Punch and Judy by Rick Kinsella (decadencefilms'37.com) - Short, Thriller - A savagely good suspense thriller that asks the question; Is it possible to change the world with a puppet show? 17 pages - pdf, format 8)

As soon as I saw the title for this one I knew straight off who it belonged to. (yeah I confess, I've been stalking your website for over a year now.)

Hi Rick and thanks for giving us at SS the oportunity to read it.

This story you have here is just gross and sick and evil. The writing for this was very nice. I like very much.

The ending was very obvious- sort of. You could see where this was going but that's what made it so compelling. Because you just didn't want to go there. You have the first half of the script where a Punch and Judy scene is acted out and you could see early on that Thomas was going to go all "Punch and Judy" on his family with some sort of whack whacker.

But once you knew where you were going and the script got there I just felt the act of violence felt restrained and didn't live up to the build up you create for most of the script. You go to so much trouble building up the anticpation of the Punch violence, why have the actual act happen off screen like it is something to be ashamed of? I wanna see Joans skull collapse under the impact of the bat and see her face cave in. Take out the kid too.  

But I have seen one of your short films and I know as a director you will crank up the drama and emotional intensity and make this story truely horrible and distressing to watch.

Now the one problem I did have with this was the page length. I just felt you could reel it in a bit and tighten the story up just a bit. As it is, it's just stretched out a bit. I feel the story you have does not warrent so many pages as you have.

Another thing to mention, it not important but I felt the last bit at the end where Thomas reveal his ambition should be done in a zany imitation of Punch and have Thomas perform like a caricture of Punch puppet rather then as himself with the big villian speech.

But yeah awesome script and love the concept of where art becomes life.      

Hey Rick, can't believe you posted something!!

I'll be sure to read it tomorrow probably. I'm not at my best at the moment! ;-)

I'll look forward to tear your script apart!  ;D

Hey Rick, I loved the visuals in this script. Some really sinister images you created with the light etc. One of my favourite films is an Anthony Hopkins film called 'Magic', I saw similarities with this script here.

The story itself is quite predictable. I mean, you know that it's going to end in a real life punch and judy by the end of the first couple of pages. I don't see that as a major problem but I would maybe take it a little further. I just felt the end was a bit of a let down. I thought you could have done more with Timmy in the end - not kill or hurt him but maybe have Thomas force him to take the final shot at his Mom. You know, to prove who's side he's on.

The writing was superb and I imagine (you're a writer/director yeah?) you're going to be filming this yourself. I think you've got a very good, low budget horror movie here. My only real thought is to work on the ending a little. Glenn may have a point about the page count too.

Ste

Hi Guys,

Cheers for the reads. Thought I'd give you all a chance for revenge.

Glenn,

"The ending was very obvious- sort of. You could see where this was going but that's what made it so compelling"

Yeah, it's very predictable. That as unavoidable I think. One thing that i think I've made a mistake with is to have the Punch and Judy Professsor as the protagonist. Looking at it now, I think the story should have been told from Joan's point of view, so we care more about what happens to her.

"But once you knew where you were going and the script got there I just felt the act of violence felt restrained and didn't live up to the build up you create for most of the script. You go to so much trouble building up the anticpation of the Punch violence, why have the actual act happen off screen like it is something to be ashamed of? I wanna see Joans skull collapse under the impact of the bat and see her face cave in. Take out the kid too.   "

Interesting comment, because that's exactly how the script ended up until very recently. I put it in as a pitch and decided to tone it down at the last minute because I couldn't see them giving me money for killing a kid! The kid and his mum were used as a living puppet show then killed.

Clearly the rest of the film still sets that up. I think I'll restore the savagery judging by the comments.

"Now the one problem I did have with this was the page length. I just felt you could reel it in a bit and tighten the story up just a bit. As it is, it's just stretched out a bit. I feel the story you have does not warrent so many pages as you have."

Yeah. The problem I've always had with this script is that a nice family man goes pyscho very quickly. It's difficult to have such a dramatic character arc over just a few pages and each time I've attempted it, it seems unbelievable to a jarring degree. If you've got any suggestions on where to make cuts, fire away.

"Another thing to mention, it not important but I felt the last bit at the end where Thomas reveal his ambition should be done in a zany imitation of Punch and have Thomas perform like a caricture of Punch puppet rather then as himself with the big villian speech."

That's the intention anyway. By the end he's even dressed as Punch (He puts the clothes on for his big show).

Hi Ste

"The story itself is quite predictable. I mean, you know that it's going to end in a real life punch and judy by the end of the first couple of pages. I don't see that as a major problem but I would maybe take it a little further. I just felt the end was a bit of a let down. I thought you could have done more with Timmy in the end - not kill or hurt him but maybe have Thomas force him to take the final shot at his Mom. You know, to prove who's side he's on."

