Quoted from james I don't expect anyone to produce it.

Don't anyone believe his bullshit.  He said the same thing about his train script.

:-)  What's up, James?

Quoted from james I think I will hear this a few times. I'm not sure I can expand this to an 80pg mark. I don't think the goods are there.

To reiterate what I had mentioned yesterday, I think you do have the goods here to expand, just the answer might not be there in your head yet.

The good thing about writing your own stuff is that you're not on a dead line.  Just sit back a couple weeks or months or so and just let the story marinate.  Other scenes and ideas'll come to you and you can let those marinate and then when you go back to revisit the hardcopy of the story again, see what pops up and if you want to go on from there.

You already wrote 25 pages.  Just do that 2 more times and you'll be golden.  :-)

- Mark

Youngstown!

Why haven't we grabbed a beer? You're like 40 minutes away. Actually, it would probably have to be a cup of coffee. Found out there's this pesky thing called a pancreas that most people have.

It will bark back at you when you drink like an idiot into your late 30s. I hope you're cooking up another nasty feature. Huge fan of your work, but I always need a shower after I read it.

Quoted from rc1107 I was definately into the story into the first 10 pages, but I think the scenes go by way too fast and the things that happen on-screen are a little too convenient for the story.  How it's always 11:11 and all that.  Of course this is a very fast paced story and a brisk read because of how short the scenes are, but I would have liked a little insight into her regular life and how she is.

Can't argue with you here. This story is very rushed early on. And yes, things happen very conveniently. I was trying to write a half hour episode. In which case, this should come in about 22 pages (with commercials). I'm already at 25. I blew it.

Quoted from rc1107 She just automatically believes and automatically goes to a psychic to talk about it without ever thinking twice.

I tried to write her a little reluctant at the outset. I didn't want her to seem like she truly believed in this "good luck" charm until strange stuff starts to happen. After it's too late for her. And, of course, my psychic is super conveniently placed in the story.

Quoted from rc1107 I don't know if you were trying to go black comedy with parts of this, but some of the character exchanges were just reading a little too off-kilter for me.

I love writing horror, but I always try to sneak some comedy in. I think, deep down, I like trying to get a laugh. It's not easy to do, but yes, I kind of saw this as a dark comedy while I was writing it.

Quoted from rc1107 Now I have a couple questions. Saki passed it on to her so he would be freed of the curse, right?  But the psychic tells Tina that she has to kill the person who tricked her into it.  So can Tina just pass the curse on to somebody else and be free?  And why doesn't Saki have to kill the person who passed the curse along to him?

My least favorite part of any horror is when things get explained. I can see your gripe. I thought I just gave you enough in the script, maybe I didn't.

Once you touch red three consecutive times the clock strikes 11:11, you have to do it the rest of your life. If you miss one, like Tina did, the beast comes for you. The only way to save herself is to kill Saki.

The beast isn't coming for Saki because he doesn't ever miss touching red when the clock strikes 11:11.

I tried to explain this with the opening scene. Dustin was told about this by Clyde. He misses touching red once. He has to kill Clyde or the beast will get him. If the beast takes Dustin, Clyde is freed from ever having to touch red again. Wow, that sounds awful to me now.

Again, I hate to explain horror. It's always that yawn part of the movie for me.

Quoted from rc1107 I didn't really like how at the end, Saki walks into the room afterwards and it's completely empty.  Then, after watching the video, Tina's suddenly back in the room.  It just kind of felt like a cheat to me.  Where did she go to?  Wasn't the room locked?  Maybe I missed something.

I should've written this better. Saki peruses the basement, but doesn't search every nook and cranny. Tina is hiding down there, waiting for him. She knows she has to kill him. He simply thinks the beast got her and can't wait to watch the film of it.

No need to quote your compliments, but I do thank you for them!

As always, I just post the scripts and hope they get some attention from a film maker. If they don't, I usually don't go back to work on them.

Did you watch So Pretty yet? Do while you can! It is the reason we write in this format, no?

James

Instead of throwing up a bunch of quotes, I want to say that I agree with some things Bill said.  I also agree with some things Marc said.  And, I agree with some of your responses.

How's that for vague?  

OK, seriously, I think you do have the groundwork for a feature and I also think it would be better than this short.  I think you need some room for this to breath, as some have mentioned it seeming rushed and you have even agreed.  I also feel like you need to rethink your curse story and make it a bit more believable - as well as have some kind of rationale behind it.

