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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    One Week Challenge    May, 2015 One Week Challenge  ›  The Deuce - OWC
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  Author    The Deuce - OWC  (currently 6962 views)
rendevous
Posted: June 9th, 2015, 4:03am Report to Moderator
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Now, onto Dr. Phil.


Quoted from Dreamscale
3 more to go, so if I can stay in, I'll be detailed.


Ooh. Hang on, if you can stay in? Is there the chance of a gas leak, or maybe a fire? You should be more careful. We'll be back right after the break.

You've been reading the first page of a lot of scripts then slagging them off. Must be tiring, put your feet up.


Quoted from Dreamscale
OVER BLACK needs to be left aligned.  I just don't understand how anyone could think right aligning anything to begin a read makes sense.


Fascinating. This is wonderful. You think it's wrong. Oh my. Bridges will fall, cities will crumble. Thanks for sharing,

Phil. Tell us about your wife's make-up website. We're just gonna take a short break. Be right back.

Read Gulliver's Travels, the part about the eggs would be of particular relevance to you. You'd learn a lot. Personally I like them narrow end up. Any danger of mentioning the script's story at any point?


Quoted from Dreamscale
IMO, way to many detailed things happening OVER BLACK.  I think attempting to do this is almost always a mistake, unless it's 100% clear and there for a reason.


Oh dear. Listening to the radio must be hell for you. How do you get through an album?

So you've said the opening transition is wrong. And the opening paragraph is probably a mistake. I'm beginning to get the feeling you aren't going to say anything good any time soon. Dedums. Plus ça change.

Ten seconds tops. Sets up atmosphere. It's good. You just don't like it. Thankfully you are not someone whose opinions I value. It is 100% clear. No one else had a problem with it. The reason it's there is because it works. It sets up intrigue.

I must say though, I'm really enjoying your review. Your views don't sound bitter or weak or anything like that. Have you thought about teaching kindergarden? You could explain to the kiddies how hopeless their drawings are.


Quoted from Dreamscale
Wow...6 passages to intro 2 characters and an unconscious guy?  18 lines!  


Oooh. Another negative comment, have you thought about social work, or counselling?

There's far more in it than that. Are you sure you read it? I know you're busy with the Syrian crisis and being on call for Accident & Emergency.    


Quoted from Dreamscale
Many of these are extremely awkwardly written and phrased.


An awkwardly written phrase in itself. You missed the subject out too, a point you're often complaining about. In amongst all the love and joy.

Care to give any examples so I can learn to master how you'd make less of a pig's ear of it? No, of course not. I suppose that would mean actually reading the script at some point and involve some careful thought. Far easier just to be overtly negative with painful stock phrases.

Have to wonder, do you get a buzz by claiming most of the other scripts are bad? I just wonder, as I note you reviewed your own and waxed lyrical about it. Rather poor form. On top of the fact it wasn't exactly much good.


Quoted from Dreamscale
I don't understand the "Chrissy" character - male, nearly pretty, heavy, and the kind who can chew a toothpick and not look stupid?


You don't understand him because he has personality and depth.


Quoted from Dreamscale
Writing continues to be awkward, long winded, and dialogue is going nowhere, sorry to say.


Nice emphasis there. Got it the first time. Now you're sounding like a weak politician. Any examples this time? Oh dear.

Sorry to say? I suspect you must be sorry a lot, as you've been doing the same old sad trick for years.  


Quoted from Dreamscale
Lots of incorrectly broken up passages - keep them to 1 thought or shot.


Nope. Wrong. Dull.

Not seen one mention of the story. You mentioned a character once, but you failed to understand him.

I know mentioning the story would involve actually reading some of it, but I do think if you're going to review it Phil, you really should read a little of it, just so you can pretend properly.


Quoted from Dreamscale
OK, I'm very bored and leaving right before page 4.  Nothing of any interest has happened.  Sorry.


Unlike your review, of course. That was thrilling. Put Kafka back in his box, I tell you. Made Chekov look like James Patterson. Cervantes it certainly wasn't.