Yeah, I think I'll have to take the film to its natural conclusion and make it more horrific. Interesting point about Timmy. That's one thing that never occurred to me. That fits in with the theme perfectly.

Cheers, Rick.

Yeah Rick, I got a suggestion where to make cuts. During Editing the footage in post production.  

And what I meant by cuts was just shave off a bit here and a bit there. Like for example I think Joan tell her husband he waste his time play with doll just one to many. Just little thing like that, shave a bit off until you drop a page or two.

I hope this helps.

Hey Rick,

Good to see that you've posted something.  Overall I thought it would play pretty well on film.  I don't really think the length is that much of an issue.  You have a lot of detail in there that is stretching the page count but since you are shooting this yourself, you kind of would want that detail in there.

I think that it's going to be pretty obvious while watching this film that this is going to be a real life Punch and Judy.  So, my first suggestion is, since you already have Joan - why not give Thomas a name starting with P.  This way they are P and J all the way.

My second and last issue is a bit harder to pinpoint.  It has to do with characters.  I think Thomas is well-developed as a character.  

Little Timmy is not.  I know the baby usually isn't in Commedia but I don't think you intended this to be pure Commedia and Timmy is an important character. Since he has to make an important choice, I would like to see more of his relationship with his mother.

Joan, herself, is an interesting character.  However, since at the end it seems to me that you want us to sympatise with her, I think you might need to set her up slightly differently. Once again she hits the Judy character spot-on, nagging her husband, etc.  But by the time we get to the end, I didn't have any sympathy for her.  I think she needs to be bit more understanding up front so we have a reason to feel for her later.

That's it.  Nicely done.  I look forward to seeing the film.    

"Little Timmy is not.  I know the baby usually isn't in Commedia but I don't think you intended this to be pure Commedia and Timmy is an important character. Since he has to make an important choice, I would like to see more of his relationship with his mother."

Yeah. i agree. It's hard to find a balance between keeping it short and fully developing the characters. The story isn't strong enough for a longer film, but it's hard to develop three sympathetic characters in a short space. I left Timmy as a symbol of the future rather than trying to develop him as a character, but I'll have another look at it.

"Joan, herself, is an interesting character.  However, since at the end it seems to me that you want us to sympatise with her, I think you might need to set her up slightly differently. Once again she hits the Judy character spot-on, nagging her husband, etc.  But by the time we get to the end, I didn't have any sympathy for her.  I think she needs to be bit more understanding up front so we have a reason to feel for her later."

Again, I think you're right. The script has been through an almost infinite number of changes in terms of the story line. It's got to a point where I'm trying to give it one last shot before i bin it forever.

The story that it's settled on should actually be written from Joans point of view. She's the antagonist at the moment, the obstacle to the main characters goals. It should be the other way round. She should be trying to save the family and her crazy husband is destroying it.


I've had more problems with this script than all the others I've written put together. I was trying to bend it into what I wanted as a filmmaker rather than just telling the story as it should naturally develop. I was aware that the basement scenes would have great visual atmosphere, but that the atmosphere would drop badly when it went upstairs, so I tried to tell the story from downstairs up if you like.

I had problems with this script from the very beginning.  Problems with the formatting and with the story.


SPOILER SPACE


Your first line of description:  A puppeteers workshop. It resembles a mad professors Laboratory just doesn't make sense to me.  A mad scientist's lab should have the test tubes and jars and computers and those things that contstantly give off sparks.  A puppeteers workshop (whether insane or not) should be filled with various carpentry tools and hundreds of puppet heads whose eyes follow you around the room.

A few paragraphs later, you wrote As he holds it up, the puppet is
silhouetted in light that shines from candles.  This leads me to believe that the story takes place a long time ago.  This caused confusion for me when Thomas later talked about single mothers and disrespectful kids.  It wasn't until the television was mentioned that I accepted that this script took place in present day.

I also think you should include your characters' ages when you describe them.  I pictured Thomas being in his seventies when you introduced him.

WTF is a swazzle?  Really!  And the electric fire?  WTF?

On page 13, I think you described Thomas impersonating Joan incorrectly.  It should be more like this:

             THOMAS (CONT'D)
    (mimicking Joan)
We need the money Thomas...  It's just a
story Thomas. It's violent, misogynistic.
    (normal)
Every turn you've been there stopping me.
Whispering in my ear like the Devil himself.


On page 16, Thomas tells Joan that she will be the first disciple of a new religion.  Shouldn't that be martyr?

On the same page, you wrote Timmy walks reluctantly behind his father.
Thomas films him as he walks towards him.  How does Thomas film his son who's walking up behind him?  This confused me.

The story was a good one, though I thought it draged on a bit.  Joan sounded like a stuck record, telling Thomas about their circumstances.  I think that, if you were trim the fat away, you could cut five pages from it.

