Quoted from nawazm11 I'd also like to say I noticed a lot, and I mean a lot of people reading two paragraphs and then literally writing they couldn't finish the script, and then consequently writing in this very thread as their final consensus -- "Yeah, I've read every script"

I think it's safe to say if they couldn't make it past page 1, or 3 or whatever, they wouldn't have voted for that one anyway. So they read enough to form their own opinion on it.

Quoted from DustinBowcot That's not what the rumours say.

I should know...I started them...

Quoted from mmmarnie I think it's safe to say if they couldn't make it past page 1, or 3 or whatever, they wouldn't have voted for that one anyway. So they read enough to form their own opinion on it.

Exactly.  Well put, Marnie.

And this is actually the key here...

We have peeps saying they're going to only read 10-15 scripts but they're going to give indepth analysis...and then...well...look at most of the feedback and you tell me how indepth it is.

The majority of reviews state the exact same thing over and over - decent writing, decnet formatting, a few errors here and there, but it's an OWC, so who cares?

Does this actually help anyone?  Seriously...does it?  Does it help when the majority say it's "pretty well written", when in reality, that's so far from the truth?  Should writers think they're writing well, when they're really not?  If they do, what are they going to do? They're going to keep writing the same way and expect peeps to love what they're doing.  Really?

Obviously, I don't think so, and I'll continue to give feedback that's based on exactly what I read.  And if I stop on the 2nd or 3rd passage because literally everything that preceded it was incorrect, and I give the exact reasons why...is that bad or meaningless feedback?  If I read through Page 1...2...4...or the whole damn thing, and I state exactly what's wrong...or exaclty what I think is wrong, does that make me a "bad reviewer"?  

No...actually, it's potentially the best feedback you'll ever get and if you take that to heart, and see the error of your ways, with alot of work and effort, you're going to be a much better writer, and there's really no way around that.

And with that being said...

I give you my TOP 3 ENTRIES in this OWC...

...and, these are in order of #1, 2, and 3...

1)  Bitch's Revenge - IMO, easily the standout effort here, by quite a margin.

2)  A Change of Heart - Well written, with great dialogue, good humor, and a nice twist on the UL.

3)  Final Piece - A great example of less being more, with simple, laid back, assured writing that packs a punch and takes no prisoners.  

Quoted from mmmarnie I think it's safe to say if they couldn't make it past page 1, or 3 or whatever, they wouldn't have voted for that one anyway. So they read enough to form their own opinion on it.

That's fine and valid, but I was making a point that it feels wrong to say "I've read every entry" or "Only people who've read every entry should vote" when they've read two paragraphs of one script and dismissed it. That's far from reading every entry, and their vote is barely any different to somebody who has read half the entries in full. It takes a minute to write a comment about how bad the first paragraph is and doing it 20 times doesn't mean you've read every entry, and it definitely does not mean that nobody else should vote since they didn't do the same thing. Again, not picking out particular people but that just doesn't sit right with me.

I read as far as I can, and will look over (what I consider to be) bad writing. I have dodged out early with one or two entries but I've gotten a lot further than one or two paragraphs. I've given what I consider a more than fair chance. I think both stories were of the absurd type. I also skip-read some, particularly the dialogue... which actually helps me get through the story.

I really don't even need this many reads on mine. I already have enough reviews to help me with the rewrite.

I read a little more than a third. Some I started and haven't finished (not because they are bad - I may do it for various reasons) but I don't comment on something I didn't finish.  

I would add this as a matter of framework. The extent and depth of reviews is dependent on the expertise and the values of the reviewer.

In terms of expertise - there are objective items (typos, punctuation errors, etc.) that even as a rookie in this field I am comfortable commenting on - so I will comment when I see them. There are other objective areas (Slugs, Orphans, Intercuts, etc.) that I will not generally comment on because I really don't know what I'm talking about in the first place (i.e., still learning) and, as such, I am fairly uncomfortable in providing feedback in those areas. I am guessing that I am not completely alone on this.

In terms of values - I will speculate that, even among the experts, there are differing opinions on the weight that some of these objective criteria carry over the more subjective areas (e.g., dialogue, conflict, theme, etc.). In other words, an expert in this area may feel that it is appropriate to focus their critique in the more subjective areas (story, dialogue, etc.) than on the mechanics of screenwriting. This can result in shorter reviews. If someone subjectively feels that the premise of a story is tired or unoriginal - what more than stating that does the reviewer need to say in order to constitute an acceptable review?

