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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Unproduced Screenplay Discussion    Series  ›  The Five Moderators: bert
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  Author    The Five  (currently 3569 views)
Don
Posted: June 29th, 2005, 9:31pm Report to Moderator
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So, what are you writing?

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The Five, The Pilot by Danny Strachan - Series, Action - Daniel Strachan and Fiona McMillan live in a big Edwardian house together. Theyr'e wanting people to move into the house, so that they can make it more family like.  They meet old school friends and they tell them that they are lookjing for people to move into the house. - pdf, format

The Five, Episode Two by Danny Strachan - Series, Action - No Summary - pdf, format


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You will miss 100% of the shots you don't take.
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Don  -  July 5th, 2005, 2:22pm
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Mikal
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You really need to work up a PROPER LOGLINE!

Go to my site and read some of the articles there on logline construction. This is such a neglected aspect of many screenwriter's eductaion, yet the LOGLINE is your first step towards making a sale. I'm a professional script analyst and reader, as well as a screenwriter. A well-constructed logline tells the reader WHO WHAT WHEN WHERE and WHY. WHO is the protagonist, WHAT opposes him, somewhat less important is WHEN it takes place and WHERE , but the main thing to convey in your logline is WHY we should give a small squirmy pooh about what happens!

http://trutopia.webpal.info/index.php?
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Alan_Holman
Posted: July 1st, 2005, 2:01am Report to Moderator
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Once I began reading the script in a british accent, it all fell together.  Accidentally touching a leg at the start doesn't seem like big of a problem, but the fact that they took it seriously is what makes it funny.

When Anne talks about the tempermental boiler, I had flashbacks to similar situations.  It seems as if every house has its own unique methods and practices with regards to water, so that particular dialogue in this script is an oddly relaxing awknoledgement of that fact.

I laughed when it said:  "LETTER BOX:  Letters fall through the box."  I laughed because I thought your "LETTER BOX:" cue was a suggestion to change the aspect ratio, and then the words "Letters fall through the box." is what made me laugh because it meant that I was wrong about the aspect ratio.  Of course, if a shot of a letter box is the only shot in the production to be shot in Letter Box aspect ratio, that would be funny.

Just when I was getting slightly uninterested in the script, your character asked if she downloaded "Charmed."  I don't like that show; it's just a bunch of yappy girls who sometimes use magic, but what I like is that this script awknoledges that people download TV shows.  It's a familiar situation, and I rarely see it depicted.  And just seeing familiar situations depicted -- reflections of familiar aspects of life -- makes it more appealing to read.  There's something attractive about the familiar.

Act one ends with a familiar situation involving a CD, however even though these characters are familiar enough that they can become friends, I'm not compelled to continue reading the script because act one ended without any suspense that I care about.  Sorry.  I can't bring myself to continue, but it IS good so far.  It's just that I'm changing the channels to see what else is on.



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dannystrachan
Posted: July 2nd, 2005, 9:45am Report to Moderator
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I have spent a lot of time writing the pilot. I had to break it into a 1 part short 45 mins pilot.

Danny
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Martin
Posted: July 2nd, 2005, 11:24am Report to Moderator
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Hi Danny, I had a read of this today. Here are some thoughts.

Overall your writing's pretty good and the format is fairly solid although you could do with cutting all stuff about cast and credits and commercials and sponsors etc. It just gets in the way

My main problem with this script was that not much happened. There was no drama, no suspense, no conflict, no action. I'm not sure if this is a drama series, a comedy series or a soap opera.

You have some unnecessary and uninteresting scenes. The events covered in this episode could be condensed into the first 10 minutes. Your characters talk about what they are going to do and then they do it. This makes it predictable and slow paced. What's exciting about watching someone shopping in Tesco's? or people talking about what they want for dinner? or people saying they need to buy more stock for the computer shop? This script is too much like real life. Real life is boring, that's why people watch movies and TV. We don't want to watch people doing mundane everyday things. There has to be conflict, drama, suspense, action, comedy

Your characters tend to repeat themselves. By the end I was tired of hearing about the spare bedrooms and the club.

The scene with the newspaper editor just didn't ring true. How can he offer her a job, he knows nothing about her. If only life was that easy. "I like writing"... "here, have a job as a feature feature writer"... "thanks, i'll go and quit my other job"
Can you see how this is totally unrealistic?

I think you need to go over this and trim it down the bare essentials. If you removed all the unneccesary dialogue and scenes I think you'd be left with about 15 minutes of material. Dialogue should portray character, provide crucial story information, and drive the story forward. If it doesnt do any of this it should be cut. Same goes for scenes. Arrive late, depart early. You could probably trim the beginning and end of every scene, just leaving what is necessary.

I think this series has potential but you need to keep it lean, add some conflict, and work on your dialogue.
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Alan_Holman
Posted: July 2nd, 2005, 3:10pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Martin
What's exciting about watching someone shopping in Tesco's? or people talking about what they want for dinner? or people saying they need to buy more stock for the computer shop?