Characterization, I thought, was good.  Thomas was well developed and I saw the relation between him and his wife.  Timmy was very natural as a child; I'm glad that he didn't try to be a hero at the end.  I thought the ending, however, needed a little better pay off.

Hope this helps.


Phil

Cheers for the read Phil,

You make some good points.

I've basically ballsed up the entire opening scene. I changed it for a pitch at the last minute and I've put numerous problems in by doing so.

The first line was trying to suggest exactly what you wrote. I can see your problem with it. It's like Frankensteins laboratory but with Puppets and carpentry tools instead of test tubes, scalpels and body parts.

The point about the time frame is understandable. On screen it will be obvious it's set in the present day. The candles are because he's a traditionalist, it's just a symbol of his old way of thinking.

The point about the ages is again a correct one. They've just been lost as I've moved stuff around. It's a result of the fact I know what they'll look like so I just got to the point that I forgot I needed them for other peoples benefit.

The electric fire is missing in the opening scene as well. He turns it on when he sits down.

Fair point about Timmy's walk. Geographically he is hugging his mother in the scene, in front of Thomas. He then walks behind Thomas and Thomas films him during the action. I'll make that more easily understood.

"Joan sounded like a stuck record, telling Thomas about their circumstances"

The problem I've had with this script is that I've been trying to bend it to fit circumstances. I wanted to shoot a film in one location so that I could concentrate on lighting and atmosphere. I started writing this damn thing about two years ago.

Because he never leaves the house, the only antagonists become his own sanity and his wife. So it's hard to give him a reason to mentally degrade without it being expositional if you take away the antagonism from his wife.

If I was writing it without a limit on location, we would see him take his show on the road and see the reaction to it of the public and that would replace the need for the antagonism from Joan.

It's been a script that every time I've corrected one problem, another two have appeared in its place.

Everyone seems a little disappointed with the ending, so I'll stiffen that up considerably.

If you can be bothered I'd be interested to see the specific cuts you'd make.

Rick.

P.S A swazzle is a reed like device used by Punch and Judy Professors in their shows to distort their voice. Apparently, unless you use a swazzle in your show, then the proper Punch and Judy Professors don't consider it an actual Punch and Judy show, it's just a Puppet show.

:)

Hey Rick,

I've been thinking about this and was wondering how it might be if you went totally pure on the Commedia with it.  Instead of worrying about all the modern emotional bang, what if you went for an more authentic Punch and Judy experience?

You could start the story in the middle of the story, so to speak.  Don't show us that their financial problems are building.  Show us that they've been around for a while.

I saw that you were trying to keep the locations at a minimum, and it worked.

E-mail me the script, as a doc or fdr file, so I can play with it.


Phil

Hey Rick,

I'll guess I'll be the first one to say I have no idea who Punch and Judy are. Never heard of them before...  Just wasn't big in Sweden I guess...

Anyway, I liked the story and I liked how it escalated at a steady pace throughout all the way into complete insanity.

I agree with Cornetto that I would have liked to feel sympathy with Joan in the end. I did a little bit, but she seemed like a nagging bitch in the beginning and I had a hard time to get on her side in the end.

I do disagree with Cornetto about Timmy though. Even though I didn't "know" him real well, he was the one I was concerned for and felt strongly about when he had to watch his mother getting beaten to death. I didn't like that part at all. A mother thing, I guess.  :-)

About the length of the script, I didn't have a problem with it at all. I think it would automatically be at least three pages or so shorter if you had been a little tighter in your writing. At the same time your writing could be trimmed, you waste space by doing things like

WHAM!

WHAM!

WHAM!

WHAM!

When that could easily have been written as WHAM WHAM WHAM WHAM on one line.

Ditto that for some of the dialogue

CHARACTER
talkie talkie talkie

(BEAT)
CHARACTER (CONT'D)
talkie talkie talkie

Anyway, I liked the story and it's dark disturbed story and tone. Don't worry about the length. You're producing/directing this so there's no real need to write in in an extremely economical and easy, fast read way intended for studio readers.

Good luck with it and please let us know when we can watch it some place.

Pia :-)

Chers for the read Pia,

"I agree with Cornetto that I would have liked to feel sympathy with Joan in the end. I did a little bit, but she seemed like a nagging b**** in the beginning and I had a hard time to get on her side in the end."

I'll have a look at Joan. Should be fairly easy to make her more sympathetic. Only problem is that in the structure it's in now, it may lose an antagonisitc force. I may have to make it more of a story about Joan and use Thomas as the antagonist.

"I do disagree with Cornetto about Timmy though. Even though I didn't "know" him real well, he was the one I was concerned for and felt strongly about when he had to watch his mother getting beaten to death. I didn't like that part at all. A mother thing, I guess."

