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I've been here since Sep-05. I've seen this site change. Seen people come and go. Fights, arguments, great collaborations and anything in between. Not sure if anyone else have noticed, but a lot of members have left lately. Some just quit coming here. Some went as far as deleting their accounts. Why? I can't speak for all of them, but for those I know and keep contact with off the boards, it's the negativity, stupid arguments and format nazi shit that drove them away.
Simply Scripts is unique and a great tool for any screenwriter regardless of level. Lets not ruin it. Right now it's a turn-off to a lot of people.
For those of you who've been around for a while, go back and look at some of your script threads. See who commented and offered great comments and suggestions, but is no longer around. It's quite sad…
The reason we don't get along is the same reason we all had different answers to the lightbulb question. We all have different interpretations and they are all correct.
If you stifle some of those interpretations, like the people who leave want - if you give in to intolerance then you are really limiting a lot of growth that can occur. Growth because you are exposed to interpretations you strongly, passionately disagree with.
I suggest that these people leave because they fear strong differing opinions. And I'm not saying there hasn't been some bad behaviour on the part of forum members, but only one of these people that left actually brought anything up to me as a moderator and that was because they didn't like the fairness of my moderation. Get that, they left because I was being too fair.
There's lines to be drawn, no doubt. But they are a lot blurrier than you would expect. There's no right or wrong here - except maybe the people that leave and try to lay their guilt trips on surviving members.
When I first came on this site a couple of years ago, many of the posters whom I really liked chatting are gone. It's easy to fall into the "I've learned a bit so I will slam every writer who crosses the line" trap.
This a great site. I left once and swore I would not be back. I was so beaten down from (what I thought) was people who enjoyed tearing me up, that I never wanted to be on this post again.
Don asked me to stay. I will always owe him that. This place has a HUGE learning curve to it. It involves, writing, technique, style, ability, humor, and skill, not to mention many others. As a member advances in one, it seems sometimes a dozen are waiting to point out the 99 problems he/she hasn't adressed yet.
Someone is always going to be offended here. If they are not, this site no longer has validity. But I think the mean spiritness has sort of become more the norn than it used to be.
With that, both the old timers we rely on as well as the new blood so vital for this sites growth, have seemed to be in agreement that there can be other sites that just might offer more than this one.
stupid arguments and format nazi shit that drove them away.
Simply Scripts is unique and a great tool for any screenwriter regardless of level. Lets not ruin it. Right now it's a turn-off to a lot of people.
I'll never go against format nazis. As long as they know how what they're talking about. And help the writer. Of late, I know when I open a script and its written by a newbie. Instead of helping, I just close them out.
I don't want to be a format nazi. I've given up passing on what little knowledge I have about this format because I've been accused as such. Why do you think the mods so rarely comment on scripts? I know they read some...
People don't want to hear it. This is kind of why I've alienated a few from this site in my day. So, I stick to those who've at least tried to learn the craft first.
Before I posted my first short here, I read two books on screenwriting. Read several scripts and commented on some written by folks here. I was kind towards any criticism I got, because I needed it.
Some of these new members may have been attacked with a heavy hand. But, they did not respond as persons, I believe, who want to learn the craft. They just got defensive. This Val guy just wants to argue. Period. IMO...
I'm always confused by the term "format Nazi", and the negative connotation that goes along with it.
Are you saying that it's a bad thing when someone points out glaring errors in the actual writing? Do these writers who, for some reason, can't really write, prefer to have their scripts riddled with obvious errors? Is it a good or bad thing when a reader lets the writer know he's got action taking place way outside where the current Slug says we are?
The way I look at it is writers often get free editing services, which most direly need.
How is it any different then a reader telling a writer that a part of his story makes no sense? Or that a character that saves the day in the end, died 30 pages ago?
It is too bad when good people leave the site. We all make our own choices and we do things for a reason. If people want to be praised constantly for the horseshit they churn out, they should stick to showing their scripts to their families. If they want real feedback, SS is the place to be.
Jeff, I prefer scripts written in present tense and little things like unnecessary "ands" and "as" and "asides" annoy me especially when a simple thing like that can be removed and in the process get rid of ugly space wasting orphans. These things annoy me because those are all things that was hammered into me when I first started trying to write screenplays here. However, fact is that none of those things matter that much. The readers will read the first 10 pages regardless and all that really matters is the story. A writer's style is not really a hindrance.
The people I'm thinking of that have left this site and that I miss are all great writers. They do not look for praise and would certainly never ask for input from their families.
I'm a bit surprised that you would rather read a crappy story that was written perfectly than a great story with some formatting errors. I've read a lot of boring scripts. They are tough to get through. When I read a great story, I don't even notice the format...
A great writer doesn't always write a great story, at least not in the eyes of everyone. It's impossible, because it's completely a matter of opinion.
But, a great writer can write a great script every time, once they understand how to. And by "great", I'm talking well written, clean, etc.
You and others make it seem like there are all these "great stories" floating around here...or anywhere else for that matter. Not in my opinion. A great story for me is one that is well crafted, makes sense all the way around, and is entertaining, and those are very hard to come by.
Now, don't get me wrong, you know damn well by the movies I say I love that maybe I'm not so hard to please, but then again, the vast majority of the movies I watch are pure crap, IMO. So, I am hard to please, but can be pleased by "simple" movies that are well done.
One more thing...people seem to hate to have to write clean scripts, but yet they bow at the alter of Blake Snyder and his other crony gurus. This makes zero sense to me. Someone, please show me a script that Mr. Cat wrote that's a great script.
A great story comes from a unique, great idea, and they don't come along very often.
A great script comes from a great writer, and that's just a matter of practice, commitment, research, and natural talent.
I don't think the issue's so much of a matter of being format nazis as it is readers jumping on scripts they know are going to be awful. I think if an average writer posted a script with a couple typos or formatting no-nos, readers would point them out but not harp on them.
The trick is not to read the 150+ page sci-fi from a nonmember with a format rating. But people do it all the time and on the occasion that the disgruntled writer will actually respond, chances are the thread'll make it to at least two pages of argument.
I know we're here to help other writers but it seems to me the writers who want help actually do some research on formatting before posting and care enough to proofread, even if they don't catch everything. The ones that don't will throw a script together spontaneously and either not respond to criticism or respond poorly.
You can defend yourself being a format nazi but not so much ganging up on a junk script because you don't want to read something that won't waste your time. People will gladly own up to one but not the other. That's the issue to me.
2 of my all time favorite scripts are The Cabin and Cannibal. They are both junk scripts, but they're so bad they're actually great.
If you're referring to the "The Ill" thread, I'm not sure what to say. It is one of those instant classics in its ineptitude and sheer terribleness. There is entertainment in that just like there's entertainment in pissers.
If someone has no clue how bad something is and can't or won't listen to reason, they're making their own bed.
So everyone's just looking for the next best/worst script? I read No Meat. I believe you when you say you enjoyed those scripts. I can't say I'd believe everyone else.
You should read "Of Cannibals and Cabins" - much better than "No Meat".
No, James, I'm not saying that peeps are looking for the next best worst script, but there is entertainment value there.
Many peeps actually provided sound advice and feedback on both of that dude's scripts. His responses were worth the price of admission alone. It may be sad that this is viewed as entertainment by me, but that probably tells you how little actual entertainment I have going on in my sad life.
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Stop feeding the trolls.
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format rating. But people do it all the time and on the occasion that the disgruntled writer will actually respond, chances are the thread'll make it to at least two pages of argument.
