Anthony

Thanks for the read. Sorry this didn't work for you. I've explained my intentions with this numerous times on the thread so I won't bore you with another long winded rendition.

Yeah, this does dip into melodrama at times, which preferably, I'd like to keep to a minimum but given the situation there are going to be words exchanged of that fashion, that high drama so it’s difficult to avoid. I'd like to think with strong enough actors it would come off emotional and genuine rather then hokey and overwrought, it’s a case of trying to stay the right side of that ever fine line between the two.

Case in point is "Revolutionary Road" the book is great, fantastic read but it does descend into melodrama many times which reads fine, often wonderful since Yates is such a first rate writer. In the film however, there is no denying that it becomes much more noticeable when experienced on screen. Some of the arguing scenes really coast that dreaded border, one or two, in my opinion, spilling into the aforementioned territory. For the most part though, they do a great job and I enjoyed the film, particularly on the second viewing and that’s undoubtedly due to both actors being up to the task. Obviously this measly thing I've written can't even be compared to the said text it’s just the similarities of situation where you have a verbally warring woman and man that I draw the parallel.

"I see very little resolution, which is why I need to ask - why are we joining in with these people at this point in their lives?"

-- Correct, not much is resolved accept whatever satisfaction the woman may have derived from telling off men that hurt them deeply in the past. The reason why I chose the low key ending was purely for realism - I simply ask, If you were in such a situation, would you spark a big scene, get it all out in the open when all four of ye meet? Or would you bite your tongue and inform your current partner when ye go to the car or whatever? I'm under no allusions, I know I'm a ball-less, lily livered, yella bellied, mealy mouthed weasel who will be choosing option 2 and I realise not everyone is of the same spineless persuasion but I think its fair to say that most would take the easier life and do the same.

"Add to it the coincidence that each has dated the other in the past and it feels even more forced."

-- While I chose to conclude this with what I thought would realistically happen (thus sacrificing drama), I definitely used some dramaturgical licence when setting up the situation. Sure, it’s a coincidence but not totally implausible, every film you watch is driven by coincidence and chance. I don't think what happens here is pushing things or breaching boundaries that haven't been exploited before.

"I think you can play with this and make it better by adding locations.  I would add each couple later on at their apartment, talking about the meeting in the airport over dinner. You can flash back to bits and pieces of the airport drama and juxtapose it against the dinner conversation, where each of the four would basically be lying about what was said in the conversation and what happened in their pasts. This for me would be giving the audience a glimpse into these lives, and add some consequences to the action (i.e., they're all keeping something from their significant others)."

-- That's a fine idea Anthony and one I may well explore in the future, thank you. In terms of "they're all keeping something from their significant others" I think its pretty clear from John not knowing Mark and more significantly (since they were to be married) Elaine being unaware of Helen that they are all keeping secrets from one another.

The lack of acknowledgement experienced between the four when they meet was to suggest this; How they all represent a part of their lives (more specifically their past) that they would rather forget.

Thanks again for your comments, Anthony, very helpful and much appreciated.

Cheers

Col.

Vladimir

Thanks for your comments, glad you liked it. This is one of those scripts that is going to divide people. The ending being the most divisive factor and I can appreciate why some don't go for it.

I'm always particularly pleased when someone says the dialogue worked for them here because that's really what makes or breaks this piece. It all hinges on the characters conversations being genuine. Without that, the whole thing falls on its face.

It's funny that you picked up on the visual aspect of it as it’s not something I ever went for or ever thought about in regards to this.  It is purely two sets of characters sparring off on another, the closest work I’ve done that, in some way, resembles a play. Although, the airport does make for a busy, diverse location with people going to and fro all needing to get somewhere. It provides the perfect backdrop and compliments the tension builder of Elaine and Mark unwittingly on a collision course of sorts with John and Helen.

Out of curiosity, what spelling and grammar issues are you talking about? I'm sure there are a few sprinkled here and there but what scripts doesn't have them? Nothing too distracting I hope.

p.s. I love your username, very cool.

