I've never seen that one, Death Monkey. In fact I've never heard of it.
But my guess is that it probably failed because the story and characters were rubbish. Even if you turn the clichés inside out, you'd still need a decent story for it to be any good; you couldn't just rely on the gimmick.  

Yeah plus the thing went through a lot of shit with the censors and ended up pretty watered down as I remember it.

I haven't seen it since it came out though so I don't remember it too well.

Man oh man, I could list the clichee' list down to the end of this page, but I just got a few that irk me bigtime.

1.  A group of terrorists steal a warhead and threaten to use it in American Homelands.
You know, that's happened so much that I'm starting to think that the U.S. MAY want to hide their warheads better, or protect them better.  The warhead scheme is so bland, I must admit I used this dull plot before, until it hit me how clichee' it was.

2.  The mad pyronatic.
It's probably unavoidable, because anyone who uses a flamethrower is probably a nut job.  It's sad that you never see a regular antagonist who can use the flamethrower.

3.  The women being all these strong willed fighters, Die Hard 4, Charlies Angels, etc, beating down on the guys.  Now pardon me if I sound sexist saying this, but why is it that the women always have to look so tough, especially when THEY'RE always the damsels in distress, or the girls getting kidnapped or raped?  It makes you really feel that the guy getting his ass kicked by the chick is really a fruitcake.  I just don't like that.

4.  The prison guards always being corrupt or evil.  
It's so old, yet you see it everywhere.  The Longest Yard, Prison Break, Simpsons, Face-off, and such.

5.  The badguy finally pulls out his gun, and his ammo is dry.  
Wouldn't you think that it's always a bit inconvenient that just when the badguy is about to win, he is always negligent enough to let his ammo be empty?

Here are a few of my pet peeve clichés that I don’t believe have been mentioned yet:

1) The Tough At First And Helpless Later Chick - I hate when a woman is tough enough to beat up a man in the beginning and then later becomes the damsel in distress. Is she tough or not? I can’t think of all of them right off hand but the one that pops into my mind at the moment is Robin Hood - the Kevin Costner one. At the beginning Maid Marian is such a good sword fighter that she nearly whips Robin’s butt and then at the end the villain easily subdues her - far easier than it would be to subdue an ordinary woman. She helplessly and futilely struggles against the villain throughout the entire last third of the movie - until Robin comes to save her. It was two totally different women. They should have credited Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio with two roles - Marian I and Marian II.

2) The One Punch Knockout - very seldom does a person just hit someone once and completely knock them out - but not in Hollywood! In Hollywood, a hero can one punch knockout anyone until the final showdown when he suddenly has to hit people fifty times to do any damage.

3) The Head Twist Kill - I’m so sick and tired of the scene where the Navy seal or whatever just loosely twists a guy’s head to the cracking sound of his neck and the guy just instantly drops dead. It’s like it replaced the old time double fisted knockout ala Captain Kirk. It’s so silly.

4) The Army Of Soldiers Or Police Who Can’t Hit the Hero No Matter How Many Times They Shoot - I’m sorry but some movies have a hero who gets into a shootout with the police or military and then decides to make a run from one spot to another. Despite the fact they’re under an intense nonstop barrage of gunfire from people who regularly practice shooting weapons, suddenly no one on the entire force is a good shot. I mean, honestly, someone would hit the guy by sheer accident.

5) The Man From Atlantis - the guy who can breathe underwater indefinitely. Not only can he hold his breath for elongated periods of time but he can also do strenuous physical labor! He can swim half a mile underwater, break through some metal gate to some underwater tunnel, and disarm a bomb or whatever all while holding his breath. Honestly, why don’t they just have him fight off a shark with his bare hands while he’s down there. Maybe he can use his one punch knockout.


Breanne

Quoted from Breanne Mattson 2) The One Punch Knockout - very seldom does a person just hit someone once and completely knock them out - but not in Hollywood! In Hollywood, a hero can one punch knockout anyone until the final showdown when he suddenly has to hit people fifty times to do any damage.

What about when the hero takes on gangs of people. While he's busy with one gang member the rest of the gang stand around waiting for their turn to be beaten up.
The only time I've ever seen this scenario look believable was in the Korean film Oldboy, because the hero was fighting a gang inside a narrow corridor and they could only come at him one or two at a time.  

I'm so with you on #4. We watched something a few nights ago... but I can't remember what it was. It's so annoying.

I like the story about the Hot Dog Vendor who sells to a Zen master.  The Zen Master says, "Make me one with everthing." And then he hands the vendor a twenty dollar bill.  The vendor promptly puts away the twenty, closes the till and the Zen master then says, "Hey, where's my change?"  And the Vendor's reply is "Change must come from within."

You've probably heard that one.  But consider this: When was the first time you heard it?  Were you six years old?  Twelve perhaps?  Or did you only first hear it in your teens?

The truth is that things which are cliche to you; even if they are very cliche as a whole, are very new to the next generation.

