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SimplyScripts Screenwriting Discussion Board    Reviews    Music Reviews and Discussion  ›  I can't get this song outta my head
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  Author    I can't get this song outta my head  (currently 19949 views)
Dreamscale
Posted: December 5th, 2011, 6:08pm Report to Moderator
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Sorry, Stevie, but Ringo was not a great drummer by any means.  Serviceable?  Sure.  Cool guy?  Definitely.  But great drummer?  No way, bro.


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stevie
Posted: December 5th, 2011, 9:30pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Dreamscale
Sorry, Stevie, but Ringo was not a great drummer by any means.  Serviceable?  Sure.  Cool guy?  Definitely.  But great drummer?  No way, bro.


Obviously you don't know any drummers. Or read stuff on the Internet. You'd be surprised at the high regard he's held in AS A DRUMMER!  Major music magazines consider him influential, bro, not just this little black Aussie duck.

Peace, love and Niners, buddy...




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Dreamscale
Posted: December 5th, 2011, 9:48pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from stevie
Obviously you don't know any drummers. Or read stuff on the Internet. You'd be surprised at the high regard he's held in AS A DRUMMER!  Major music magazines consider him influential, bro, not just this little black Aussie duck.


Oh, contrare, mon frere.  I do know drummers...very well actually.

Sure, any time a musician has the success that Ringo has had, just by default, "experts" will throw his name out as an influential and talented drummer, but in reality, he pales in comparison to so many "modern" drummers.  Put him behind a big drum set and he wouldn't even know where to begin.

Don't get me wrong, I definitely like the guy, but his drum rhythms are as simple as they come. Compare his work to Neil Peart, Mike Portnoy, Nicko McBain, Carmine or Vinny Appice, Tommy Lee, Scott Rockenfield, Uli Kusch...damn...I could go on and on...

C'mon, man...listen to his stuff and then anything by any one of these guys...no comparison.



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stevie
Posted: December 5th, 2011, 10:43pm Report to Moderator
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I think you would find all those guys would cite Ringo as an influence.

Would Ringo have stayed in the Beatles, if a strong willed bastard like John didn't think ge was up to scratch? Would he and Macca have let their songs be ruined by an inept drummer?

Of course not! Ringo's technique and style is a big part of the success of the Beatle catalogue. And his timing is legendary amongst drum connoisseurs.

Remember that back in the sixties, a lot of the drum tracks were virtually 'live' in the studio. They didn't have the luxury of nowadays, where drummers can just edit their best strikes.



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James McClung
Posted: December 5th, 2011, 10:53pm Report to Moderator
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I'm gonna lay my ass on the line here and say I'm gonna have to agree with Jeff on this one.

Drumming's hard and the prospect of me being able to do it is near inconceivable so props to him being able to do it. And while not one of my favorite bands in the world, The Beatles are among the greatest and most influential bands in history.

But I've never heard Ringo do much else than keep pace. Granted that doing so is probably difficult in its own right but I don't listen to The Beatles and hear any technical prowess, uniqueness or even playfulness. Very formal and straightforward, frankly. Seems like he'd only appeal to drummers as they can actually tell what he's doing.

I don't see much merit in music magazines either. Rolling Stone is amongst the biggest and they'd probably put Nirvana as #1 on their 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artists of All Time list, if they had one.

That said, I'm open to hearing you prove me wrong, Stevie.

BTW, Jeff, you're going to have to recommend me some Rush songs that actually have some genuine technical/progressive flair. I've been trying to get into them for a while but every song I hear just sounds like straightforward classic rock and has none of the technical edge that people build them up to have. Same goes for King Crimson. I've come to conclusion that I haven't heard the right songs from either of them.


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stevie
Posted: December 5th, 2011, 11:26pm Report to Moderator
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Yeah, all good points James!

When I mentioned the magazines I meant quotes I've read on the net, from well known drummers talking about Ringo.

Believe me, this was all new to me till about 5 years ago. In the last decade there has been a greater appreciation of Ringo. YouTube is filled with covers of his drumming, and some very talented drummers are still trying to replicate certain fills he used.

A large part of his success was the fact he was a left handed drummer playing a right hand kit. So he did things differently and thus created a unique style.

I'm not merely arguing his case because of my obvious Beatle bias; over the years I have studied all the comments made about him, and find it all fascinating.

Just Google 'Ringo's drumming influence' or something and you should find some very famous drummers espousing his skill.

Love Is All You Need...and a Niner Super Bowl win.



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stevie
Posted: December 5th, 2011, 11:52pm Report to Moderator
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In 8 years of recording in the studio, the number of times a take broke down on a Beatles song, caused by a mistake by Ringo, was less than 12.



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Dreamscale
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 12:02am Report to Moderator
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James, I'll throw you some amazing RUSH songs...there are so many...not much in "recent" years, but if you go back into the late 70's/early 80's/even early 90's, you'll hear the "Professor" jam like no other ever has.

And for you, Stevie, my Aussie fiend, here's a nice vid of Nicko tattooing his monster rack, and the entire vid is on him.  Classic track - The Trooper, recorded from their also classic Live in Rio tour (I think).