Cheers again for taking the time to read this and commenting. Let me know if you got anything, I'd gladly return the favour.

Col.

nice work col. thoroughly enjoyed it ... would have loved if u made it a lil more compicated with flickering images from the past ... for me a screen play should be some thing that has some visual value ... so thats myway of doing it ... but ur dialog was superb .. wish i could write this kinda dialog some day ...

by the way .. i would recommend a movie for u to watch .... the movie is named ten .. by abbas kiarostami ... i think u ll enjoy it ...

Thanks for the comments, Raz.

Cheers for the recommendation, I'll check it out as I liked his segment on the feature "Tickets" with Ken Loach and Ermanno Olmi.

Have you any new films coming up?

ya i have written one but i don't think its good enough to be posted on simply ... i am working on another one ... lets see how it turns out ...

Ya i have yet to see tickets ... but i have seen "TEN " and " Sheeren" , It was a new cinematic experience ...

Just like when I first saw  blue velvet ... although its a totally different genre but i bet its will be a different experience

I think this needs a lot of tightening. It's pretty long-winded to get through all those conversation until the two pairs of couples meet each other.

Although the dialogue sound very natural and smooth for each character, it's not that interesting. I never got a sense of tension that their boy/girlfriend would find out about their love one's past.

And I think, especially between the talk between John and Helen, was just talking head. Mark and Elaine's talk was better because they were actually doing something.

I just hope the story can be more compelling. No offense.

Writing and format is pretty good. Maybe you can get rid of the CUT TOs.

Herman

Herman

Thanks for the read. I can see where you're coming from, this type of story isn't going to appeal to everyone.

The reason why I used the CUT TO: so extensively at the end is because by then they are both occupying the Arrival's Lounge so I didn't want to use separate slugs but still required a division for both sets of characters, for clarity.

Personally, I don't mind using CUT TO: in a situation like this if you are going back and forth between two scenes in the same location as things can get confusing for the reader otherwise.

Thanks again for taking the time, Herman, let me know if you have anything you want me to read.

Col.

Col,

Wanted to return the favor. Pretty clean writing. This was the only dialogue that threw me a bit. pg. 11

HELEN
Yeah...I never got the chance
before with your mother was being
sick.

Other then that, very clean. Dialogue was true.

I don't get the title. Maybe you could explain or reference me to a comment.

Overall this was pretty sad. Poor Helen, left at the alter, dating an abusive guy. Doesn't really seem like anyone is truly happy here.

I guess my complaint would be that I didn't get what you were trying to convey here. The point of the story eluded me. Nobody changed. Maybe that was the point??

Anywho, can't fault your writing, loved the dialogue. Very clean and well paced.

Nice work.

James

James

Thanks for checking this out, James. Good catch with the dialogue typo, I just checked the latest draft on my computer and it had been fixed, I musta polished it again after I re-posted it on here.

You're not the first to wonder about the title, I've explained it many times in previous comments but couldn't be bothered right now to go look for it so I'll go through it again briefly, it’s nothing too clever or complicated anyway.

Basically, it’s a reference to what is considered (although arguable) statistically the worst hand to be dealt in poker. In my lazy, half as?ed attempts to be smart, I drew the analogy of the hand to that of the two men in the piece. I imagine Mark to be the Two, a low card of little value or merit (unless you get a run from the Ace) and John to be the Seven, a decent card in comparison to the two but not all that useful either within the said hand. In other words, John might seem like a spineless prick but represents the lesser of two evils when compared with Mark. Pretty basic I know but I think it has a nice ring to it while stoking curiosity by most who've read the script, which is never a bad thing.

As for the point of the story, you're right there is no "arc" to speak off, except maybe Helen finally getting a few things off her chest but at the same time we know now that she has effectively gone from the frying pan into the fire by shacking up with Mark. The concept really came when wondering what would happen if such a random (admittedly improbable) thing like this were to happen. How would the people react in such a situation, how would they deal with it and what would be the most likely outcome. I sacrificed drama and a big climax for what I thought to be realism (bar some melodrama from all concerned), how I thought it would actually pan out in a real life scenario. That the women would bite their tongue, keep their mouth shut, not cause a scene and possibly wait till their were alone with their current husband/boyfriend before filling them in and maybe intervening further down the line, who knows.