I'm thinking that there'll be a greater sympathy for the child on screen than on the page. Watching a blubbering child in that situation will be more unsettling than on the page and evoke more sympathy. That's my hope at least. I may give him slightly more to do though.  

Anyway, cheers for the review.

Quoted from Grandma Bear At the same time your writing could be trimmed, you waste space by doing things like WHAM! WHAM! WHAM! WHAM! When that could easily have been written as WHAM WHAM WHAM WHAM on one line.

I think that, by placing all the WHAMs together, I picture Joan getting quick smacks on the head.  By separating each one, I picture a wind-up with each hit.


Phil

Yeah, that was why I did it.

i thought it was more accurate as regards the screen time.

My comment was more in regard to someone complaining that 17 minutes was too long for this. What I meant was, if this script was trimmed some in its descriptions and such, it would automatically shave a couple of pages off. In other words, this short would not play on film as long as the page count suggests.... Does that make sense or did I just make the water murkier?  ;D

I understand what you're saying. It's just that Phil's interpretation was the correct one. I'm imagining Punch really winding up between whacks rather than just quickly banging on Judy's head in rapid succession.

So the screen time will run like I'd written that segment and I'd be cheating by doing it like you did.

I tend to write my films to as close to 1 minute per page as possible, so I'd imagine if filmed as it is, it would run at the exact length that it currently is.

So around 16 minutes 30. Any long description I use is intended to give an idea of the length of the shot intended. So I'll probably make cuts in the length by removing scenes, rtaher than trying to cut it in post.

Hi Rick,

Just read your script and thought it was very good.  Great visuals, good dialogue.  Quick & easy to read.  Well written overall.

Your story was a unique story and very interesting.  It's the ending I think needs more to it.  I was thinking what's going to happen next?  Especially for little Timmy.  The kids just lost his mum and he's holding his dad's hand.  If the kid is say 4/5.  He'll be devastated, crying his head off.  With Timmy talking his dad's hand, it felt like he's accepted the situation and moved on.

Even though I feel the ending is unresolved, I think the rest of your story is very good.

All the best,


Javier

I'm not really sure what to make of your script.  I'm going to be honest and say that I basically knew where it was going the minute Joan was introduced.  And so, for me, it really became an experience of thinking "Ok, when is she going to die?" in my mind, the whole way through.  And then when she did die, I was more like "Ok, she's dead...that's pretty depressing."

For me, I didn't really know what I was supposed to be feeling during the script.  I went from thinking that Thomas was a crazy nut (and disliking him for it) to thinking that Joan is a nagging annoyance (and disliking her for it).  Perhaps you could make us kind of feel something for Thomas?  Show that his intentions are good (to change the world), but he's off his fucking nut.  You might have been trying to do that, but I just felt like he was evil the whole time.

So I don't really know what I'd suggest to remedy this script.  Basically, it would take a whole new track, not resulting in his wife's death.  And if it were going to, you'd have to mask it early on.  But you have to understand, a lot of stories have been told like this, so it was pretty easy to see where it was going.

Sorry for the rambling.  It's sometimes harder to organize my thoughts for shorts because I'm hit with so much in such a short amount of time, and the ending is usually WAY more important for such a small time frame.

Cheers for the read Dressel,

I agree that it is a predictable. What I was going for was the feeling of suspense, you knew it was going to happen, but I wanted to build the tension as it went.

It's a common problem for people that Joan is annoying. I am forced to agree and that obviously harms the tension as well...

...The ending is a let down for everyone in one way or another, so there's only one solution:

Re-write!!!

Make it less predictable and a lot more violent.

First time I've read it in a year or so. I can see lots of bits and pieces to change. I did buzz off Thomas though, I have to admit. The right actor will have a field day with him.

Hey Rick, just found this, thought I’d give it a read.

I took page by page notes, which are mostly grammatical/technical things, and I know you probably don’t give a shit about them, since you’ll be filming this yourself.  I have an editing background, so I just can’t help myself…sorry.

I’ve also read all the feedback, and firstly, I want to say that I had similar feelings to Phil’s initial post.  Some of your descriptions didn’t work for me or make sense.   Omitting the ages of your characters was also a problem, IMO, as I couldn’t visualize anyone.

Story-wise, I liked this.  Puppets are creepy, IMO, and you have unlimited opportunities here to ratchet up the creep level in the basement scenes.  I don’t feel you’ve adequately done that on a written level, but I’m sure you’ll pull it off successfully in a filmed version.

I don’t think Thomas should be a full on “hunchback”.   It’s to cliché that he is going to be evil. I also doubt he’d be in a normal relationship with a normal woman, but I could be way off on this theory.  I feel his transgression into a scary psycho would be more effective if he came off as more of a normal person right off the bat.