The same dull phrases in every one of your reviews. Don't you ever get bored doling out the same tired old cliches?

Nothing of interest has happened. Oh dear Dr. Phil, aren't you supposed at least to help people by exploiting their faults by means of exposing them on television?

I don't think you even got to page four. I doubt you bothered to go halfway down the first page. You just copied and pasted the same old gumph you always dribble out. But it's not just my script you do it on.

Apart from on your own script of course.

Your tactics are weak and repetitive. Worst, they are disappointing. It's like being chased by a sheep.

Now, I believe Robyn is going to pretend to help some vunerable women in need, by flogging them some of her cosmetics.

R


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rendevous
Posted: June 9th, 2015, 7:15pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from paydirt
I thought this one was pretty good.


Back to sanity. Thanks, paydirt.


Quoted from paydirt
It's well written with only a few minor errors and a couple of orphans.  The banter between Joey and Chrissy works well.


Thanks again. Oh, what's this about errors and parentless bairns? We're back to biscuits and you're talking your way out of one.


Quoted from paydirt
The action lines are verbose at times and it lagged a bit in the middle,  but overall a solid effort.


The last bit saved it. Half a jaffa cake. I'm never sure if they're biscuits or cakes. I could discuss this further, but I won't.

R


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rendevous
Posted: June 9th, 2015, 9:09pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Dustin
Code

JOEY
Don’t look at me like that. This is
important. Listen, and don’t do it
again. Is he supposed to be awake
or asleep?


Don't do what again?


Just prior to this Chrissy shrugged in response to a question. This annoyed Joey enough for him to mimic him and ask him 'What the fuck was that?'

I hoped most would remember what just happened. A quick look back and you'd have seen it.


Quoted from Dustin
Code

JOEY
You sure? I thought he said
something else. I mean are you
absolutely sure? 


It can't be that difficult to remember unless this is a comedy?


It's amusing in parts. Like my face. Never been nervous and wondered what someone in charge said to you exactly? Never had a disagreement with someone about what exactly was said?


Quoted from Dustin
Code

DOM
Why’ve you bound me? Hey, I’m
talking to you.


Who talks like that in that type of situation? They'd likely scream... even men. Dialogue is way off for me so far.


Oh dear. I've explained that a few times in previous responses. Absolutely no biscuits any time soon. And I've just invested in a full pack of Farley's Rusks.  


Quoted from Dustin
Code

His voice is hoarse, pained.


Really? He's tied up and been beaten, he wakes up in a lift with the two perps, alone... I'm not buying this at all.

I'm out at page 6. The dialogue is killing it and I don't believe the actions of the characters. Even if this guy does turn out to be the Deuce and he's tricking his way out, I'm too bored to find out. Not one for me.

3 out of 10.


Oh double dear. Somewhat of a shame. Three? That is harsh. Have you only a few points left?

I was wondering what you'd think, as I thought a guy waking up in a lift with two perps would be right up there in your book. Goes to show how wrong you can be. I mean me.

Still, at least you did actually read up until page six. You've already apologised in a previous post, so I think we can both move on. Just one of us will be biscuitless. And it won't be me.

R


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rendevous
Posted: June 9th, 2015, 11:58pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from nawazm11
Hard to judge, there's a lot of banter, a lot talk, much which seems to be useless -- but I guess that could be argued.


Indeed, it has and shall be. See the previous responses. You can ignore the biscuit stuff, but only at your own risk.

Funny how these comments ebb and flow from rather good to ooh dear me bad. Much like my hairstyle.


Quoted from nawazm11
The crux of the story is good, but it's seriously a wonder on how you even stretched it for so long. Two guys grab the wrong guy, that's literally it from what I saw unless I missed something major. Cut it down, cut everything down actually -- either put more meat or leave it out. A decent effort nonetheless though.


Another wonderer. Well wonder no longer, nawazm11.

There's a bit more to it than your take on it. You were somewhat harsh there, I'm not Adam Sandler. And that Libya thing - that's got nothing to do with me. I didn't vote for the Conservatives either, I never have. And I was nowhere near poor Charles Kennedy when he went. I liked the guy.

