****I was about to post this in the Shards thread, but it has disappeared. It is probably more appropriate here anyway*****

Hey Lee, sorry to see this has happened to you. Don’t get too discouraged though.  It seems you’ve got some solid leads, and the investigation process rarely reveals everything in the first few days. Just keep your eyes open. Obviously I don’t know all the details, and lack of registration means you can’t sue for damages, but if you can find the writer/s, you may be able to “hold the project hostage” in exchange for a reasonable amount of compensation (whatever feels right to you). I’m sure the infringing writer/s would prefer to give you a slice of the pie rather than starve themselves.

I’ll admit, before all this, I would’ve thought Poor Man’s Copyright (PMC) to be adequate.  I would’ve been wrong…

http://www.snopes.com/legal/postmark.asp

The link refers to a snail mail method, but I believe an e-mail method would have the same drawbacks. Disturbingly, many of the same drawbacks can be seen with WGA registration…

http://www.writersstore.com/wgaw-registration-vs-copyright-registration/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WGA_script_registration_service

Now, it appears that WGA registration may hold some additional benefits when filed in conjunction  with US Copyright registration (having a union at your back in the event of a lawsuit, for instance), but it is NOT a substitution for US Copyright registration. Indeed, in the States, it appears as though there is no substitution…

“an official Copyright registration with the U.S. Library of Congress is required to invoke the jurisdiction of U.S. Federal Courts, where most copyright infringement claims are adjudicated.” (The Wiki link, but verifiable elsewhere)

As best as I can figure, WGA registration will allow you to prove your copyright, which can theoretically give you the ability to halt unauthorized distribution of your work, but without a Copyright registration with the U.S. Library of Congress you can’t file in Federal Court for damages already incurred.

[This amateur analysis was brought to you from the loft above my in-laws' house. Please do your own research  ]

E Wall's 100% right.  (Not to flog the STS showcase, but it just so happens that I reviewed 'The Writer Got Screwed' today - which has a whole chapter on why you need LOC Copyright.  Not WGA, and definitely not "poor man's postmark.")

I don't know the details of what happened - but I'm heading over to the Shards' thread now.  Best of luck.  And if someone stole your work; screw them to the wall.

Best,

--Janet (W)

Quoted from wonkavite screw them to the wall.

It would probably be easier, in the long run, to nail them to the wall first, then use the screws afterwards.

Every writer needs to learn about copyright protection.

U.S. COPYRIGHT
A U.S. Copyright costs $35 (if you file electronically) and protects your work for up to seventy years after your death. It's admissible in court and can even help in disputes between U.S. and foreign citizens since the U.S. has copyright agreements with many other countries. An unknown writer actually stands a chance against a wealthy and powerful offender if he or she has their work copyrighted. You simply can't beat that kind of protection. It's affordable and it takes about ten minutes once you get used to it.

WGA REGISTRATION
I can't recall the cost or the period off the top of my head, but I think the term is currently five years. I can see a use for this if you're reasonably certain your script will sell soon. In that case, you might register a script with the WGA because it's cheaper and you're not going to own it by the time the period is up anyway. This will give you time to develop the script and sell it. In that case, the full protection of a U.S. Copyright may be overkill.

POOR MAN'S COPYRIGHT
The problem with this method is that it's too easy to fake. Psychics and mentalists have been tampering with the mail for centuries to create the illusion of predicting future events. Faking a poor man's copyright is as easy as sending yourself an empty envelope sealed with a couple of pieces of double-sided tape. You can simply stick your manuscript into the envelope and seal it after the fact. This is why it isn't admissible in court and never will be. So please, please, those of you who advise that sort of thing, please stop! You're hurting writers with your misinformation.

Those are my thoughts on the matter anyway.

Quoted from DustinBowcot It would probably be easier, in the long run, to nail them to the wall first, then use the screws afterwards.

Whichever hurts more.  (And I say that with the utmost empathy...  to the writer, that is.)

BTW - I just checked WGAW.  The fee (assuming you're a non-member) is $20.  IE: $15 less than LOC.  LOC protection is far more encompassing and allows for damages...and lasts until 70 years after your death.  

WGA is five years from date of registration, and far lesser protection.  Honestly, is there any question as to which is the logical choice?

And - btw - writers can copyright shorts as a compilation, saving a ton of money there.

I do both...

WGA and COPYRIGHT when I finish.

If I make major changes to the script, I COPYRIGHT it again.

Equal Retribution has three COPYRIGHT dates.

That way if an eariler version surfaces in some other work, that version is covered.

It may be overkill but the time I put into writing deserves as much protection as I can give it.

I've never COPYRIGHTED a short.

Shawn.....><

Two words

-notarial deed-


We have holiday tomorrow, so here's the blah...