I agree with the others that the end is somewhat of a letdown.  I’m not sure you need to show the actual violence, but the way its worded just didn’t quite work for me.  A possible idea is to have the camera on Timmy’s face as he’s delivering the blows…maybe something in Timmy’s eyes lets us know that Timmy will follow in his father’s footsteps.  I don’t know…tough call, but the way it is now didn’t work the way I think it could and should.

The dialogue was pretty good, IMO, but I’m not a fan of such big blocks of dialogue being spoken by 1 character. ..which brings up another issue of debate.  A few mentioned the running time, as well as page length.  First of all, I agree that it could be trimmed down, page-wise.  You said that it would pan out to be pretty close to 1 page equaling 1 minute of film.  Dialogue is deceiving, when it comes to run time, IMO.  Short lines of back and forth dialogue go very quickly in a filmed version, but take up more space, based on the fact that you have to continually use the character’s name in a dialogue box, as well as the empty lines.  But long blocks of dialogue, spoken by 1 character, actually takes up more time, just based on how we speak, but takes up little space, per the fact that there aren’t any blank lines or need for continual character names in dialogue boxes.  A quarter page of unbroken dialogue takes way more than 15 seconds of film time, but takes up such a small amount of space.  There’s a lot of dialogue here and a lot of long blocks of dialogue. Not sure how this would actually pan out in film time, but I think it’s something to think about.

Characters –I thought they were pretty good.  It’s tough to get much across in a short like this.  I’m not sure why most didn’t like Joan. I did like her and think she came off very real and believable.  I was fearing for her, more than Timmy, cause Timmy didn’t do much, nor did he speak.

Overall – I liked it, and I usually don’t say that.  I’d play up the creepiness of the puppets, as well as Thomas’ descent into madness.  I’d alter the end for more impact, and I’d cut down on the long blocks of dialogue, as best you can.  I also agree that Thomas should be more in “character” with Punch and speak in creepy/insane ways in the finale.

Good effort here.  Best of luck with this.

Page by page notes

Page1 – No age given for Thomas.  Without an age, it’s impossible for a reader to get a visual.  EDIT – No ages given for anyone, which IMO, is a problem…especially when you’ve got a young kid involved, as ages for children are very important in terms of what they’re doing in life, and how they talk/act.

I’m not a fan of blocks of text over 4 lines.  This 6 liner has an obvious break in the 4th line.

Page 6 – “JUDY and the BABY are surrounding PUNCH, shouting at him:” – Very unnecessarily passive.  Easy fix by replacing “are surrounding” with “surround”

“Punch is shrivelling under the pressure.” – Same thing here, also, spelling error (shriveling).  Should just be “shrivels”.

Page  7 – The title comes in at Page 7?  Almost half way through your script.   I don’t like that at all, and don’t see why you’d wait this long…or even give a prompt for the title in a short like this.  EDIT – Is this supposed to be the tile of the short film he’s showing? It doesn’t read that way, IMO.

I also don’t like camera directions, even though I’m sure this is here cause you’re going to be filming this yourself?  IMO, no need for this stuff in a spec script.

2 examples in a row of “starts to” – I am always against using these types of phrases.

Why is “the baby” showing up as “the BABY” again and again?

General note – An awful lot of missing punctuation in terms of apostrophes, showing possession.

Page 8 – Why is “ON SCREEN” right aligned?

“Punch is walks…” – take out “is”

“began to” – Argh!

Page 9 – “Thomas turns of the projector light and walks over to the wall to turn on the main light.” – “of” should be “off”.  Also, this is an awkwardly phrased sentence, IMO.

General note – Am I to assume this is the entire “movie” being shown?  It’s like 1 minute long?  What is Thomas thinking?  I don’t get it.

Page 11 – comma between “me” and “you”.

“starts to cry…” – I just dislike these “starts to” things so much.  No place for them in a script, IMO.

Page 12 – “period” missing after “yourself”.

Page 13 – “He needs and education…” - “and” should be “an”

“Thomas walks over to work surface. Puts his dolls down.” – missing “the” between “to” and “work” – also, this should be 1 sentence, connected with a comma.

“He grabs some paint from on his desk and starts to apply it to the face of Joan.” – Very awkward – “Joan’s face”

Page 15 – An incorrect break in the long dialogue block.

“Timmy and Joan are crying.” – Sounds bad this way…way too passive.

Good review Jeff.

I'm glad you liked it. It is aimed at the likes of you, after all.

All the formatting points are correct as usual.

You picked on a point that I wasn't sure how to convey: The 1 minute movie.

Obviously I couldn't have a longer film as it would be intrusive and boring. I also thought that if I did something like start off the film and show that they (Timmy and Joan) didn't like it and he fast forwarded it to the end or something, it would just waste time as well. So I settled on him making a stupid, OTT film that tried to deal with a serious issue that failed and hoped people would just accept the inherent absurdity of it.