I understand the ending is very anti-climactic and you're left wondering "what's the point of all this?" but that's just what I feel would happen as oppose to ending it with something the audience would like to see happening. Lets just say, its not going to be included as a sample in a "How To Write A Screenplay" publication anytime soon...and I'm cool with that.

Thanks again for taking the time, I'll be checking out more of yours in the coming days.

Col.

I did wonder why neither of the gals opened their mouthes. I do agree, feels very real. Sometimes it's just so much easier to avoid conflict.

Admit, the title was what intrigued me. Just a bit hard to get at first. After your explanation, I really like it.

James

Hey Col.

Saw this title and couldn't resist.  It's a great attention grabber.  (Probably even to those who don't like poker, it's still intriguing.)  And I knew what you were going for in the title while I was reading.  (Except I thought it applied to the girls, too.  Helen we can definately see she has problems, and maybe that's why she likes Mark, because even though it might be misguided, abuse is still a form of attention.  And Elaine has moved on, though she still seems nervous, she's not going to give in.)  I thought Elaine was the seven and Helen was the two, just like it makes sense that John is the seven and Mark is the two.

    (Now to just go on a little bit of a poker rant, don't believe anybody whose job it is to lie.  (In other words, don't believe the poker books.)  A 3-2 offsuit is worse than 7-2 offsuit, even statistically.)  That straight doesn't come near enough times as people think, and when it does, it can even be counterfeited by the 7 flush.  (You can check even statistically when those hands happen straight up.  I forget what is is off the top of my head, but it's roughly 7-2 is 45% to win, 3-2 is 30% to win, and there's a 25% chance the pot will be split.)

That of course has nothing to do with your story, just wanted to save you a couple bucks if you ever go heads up in the future.

All in all, like I said, it was the title that grabbed my attention.

I think you have a great great setup here.  You really built up a story that could have some great conflict in it.  Really good timing going back and forth between the two couples at the airport.

And then they meet, and there's a chance for some great drama... but then it fizzles.  Everybody's too much of a scaredy cat to say anything.  (Mark I figured would definately antagonize Elaine to a point that John would feel like he'd have to do something.  Then, I thought John would chicken out and Helen would rub it in John's face at the end that he's just running away again, then Elaine would come through somehow.)

But, as it is, after this great setup, everybody just shrugs and walks away.  I was left with a very empty feeling at the end.  So much more could have been done with this.

Don't take that as I think it's a bad story.  It's not.  That great buildup made the read enjoyable, but the fact that there's nothing at the end is what makes it feel a bit empty.  I can understand why you had everybody just walk away and not deal with anything at the end, because they're all very weak people.  But Mark could have really upped the ante for a pretty intense climax.

I see this was posted a good long while ago, (sorry I'm late to the party), so I don't know if you'd want to play with it anymore, but it was definately interesting.  Just needs something to tie it all up at the end and give them a resolve.  (We don't even get to know if Mark's still abusive, anymore.  He seems like he would be in his attitude, but Helen never answers that for us.  Not definitively.)

But good job building up tension on this one, Col.  I enjoyed it.

- Mark  (not the asshole Mark from your script, just regular Mark from SS.)

Mark

This is a blast for the past, thanks for digging it up and sorry for not addressing your thoughtful response sooner, I've been away.

Quoted from rc1107 Saw this title and couldn't resist.  It's a great attention grabber.  (Probably even to those who don't like poker, it's still intriguing.)  And I knew what you were going for in the title while I was reading.  (Except I thought it applied to the girls, too.  Helen we can definately see she has problems, and maybe that's why she likes Mark, because even though it might be misguided, abuse is still a form of attention.  And Elaine has moved on, though she still seems nervous, she's not going to give in.)  I thought Elaine was the seven and Helen was the two, just like it makes sense that John is the seven and Mark is the two.