I mentioned in a different post that I don't watch too much T.V. anymore.  It's an age thing I said.  Why?  Because I've seen it.  The formula, the stale routines... but that doesn't mean that someone else can't enjoy it.

The thing is, when it comes right down to it: life is cliche.  It's recycled.  Over and over again.  The goodness that we take in and the badness that we spit out.  All cliche.  And we'de like to think our ideas are wonderfully original, but at the moment we're dreaming something up, someone else is having that very same thought too, or has had already, many years before even.

Maybe we're all drawing from the same great melting pot and some of us have a bigger spoon.

Blessings,
Sandra

Quoted from Sandra Elstree. The thing is, when it comes right down to it: life is cliche.  It's recycled.  Over and over again.  The goodness that we take in and the badness that we spit out.  All cliche.  And we'de like to think our ideas are wonderfully original, but at the moment we're dreaming something up, someone else is having that very same thought too, or has had already, many years before even.

Yes and no. I wrote a script about a guy whose identity changed every time he changed the avatar on his computer. No one could've written that thirty years ago. Sure there have been stories about people changing their identity via: disguise, magic etc, but I've never come across another story where someone has changed their appearance by changing their avatar. So it's still possible to be original to some degree.          

Quoted from Takeshi Yes and no. I wrote a script about a guy whose identity changed every time he changed the avatar on his computer. No one could've written that thirty years ago. Sure there have been stories about people changing their identity via: disguise, magic etc, but I've never come across another story where someone has changed their appearance by changing their avatar. So it's still possible to be original to some degree.

Indeed, at least it seems that way; but I'm inclined now to be very suspicious of the fleeting quality of things--so much so that I don't think you can really trust the way you "think" things are.  Take any adult and ask them to be a child again and they can't do it.  What have they lost?  What has changed?

Writers are part of a group that make their bread and butter through the imagination so it's important to consider its properties.

What's an avatar?  Maybe you and I are avatars.

My question to you would be: Was your work conceived by you or revealed to you?  Either way, if the possibility existed, the possibility existed and it was born out of preexisting knowledge which came before you or I came along.

I wonder if someone might have considered avatars in their conscious thirty years ago?  Why not?  Maybe the general population didn't, but where did all of this spring from?  Maybe avatars were contemplated by the creators of ENIAC.  Who knows?

We live in a paradox.  What came first, the chicken or the egg?

Like the Sunscreen song goes:

"...whatever you do don't congratulate yourself too much or berate yourself either, your choices are half chance..."

And I'm just fueling discussion here so...

"Be careful whose advice you buy, but, be patient with those who
supply it. Advice is a form of nostalgia, dispensing it is a way of
fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the
ugly parts and recycling it for more than
it’s worth.

But trust me on the sunscreen…"

Baz Luhrmann

Isn't it hard to think outside of the box when you're trapped inside?

Sandra

I'm glad this thread resurfaced cuz I just thought of another cliche. How about every sports movie ever made?

An "avatar" is defined as:  

1. The incarnation of a Hindu deity, especially Vishnu, in human or animal form.
2. An embodiment, as of a quality or concept; an archetype: the very avatar of cunning.
3. A temporary manifestation or aspect of a continuing entity: occultism in its present avatar.

(c) Dictionary.com

I don't know when the term "avatar" became intertwined with the Internet.

Quoted from Sandra Elstree. My question to you would be: Was your work conceived by you or revealed to you?  Either way, if the possibility existed, the possibility existed and it was born out of preexisting knowledge which came before you or I came along.

Who knows?

A writer once said: "When I write, it's like my hand is being driven by a force other than my own and I'm not creating something new, but revealing something that was already there".

It was an interesting comment, but I reckon there's a fine line between mysticism and psychosis.

Aha!

Someone is taking the time to go deep inside the rabbit hole.

Not so new after all.  I guess Webster learned everything he needed to know from ancient Sanskrit.

Mr. Steel, this is an example of the kind of thing that goes waaay back... like everything else.  Good detective work.  How about those ancient flying machines?

Anyways James,

I always love sports movies.  Two come to mind right now: "Invincible" based on the true story of Vince Papale and the latest "Rocky."  And I asked myself, how come I enjoyed it AGAIN?  I don't know, but I did.

Sandra

Quoted from Sandra Elstree. Not so new after all.  I guess Webster learned everything he needed to know from ancient Sanskrit.

I used to love Emmanuel Lewis when I was a kid. But I don't remember the Sanskrit episode.  

I do remember a pretty old TV show, about a girl who lives on this island and she has a pet whale (named Charlie, if you were wondering). There was also this underwater city, and two, or three, of the kids would visit her during their free time.

It was revealed that her island had grown over this space ship, and she was an ALIEN.

Now, when LOST came around, and they revealed that there was something underground, all I could think about was that show.

Been there, done that. Moving on...

I have no idea what the older TV show was, though.