I do like the script myself, I have to admit. It's far from perfect, but the idea of this nutter dressed in a stupid outfit killing his wife and thinking he can take over the world from his basement makes me laugh. I suppose there's a bit of us all in there somewhere...

I think you could be right about the dialogue running time, it's one of the reasons I want to cut it down a bit.

Yeah, Rick, I agree, the 1 minute movie thing is an issue, and a tough thing to "fix".  Maybe if you were to show just certain "scenes" from it...or flashes of it...the violence, the absurdity...make sure "we" know that you're only showing bits and pieces of it, it would be more effective, or realistic.

You touched on a good point in your rebuttal here, and one that I don't think is played up enough...

The real story here is that Thomas is indeed whacked and does think he can change the world through his puppeteering. It's definitely touched upon in several places, but for me, it didn't really hit home until you just said what you said...the way you said it, if that makes sense.

IMO, he is already crazy but just hasn't quite gone over the edge.  Maybe an event pushes him over.  I kind of was led to believe that, based on his movie, that Joan was cheating on him (kind of back to my issue with him being a hunchback, with a normal woman - maybe she's been cheating all along, but just now got caught).  It almost came across that the reason he showed her the movie, was to let her know that he knew, and what he ended up doing, was based on that knowledge.  I don't know...maybe an incriminating call, a letter...something that would literally push him over that threshold into stark raving madman, capable of brutally killing his wife in front of their son.

Potential is definitely here for lots of creepy and freaky scares.  Hope it all works itself out.

Jeff,

I made all the corrections you suggested. Just wanted you to know that you didn't waste your time.

One thing:

The camera directions. I can understand your point about using them in spec scripts and it's a common complaint that I see.

Personally I follow my own rule that if I have to take more than 30 secs to a minute to think of something different, I just leave it in.

Just for purely academic purposes, what would you do instead?

The transition is a decent one to me. Push into the puppets eye so the screen goes black. This gives the impression that the film has come from Punch's imagination which foreshadows/supports Thomas's descent into madness. It also cuts out the need to show all the mechanics of him creating the film itself. The Pull back then gives us a nice establishing shot for the next scene.

I tend to find that it can take a very long time to try and find another way to say it and often it's not as clear as to what is supposed to be going on.

So, what would you write?

Rick

Rick, I totally understand your "rule".  It usually does take longer than that to come up with an alternative, and if you're shooting it yourself, who cares, right?

I'm not sure I follow you from there...you ask what would I do instead...instead of what?  The camera directions, or the use of the 1 minute movie?  Let me know exactly what you're asking here.

Also, not sure what you're referring to in your next paragraph.  Is this an idea you have for eliminating the movie, or what?  If so, I think it is a good idea.  But, you have to make sure that Joan and Timmy are in the basement for some reason and Joan says something to set Thomas off.

Let me know exactly what you're saying here and I'll give you my $.03.

I'm talking about the camera directions.

I'm not talking about eliminating the movie.

The only camera directions in the script were when Thomas has found the camera and starts to play with it. It pushes into to Punch's eye and then pulls back out to the basement, later on.

What I said  above explains the transition.

I'm just wondering how you'd replace the camera directions.  

Oh, OK, gotcha.  I'll give it a look.

So, you're referring to these lines, right?

"The camera turns on with a PING, framing Punch's face. The camera tracks in until the black pupil fills the screen… "

"The camera pulls back."

The end result would be fine for both of these. I agree with you that it is a good transition.

To me, though, for a spec script, it's actually a bit confusing, because when I read "the camera...", and I know that Thomas just pulled out a video camera in the script, I'm not sure if you're referring to Thomas' camera, or the one you're going to be using to actually shoot this.  Know what I'm saying?

Here's an idea off the top of my head...This is actually a "through Thomas' video camera shot", right?  A POV, even, if I'm reading this correctly.

"The camera tracks in until the black pupil fills the screen… " - This line could easily be replaced with something like this..."Closer and closer, until Punch's black pupil fills the entire screen..."

As for "The camera pulls back." - I personally prefer something like this, "Pull back to reveal..."

I just don't like using the words "the camera", unless you're referring to an actual camera being used, and this is why I feel it could be confusing in your script.

Hi Rick. Thought I'd give this a read. Is this your only work onsite/
I read some of the other comments but not all.
I thought your writing was pretty concise and easy to read. Like most of the other readers, it was sort of inevitable what the outcome was gonna be. Though I did harbour thoughts that maybe Joan would survive, maybe even kill Thomas? No...

The problem to me seemed that Joan and Timmy(who wasn't intro'ed in CAPS - don't think anyone mentioned that) were held prisoner way too early, thus telegraphing how it would pan out.
Perhaps you could show Thomas out in public, acting weirdly, if only for a brief scene.
But I guess you know what you're after with this.
Anyway, just a few thoughts.
Cheers stevie

Not sure if you did an OWC? I read most of them - if i missed yours, will read after revelation.