-- I'm glad the title got your attention but even more chuffed that you gleaned the meaning of it from reading it, that's probably a first but I can live with that.

That's an intriguing point about the title applying to the girls. I always intended it for just the guys but I see your point, well spotted.

Quoted from rc1107 (Now to just go on a little bit of a poker rant, don't believe anybody whose job it is to lie.  (In other words, don't believe the poker books.)  A 3-2 offsuit is worse than 7-2 offsuit, even statistically.)  That straight doesn't come near enough times as people think, and when it does, it can even be counterfeited by the 7 flush.  (You can check even statistically when those hands happen straight up.  I forget what is is off the top of my head, but it's roughly 7-2 is 45% to win, 3-2 is 30% to win, and there's a 25% chance the pot will be split.) That of course has nothing to do with your story, just wanted to save you a couple bucks if you ever go heads up in the future.

-- Ha ha, I love the passion for stats and I won't argue, I was told an off suit 7 and a 2 was the worst hand by a few people and it stuck with me, I'm only a casual player myself. However, I have heard conflicting views such as your own also. Cheers for the insight.

Quoted from rc1107 I think you have a great great setup here.  You really built up a story that could have some great conflict in it.  Really good timing going back and forth between the two couples at the airport.

-- Cool, glad you liked that, it was too slow and laborious for some but it was always my intention to gradually bring things to a head.

Quoted from rc1107 And then they meet, and there's a chance for some great drama... but then it fizzles.  Everybody's too much of a scaredy cat to say anything.  (Mark I figured would definately antagonize Elaine to a point that John would feel like he'd have to do something.  Then, I thought John would chicken out and Helen would rub it in John's face at the end that he's just running away again, then Elaine would come through somehow.) But, as it is, after this great setup, everybody just shrugs and walks away.  I was left with a very empty feeling at the end.  So much more could have been done with this. Don't take that as I think it's a bad story.  It's not.  That great buildup made the read enjoyable, but the fact that there's nothing at the end is what makes it feel a bit empty.  I can understand why you had everybody just walk away and not deal with anything at the end, because they're all very weak people.  But Mark could have really upped the ante for a pretty intense climax.

-- All good points well expressed, Mark and the ending has been a bone of contention for most who've read it. Some understand the decision and like it, others, like you, understand it but don't and the rest just flat out don't like it...and all opinions are valid. However, this was the decision I made when I wrote it and I will always defend it as I have in numerous posts above. I felt the easy thing to do would be to have a sparks fly at the end. I constructed in that way, with both couples destined to meet each other due to the airport scenario and all the history, bitterness and tensions expressed in the build up that an explosion was inevitable thus the obvious thing to do and this didn't interest me. There were a hundred ways I could have initiated a confrontational climax but I try to subvert expectations where possible, predictability is the worst criticism regards storytelling I reckon so I wanted to avoid that.

Plus, I think how both injured women handled the situation is also more believable and more likely to happen (I think its fair to say that the average person seeks to avoid embarrassing public scenes) Their passive reactions ennoble the women in my eyes, they're bigger than them and want to move on, put it firmly in their rear view mirror without reducing themselves to their level.

Quoted from rc1107 I see this was posted a good long while ago, (sorry I'm late to the party), so I don't know if you'd want to play with it anymore, but it was definately interesting.  Just needs something to tie it all up at the end and give them a resolve.  (We don't even get to know if Mark's still abusive, anymore.  He seems like he would be in his attitude, but Helen never answers that for us.  Not definitively.)

-- Yes, it is from some time ago but I'm always going back to old scripts and reworking them and this could well get a look over too, no need for the apology either. And yes, its all left up in the air for reader interpretation. I always imagine both women would fill in their respective partners when they got home. What happened after that is anyone's guess.

Quoted from rc1107 - Mark  (not the asshole Mark from your script, just regular Mark from SS.)

-- Mmm, really, how do I know that? ;)

Thanks for the comments, Mark, very insightful. Sorry the ending didn't work fir you I completely get where you’re coming from, that's the beauty of opinion.

Col.