I posted my review in the script's thread but, for the sake of discussion and if anyone's interested, here's one of my suggestions to James:

"I wish that Dylan represented more of a challenge for Randall, since he managed to dominate him pretty quick. During most part of the second act, Randall seems to have Dylan under control.

Since the protagonist’s goal is to keep a suicidal alive, I think the plot demands more scenes where the suicidal escapes the protagonist’s “custody”. By making Dylan sneakier, you’ll give Randall much bigger headaches, escalating the conflict, and injecting more dynamism into the second act.

I don’t think you need to go all the way and allow Dylan to make a suicide attempt (once he does, it’s hard to laugh), but it would be cool if you give him enough rope to get close (repeatedly) keeping Randall busy and on edge."

I've read the script and absolutely plan on taking part in the discussion. I just haven't had the time to type something up yet. I've been busy.

I liked it though and was glad to see there were no Japanese people in this one.  

Quoted from Grandma Bear I liked it though and was glad to see there were no Japanese people in this one.

Was it the lizard man or the vampire herpes?

Oh and don't mind me. I'm not posting anything about Tis The Season until the script club is over.

I did not have a problem at all with there being mostly two characters talking and spending most of the time in one location. One film that came to mind was Secretary. James Spader and Maggie Gyllenhaal alone for the most part in one location and it was a good movie too.

My problem was mostly that I wanted to see more change in the characters. When Randall starts to open up to Dylan on page 51 I would have liked to see something happen after that. Like maybe a reversal of roles.

And James, I meant your Bucket of Blood script and the black market body part script too. I'm glad you didn't stay in Asia with this one.  

Yeah, I agree with Me about the reversal of roles and lack of change for the 2 characters.  As I said earlier, I actually was expecting their roles to be reversed immediately, and I think that still would have been a good idea.

What do you think about the depressing and downright "ugly"nature of the script?  Were you still able to laugh and find humor and entertainment?  I had trouble, especially with the masterbation segment, and constant barfing.  

Quoted from Dreamscale What do you think about the depressing and downright "ugly"nature of the script?  Were you still able to laugh and find humor and entertainment?  I had trouble, especially with the masterbation segment, and constant barfing.

To be honest with you I didn't have a problem with that at all. I can see how some people might, but for me it was a non issue. As some people here know, I've written some "messy" scripts myself.

Comedy is a tricky thing which is why I hate writing it. What works for one person may not work for the next person and taste in comedy even differs from country to country. It's very hard, if not impossible to write comedy that will appeal to everyone. I for one do not have a problem with scripts that border on the extreme or pushes the envelope. In fact I prefer that over dull middle of the road scripts.

In other words, the stuff that you and some others mentioned in the script thread to be over the top, was stuff that I didn't even think twice about. In fact, I probably chuckled at those.

Still, even if a script is "extreme" it still needs to have an effective story to keep us "extreme" people interested.  

Extreme things are not an issue for me at all.  In reality, I am an extremist in everything I do and enjoy.  The problems I brought up are not due to being too extreme, just too ugly, depressing, etc.  Mixed with atempted humor, it's tough for me to find actual humor here, based on the jet black tone.

Looks like we're not getting alot of back and forth in here on this script.

I've tried to get things going, but very few seem to want to involve themselves.  Oh well, sometimes, that's the way it goes.

I'm still here posting. Can't get rid of "me" that easily.

I understand what you mean by the ugliness, but I honestly do not have a problem with that. I also didn't think the tone was jet black...

Okay, so the discussion has dwindled, do we want to talk about some other elements of this script? Or are we done?

I'm in for whatever people want to discuss.  It just doesn't seem like anyone wants to add much here.  What happened to the rest of the group?

Sorry guys for not inputting much, been busy writing the feature.

To answer dreamscales question, I didn't have a problem with it. It was all exaggeration especially when Santa gets involved. Like Pia commented earlier (did bit a back tracking to catch up), comedy is hard. But comedy does serve to announce these problems rather than a serious piece that will make people cry. Look at fight club (deals with a serious matter but is able to pull it off a bit funny). But I think James' script worked in the comedy side of thing. It could be more if James added more chase scenes between Randall and Dylan.

Gabe

Hey, you guys are lurkers!! Waiting in the shadows.  

How about, subtext, layering, through lines, transitions, dialogue...
You guys can pick one.  

Quoted from Dreamscale Extreme things are not an issue for me at all.  In reality, I am an extremist in everything I do and enjoy.  The problems I brought up are not due to being too extreme, just too ugly, depressing, etc.  Mixed with atempted humor, it's tough for me to find actual humor here, based on the jet black tone.

I think this is all a matter of taste all across the board, really.  You'll have some people that like the subtle, dry humor, others that go for the darker stuff, like this, and ones that want the cute "puppy dogs" and ice cream funny.  The last group is those that are pretty much indifferent.  Which is probably where I fall.  I can appreciate a well placed fart or masturbation joke just as much as a built up, dialogue driven comedic conversation.

Anyway, on to your point, and I think it's an easy fix.  Mix in more of the female character.  Chloe, is it?  I'm not 100% sure.  Anyway, she is the other side of the spectrum for Randall, just sugary sweet and nice as can be, and their exchanges seemed to give Randall just a little bit of a push away from the dark side.  At least I noticed.

Quoted from Dreamscale Looks like we're not getting alot of back and forth in here on this script. I've tried to get things going, but very few seem to want to involve themselves.  Oh well, sometimes, that's the way it goes.

Patience.  The OWC is just winding down, and that usually monopolizes the board for a week or two.

I agree Shelton, it is a matter of taste for sure, but it's also a matter of what works, and what doesn't, and then of course, why it works, or why it doesn't.

I'm 45 and I still laugh like a teenager at a nice, big, loud, well placed fart, and masterbation "jokes" are funny to me.  The masterbation scene here is just downright ugly...sick...almost twisted.  I don't see any humor in it at all.  And then bringing it up again when Dylan buys Randall the same device for a present just didn't work at all for me.

It's important to note though, like I said in my original post, I'm not much for comedy in the first place, and black comedy is a step down from there.  But, whether I like the subject matter or not, I found this script to be well written for the most part, but extremely lacking in terms of plot, structure, and most of all, action.  I also feel that James missed several great opportunities to pull this off, based on the direction he chose to take his story.

Even black comedies can have some redeeming qualities and light hearted, uplifting values.  I feel that this is what is missing most here.

I think everyone is on the same page here as far as the redeeming qualities and uplifting values goes.  It's like I had said in my previous feedback.  It felt like the characters had just reached a point of redemption, and that was it.  The End.  

Now, I suppose you could go the route and assume that maybe, just maybe, Randall and crew were going to be somewhat better people and live happily ever after, but the precedent doesn't really allow for it.  So much so, that the few times we do see Randall "open up", he immediately shuts it down by saying he doesn't want or need a friend.

The masturbation (U, Dreamscale, U! ) scene, I had to read a couple of times.  I can see the gross factor in the mind's eye, but thinking about it from a film standpoint, it's a little more tame.  It is a set up for the later joke, which you mentioned, and I thought it worked out okay to point.  At least enough to where the end justified the means.

I think it's one of those things that either works or doesn't work, depending on the person.  But, I think the bottom line is that it wouldn't work for most, unless there are alot more twisted people out there than I imagine.

For instance, the masterbation scene in "There's Something about Mary" was downright hilarious, and turned out to be something that has been talked about ever since.  It was well done, and had lots of comedic elements that made it work.  I don't see the funny side to this one...what I see is the gross side, and it come off as  offensive, rather than comical.

Maybe it's just me...