this and how? |
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dogglebe |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 12:02pm |
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Just use a header where the story continues. Include PRESENT at the end of it.
Phil |
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Zack |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 12:12pm |
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January Project Group
LocationErlanger, KY Posts4503 Posts Per Day 0.69 |
Would you use PAST for the opening header of the flashback, since you use PRESENT in the end header? |
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dogglebe |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 12:35pm |
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You can include the year in the header:
EXT. JOE'S GARAGE. 1976
You don't have to describe everything as period if you do this. It'll be understood.
Phil |
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Zack |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 12:42pm |
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January Project Group
LocationErlanger, KY Posts4503 Posts Per Day 0.69 |
Cool, that doesn't sound very hard. Thanks phil. |
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Andy Petrou |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 12:52pm |
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Been Around
Posts697 Posts Per Day 0.10 |
Hey there, I wrote a short for one of the one week challenges - it had flashbacks and according to the readers, I did an ok job of conveying the flashbacks well and I put "flashback" in my header. Some of the reviewers seemed to think it was fine that way, can't seem to find many objections about it in my thread. (I didn't go back and re-write the script without the "Cut-to's" etc, but please ignore them!!) Script thread - http://www.simplyscripts.net/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?m-1121873212/"House of Fun" Script, direct link - http://www.simplyscripts.com/scripts/houseoffun.RTFHope it helps in some way. I have another short which has a montage scene in it, and again, it seemed to work ok according to the readers here. Andy x |
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alffy |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 1:55pm |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
Thanks everyone for the advice. |
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dogglebe |
Posted: April 2nd, 2007, 8:51pm |
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In my first feature posted here, The Burnout, I used seven flashbacks, two of which were from the same moment in time but told through different perspectives. Phil |
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tweak |
Posted: May 2nd, 2007, 8:32pm |
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Posts76 Posts Per Day 0.01 |
I have seen these done two ways now.
1) dates in the scene taglines 2) flashbacks written as such
I am seeing the dates more and more. Is this the preferred way to handle them? |
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dogglebe |
Posted: May 2nd, 2007, 8:41pm |
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Unless an exact date is needed (like a time traveller going back to the day Kennedy was assassinated), I would just include FLASHBACK in the header. If you can slip the date into the scene or dialogue, all the better.
Phil |
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Reply: 92 - 102 |
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alffy |
Posted: May 29th, 2007, 9:09am |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
What if you don't initially want the viewer to be aware it's a flashback, unless they work it out of course?
Like you don't realise it's a younger version of a main character and it only becomes obvious at the end of the flashback. Would you still include FLASHBACK in the Slug? |
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Reply: 93 - 102 |
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dogglebe |
Posted: May 29th, 2007, 9:23am |
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Then just write it as a scene, but leave some indication somewhere that it was a flashback. Otherwise, it'll confuse people.
Phil |
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Reply: 94 - 102 |
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alffy |
Posted: May 29th, 2007, 1:09pm |
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Old Timer
LocationThe bleak North East, England Posts2187 Posts Per Day 0.33 |
Cheers Phil, that's how it is at the moment so i'll leave it be. |
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Reply: 95 - 102 |
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sniper |
Posted: November 18th, 2007, 3:02pm |
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Old Timer My UZI Weighs A Ton
LocationNorthern Hemisphere Posts2249 Posts Per Day 0.48 |
I've been looking through this thread for some info about Dream Sequences, but most of this thread seems to be focused on Flashbacks.
Anyway, my question is this: Is it okay to write a dream sequence without telling the reader that they are about to read a dream sequence? I wanna pull a fast one on the reader and I will, of course, make it very clear later that it was a dream sequence. |
| Down in the hole / Jesus tries to crack a smile / Beneath another shovel load |
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Reply: 96 - 102 |
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Scar Tissue Films |
Posted: November 18th, 2007, 7:09pm |
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Posts3382 Posts Per Day 0.63 |
Of course.
You can do anything you want.
That particular technique is fairly common I would say. |
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Reply: 97 - 102 |
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dogglebe |
Posted: November 18th, 2007, 7:18pm |
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Man Without a Face had a great dream sequence that didn't let on it was a dream sequence until after it was over.
Phil |
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Reply: 98 - 102 |
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sniper |
Posted: November 19th, 2007, 2:36am |
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Old Timer My UZI Weighs A Ton
LocationNorthern Hemisphere Posts2249 Posts Per Day 0.48 |
Thanks a lot guys. |
| Down in the hole / Jesus tries to crack a smile / Beneath another shovel load |
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Reply: 99 - 102 |
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slabstaa |
Posted: December 17th, 2007, 4:22pm |
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Say if you were writing a script where a substantial amount of your main characters ended up dying, but then you wrote a few more pages from a time where days were better...kinda like The Godfather II....is that done anymore? |
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Reply: 100 - 102 |
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dogglebe |
Posted: December 17th, 2007, 4:51pm |
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Like Reservoir Dogs?
Flashbacks are a little difficult to write. Keep them to a minimum if you need to use them.
Phil |
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Reply: 101 - 102 |
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slabstaa |
Posted: December 17th, 2007, 7:30pm |
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No, Dogs wouldn't be it....imo, its completely different from what I'm thinking.
Say if Godfather II didn't jump back and forth from the past to the present, but only kept the Christmas dinner scene at the end. That's what I mean. I'm toying around with something like that. |
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Reply: 102 - 102 |
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