There was a script I wanted to save as good as possible. My brother in law is engineer; he already had to save some of his inventions, I guess   engineering stuff and so on; and told me to visit a notary, because he said, the best status you can achieve is a notarial certification of the work. I called some of them and finally met with a notary. The notary was fine, and as an interested author, which  I am,  I liked the whole new to me surroundings of his place.

I life in a relatively small city, so, this notary wasn't ever confronted with saving literal material, but there's no difference to saving other stuff, he said. He was very interested in what I do; it was refreshing for him to see something different. So he gave me the lowest costs, because he saw I was a poor guy of his home city. I signed a document where my name and the date and so on were confirmed.

He copied the script two times and sent it to me, with the, signed by him and me, document I mentioned above. There's a bound through every page of the script now, and a certain official seal of our states jurisdiction.

He wanted 30 $ or something. I expected maybe 100-150 before.

That seal gives you another position. People who treat with law trust people who treat with law. You're not a number, or part of a database. There's a person standing between the burden of proof and yourself- the notary- who signed that at this and that date you strengthened your claim for property, which "already" is yours naturally.

At last it's all about the date. You have to prove that you did it earlier. I guess in the US, or elsewhere, you have the same possibility. I would definitely encourage you to speak to a notary. If it's too expensive, just say no sorry. You're authors, talk to those people, notaries or so on. Hear what they have to tell. Best regards.

For those of us in Britain, I tend to use the script vault.

http://www.thescriptvault.com/home.html

£10 per script for ten years. You receive a registration number within a matter of days but the script is protected from the date they receive it.

This is all very fine and good.

But many writers are not in the US. Or the UK. And neither are the thieves. This is the web.

If you spend your money and you get this protection - what how and what exactly do they do to protect?

And what happens when some bloke in India or Nigeria sells a script nicked from you?

R

I think Breanne nailed it.  Copyright your work before you show it to anyone.

If you're like Shawn and make alot of changes or take your time writing it, while showing your progress, Copyright it before you show it to anyone.

Peeps say they can't afford it or more accurately, don't want to afford it, need to...and skip a meal or 2 if necessary.  You get me?  

BE SAFE, not sorry...or pissed.

Quoted from rendevous This is all very fine and good. But many writers are not in the US. Or the UK. And neither are the thieves. This is the web. If you spend your money and you get this protection - what how and what exactly do they do to protect? And what happens when some bloke in India or Nigeria sells a script nicked from you? R

It gives you peace of mind.
You can prove you wrote it first.
If/ Whenever a producer asks if your script is registered, you can pass over the number without hesitation.
If any later disputes with producer occurs you have the proof to back yourself up.

Probably loads I'm unfamiliar with, but for £10, probably worth it.

Quoted from rendevous But many writers are not in the US. Or the UK. And neither are the thieves. This is the web. R

I'm pretty sure you can apply for U.S. Copyright protection from any country in the world.

I see what you're saying, ren...

Whether or not this has legs in another country is to be seen, but it is better than nothing.

I suppose that also lends the question as to how foriegn writers get a script done in other areas of the world.

IMO, here's the rub...

Say it's made and you don't see a dime. You do whatever to seek retribution, right?

The movie is still out there and now no one will touch it.

So even if you do get a sum from a company that did you wrong, that script is toast and no amount of Copyright will give that back.

Can't unscramble the egg...

Shawn.....><

Scoob,

Good point. Well made.

But I'm still not sure it should have to be paid for. Old rope money for these crowds who take it, in my humble.

As for the other points about skipping meals I see no logic. Surely they could have noodles or something else cheaper. And how much do you people spend on meals? I'm no fan of McDonalds but I did notice they have some cheap options. Please note other food outlets are also available.

R

I don't like paying for it either, lol
But it's kind of like - if you believe in it that much, put your money where your mouth is... haha
Something you work hard on like Ledbetter said, it is worth doing, and protecting as best you can.  It's not invincible, but it's reassuring.

Why we can't just send one sript over Gmail,  then Hotmail,  and upload in dropbox? Dates and time of uploaded file will be there forever.  The proof is there.  These are three Internet giants and they are almost impossible to hack and fake dates or time of uploaded file.  Why we can't do that and be safe????????????.????... .

Quoted from INTS Why we can't just send one sript over Gmail,  then Hotmail,  and upload in dropbox? Dates and time of uploaded file will be there forever.  The proof is there.  These are three Internet giants and they are almost impossible to hack and fake dates or time of uploaded file.  Why we can't do that and be safe????????????.????... .

You can. You just have to prove it later on, that it's all legit.

