Hey Abel, I’m Jeff, BTW.  I’ll start my reading up again in a few minutes and try to get done with your script today.

As for the detail level of your writing, IMO, you’re going into detail in the wrong areas, and not going into enough detail when you need to.  Since I haven’t finished yet, I can’t say that with certainty, but I’ll go over it again, once I’ve finished.

IMO, you don’t need to even show Bear at all, until he walks into the restaurant.  Also, so far I don’t see the remote need for the character of Nona.

Something else I wanted to bring up is the “leather box” Bear has with him all the time.  I’m not positive, but I don’t think you described it very well, as I was picturing a small box, when it turns out to be a rifle box, which is a big difference!  Again, it’s little visuals like this that need to be addressed when something’s first intro’d.

Just an FYI as to the inflatable white water river raft – I did a little digging, and the lightest raft I found (which wasn’t an actual heavy duty Pro raft) was about 80 pounds for the raft alone, which is a tough haul for anyone.  The Pro rafts are all over 120 pounds.  When you take into account the climbing/rappelling gear, as well as everything else necessary for a 5 night trek across Alaska, you’re obviously talking about A LOT of weight for these guys to be carrying.  I honestly think you’d have to have the raft waiting for them at the river, as they just wouldn’t be able to lug this thing with them for 60 miles.

I understand why Bear is doing what he’s doing, and how he’s done this type of thing in the past.  BUT, he crosses a major line when he cuts the support rope of the suspension bridge.  That’s seriously attempted murder there and it’s very possible no one would make it off that bridge alive.  Same deal when he “makes” them free climb down a steep cliff face.  Chances are good that at least one would be seriously injured, if not worse.

What I meant by “poor decisions made all around” was Miguel running away without firing a shot, and then everyone else doing the same.  Their best hope is with the campsite and all that was available to them, including fire.  Especially, considering the bear was already busy mauling Bear…perfect opportunity to whack it over the head with something or shoot it.  I know people make poor decisions all the time, both in real life and especially in movies, but this really didn’t sit well with me.  Whether or not they were able to ward the bear off, they should have at least made some sort of effort.

OK, I’ll pick up on Page 77 and get back to you when I’m done.

Sorry for the delay, Abel.  I actually did finish this on Wednesday, but didn't get around to this post until now.  So, I'll start off by commenting on the last 42 pages and then some words on the script as a whole.

Things did not get better for me in the last section, and actually continued downhill, sorry to say.

Your earlier reviewer, MacDuff mentioned that everything seems to have a repetitious feel to it, and I agree completely.  Not only do the actual events feel repetitious, but your writing does as well.  I think there are several factors at work here which is causing this feeling.

1)  First of all, the actual action is very repetitious.  2 cliff climbing scenes.  2 suspension bridge scenes.  Multiple bear attack scenes.  Multiple burying of character scenes.  Etc.

2)  The way you write your action is very repetitious in itself.  Once the bear is intro'd, it's shocking how many times you use words like low growl...over and over again.  Also, in the finale, you use the word "beast" just a shocking amount of times for the bear.  It was getting comical, actually.  There are many other examples as well, but I can't remember what they are right now...sorry.

3)  Your Slugs are all so generic, every scene feels the same.  There's no visual clues being used in any of your writing, for basically anything.  Everything feels the same because it's impossible to get a visual of anything.

4)  You continually use all the characters names, over and over again.  I mean, seriously, if you've got 4 characters in your script, and they're all together in every scene, do you think you really need to continually write out all their names?  How about "the guys", "the 4 men", "they", whatever...anything to mix it up, and save room, as writing out all their names again and again, takes up alot of space.

The stuff with the bear just didn't work for me like it should have.  I didn't buy the action, didn't feel the guys did a very good job of attempting to survive, and the final 1 on 1 battle also seemed rather anti climatic for me.  Nothing jumped out as being original...it was all by the book and I've seen this all before.

The stuff with all the families there, immediately after the rescue chopper picked up our sole survivor was ridiculous.  How is that remotely possible?  How'd they all get there like this?  Made zero sense.

I did appreciate the final few pages with Shelton and the fox and even his family, but it, like everything here, went on too long, IMO, and was over written again.

So, overall, I think you're guilty of a number of things here...

Both over and under writing - Over writing where you don't need or want to, and under writing in terms of action and visuals, where you need much more.

Stagnant, repetitive writing - Your action scenes just don't click like they should, and in an action script, that's a death blow.

