Quoted from George Willson I definitely feel like the back and forth nonsense needs to cease. Seriously, I clicked on Edmund to see what the fuss was about since that thread had four pages of comments, and it turned out to be the same bickering we've seen between Dreamscale and some others that's been going on for a week now (at least). Come on, guys. A script thread is not the time or place and it's way off topic.

Read the comments.  It's all about the script.

It was not all about the script. I read what was there, and now it's not. If you want to bicker, this thread is a nice place to do it. It seems this thread was started for that topic, and it would be a perfect to complain about how someone reviews scripts (if you want to) since this thread is entitled "Feedback on the Feedback." It may have started as a joke, but it would at least be topical.

Quoted from George Willson It was not all about the script. I read what was there, and now it's not. If you want to bicker, this thread is a nice place to do it. It seems this thread was started for that topic, and it would be a perfect to complain about how someone reviews scripts (if you want to) since this thread is entitled "Feedback on the Feedback." It may have started as a joke, but it would at least be topical.

Just about everything you deleted was related to someone's threat of giving a line by line review of that script, and that person's failure to follow through on it.

This thread is for general reviews, which have also sucked from some people.  But this was a full fledged discussion, related to that script, that you deleted.

I can appreciate your desire to fight for the the author in regards to the line by line critique promised by Dreamscale. I can also appreciate that he continually failed to provide said critique. However, the discussion never progressed beyond that point, which could have been done in two posts, as opposed to the 30-odd posts that failed to progress the discussion beyond that point, and which started as insults to Dreamscale's review tactics.

I am all for negative feedback since it helps us grow and if there were an iota of something beneficial in all of that, then it would have remained. What's done is done. Move on.

Anyone else think 'Feedback on the Feedback' is actually quite a good title for a script?

No?

Just me then.

I don't really see a problem with Dreamscale's review tactics at all. He's probably the most honest person on here when it comes to reviews and although he may not have pointed everything out in his post, I'm sure he will point out exactly what he thinks is wrong with it in due time. The feedback you get with the OWC is very different than just posting a short, lots of the feedback here has been one sentence replies that don't tell you much compared to the in depth reviews on the shorts board.

Hell, Dreamscale didn't like my OWC entry but no worries, other people did. You can never write something that will please everyone so why do people take things so personally?

ps - I liked Edmund.

Quoted from Brian M He's probably the most honest person on here when it comes to reviews

This is what I find weird.  If you don't give off a mean or negative impression in your review, you're not honest?  

Every review I've ever given on this site has been honest.  It may not be as nasty as others, but, does that make someone more honest than me, or the countless others that have done the same thing?

No Mike, not at all. What I'm saying is that out of all the reviews I've read, Dreamscales's are the most blunt and straight to the point. If he doesn't like it, he say's he doesn't like it.

I know lots of people give very honest reviews, like you and many others. That doesn't make him any more honest than you. I stand corrected.

Quoted from 1987brian referring to Dreamscale He's probably the most honest person on here when it comes to reviews…

Is he more honest than you? He certainly isn’t more honest than me. I’m completely honest with my reviews. If I like something I say so. If I don’t I say that as well. I have no problem with giving an honest review.

Why do you think Dreamscale is honest?

I find it insulting when people (not just you but many others) insinuate abrasiveness equates to honesty. Where in the world do people get that idea? Why on Earth would someone question the integrity of people simply because they’re polite. It’s insulting.

I’ve seen abrasive reviews that were of highly questionable integrity. The reviewer just wanted to tear the writer down for whatever reason. Reviews can be unfair whether the writer is anonymous or not. Some writers can’t stand to see another writer succeed. It happens.

The point is that just because a reviewer calls a script a piece of shit doesn’t mean he’s honest. And just because a reviewer isn’t an abrasive asshole doesn’t make them dishonest.


Breanne

Quoted from Brian M I don't really see a problem with Dreamscale's review tactics at all. He's probably the most honest person on here when it comes to reviews and although he may not have pointed everything out in his post, I'm sure he will point out exactly what he thinks is wrong with it in due time. The feedback you get with the OWC is very different than just posting a short, lots of the feedback here has been one sentence replies that don't tell you much compared to the in depth reviews on the shorts board. Hell, Dreamscale didn't like my OWC entry but no worries, other people did. You can never write something that will please everyone so why do people take things so personally? ps - I liked Edmund.

I don't even think he gave my script more than a scan.  This was evident from his review asking what the secret was, pretty much saying it was badly written without making any effort whatsoever at understanding it.  And you know what. I didn't have a single problem with that. My script isn't perfect and I know when a review is a write off and someone hasn't read my script.  I've been in the realm of peer reviews for a long time.