Tina can be a cool character if you want her to be.  She can even be a kickass character, as you already have her working as a trainer at a gym (scenes that i called a waste, but these scenes could actually define her a bit).

First thing I'd do is expand your intro to 5 or 6 pages, which would be pretty simple.  From there, Tina and Saki's intro and first night together could easily be another 5 pages or so, and your already over 10 pages and leading into your inciting incident, right about where you'd want to.

IMO, you should lose the psychic and have Tina's Mom or a friend be the one who lets us all know of the legend/curse (and I'd revamp it a bit, as well).

As long as you can come up with some interesting "filler" and characterization, I see no reason why you can't move the mall scene back to page 40-45, and play it out longer, and lead right into a roller coaster finale.

You'll need some additional kills and creepouts, but I honestly think you could and should go for it.

Quoted from Reef Dreamer The reason for replying is that this actually raises an interesting point in scripts, namely plausibility. Often we are asking a character to do something they haven't before, or in unusual circumstances etc etc Do we believe it. Different genres seem to permit different things and to be honest i am still learning what is permitted.

I see your point, Bill, but isn't that why we write such incredible stories? I want the audience to identify with Tina. I like that fish out of water script. She is no killer, but she has no choice. She certainly does not dispatch of Saki with deft hands. It's a bloody mess. She was lucky.

I don't know about any rules. I've read all the required reading when it comes to scripts. I don't ever remember one genre having more permission to cheat rules over another.

And I loved an Innocent Man and totally thought Selick sold that role! Again, he wasn't a killer, but had no choice!

That's just probably where you and I will differ in our opinions.

Quoted from jwent6688 Tried to coerce Bert into giving me a Tanis intro/outtro. Always loved that part of Soulshadows.

Haha...so even without the positive reviews, I would have had to read this based solely on the ego strokes.

Yes, I am that shallow.  

Sorry that I put Tanis to bed before you wrote this -- and this could have been a nice SoulShadows episode, too -- I have no idea what the object might have been, but Tanis would have surely been dressed in red.

So, yeah -- back on topic -- this is a fine piece of horror, James.  A set-up that is unique (enough), a good sense of menace, and spots of humor that actually work without undermining the building dread.

It doesn't need much, really, but I do have a few things to toss at you.

First off, you hit on two peeves of mine.  Clyde would say it is Dustin's curse to BEAR, not bare.  Fix that.  The other peeve is vomit.  Maybe Tina is no killer, but does she really have to run over to the corner for a quick yak before asking Lucinda what to do?  A small detail that I would lose, personally.  

I am not sure why we are opening in the bar with C.C., as this seems a bit of wasted time.  I might have opened right up in some dank and dingy unnamed restroom.  Just something to consider -- and maybe even creepier than what you've got for that very lack of context.

I like the scene with the cameras, and I like what you did with Earl throughout the story.  Lucinda was a bit cliché, and maybe that is unavoidable, but I also think Tina finds her too easily.  There should be at least a little searching involved, you know?  The Yellow Pages...the internet....something.

I also wish the beast had played some sort of role is Saki's demise.  I get what you are doing with Tina, but at the same time, I was kind of like, "Well, where did he go?"  It feels like he should at least be around, and maybe even drop a hint that Tina’s ordeal is not yet ended.

All of this is nitpicks, though.  Personally, I am not sure this has the legs for a feature, but if you think you can pull it off, you are definitely starting with a good foundation here.  You could start with more torment for Tina up front, bringing Lucinda in later, and having Tina have to hunt Lucinda down instead of just stooping to tie her shoe.

I mostly like this just as it is, though.

Hey James

SPOILERS!

I would highly suggest to expand this until a feature. Don't know if you like these movies but...it's a combo of 23 and Paranormal Activity. The short doesn't due this script justice.

Tina's your protagonist. I would probably suggest getting even with out of her clients.

Other than that, it was a good read. And good luck at Sundance with So Pretty.

Hope this helps,

Gabe

Quoted from james Why haven't we grabbed a beer? You're like 40 minutes away.

Lol.  My excuse is work.  Now that you guys have a casino up there, as soon as I get things a little better settled financially here, I'll probably be visiting on a weekly basis.  We should definately meet up.

Quoted from james I hope you're cooking up another nasty feature.

Two, actually, although I'm taking my good old time with them.  Right now, I have a fire up my ass to work on some shorts.  I have a new one finished and a couple others that I'm rewriting.  Plus, for the past couple weeks, I've been brushing up a couple songs for a new band a few of us might get together.  (I think it's our mid-life crisis kicking in.)