Anyway, I have read all the scripts in their entirety. That being said, it doesn't violate my sensibilities that someone would read 3 pages of a script and want to bail out. That is somewhat a review in and of itself - i.e., I read one third of your script and there wasn't enough there to entice me to go on.

Anyway - my ramblings for the morning.

      

Quoted from Stumpzian I have a different opinion. You should vote only if you've read them all. I defer to Don, though.

Ideally , yes. I don't think I have ever not read all the scripts in an OWC if I took part.

BUT... I do understand that life can get in the way and that within reason some find it hard to get to all scripts in the time allowed. And they never have been asked to do so.

Better they read some, than none at all.

One OWC I think we have 45+ scripts, that adds up.

If Don does his normal pass, consider, recommend method, then any votes will add to the averages, so even if you haven't read them all, you would still give the vote more credibility by voting on those you have read.

I would also like the voting to include a 'this is my script' button to enforce we only vote on others. Best be clear.

This OWC was an interesting bunch. In some ways the criteria appeared good for ideas, in other ways it was limiting.

I can think of 2/3 scripts that have sound concepts but weren't the best delivered. I will probably vote for them higher than others as IMO the OWC is more about promising concepts, than polished work.

Got a couple more to do, I think.

Reading all of the scripts has never been a requirement for anyone.  That's a huge ask.

But if you submit and then read ZERO scripts, you are a scumbag leech.  No excuses.

If you follow the boards closely enough to be aware of the contest and submit a script correctly, then you are also aware of the honor system at play -- and have elected to ignore it.

If I find I have posted a review on a "zero reader", I go back and delete my review.  (Unless I totally slammed the script, of course , then I might leave it) I encourage others to do the same.

Don is more forgiving of those folks, but I would flat-out disallow them from future OWCs -- one of those rare instances where he and I agree to disagree.

Yes, I agree with Reef. Don wants all participants to vote. You can choose "haven't read" if that's the case. Since I believe he doesn't want to disqualify any user for not commenting on all of them (which I think is right), it's the best choice to vote even if you've read 5, 10 or 20 scripts only. It builds a better average than staying away without knowing if some won't.

Trusting in an unwritten law, and stay away, is the other pattern though.

But, wouldn't those lazy ones be selfish again and vote because they read three scripts, and then give one of them a recommend?

The average is better if everyone votes imo.

Since Don gives us the "haven't read"- box, I think everyone who took part and read should consider or recommend those she/he liked.


On another note, I disagree with some who stated this challenge lacks in quality. It's the opposite imo. It's very positive that the lower third of the scripts is much better than it was usually imo. The gap narrowed a lot here for my taste.


@ Well done mods and hosts, and Don of course. Thanks for your commitment

It's been a little crazy in my neck of the woods, so I decided to stop and vote for what I did get to read. Just in case life keeps throwing me a wrench.

I hope to eventually read/review the scripts I missed. For me, most of the entries I read were surprisingly good, but a few fell flat.

I'm glad not everything was horror (And I love horror!) or one genre, so that opened up the possibilities. This was good for me because I had just written an urban legend-based horror feature script, and so I decided to do a 180.

Good luck to everybody.

My 3 faves were:

Roadside Attraction (fave)
Change of Heart
Final Piece

I tried to guess who wrote what but I have no freakin clue.

My picks are:

Apple (absolutely the best)
A Change of Heart
Doctor Shopping

I read only 13. And the 13th was after I submitted my vote otherwise it would be another recommend.

Really great job this OWC.

Don't remember how many I've read. Not many. Maybe six or seven. A couple I elected not to comment on, but the others I felt were really good for OWCs scripts. They can be a bit of a mess sometimes.

This was an interesting(and quite a tough) challenge.  It's hard to improve on stories that are already complete, and have stood the test of time.  That being said, there were a few standouts for me:

The twistiest:  Captain Hook
The funniest:  Bunny Man Untold
Best concept:  Tie between Strangers Come a Knockin' Round Midnight and The Wandering Bus
Flat out weirdest: Phantom Barber
Best use of Richard Gere: Arthur the Legend