This site offers a free service: http://www.copyrighted.com/

Guys -

Not to incite something here, but we're talking about $35 for an LOC - which provides the best legal protection (at least within the US - I can't swear by other countries.)  I'm cheaper than almost anyone you'd care to name.  (Just ask Phil.)  But even I wouldn't begrudge $35 to really protect a script that I slaved over to perfect from intellectual theft....  That's my main priority, above a lot of other things.  And no, I don't have tons of discretionary income.

--J

Every country has its own copyright laws and most countries do not require official registration of a work before an infringement suit can be brought. The US does however (for domestic works, foreign works are another matter).

Those with more global concerns might find these rabbit holes useful to tumble down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berne_Convention_for_the_Protection_of_Literary_and_Artistic_Works

http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl100.html

http://cc.bingj.com/cache.aspx.....DIQU3NJfHmdoH12xAZGD

That last link is cached, so it’s a little colorful.

P.S. Does anyone ever close their eyes and just see words floating all over the place?

http://www.thescriptvault.com/ works with both writers guild of UK and USA.

It's cheap cover for a long length of time.

When I was asked for my registration number in order for a contract to be sorted out, it was delayed because I didn't have it copywritten. They could have just ran with it. Thankfully, they were pros, were incredibly helpful and waited until I got my shit sorted out. Once I got the registration, they could then register it in the USA. Once I signed the contract, it of course, is theirs.

But the above link works for those of us in europe. It's a probably cheaper alternative than anything else and it works.
£10 a pop? For ten years protection?
Not a bad deal.

I think £10 is probably the equivalent to what the WGA ask for? Like £10 is probably $20.

But I like to use that site as it gives you a registration number and protection all in one. Saves a lot of hassle.

Quoted from rendevous This is all very fine and good. But many writers are not in the US. Or the UK. And neither are the thieves. This is the web. If you spend your money and you get this protection - what how and what exactly do they do to protect? And what happens when some bloke in India or Nigeria sells a script nicked from you? R

You get bugger all protection, mate. If a Nigerian or anyone else that don't follow copyright the way we do steals it, it's stolen and that's it.

Here in the UK copyright is automatic. All one is paying for is protection.... and even then it is only very weak protection and no protection at all if stolen by someone in a country that doesn't recognise our copyright laws.

Hey folks,

I'm back on the boards after a few days off to clear my head.  What happened was a big PitA and sent me on a depressive downward spiral, but I'm getting over it.

I'm copyrighting from now on.  I got in contact with the Writers Guild of Great Britain (WGGB) and I am copyrighting my next 6 features to ensure this doesn't happen again.

-Lee

Welcome back brother. We missed you...

Shawn.....><

I'll second that.

Welcome back.

R

Yes, welcome back!  I missed the other thread. Can I ask what happened?  (Either here, or via PM?)

Good to be back, guys.

Janet,

It was a simple snatch-and-grab of a work I posted on another site.  Someone lifted the script, or at least portions of it, reworded a few things and sold it off as their own.

After taking some time off, I've decided it's not worth the hassle to chase him for a simple apology.  What's done is done, dead and buried.  As will his career be when Capcom find out the script is a rip-off of Resident Evil.  It was a fan script after all.  No idea why I got so annoyed in the first place.

-Lee

Learn from the mistake. Always copyright.

And you still have more great ideas. Take it as a compliment that your material is marketable.

Gabe

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Quoted from Leegion Hey folks, I'm back on the boards after a few days off to clear my head.  What happened was a big PitA and sent me on a depressive downward spiral, but I'm getting over it. I'm copyrighting from now on.  I got in contact with the Writers Guild of Great Britain (WGGB) and I am copyrighting my next 6 features to ensure this doesn't happen again. -Lee

Good to see you back, mate.

Quoted from Mr.Ripley Learn from the mistake. Always copyright. And you still have more great ideas. Take it as a compliment that your material is marketable. Gabe

This is something I read on here in the Shards thread.  At least something sold even if I didn't reap the rewards.  That's a bigger positive over a large negative.

And yeah, copyrighting is something I'll be doing from now on.  Not worried about the cost because in the long run it'll be worth it.  

Quoted from Leegion Hey folks, I'm back on the boards after a few days off to clear my head.  What happened was a big PitA and sent me on a depressive downward spiral, but I'm getting over it. I'm copyrighting from now on.  I got in contact with the Writers Guild of Great Britain (WGGB) and I am copyrighting my next 6 features to ensure this doesn't happen again. -Lee

Happy to see ya back, Lee!

US Copyright I've heard is the best BUT remember ideas really cannot be protected like we think they can. Anyone can take an idea or a title and write it their own way. It's been done over and over. Best advice is write a damn good script...because once you start circulating even your logline, you can bet the leeches will be trolling for that great idea.