Quoted from james Did you watch So Pretty yet?

I sure did.  I thought I left a reply to it on the thread.  I'll check again to see if it never posted.  (Sometimes my wifi times out after I hit post.)

Anyway, I'll see you later.

- Mark

James

Very smooth 25 pages.  Not generally a fan of horror but the way you told this sucked me right in.  Liked the use of the laptop and camera. Think that first image of the ‘neon blue eyes’ on the laptop (p.12) would be a great moment visually. Great story, well told.

Steve.

Hey James,

I saw that you had a new short up, and after enjoying Willowick so much I had to give this a read! As with the aforementioned feature, this was superbly written. The pages flew by and it read quicker than most 10 page shorts.

While not entirely original (it reminded me a lot of Drag Me To Hell), you took a story that works, gave it your own spin and the result is great. I particularly liked your characters, especially Earl.

My main gripe with this was that your idea is too big for a short. I know you've stated you don't think you could stretch this out to a feature, but I have to disagree. As a short, everything just seems to happen too quickly -- the instances of 11:11, Tina learning about the curse, her transformation from scared woman into would-be killer.

Not much seemed to happen to convince Tina to visit a psychic (the radio turned itself up, her computer clock glitched). Then after these minor events she believes everything the psychic tells her, and after finding an envelope in her microwave she panics and decides to have cameras put up all over her house. I think more weird, bad and scary things should happen to convince her that she's been cursed and is in real danger before she goes to the extreme of having cameras fitted.

On the subject of the psychic, she was the only character I didn't like. She seemed far too convenient for the story and has been done a lot of times before (and done better in Willowick). She seems to know plenty about the curse - how it's passed on, how it works, how to stop it. Yet when Tina asks her about the beast she just shrugs it off with "I don't know for sure. Never have." I wanted to know all about this thing! Don't add such an interesting creature and tell us nothing about it - Give it a back story, a mythology.

Maybe instead of going to a psychic, Tina could have a friend or colleague who's into all this kind of stuff and they work together to find out what's going on, starting online in forums & chat rooms etc to learn about the '11:11' curse and then having to delve into old books to learn all about the beast.

This would have the protag being more active & learning things for herself, rather than just being told what to do. It would also give the reader a chance to learn along with Tina, discovering more about the curse & the mythology of the beast.

Also, Tina's transition to a killer shouldn't be so easy. It was almost as if she learned she had to kill Saki, puked, and was then suddenly fine about it, ready to get herself a disguise and go bump him off. She should be horrified with what she's got to do, wracked with guilt and fighting her conscience, struggling with becoming a killer. Then maybe another terrifying encounter with the beast could push her over the edge.

As you can see, the majority of the issues I had (psychic aside) were caused because this is a short. I seriously think you have not only the foundation, but also the talent to expand this into a terrific feature. I really hope you change your mind and consider doing this!

Thanks for reading Bert, and some great notes too.

Quoted from bert First off, you hit on two peeves of mine.  Clyde would say it is Dustin's curse to BEAR, not bare.  Fix that.  The other peeve is vomit.  Maybe Tina is no killer, but does she really have to run over to the corner for a quick yak before asking Lucinda what to do?  A small detail that I would lose, personally.

My bad about the BEAR. I always mixed that up, but I won't again. As far as the vomit? Maybe it doesn't work because she's thrust into all this too fast.

If I ever were to expand this into a feature, I would definitely spend more time tormenting Tina and she wouldn't find Lucinda for advice so quickly.

I like the idea of the beast hanging around, but I felt it would be too hokey if he had too many more lines. Was trying to figure a way to end this without him even speaking at first. I'm glad nobody's found it cringe worthy at this point.

Thanks again, ever gonna post a new script or just keep waiting for another horror OWC to roll back around???

James

Quoted from Mr.Ripley Don't know if you like these movies but...it's a combo of 23 and Paranormal Activity.

Thanks for the read, Gabe. I was trying to kick around a bit of the found footage ideas like you would see in Paranormal Activity.

I like the scenes on Tina's laptop and then another scene only on the viewfinder of the cam corder. Just wanted to try writing it out to see if it was effective at all.

Don't remember liking 23, but I may need to give it another look.

James

Steve miles, thanks for the read! am glad you enjoyed.

SteveUK!

