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I use the dashes, but I've eased back a ton on their use, and sometimes replaced with the ellipse...simply because it strikes me as less harsh.
The ellipse(or dashes) is also useful in steering through a slug.
I've used a beat and ellipses interchangeably. So you don't have to read (beat) all the time. It usually means the same thing though. But maybe some people like to think of one as less severe than the other.
Man, your "advice" is as far off course as you claim everyones else to be.
Why did you omit to quote me on the fact that more than half the scripts on the 2013 Blacklist use camera placement/movement? Is it because it would contradict your "statement"?
People can do their own research and come to their own conclusions. Those that actually "care" to do it.
Yo, JS, calm down, bro. Make yourself a nice tall drink and down it. You'll feel better...trust me.
I don't know what you're smoking wherever you are, but things like this just ain't black and white, brother. This idea you have for pacing or whatever, is a bit loony. Are you saying you're using "beat" on a standalone line, because you want less on that page? Really?
Stoker is a kickass movie, BTW. It's Chan-wook Park's (of Oldboy fame) first time directing an American film. He's also a writer, and most of his work, he's written and directed.
Stoker was written by an actor, named Wentworth Miller. Whether or not you know of him, you've definitely seen him. He's been in a shitload of flicks and is well connected within the industry.
The opening page you posted for Stoker is piss poor spec script writing...terrible, actually. 99.9% of the time an unknown submits something like that, it's going in the garbage long before the reader will get to Page 10, let alone the entire script. Why? Because it's filled with complete and utter bullshit that no one wants to read.
As for your statement that because whatever % of Blacklist scripts are written poorly with beats, overwriting, whatever, don't think that makes it right...or why they somehow found their way onto that damned Blacklist.
And, check out just how well Blacklist scripts do in terms of BO results...or even critical praise. Not all that well, and that's because the scripts themselves aren't all they're cracked up to be. You see when you write in certain ways, it decieves the nonastute reader, and many of those in power, are not astute readers.
We all get to do things however we choose to and that's the beauty of life, but what you're saying is definitely not correct - there are always numerous ways to hose a bag, if you catch my drift.
"I don't know what you're smoking wherever you are, but things like this just ain't black and white, brother."
I stated nothing of the kind.
"This idea you have for pacing or whatever, is a bit loony. Are you saying you're using "beat" on a standalone line, because you want less on that page? Really?"
No. Not at all. You use beat whenever you feel there should be a pause. Nevermind the reason. Every script uses it for different reasons.
"Stoker is a kickass movie, BTW. It's Chan-wook Park's (of Oldboy fame) first time directing an American film. He's also a writer, and most of his work, he's written and directed.
Stoker was written by an actor, named Wentworth Miller. Whether or not you know of him, you've definitely seen him. He's been in a shitload of flicks and is well connected within the industry."
I thought it was a strange one, personally.
Chan-wook Park is the reason I watched the movie. I'm a fan of all of is work except Stoker. I don't see how him being a writer and having written the majority of scripts has anything to do with anything.
Wentworth Miller is the reason I read the script. Because I read somewhere he wrote the script under a pseudonym to subvert the very reason you cite why the script got made. It got made because it's well written. Not because he's in the industry. Well-written, however, and great movie are not the same thing, as is obvious to the movie going public.
"The opening page you posted for Stoker is p*ss poor spec script writing...terrible, actually. 99.9% of the time an unknown submits something like that, it's going in the garbage long before the reader will get to Page 10, let alone the entire script. Why? Because it's filled with complete and utter bulls*** that no one wants to read."
And yet there are several scripts from the Blacklist over the years that have done exactly the same. So the evidence is clearly not in your favor on this one. And lets not forget. It got made. A script you call piss poor terrible someone, as I wrote earlier, read, took the cigar out of their mouth, and said I'll invest $12 million on this thing. So clearly, the facts are proving wrong.
"As for your statement that because whatever % of Blacklist scripts are written poorly with beats, overwriting, whatever, don't think that makes it right...or why they somehow found their way onto that damned Blacklist."
It doesn't make it "right" because there are no "rules" to screenwriting. It means it's something that works and its clearly what the producers are looking for. For you to suggest otherwise is beyond logic, my friend. It's against common-sense. Damn, it's against human nature.
"We all get to do things however we choose to and that's the beauty of life, but what you're saying is definitely not correct - there are always numerous ways to hose a bag, if you catch my drift."
I don't say "Do it like this!". I say, "Don't be afraid to do it that way just because someone out there tells you otherwise." That's all really. As I said, people will come to their own conclusions when they do their research. I've done mine. I've seen the patterns. I've seen what writers--great writers from 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, so on and so on--put in a script and that is why I make the claims I make. I have no stock in arguing with anyone. I'm just warning people of these completely unsubstantiated claims people have found in some derelict corner of the interwebs.
I hated Stoker. Dull and slow and oh God, it was dull. I remember when Kidman used to be able to move her face.
I may have been in a bad mood, it does happen. I certainly was when it was over.
Anyways, to my point. As Led said once, you can write a script in red crayon as long as it's good. Nobody will take a blind bit of notice as long as the story is engrossing.