I think you've got the basics for a cool action/adventure script here, but I don't think you thought it all out well enough.  Bear's motivations aren't well thought out and his early demise is an issue, IMO.  I think you need more happening, other than the bear chasing them, as it gets dull and very repetitive.  I think you need to cut the beginning WAY down and get them to Alaska before Page 10, unless you start out with the end of one of Bear's early trips, so that we know something's up by seeing it go down, as opposed to just hearing a character talk about it.

I do see some potential here, but it needs alot of work, IMO.  I hope this helps and doesn't come across as harsh.

Take care.

Hello again, Jeff, and thanks for your added notes. I'll have to meditate on the many points you've made when I work on a second draft, hopefully sometime in the early fall.

Also, you don't have to apologize for being too blunt.  I know exactly where you're coming from and honest feedback is the only way any of us can improve.  Thank you once again for all your help.

(Sorry for not referring to you by name earlier.  I've been on other message boards where posters are expected, if not required, to refer to other members by screen names only.)

Hello Abel,

I see this script has been getting some attention.
I haven't seen you around the boards much, but Jeff seems to like you.
So, I thought I'd take a look at it for myself.

I got thirty pages in this morning, I'm stopping for now.
Will continue tomorrow as work allows.

I browsed through Jeff's review.
While the comparisons to The Edge are valid, my mind went to another film.
It's called Severance. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0464196/
Execs go on a team building mountain retreat that goes horribly wrong.

Your writing here is decent, but overly descriptive in parts.
I feel like you're trying to show us every move these people make.
It's not necessary and takes up a lot of space on the page.

As we take off in the helicopter, I'm having a hard time with the four candidates.
What separates them from each other isn't standing out in my mind.
By that I mean, what's differentiates them from each other, except for ethnicity?

Perhaps one got there through falsifying their resume.
Or one comes from a blue collar family trying to make a white collar career.
Another is a brown noser that researched Bear to gain an edge.
That "guy" is a good deliverer of exposition later in the story.
One guy could have an ax to grind with Bear, add a dash of mystery to the scenario.

These are just a few general examples that sprang to mind.
They come from social class and personal motivations.
Things like that stand out to me, make someone memorable.

I didn't get much from all the time with the wives and extended families.
So far, I don't feel those pages were well spent, I didn't learn much.
I guess Shelton is the main protag, since you started with him.
Other than that, I have no idea why spent so much time with them.

I like the premise, let's see where we go from here.

Keep writing and rewriting.
Regards,
E.D.

Hey Abel,

Going to read pages 30 - 60 this morning.
Let's see where that helicopter drops our guys!

As I read, sometimes I have to catch myself, thinking there's a bear in the woods.
Having a character with that for a name keeps you on your toes.

Mountain climbing sequence. Is pretty long. 8+ pages for one scene.
You may want to consider finding a way to shorten that sequence.

Bear's excuse about the outfitters tricking him is too fishy for me.
I can't see anyone buying that reason, it's transparent.
We'll see where this goes, but it doesn't wash right now.

p. 58. Seems weird to me no one complains about the bridge collapse.
They were whining earlier about the climbing and the rafting.
Three incidents in a row in 25 pages, seems a bit much to me.
I'd like to see more bonding and less complaining and coincidental dangers.
It feels a little too adversarial too soon, some guy bonding could help along.
Also be a nice way to get more invested in the characters.

This has a lot of interesting outdoors sequences.
We'll see where the story goes from here.

Regards,
E.D.

Hello, Electric Dreamer.  Thanks for taking a look at my script, and I await your input once you've read the entire story.  I'm afraid I don't have anyone around me who bounce ideas off or share thoughts with, so any feedback I can get through this medium (no matter how blunt) is greatly appreciated.

I'm fairly certain I can remove most of the family scenes and dramatically cut down the material which takes up the first twenty or so pages.  I'm also kicking around a more dynamic opening sequence based on one of Bear's previous excursions.  I've been trying to think of more diverse scenes and problems the group could encounter, but I'm afraid this part of the brainstorming process is coming to me rather slowly.

(Sorry for not replying earlier, by the way, but an Internet outage yesterday kept me offline.)

Hello Abel,

I'm reading pages 60 - 90 this morning.

The free climb scene after Bear leaves the guys is super short.
The previous climbing sequence was almost eight pages.
It feels very rushed, perhaps should be more drawn out for tension.