Damn, you continue to impress me with awesome notes.

Quoted from SteveUK My main gripe with this was that your idea is too big for a short. I know you've stated you don't think you could stretch this out to a feature, but I have to disagree. As a short, everything just seems to happen too quickly -- the instances of 11:11, Tina learning about the curse, her transformation from scared woman into would-be killer.

Agree, agree, and agree. This would seem a little too unreal and rushed at this page length. It could easily be 40 pages plus, but I think feature length would require a major sub plot, one that will need to tie into the story all nice and tidy like by the end. . I'll be thinking about it now. Maybe it could be more about the beast and where it comes from, what it is...

I do like the psychic, even though she can be a cliche. I would definitely make it harder for Tina to find her though. I do like your idea of Tina searching this online first. Maybe more and more knowing people start to avoid her like the plague when they find out she's activated the curse and the beast is coming. Lots of time for some good chills in there!!

And you're right again about Tina becoming a killer way too fast. I would really have to back her in to a wall to make it convincing. But I've got plenty of pages to do that.

Again, thanks for the reads and awesome notes!

James

Hey James!

Sorry for being late to the party, pal.
Been juggling three features and a move into a new house!

But I've really wanted to dig into this one.
Always up for a read from the SS veteran gluttons for punishment!

P. 2
I dig how the dialogue teases the curse.
And the eyeball imagery is good fun.

But you also have three orphans on this page.

Saki sounds like a girl in the description.
Consider manning up your words there.

P. 7
The psychic visit feels left fieldish here.
Didn't really get that Tina was the type to go for this.
Perhaps it's more like we're here too soon in the tale.

P. 12
The "key is struck" parts read chunky.
Consider something like...

Tina split screens the camera views on her monitor.

P. 15
Hmmm, I wonder who dad is.

P. 20
I dig the camera set up.
Would play very well on the screen.
You found a fairly clever way to get a found footage element into the piece.

P. 23
The prime rib line is funny.

Finished.
I like the concept and the short worked for the most part.
But the climax fizzled a bit for me.
I REALLY wanted to know why the beast preferred Saki to Tina.

I do think you can draw out the suspense much better in a feature.
The taunting was very truncated here.

Perhaps the key to the feature may lie in the reward before the curse.
If you want/wish for something with touching red, you get it.
But the cursed person didn't tell you that you're now part of it all.

Using people's greed/desires gives it that E.C. Comics delicious edge, IMO.

Good stuff, James.
I'd turn this into a feature over reworking Willowick, *IF* you're interested in a sale.

Regards,
E.D.

Hey James,

I've had my eyes on this one for a while now as I really enjoyed 'Teaching with Violence' and I was interested to see what else you could come up with.

Like 'Teaching with Violence' there isn't a lot I can say other than the usual I really liked it. It had me glued to the screen to the very end. You come up with some intriguing little stories which are just hard to love.

For me, it was a little too long considering the story that you're working with. Looking back on the script, I'm wondering if you really need that opening scene in the bathroom...? I don't know. It's not a pointless scene, but I do think the story could be told effectively without it.

Sorry I couldn't help (again! ).

Another great script from you. Admire your work

Dan

Brett,

Thanks for the read! Hope those features are coming along nicely. I owe ya whenever you need a pair of eyes.

Quoted from Electric Dreamer Saki sounds like a girl in the description. Consider manning up your words there.

I didn't do well on his description in retrospect. Just wanted a dark haired European fella.

Quoted from Electric Dreamer P. 7 The psychic visit feels left fieldish here.

It was too rushed. If I expand on this, I still feel the psychic is needed, but I could take more time driving Tina to seek her out.

Quoted from Electric Dreamer P. 15 Hmmm, I wonder who dad is.

Her father. Who else? I don't get how you were confused?

Quoted from Electric Dreamer Perhaps the key to the feature may lie in the reward before the curse.

Very good suggestion, you now have my mind searching!

Quoted from Electric Dreamer I'd turn this into a feature over reworking Willowick, *IF* you're interested in a sale.

Damn you! Well, you're probably right here, but I'm going with my heart and reworking Willowick first. I've got awesome notes on it thanks to you all.

Dan,

Thanks for reading and glad you liked it. I like the opening scene, I just like to jolt the viewer/reader to start out a horror. It's not a rule, just a preference.

Thanks for the kind words and good luck with your filming! I did watch your music video, but didn't post on it. I did like it, just felt everything I would've said was already covered.

James