I did however have a problem with his later bravado about being able to go line by line through the script in order to tell us how badly written it was.  Especially because I don't even believe he actually made a real effort to read it the first time.  

I don't expect that my script is perfect.  I wrote it in 8 hours. However, I do take exception to it being called badly written.  It may have some mistakes but I would hardly call the script a write off.

And this is the main problem with Jeff and I've defended him in the past because I believe this.  Jeff is not capable yet of expressing his thoughts about a script in writing.  His criticism comes off as insulting rather than constructive as he intends it to be. This is why Jeff often feels he is the victim in these situations.

So when you say it's ok for Jeff to write these kind of reviews you are actually promoting misunderstandings on the site.  And, more importantly, you are not encouraging Jeff to increase his written communication abilities.

Those are my thoughts on this situation and likely the last I will say about it.  

Quoted from Brian M No Mike, not at all. What I'm saying is that out of all the reviews I've read, Dreamscales's are the most blunt and straight to the point. If he doesn't like it, he say's he doesn't like it. I know lots of people give very honest reviews, like you and many others. That doesn't make him any more honest than you. I stand corrected.

I read this after my initial response above but I still find your view disturbing. Dreamscale is blunt and to the point? Okay. How does that equate to honesty?

I’m not saying he’s dishonest. But when you say a reviewer is the most honest reviewer here and the only reason you can give to back that up is that he’s “blunt and to the point,” I have a problem with that. Blunt and to the point doesn’t equal honesty. It sounds like a backhanded accusation that polite people are dishonest.

Please don’t take this as an attack but comments such as yours crop up every so often around here and seriously, I get tired of hearing this “he’s harsh but he’s honest” shit.


Breanne

Breanne, I said in my last post I didn't exactly phrase what I was wanting to say right.

Every review is honest, or I hope they are. Most of Dreamscale's reviews are harsh, really harsh, which makes it feel better if he writes you a good review. I'm glad everyone on here doesn't follow Dreamscale's review tactics, but every board needs someone like him who's harsh and gets straight to the point.

I was in no way insulting other reviewers, my main point was it was unfair to ask Dreamscale to justify why he didn't like a script with a line by line review when others did simply because of the nature of his reviews. I hope this makes sense.

Quoted from Brian M I was in no way insulting other reviewers, my main point was it was unfair to ask Dreamscale to justify why he didn't like a script with a line by line review when others did simply because of the nature of his reviews. I hope this makes sense.

No one asked. Jeff offered.

Quoted from Brian M Breanne, I said in my last post I didn't exactly phrase what I was wanting to say right. Every review is honest, or I hope they are. Most of Dreamscale's reviews are harsh, really harsh, which makes it feel better if he writes you a good review. I'm glad everyone on here doesn't follow Dreamscale's review tactics, but every board needs someone like him who's harsh and gets straight to the point. I was in no way insulting other reviewers, my main point was it was unfair to ask Dreamscale to justify why he didn't like a script with a line by line review when others did simply because of the nature of his reviews. I hope this makes sense.

Yes it makes sense. And I understand what you’re trying to say although I don’t agree with everything you say. I’m relatively certain every review isn’t honest. I do believe most are however. I do not agree that every board needs someone who’s harsh. I judge the worth of a review by how constructive it is, not by how harsh it is.

I don’t believe reviewers should be expected to write line by line reviews but I do however think that if a reviewer calls a script a piece of shit, he should justify that comment. Otherwise this board would be filled with a lot more such reviews and a lot less constructive criticism.

I have read reviews from Dreamscale I thought were in depth and constructive and I have read others I thought were effectively worthless. I have also listened to his incessant references to his harshness to the point that I’m convinced he thrives on the reputation of being harsh. That leads me to wonder if he isn’t sometimes harsh for the sake of being harsh.

In either case, it has nothing to do with his integrity. But I do believe your comments are benign. So are mine.


Breanne

Quoted from Breanne Mattson Is he more honest than you? He certainly isn’t more honest than me. I’m completely honest with my reviews.

You're either honest or you're not. There isn't a scale for this sort of thing.

Quoted from Breanne Mattson Why do you think Dreamscale is honest?

I truly believe that when Dreamscale called both Memories and Love Is All You Need piles of shit, he was typing exactly what was on his mind the moment he finished reading them. For him to write anything else would be dishonest, so either way, the guy can't seem to catch a break.