In all seriousness, check this dude out, and think about what Ringo would/could do if he had to play like this...or eve close to it.

Enjoy, my METAL BROTHERS!!!




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stevie
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 2:49am Report to Moderator
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Rather tuneless song bro. I see no reason why Ringo couldn't play that if he wanted to.

Incidentally, 'Ticket To Ride' (1965) was claimed by John to be the first heavy metal song. Ringo's drumming on it gave it a unique sound.



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James McClung
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 3:09am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from stevie
Incidentally, 'Ticket To Ride' (1965) was claimed by John to be the first heavy metal song.


Whahhh???

I'm afraid I don't see it.

Consequently, there does exist a legit Beatles/heavy metal link.



And while we're on the subject...



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stevie
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 4:31am Report to Moderator
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That Ghost version of HCTS sounds cool! Not that heavy metal either as the singer has an ok voice!

Um, with Ticket, I think John meant cos there were very few chord changes in it in the verses; it was like this relentless beat that hadn't been done before. The sort of 'droning' that HM became in the seventies I guess.



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James McClung
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 10:41am Report to Moderator
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Glad you liked it!

The cover isn't a heavy metal version of the Beatles song but Ghost is a heavy metal band. They just have more throwback influences and don't scream or use harsh vocals of any kind. They've even been compared to Blue Oyster Cult. The lyrics are 100% metal through. They almost seem out of place once you realize what they're saying. I think that's part of the fun of the band.

Members of Ghost (including the singer) are also in a death metal band called Repugnant.

As for Lennon's comment, I suppose at the time it would've made more sense. Either way, it's not particularly bothersome and indeed, I think the song came from an interesting transitional period for The Beatles. So fair enough. Honestly, I get much more irritated when people make a case for Alice Cooper or Led Zeppelin being metal. I'll concede that Led Zeppelin were a pioneer of heavier music in general but only people who don't listen to metal actually cite them as influential to the genre.


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Dreamscale
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 11:36am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from stevie
Rather tuneless song bro. I see no reason why Ringo couldn't play that if he wanted to.

Incidentally, 'Ticket To Ride' (1965) was claimed by John to be the first heavy metal song. Ringo's drumming on it gave it a unique sound.


Tuneless?  The Trooper?  The Trooper, tuneless?  WTF?  Funny thing is that the majority of Maiden's earlier work, when listened to for the first time, is tough to pick up the tune.  But, trust me, bro, it's extremely "tuny", and one of those anthems that you can't help but sing along, or at least hum along..once you know it, that is.

I'm also surprised you can't even throw Nicko some props for the drumming here.  His speed, and intricate rhythm is amazing. He's a true master on the hats.  And maybe best of all is his stamina.  There are numerous Maiden songs that run north of 7 minutes, but even 5 straight minutes of relentless drum work is more than taxing on the human body.  In concert, this guy just keeps going and going, kinda like the Energizer Bunny - and let's not forget that Nicko is 59 years young, and at the tender age of 13, was already playing Beatles cover tunes - with ease, I might add.



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Ryan1
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 5:19pm Report to Moderator
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Just to throw my two cents in on the great Starr debate.  I only really started listening to the Beatles over the last couple of years because they were the band my parents listened to when I was growing up, so they were too "old."  But, listening to their catalog of music now, the overall influence on rock was immeasurable, and Ringo's drumming was definitely part of that.  I think the fact that he never played with any speed and also the fact that he was always regarded as the "clown" of the group kind of made people look down on his drumming.  It didn't help when Lennon joked once that "Ringo wasn't even the best drummer in the Beatles."  But Stevie's right about Ringo's influence on modern drummers.  Nicko McBrain, Dave Grohl, and Mike Portnoy have all said Starr's style influenced them.  Ringo's timing and fills were deceptively complex, if you believe many of these modern drummers who cite Ringo as an influence.  Listen to the fills on "A Day in the Life" and the "Golden Slumbers-Carry the Weight" medley that ends the White Album.  I've read that many drummers regard those examples as extraordinarily difficult to replicate the timing on.

As for "The Trooper", guess you're not a metal head, Stevie.  That's one of the greatest metal songs ever.  But "Ticket to Ride" the first metal song?  I don't think so.  You could definitely make an argument for "Helter Skelter", though.  

James, for Rush songs that display Peart's abilities, listen to "La Villa Strangiato" and "YYZ."

Finally, I knew that that cover of the Ghost album looked kinda familiar:

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Dreamscale
Posted: December 6th, 2011, 6:40pm Report to Moderator
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Yes, McBrain was playing Beatles covers as a kid...a 13-14 year old kid.

Is/was Ringo an influence to many modern, great drummers?  Sure, but that doesn't mean much in terms of his overall talent, compared to ultra talented, speedy drummers.

But then again, any "Pro" who has played his entire life, be it drums, bass, or guitar, is obviously very talented.  People look down on various Pros and say they suck, when the reality is far from that.

Ryan, I'm impressed with your metal knowledge...didn't realize you were a fan.

Up the irons, mate!!!


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