Hi Stevie.

Thanks for the review.

I think you've hit upon the core problem with the script: It all takes place inside.

That was obviously deliberate, but twisting the story into such confines has proven difficult, it limits the antagonism and gives me little scope for using red herrings etc.

I wanted to make a film that took place in one place so I could concentrate on getting everything right visuaLly and audibly.

Really the story should be like this:

1. We see Thomas at work in a shopping mall.
2. We see how society is changing (Iphones, single mums etc)
3. He gets sacked. Perhaps they put a LCD screen up in his place.
4. Goes home and gets support from Joan.
5. Tries to come up with his new play
6. Takes it to a Punch and Judy festival. It's hated.

ETC, Etc.

Same structure, just showing it all rather than having to use dialogue to tell the story. I'd then have the characters who haVE appeared in the outside world as possible victims or whatever and have a bit more scope with making it unpredictable.

I'm kind of loathe to essentially start from scratch on this project yet again...it's already a relic of the past in some ways...but maybe I need to.

Hey Dec,

I have been meaning to look at this one for some time.  Sorry to be coming in so late.  I have glanced at some of the previous reviews, but only enough to get a feel for how positive or negative the reception has been.

For me, I like what you have done here.  Sure, we have seen this template before, but the details on the skeleton feel fresh enough.  It is a glimpse into insanity.  You feel sorry for Thomas, but at the same time, you want to give him a good shake.  Until you realize that he has totally lost it.  I think you chart this character's descent fairly well.

As to the script itself, to start, you compare the basement to the laboratory of some mad professor, but perhaps a torture chamber is more appropriate? The narrative also leaves a few questions unresolved.  Does this take place in the present day?  What is Timmy’s age?

As you clearly intend to film this yourself, I will not linger on some of the formatting details, but do feel compelled to point out that I was sometimes confused as to whether it was the puppets actually speaking, or if Thomas was speaking for them.  I thought you might want to know that, but also figured you know your intent.  For a small niggle, I doubt you will find many readers, this one included, who have the slightest idea what a swazzle might be.

You mentioned on another thread that you were looking to make cuts in the narrative, and while I personally do not find much need for trimming, if pressed, I do have a few thoughts.  In the kitchen, after Joan is horrified by what Thomas has been teaching Timmy, for example.  After she sends Timmy away, Thomas simply collecting his things and leaving might be shorter and just as poignant.  There is nothing in their subsequent conversation that we do not already infer from Joan’s initial response.  And you might shorten some of Thomas’ speeches near the end, where he has a tendency to ramble -- about the "new religion" and all that.

I also have some concerns with the title, and am not sure that you would want to call this "Punch and Judy".  I mean, that is an existing story, and you are not telling that story.  It is more like if you made a movie about some guy that was obsessed with Robin Hood -- and then called your movie, "Robin Hood".  Does that make any sense?  Anyways, if it were mine I would revisit the title at some point.

And maybe it's just me, but you know how I would end this?  With Thomas discovering that he had left the lens cap on.  But maybe that is just me.  Yeah, probably is.

Otherwise, I think the pace here is good and the concept is sound.  Should make for a very interesting project should you eventually decide to carry it thorough.

Quoted from bert Hey Dec, I have been meaning to look at this one for some time.  Sorry to be coming in so late.  I have glanced at some of the previous reviews, but only enough to get a feel for how positive or negative the reception has been. For me, I like what you have done here.  Sure, we have seen this template before, but the details on the skeleton feel fresh enough.  It is a glimpse into insanity.  You feel sorry for Thomas, but at the same time, you want to give him a good shake.  Until you realize that he has totally lost it.  I think you chart this character's descent fairly well. As to the script itself, to start, you compare the basement to the laboratory of some mad professor, but perhaps a torture chamber is more appropriate? The narrative also leaves a few questions unresolved.  Does this take place in the present day?  What is Timmy’s age? As you clearly intend to film this yourself, I will not linger on some of the formatting details, but do feel compelled to point out that I was sometimes confused as to whether it was the puppets actually speaking, or if Thomas was speaking for them.  I thought you might want to know that, but also figured you know your intent.  For a small niggle, I doubt you will find many readers, this one included, who have the slightest idea what a swazzle might be. You mentioned on another thread that you were looking to make cuts in the narrative, and while I personally do not find much need for trimming, if pressed, I do have a few thoughts.  In the kitchen, after Joan is horrified by what Thomas has been teaching Timmy, for example.  After she sends Timmy away, Thomas simply collecting his things and leaving might be shorter and just as poignant.  There is nothing in their subsequent conversation that we do not already infer from Joan’s initial response.  And you might shorten some of Thomas’ speeches near the end, where he has a tendency to ramble -- about the "new religion" and all that. I also have some concerns with the title, and am not sure that you would want to call this "Punch and Judy".  I mean, that is an existing story, and you are not telling that story.  It is more like if you made a movie about some guy that was obsessed with Robin Hood -- and then called your movie, "Robin Hood".  Does that make any sense?  Anyways, if it were mine I would revisit the title at some point. And maybe it's just me, but you know how I would end this?  With Thomas discovering that he had left the lens cap on.  But maybe that is just me.  Yeah, probably is. Otherwise, I think the pace here is good and the concept is sound.  Should make for a very interesting project should you eventually decide to carry it thorough.