In my script there's power play, the problems with being a gangster, the politics. All that and more in the dialogue. But if you didn't like the dialogue then it's pretty much like giving you a Mars Bar and asking you what you thought of the caramel bit when you've already proclaimed 'I don't like chocolate.'

There's loads of meat of on it, the story I mean, not the Mars Bar. There's elephants with less meat on them. Would you like a Farley's rusk?

Well you're not having one. You get one Ritz cracker, from the bottom of the box, for the very start and very end. You lost your way in the middle there completely. Much like David Cronenburg does these days.

R


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Dustin
Posted: June 10th, 2015, 6:40am Report to Moderator
Of The Ancients


Action speaks louder...

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I've probably unduly scored this down because I'm a little tired of that particular story where people wake up bound and the reader is led on a journey to discover why. I'd just written one in Disassociation. I have noticed that I have a certain distaste for those type of scripts recently and this unfortunately falls into that category.

There are people that would remain calm, because that's the best thing to do. Maybe if you started using the odd wrilie to help us better understand the tone of the character's lines. Because in the instance where your character says 'Why’ve you bound me? Hey, I’m talking to you.' I'm finding it difficult to imagine this actually being said. I can imagine a 'what's going on?' even a 'what are you doing?' in a slightly panicked tone... but if you wrote (calm) this would let us know how the character is handling the situation, otherwise you allow the reader to place their own tone on the words and it may not be the tone you intended.

Obviously not something you should do all the time, just when it may not be clear from the context.

I'll give it another read with a less judgemental eye as it seems quite a few people like it, so I'm obviously missing something.


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Dustin
Posted: June 10th, 2015, 6:56am Report to Moderator
Of The Ancients


Action speaks louder...

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I still think you need to tighten up the initial dialogue from Dom. Other than that though it's a good story. Way better than mine and I did unduly score this. I would give it a 6.5.

Only missing a 7 because I still think Dom's initial dialogue is off-kilter. Sorry again for my earlier review, I didn't give it much of a chance after that dialogue... well, I didn't give it any chance, and that was unfair.


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Dustin
Posted: June 10th, 2015, 7:18am Report to Moderator
Of The Ancients


Action speaks louder...

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If you do rewrite this I have a couple of suggestions. Lose the lift. Have it happen on a stairwell because the lift is out. So they have to walk the guy up the stairs. They're not going to carry him, so he needs to be brought back to consciousness. The thugs also should intimate something about the boss, about how he's expecting them and the Deuce, and that if he isn't the Deuce, they're all fucked. So their only option is to do what they end up doing.

There's no reason at all, if you make it simple enough to film, that this one wouldn't get picked up. Good luck with it.


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rendevous
Posted: June 10th, 2015, 7:46am Report to Moderator
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Dustin,

Some interesting points made. I appreciate the reread and comments. I'll come back to them once I've done with the others. Thanks for that.

R


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rendevous
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Quoted from oJOHNNYoNUTSo
A case of mistaken identity makes for a funny ending. It felt like a scene from a feature rather than a short, but it's got legs.


Dancing ones. I'll take all that as a compliment. Thanks.


Quoted from oJOHNNYoNUTSo
Writing was okay - a bit clunky -


Steady there. You probably meant 'classy'. Easy mistake.


Quoted from oJOHNNYoNUTSo
I'd imagine the writer knows and is itching to smooth it out.


I wouldn't count on it.


Quoted from oJOHNNYoNUTSo
I would recommend cutting out some of the dialogue. Joey's character was annoying, I guess he's meant to be, but up against the coolness of Chrissy it wouldn't take much to get that across.


He is meant to be annoying, at least at the start. They both change tone as the story progresses.

I'm quite fond of the dialogue. Certainly could trim some, this is nearly always the case. But I think it works as it is. Only way to know for sure is say it out loud. I did that. It went quite well, apart from inadvertently amusing a neighbour. But there's not many scripts that don't need improvement. I'm not saying this is one of them. Well, I probably am. But I was trying to be modest. I suppose I should try harder. Pretty unlikely any time soon.