A beat is the American way of saying Pause. In the UK we'd write Pause. I agree though too that it can be used interchangeably with ellipses in dialogue as well as used in action lines. The fashion today tends towards ellipses or double-dash. Nobody likes using Pause or Beat anymore. Let's face it... both look ugly on the page.
I don't say "Do it like this!". I say, "Don't be afraid to do it that way just because someone out there tells you otherwise." ... people will come to their own conclusions when they do their research. I've done mine. I've seen the patterns. I've seen what writers--great writers from 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, so on and so on--put in a script and that is why I make the claims I make. I have no stock in arguing with anyone. I'm just warning people of these completely unsubstantiated claims people have found in some derelict corner of the interwebs.
There's many routes to production, as I'm sure your research will show you, and hopefully some of your experience will inform you too. There is an element of wanting that magic formula, the way to get it right, that is behind the STC devotees' motivation, and lacks the creativity and hard graft sometimes needed to get something made.
On Wentworth, it's clear that by the time the script got to Nicole Kidman, there was a cinematic influence by the director - she comments on it, so he had the chance to influence the written work. Kidman still states it was the story that sold to her however, and underneath the clutter, much of which is unnecessary, there is a good story - which is the key to any good script. Try getting hold of the abortion that was QT's first draft of RD.
On Billy The Bomb, I noticed that you tended toward the pedantic at times in regard to the writing, yet that script is now going into production. So you must agree that scripts good and poor can get the go-ahead. And a clean written spec, that avoids clutter in the way of directions and beats, and concentrates on a solid story is a valid piece of work? If so, peoples' posts here encouraging a clean read are not innaccurate, but a method of working.
And...careful what you try to lock in a suitcase and throw in the oven! I love that avatar SC, brings back some scary memories of watching that ep. of Trilogy of Terror - such a classic!
Open 10 Black List scripts randomly. Read the first 5 or 10 pages.
Then open 10 of the top scripts here and do the same.
As you read, don't focus on "rules". Focus on how the scripts read. Is the writing clear? Efficient? Does it convey a MOVIE?
Not all of the Black List scripts have great writing.
And most of the Black List scripts have concepts that don't interest me.
And very few have stories that really grab me.
But that said...the writing is one thing that MOST of the black list scripts have in common. They are generally MUCH better written than even the good amateur scripts.
If you're stuck on some set of strict rules that someone sold you, such as never do this or that, and always do this and that, you will think the writing in those scripts is flawed.
But if you judge the writing in those scripts on its effectiveness at conveying a story that can be imagined by the reader as a film, then you will find the writing to be vastly superior to amateur writing...most of the time.
Rules don't exist. Rules of thumb do. Rules of thumb are meant to foster better writing. Where they don't do that, they should be bent or discarded as the situation requires. There's no such thing as "correct" or "incorrect". There's only what works best.
If "we see" is needed to properly convey a scene...then it's the right choice.
If "angle on" is needed to convey the story properly...it's the right choice.
It's not about directing the shot. It's about conveying the story.
In Inglorious Bastards opening scene, there is a shot where the lens drifts below the stairs to show the Jews hiding underneath the floor. That shot is needed to convey the story, to help us imagine the film. Why would a script leave that out? Because someone said it's a rule? Because someone said it's a rule to not direct the shot? Really?
The idea is to not micromanage the scenes...leave stuff like that to actors and directors. However, if it's important to the telling of the tale, it should be in the script.
Yeah, I think JS is catching a lot of unneeded flak. No good writer gives a rat's arse whether you use 'we' or put ellipses instead of a double dash (like really?). If a writer needs to use beat, then let them use beat.
The Black List does have some circle jerk elements to it but the writing for the most part reeks of confidence and hard work. Here's the first half page of Hot Summer Nights, probably the strongest script on the 2013 Black List, and probably one of the best I've ever read.
"OVER BLACK
DANIEL (V.O) Every moment in life is the result of all the moments preceding it...or some shit like that.
From the darkness we hear a harrowing roar. Powerful and tragic. Like the aching cry of some prehistoric beast.
CLOSE ON A HIGHWAY SIGN: WELCOME TO CAPE COD Nightfall. We are in the middle of a violent hurricane and what we just heard was the wind.
Stinging rain slams into the earth. Snapped power lines and uprooted trees. Nothing’s safe. Mother Nature’s genocide.
I-6 Westbound. Breaklights for miles. Every Tom, Dick and Harry is headed for the hills. Except for one crazy bastard.
Driving headfirst into the storm’s mouth is a ‘91 CHEVY CORVETTE. It blows past us, leaving behind a trail of light in the fog."
This breaks almost every rule that the screenwriting police preaches. There's no slug, there's no character intro, there's 'we' everywhere, we have camera angles, asides, the only thing that's missing is a beat... But this is probably one the most visual writing I've read all year, it throws you into the scene and makes sure you can't escape the script's clutches. I know plenty of writers that would've just written "A hurricane brews in the distance as a car blasts by us". Economical maybe but so damn bland and uninspiring.
Yes, some Black List scripts turn into complete shit when filmed but what about the dozen others that have garnered Oscar noms?
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