A lot of content in The Sopranos is mundane, but we like it because it helps us identify with and therefore understand characters who live otherwise unthinkable lives.  It excuses things, and helps us understand why people are who they are, for better or worse.  Although I don't expect that THE FIVE will become a mob drama, I do like watching people do identifiable, normal things.  It's like communication because we see a version of normalcy, and those of us who strive for normalcy can attempt to emulate those aspects of their normalcy which we find appealing.  The early parts of the movie VANILLA SKY didn't have much happen, but they really showed us the characters, and I was engaged.  Even if nothing's hapenning, if you show characters who stay true to themselves regardless of how long nothing's hapenning, as long as they remain true to themselves, there is an audience for any type of character.



Quoted from Martin

This script is too much like real life. Real life is boring, that's why people watch movies and TV. We don't want to watch people doing mundane everyday things. There has to be conflict, drama, suspense, action, comedy


People watch TV to get reflections of real life.  Those reflections psychologically help people to adjust to things in their own lives.  The more reflective a show is of reality, or the more inventive of a new reality and consistent with its own reality the show is, the more people will watch it.  You CAN reflect reality with any type of story, be it one with OR without conflict, drama, suspense, action or comedy.  


Quoted from Martin

Your characters tend to repeat themselves. By the end I was tired of hearing about the spare bedrooms and the club.


But now you KNOW about the spare bedrooms and the club.  You didn't know those things before, but now you do.  And that is a wonderful thing.



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dannystrachan
Posted: July 5th, 2005, 11:56am Report to Moderator
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i agree with Alan. You'd have to read the other episodes that I have written. I tend to keep them to 45 pages (about 45 mins) apart from one which was 39, and I couldn't have written anymore to it to make it last longer.

A lot of the content in Charmed is stupid, but watch the first season and then  the other seasons, and you will see how it has grown. Watch the last season, see how it grows, until the last scene of the last episode. You would think that the sisters are dead, until piper click her fingers and she transforms into her normal self. They had to die, otherwise they would have been found out as witches again, and it was terrible the last time, a sister died because they were witches. This time, they're pretending to have died so that they have no worry of being found out as witches. They will also get no hassle from demons if the demons think they're dead.

Danny
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Martin
Posted: July 5th, 2005, 12:30pm Report to Moderator
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I also agree with Alan to an extent, he makes some valid points. However, I don't think I expressed myself as clearly as I could have.

There's nothing wrong with showing identifiable everyday events as long as it's backed up by strong character development. I think what's lacking in this is the kind of character development that would keep me watching/reading.

Looking back on this episode, I know very little about the characters. I don't know what they look like or even how old they are. The dialogue as a whole didn't give them much personality.

I know that Danny wants to open a club, I know that Fiona wants to be a writer. I know that they are looking to fill their spare room. Basically, I know what they do, something of what they want, but not who they are and what they are like.  

Don't get me wrong, I think you have a solid start to a series here but it needs a little work. As Alan said, he stopped reading after act one. You need a hook, something to grab our attention. I disagree with the assertion that you can have a good story without conflict. Conflict is real life, drama. Even those so called reality tv shows have conflict. A way to develop your characters is to put them in difficult or awkward situations and see how they react. Why not have Fiona get rejected by the editor, see what she does. Maybe she could show her commitment and ability and make him change his mind.
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Alan_Holman
Posted: July 5th, 2005, 1:34pm Report to Moderator
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Better character descriptions -- such as even what kind of shirts they're wearing -- might have kept me reading for another act, because then I'd know a little more about them to identify with them.

But I disagree with the previous post about lack of conflict.  A conflict isn't necessarily a fight, but a conflict can be any task that's tackled, any goal that's set.  He set the goal of opening the club, and she set the goal of becoming a writer.  To me, that makes her the more interesting character.  But to some people, someone with a goal of opening a club would be the more interesting.  People who want to be writers, and people who want to open clubs are a potential audience and they'll stick around as long as your characters are consistant with those goals and the series will be useful to that audience if it details the different steps the characters take to achieve those goals to any level.  
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Martin
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"A conflict isn't necessarily a fight, but a conflict can be any task that's tackled, any goal that is set"

I agree, but when the goal is achieved as easily as "i would like a job", "okay, we have a vacancy" I really start to lose interest in the character. What has she done to deserve this job other than ask politely?

"if it details the different steps the characters take to achieve those goals to any level."

Again, I agree. Which is why I suggested she shouldnt be given the job instantly upon asking. She should earn it in some way, show her strength of character.

You have set up two characters that people can relate to but you should make them work towards their goals not just have them handed to them on a plate
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Alan_Holman
Posted: July 5th, 2005, 9:40pm Report to Moderator
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Good point.  Asking and getting is okay if it's a step in a larger struggle that's been established.  Or maybe that opens a new conflict: working at that job she got easily.  