Quoted from oJOHNNYoNUTSo
The Deuce is a fun name. Could be interesting to explore in some of the dialogue why they call him The Deuce. I also liked how you presented Dom at start, pretty quirky.


Steady now again. You were just telling me to cut the dialogue. I guess you mean dump some stuff and talk about the Deuce. I did that in an earlier version. Felt a bit too telling and treading water, so to speak. Mind you, I might have been doing it wrong. That's what all my women say to me.

I think the brief mention of him as I have it creates just enough intrigue. As for knowing more about the Deuce name, it's just like having a third burger. You think you want it, in fact you're sure you do, but once you do, you're not sure you did in the first place.


Quoted from oJOHNNYoNUTSo
Not bad. It's been done before, but I like it.


Not by me it hasn't.

Felt original enough to me. It also was a route no-one else went with. So I think I did alright there. I like it too, the sharper tools in the box may have already realised this.

Many thanks, Johnny. Most appreciated. Have a fondant fancy and chocolate finger. No it isn't. Dirty.

R


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rendevous
Posted: June 11th, 2015, 4:09am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Grandma Bear
I don't see how Khamanna thought I wrote this! Upmarket is definitely British!  Or an Aussie thing.


Spot on call with the former. I was going to a lot more disguising my origins. But it was making it worse rather than better, so I stopped and did it properly instead.

I giggled when I heard the guesses. I was quite pleased you got picked for it, as your writing is rather good and often gets filmed. I was also thankful they didn't pick a dunce, or a dick.


Quoted from Grandma Bear
I liked this one. Easy piecy read. It could be trimmed just a tad as the banter started to feel that it was just filling space after awhile.


Your employment of the word 'tad' there saved you from having the biscuit cupboard locked for the night.


Quoted from Grandma Bear
Like the sounds over black. I could picture it perfectly. Well, you know what I mean.


Indeed I do. Naturally I thoroughly agree. Some thought it a mistake. They were obviously having some type of emotional crisis, or perhaps suffering from a severe head cold. It did seem to give Rick some type of existential crisis. More on that later. Next I intend to bring world peace and end world hunger with a dark piece about a bloke in the bath with a duck.


Quoted from Grandma Bear
I liked how Dom only had one slipper on. Gives me a pretty clear idea he was nabbed in surprise.

Also liked the freeze frame at the end, right before they hit Dom.


You're building up to a full plate of ginger nuts. Nope, not a euphemism, they're delicious. I may even throw in a couple of penguins. For foreigners unfamiliar with these, It's a fine chocolate bicuit bar. They're not even penguin shaped. Or fishy. It's all rather bizarre when you think about it. Hmmm, Should probably move on.


Quoted from Grandma Bear
Great job. Humbled that someone thought I wrote it.  Congrats on your short! Someone will probably pick this one up.  


Humbled? I'm honoured. I should probably wrap this soon before it gets too gushy and we decide to form a mutual appreciation society.

Your last sentence is about as good as it gets. Many thanks indeed.

R


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rendevous
Posted: June 11th, 2015, 8:01am Report to Moderator
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Alas, we can no longer stay up at the lofty heights of the last review.


Quoted from PrussianMosby
The Deuce


Yes it is. Well spotted.


Quoted from PrussianMosby
"...and pulls out a crumpled photo to hold it
beside Dom’s head..."

That doesn't work. They don't come across that stupid, having a picture and not checking it right away.


I know! I think I must have wrote it when I was out of my head on Benylin. Or maybe Night Nurse. It was probably sucking on too many Victory Vs that pushed me over the edge. Good job they weren't Fisherman's Friends.

Other people read it. Strangely, they never noticed or mentioned it. Some of them really liked it. We'll skip over the ones who didn't, cowering over there in the corner and on the naughty step staring into spoons, whilst they contemplate their mistakes.

Hmm, probably could have skipped a bit faster there.