The bear. It's ok, if a bit overdone in outdoor adventures.
I'm more than halfway through the second act here now, page 75.
And yet, I don't feel like I know these guys much at all.
All I really know about them is how they react differently to Bear's behavior.

I know next to nothing about their backgrounds.
What did they have to go through to get to this position in Bear's company.
To me, it feels like the campfire getting to know you scenes are absent.
No one's partying or chilling late at night, resting up together, etc.
That togetherness is sorely missed by me from these characters.

p. 77 I think we should see the bear destroy the satellite phone.
It's a good beat for the audience to experience.
Personally, I prefer seeing that in action, than be told by a character.

I feel like the animal attack limited our options down to walk to the river.
What if Bear's body wasn't there? But the guys know he had that satellite phone?
Now you have dilemma and decisions to make.
Do we follow Bear's bloody trail deeper into the animal's territory?
We could recover the phone OR try our luck at the river.
The river is safer, but there's no guarantee they'll get there on time.
Get the guys debating, arguing, it's a simple device.
Create scenarios and options to be explored, leads to drama in the group, IMO.

The second bear attack, it feels as coincidental as the first.
Perhaps the guys had to choose to go through the animal's perceived territory.
Cuz, if they don't, it means they'll likely miss their rendezvous.
Decisions like that add tension, where as it's written, this feels largely reactionary.
You're waiting for the next thing to pop out at them, etc.

I want the guys to make the decision to tread the dangerous path.
If they do, it increases their chances of rescue, but also ups the risk.
That kind of raising the stakes goes a long way in a script like this.

Hope this helps. I'll wrap up the read tomorrow.

Regards,
E.D.

Hey there Abel,

I'm going to tackle the last thirty pages this morning.
I'll takes notes as I go long.

p. 95 I think I can pinpoint one of my big problems with this script right here...
Well, never mind, actually, since you're script is a secured PDF.
I can't copy and paste things, that's frustrating for a peer review.
Anyway, your action description is backwards.
Saying that someone freezes as they hear a bear growl.
Action should be first.: Bear Growl. Gasp. Freeze.
Put that visceral action first, so we the reader can experience the intensity.

p. 98 Now we're down to the two characters I like the least.
The pair with some skills and decent human beings are kaput.
We're left with the gun toting coward and the whiner.
Shelton's crying more than ever, ouch. He didn't learn much from Warren or Charles.

p. 99 I don't buy for a second Shelton would willingly hand Miguel a knife.
That's a seriously bone headed move, I like Shelton even less now.

p. 104 I'm having a hard time with how intelligent this bear is.
It seems to have an innate understanding of how to deconstruct bridges.
Now that Miguel's gone, the page is loaded with actin description.
Four or five pages in a row without dialogue, thick read.

p. 106 The lynx wolf battle would be costly and seems unnecessary.
Rarely are trained animals in movies in direct conflict with each other.
Insurance and liability issues prevent such scenes from happening. IMO.

p. 109 There are six paragraphs of action in a row that start with, "The grizzly...".
The read is just way too thick through here. The spacing is super tight.
I might be more inclined to wade through if it was spaced out better.

p. 112 Shelton attained hero status after being a wuss the entire script.
I'd like to see a progression towards that goal throughout the script.
Perhaps he gains wisdom from spending time with Warren and Charles.
And I'm talking philosophy/attitude stuff, not just how to make a bow, etc.

p. 115 Nora's outburst made no sense to me.
She knew what kind of man her husband was, yet she reacts like a toddler. Meh.

p. 118 Kylie has some very advanced notions about her father.
Considering that she still gets read bedtime stories and all.

I'd much rather see Shelton be a man with his family than a fox.
I haven't spent the entire script with the fox.

This idea has been done, but it has some life in it, with some twists.
When I first joined SS, my action description was chunky, like yours is now.
Learn from the veterans, Dreamscale is a great place to start.
Besides, you should give him a read in return for his efforts here.

If you amp up the human conflict and establish a brisk pace, this will improve.

Hope this helps. Keep writing and rewriting!

Regards,
E.D.

Hello again, Electric Dreamer.  Thanks for taking the time to wade through my script and for posting your thoughts.  Your comments have been very helpful and will certainly help me when I start my next draft.

You've raised some good points about Shelton improving his outlook from the time he spends with Charles and Warren.  I'll also have to keep your writing tips in mind as I work on condensing my action prose.