Thanks for the review. All sound advice.

Phil brought up the mad professor thing as well...and you're both right. What I was trying to get across was that it was the Puppeteers equivalent of a mad Professors lab. In the same way you've got a nicely organised science lab with everything in its place and then the mad scientists lair where body parts and blood are everywhere...this room isn't like a nicley organised workshop where everything is spic and span..there are pieces of puppets lying around and dribbling red paint cans lying around.

Anyway, I'll make it clearer.

It's the present age. The candle thing threw Phil as well...it was just intended to show that he's a traditional soul...not suggest it took place in the past.

All format points are accepted.

You make an excellent pint about the title. That's something that's completely passed me by. This story has been through several incarnations..the original idea was slightly more madcap. I thought of it when I visited a prop house near me. It's an amazing place; Vast and full of hidden little places full of weird and wonderful things.

One of the things that caught my eye was this large leather box and when I opened it it had some very old and tatty Punch and Judy puppets in it. Their state of disrepair made them quite frightening to look at. That's when I decided to make a film about Punch and Judy. But the box gave me two very different ideas:

1. A crime caper about a guy who carried the case. He would leave the case unattended and then his partner in crime...a contortionist..would climb out and do her evil deeds.

2. A Punch and Judy guy who was kidnapping children. The script intimated that he was a child abuser who was locking them in his case to transport them..but with a twist.

I've actually written this one as well..it's basically just a short, sharp shock story with a kind of Don't Look Now kind of ending...the Police open the case expecting to find a child and there appears to be one in there..but when it turns round it's actually this weird female creature that he's picked up on his travels...and it of course kills the Police Officer, whilst he takes care of the partner in the confusion.

So that's where the title has come from..it's just kind of stuck.

The first idea has been subsumed into a larger story.

So yeah, I'll call it something else.

Your ending works I think. It's probably better than what I have at the moment. It would probably work better if he killed Timmy as well.

Only problem is that I was intending to use the camera itself as an alternative shooting tool, so we got to see the frenetic action from his point of view as well.

It definitely needs more of a "punch" at the end. I do think it's quite a fun story. There'a certain energy to it and If properly produced it could look great. I'm confident it would be more enjoyable than most of the short horrors I see. If I could just end it in a bit more of a surprising way I think I could just elevate it a little more.

I've just kind of written myself into a corner with it. I could have Timmy being a bit older and becoming the killer...taking on his fathers mad lust for Punch and Judy to a too literal level...but that seems a little silly.

Hey,

First time reading your material. I read the script and glanced over the other's critiques. There's a good chance I'm repeating. I'm at work at the moment so I'm just going to jot down what I thought so far.

SPOILERS!

There's no sense of what time period or place this is set in. For some odd reason I saw Russia in the 70's. This should be established.

There has to be some cathersis in this, some sort of justice. We just watched a child witness his mother's death. I think the cops should come, arrest the father, and take the child.  

Now, I'm confused with the scene after Thomas goes down to the basement after arguing with Joan. Is Thomas playing with the puppets? If he does, I suggest make a transition to let the reader know what Thomas is doing?

Other than that, I found the characters and story interesting.

Hope this helps,
Gabe

  

Hey Rick, just dug this one up and gave it a read.

Overall I think it's pretty good, but you telegraphed the ending on page 7 with the baseball bat, and then the Punch and Judy skit on page 8 confirmed it. So the rest of the script is just a straightforward path towards the inevitable ending. A little more unpredictability and twists would be nice.

If you trimmed some of Thomas's babel (it was getting a little repetitive), the pace might be better, and the second half won't feel like a drag. But I tell you the second half was very intense and emotional.

I applaud you for creating Thomas. He's such a memorable, vivid, and distinct character. A hunchback who's obsessed with puppets. His descent into madness was greatly illustrated as well. I can feel why he's doing what he's doing.

Writing-wise, it's pretty clean and neat. Noticed some missing punctuations. You also forgot to introduce Timmy, especially how old he is. I'm assume like 7 or 8 from the story.

I enjoyed it. Thanks.

Herman