Suffice to say I disagree. It works in the context. And I like it.


Quoted from PrussianMosby
Feltz – I don't like that you use him as a goal but don't fulfill my interest to see him.


Oh dear. I'd give you a biscuit to apologize, but I'm unsure you'd like it.

The unseen monster is far scarier to me. I imagine this idea isn't one you subscribe to. I've dealt with this point in a previous review, to oJOHNNYoNUTSo, if memory serves.


Quoted from PrussianMosby
I don't understand the last line "You’ll be a Deuce soon."


Oh come on. Now you're just being silly.


Quoted from PrussianMosby
Does it mean they took the wrong one and want to hit him that he looks like the right guy? Make it clearer then. (Tell us the picture and the guy don't match)


See, you do understand. I think if I did what you request you'd probably think I made it too obvious. I prefer subtle. Their actions and dialogue demonstrate their feelings. Now tell me, did you read this while jogging?


Quoted from PrussianMosby
I can tell the characters ask each other a huuuuuge amount of questions. Check that if you want to.


Check it? Alright. Yes, they do. Well, they ask some, but it's not a huge amount. You're exaggerating, and being a bit silly again.


Quoted from PrussianMosby
You were on a great track; I was intrigued by the story. Simply the points I've mentioned above had hurt that whole journey. Especially the ending.


Hurt your journey. Most people had a great time. Here's a spoon. Take a journey to the naughty step.

The fact you said I was on a great track and intrigued caught me unawares. For that alone you get a cream cracker.

R


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realxwriter
Posted: June 11th, 2015, 8:55am Report to Moderator
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Loved the dialogue and loved the characters. Well done. At some point the exchanged looks and lines started to get a bit repetitive. But I admire how you made this short, character-driven story such a success. Well done.
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rendevous
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Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Alright Renners,


Indeed I am. Good to hear from you, STF.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
The opening lines disturbed the tranquil centre of my mind. It read wrong, like you'd broken some ungodly law of writing nature.


That has happened before.

I'm not sure I intended to disturb the tranquil centre of your mind. It's rare I recommend transcendental meditation, but anything to help.

I'm taking all this as a compliment. Either that or you're winding me up. Regardless of whichever it is, I quite like it.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
I think it's because you start with nouns, and then start sticking verbs in there. Muffled voices. A distant siren. Engine revs???  Or An Engine revving??? Instead of an engine revs?  You are going from specific noises to actions...which weirded me out.


The desired effect. I'm always enormously pleased when someone puts the time in to read closely. It is flattering. Hence my flippancy with those that obviously skim, then scribble a chapter length tirade boiling with indignation.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
I read it a few times, trying to bring sense to my increasingly chaotic world, but there were red faces at the windows with chattering teeth and I'd already peeled off my own fingernails, so I didn't know which way was up by the end. Maybe you were right all along.


I'm still taking all this as a compliment, and quite a big one.  


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
You are a very proficient writer. Your scripts always have the "mass" of a professional. They feel solid in your hands. Glossy. Like polished teak.


This is the type of stuff I should put in a bio, but I'd blush. Thank you though, no higher compliment have I received.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Images flood into one's consciousness unbidden, looking as smart and swanky as any Hollywood flick. That's got to be a good thing.


It is. It's a great thing. Very kind of you to say. Well put too, and of course completely accurate.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Tone is excellent. Guy Ritchie vibe.


I do hope we're talking circa Lock Stock and Snatch, rather than Rock n'Rolla.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
"CHRISSY
You can ravish him for all I care."

Great line.


Indeed. One of my favourites. It was more blunt in the first draft. Revising it made it more amusing, but also a little more sinister.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Characters are familiar, but they work.

Page 4, doors opening...good beat.


I thank you.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Initial feeling when I got to the end was one of disappointment. The build up was so expert, that I was expecting some huge pay off rather than just the comedy of them beating the guy to look like the Deuce.


Oh dear.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
Then I thought it was clever.


Had me worried there. I'm glad you came back.