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Don  -  July 5th, 2005, 9:41pm
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dannystrachan
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yes, well i will ehera back from the BBC by the 7th of august. If they reject it, I promise I will work on the pilot episode alonewhen I go to college. I will know all of the different methods by then anyway.

I suggest that you read the secondth episode. I'll get them sent in with the guides.

Danny
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dannystrachan
Posted: July 7th, 2005, 12:21pm Report to Moderator
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The summary never came witht the second one, because I didn't have one to hand, I'll post it soon.

D
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Martin
Posted: July 7th, 2005, 1:39pm Report to Moderator
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Okay, I've read episode two and I must say I liked it more than the first. I'm starting to warm to your characters, especially Daniel. However, I still find it difficult to picture any of them since I don't know what they look like or how old they are.

I made a lot of notes, these are not intended as negative criticism, merely to help you should you decide to rewrite.

Page 12- Fiona begins to open her mail--- it's her first day and she's just arrived. Who is sending her mail? Maybe this is her job,, writing the letters page? I forget

The conversation with Lee and his lecturer is too short, it's over in a few lines. You can leave the scene without having the character leave. In a situation like this I'd expect them to be talking longer

Typo page 16 "you cam go if you want" should be "can"

A lot of conversations seem too short. Lee and Brook in the coffee shop, for example. Lee repeats the information we've just discovered then the conversation is interrupted by Brook offering him coffee. You seem to do this a lot. Just as the characters begin talking, someone offers a drink or some food and the conversation ends. I know I advised you to keep your scenes short, this isn't exactly what I meant. When I write scenes, I'll write them very long and then cut away as much as I can leaving just enough that it still makes sense and achieves what it set out to do. This conversation has a beginning, a middle, and an end. Just give us the middle, that's what we're interested in, and make it a little longer. In this case, things like saying hello and goodbye can be left out, we just want the juicy parts.


page 21: The editor comments on Fiona's column but he's had no time to read it. It's 8-10 pages. To me, this seems  very long for a newspaper column although I forget what it is she's actually writing. I work as a writer and I don't think anyone would expect me to crank out 8-10 pages in a morning. At least i hope not. Edit: Unless she's just typing up letters, then it could be plausible.

Page 22- daniel: Ok, seeing as it's you...   - this line seems a bit off- it's his shop, why wouldnt he do it for anyone else?

Page 24- the editor is speed reading again.

Page 25: there's that "seeing as it's you" line again. It seems odd that it's repeated, and only 3 pages later.

Page 26- the formatting seems to drift off to the right hand side of the page. - this continues for the rest of the script. This could be a problem with your pdf conversion.

Page 27- a nice little conversation between Lee and Brook but again you end the scene with a drink offer.


Page 28- Editor: The newspaper was over-full for some reason    - sounds like he doesnt know the reason. he's the editor, he wouldn't speak like this.
Fiona has a nerve asking for the following day off work when today is her first day. She should have mentioned this at her interview or she should be more more apologetic in asking now.   You have the "seeing that it's you" line yet again, this time from the editor.

Page 30: another scene ends with a drink offer. These people drink a lot of tea Good old brits, you're making me homesick

Page 32: Is Daniel talking to himself? I think this revelation would work better if he confided in Andre. This is getting somewhere though, I'm starting to warm to Danny.

Page 33: your use of CUT TO really interrupts the flow here. You have 3 scene changes as Fiona approaches the house and enters. You don't have to use cut to for every scene change. Scene headings are enough when you're moving from EXT to INT of the same location.

Page 35: Fiona: I'm going up to bed, are you coming up?   - I'm still confused about their relationship. This line makes it sound like they are married.


Overall, I enjoyed this Danny, I really did. It may seem like I've picked it apart but I'm just trying to help you to improve it. I'll be sure to read the next episode.

Keep writing
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dannystrachan
Posted: July 8th, 2005, 12:38pm Report to Moderator
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Thanks form your comments. Your warming to Daniel actually helps a bit, because he's a friendly guy really. They talk like that to each other, because in reality, they both fancy the pants of each other. In ep 4, at his birthday bash, (that's why Fiona had the day off, and the party's on a Saturday, so she doesn't work that day.)

page 21: The editor comments on Fiona's column but he's had no time to read it. It's 8-10 pages. To me, this seems  very long for a newspaper column although I forget what it is she's actually writing. I work as a writer and I don't think anyone would expect me to crank out 8-10 pages in a morning. At least i hope not. Edit: Unless she's just typing up letters, then it could be plausible

She's the advice columnist, so it would be a long column. Half of the time I don't even know what I'm talking about, but I do write it.

You're a writer? I'm in the middle of writing my book, (3 years writing.) Which this series is based on. (Different characters and plot. It's a magical story, horrid a bit, but I think it's good.)

Danny
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