Quoted from Scar Tissue Films
I don't really know and I don't want to see those red faces at the window again.

Rick


I don't blame you. Of all the reactions to this script, yours is the one that will stick most in my mind. Many thanks. You do fine work.

R


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rendevous
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Quoted from khamanna
Congrats, ren. I liked it a lot, but in the end went meaner and decided to give it a consider instead of recommend. Being too nice to people is not my thing - sorry.

But this was both funny and suspenseful. I'd put it under a comedy - it really is.


I was going to tell you off properly, but it's probably a bit late now. I'm not sure you could be too nice to me. There's a few others who try to do the opposite.

No need to apologise, Khamanna. Your name still makes that tune appear in my head.  


Quoted from Dustin
I've probably unduly scored this down because I'm a little tired of that particular story where people wake up bound and the reader is led on a journey to discover why. I'd just written one in Disassociation. I have noticed that I have a certain distaste for those type of scripts recently and this unfortunately falls into that category.


As we can see above, you weren't alone in unduly underscoring. As for the rest, fair enough.

Some scripts ring too many bells for some readers. I wanted to keep in mainly in the lift and see how I could make these two characters work. Which I think did.


Quoted from Dustin
There are people that would remain calm, because that's the best thing to do. Maybe if you started using the odd wrilie to help us better understand the tone of the character's lines. Because in the instance where your character says 'Why’ve you bound me? Hey, I’m talking to you.' I'm finding it difficult to imagine this actually being said. I can imagine a 'what's going on?' even a 'what are you doing?' in a slightly panicked tone... but if you wrote (calm) this would let us know how the character is handling the situation, otherwise you allow the reader to place their own tone on the words and it may not be the tone you intended.

Obviously not something you should do all the time, just when it may not be clear from the context.

I'll give it another read with a less judgemental eye as it seems quite a few people like it, so I'm obviously missing something.


And you did.

The problem with wrylies, or parentheticals, is they give strict instruction. I've often peppered my scripts with them, as I've a specific tone in mind. But they don't read so well.

Too many and I find they often take the edge off a story, as you feel the writer is a bit too insecure to let the reader's hand go.  

I'd prefer to let the reader decide how a line is said. Although obviously this can backfire when they think the line doesn't work.


Quoted from Dustin
I still think you need to tighten up the initial dialogue from Dom. Other than that though it's a good story. Way better than mine and I did unduly score this. I would give it a 6.5.


Thanks. Obviously I think you're being shy with the points, but it's a vast improvement on the previous.


Quoted from Dustin
Only missing a 7 because I still think Dom's initial dialogue is off-kilter. Sorry again for my earlier review, I didn't give it much of a chance after that dialogue... well, I didn't give it any chance, and that was unfair.


It was a little. But you've more than made up for that. If only some others would have the same amount of decency and backbone.


Quoted from Dustin
If you do rewrite this I have a couple of suggestions. Lose the lift. Have it happen on a stairwell because the lift is out. So they have to walk the guy up the stairs. They're not going to carry him, so he needs to be brought back to consciousness. The thugs also should intimate something about the boss, about how he's expecting them and the Deuce, and that if he isn't the Deuce, they're all fucked. So their only option is to do what they end up doing.

There's no reason at all, if you make it simple enough to film, that this one wouldn't get picked up. Good luck with it.



It's an interesting idea. I'm thinking about it. There's a director I know who I'll run it by. No doubt he'll run a country mile, but I'll chase after him anyway.

R


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rendevous
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Quoted from realxwriter
Loved the dialogue and loved the characters. Well done.


And well done you for having such exceptional taste.


Quoted from realxwriter
At some point the exchanged looks and lines started to get a bit repetitive.


No they didn't. You'll end up in the naughty corner staring into a spoon at this rate.


Quoted from realxwriter
But I admire how you made this short, character-driven story such a success. Well done.


Saved yourself. You can keep the spoon as you talked yourself out of a biscuit before.

Many thanks. I appreciate the read and the comments. Apart from the bit in the middle.

R


Out Of Character - updated


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