I have to admit, I really like the Jill Splat ending.  I agree that it doesn't quite fit, but I think that makes it all the more hilarious.  Personally, I would show Jill approaching through the diner window while Gabe remarks that he just needs a good ending.  Then let her have it before anyone even notices her.  It would be even better if the bus driver had an eye patch.

I think a great ending can make a movie much more memorable, even if the rest of the movie wasn't.  Just like in A Boy and His Dog.  Plus that ending will probably leave people debating about whether the whole thing was just another of Gabe's daydreams.  Mess with their heads!

Escapist, if we went with that ending, that would be awesome! Have the busdriver look like Cam, or be Cam maybe. But as I said before, the whole bus thing is cliche and is used in shitty spoof movies. In this instance it could work quite well though...

My evil twin brother...we may just agree for a change.  I like that idea and your entire spin on it.  I think it would make this thing SOOOO much better.  It would also end everything with a great big BANG!!!

Nice!  

Finally got to finish this, sorry for joining in so belatedly but will try to add my thoughts to what has already been written. Excuse if I write a lot but I am off on travels tomorrow and not sure how much time I will get to come here this week.

First off, I liked it. It was a good script and an enjoyable read, it was not great, but good enough for me.

* I liked the characters, I thought Mike did a great job in giving us such distinct people, I liked Gabe and did actually buy into him - It would have actually been a much poorer script were I not invested in his character somewhat so it was important to get that right. You know, this probably sounds odd but this reminded me of The Lord Of The Rings in so many ways. We have the fellowship coming together in the coffee shop, then leaving on a quest. Jack is Gandalf, imparting his wisdom and guiding our party. Strange but it certainly gave me that feeling, and this is where things went wrong for me somewhat, the end. I am firmly in the camp that Jack really should not have ended up the hero (and wining the girl too by the sounds of it), It was Frodo's Gabe's quest and he should have really been the one who saved the day and won the girl.

It is strange because the last Shelton script I read (which was much better than this btw) I remember having a similar problem, the hero really does need to be the one who purposefully makes the decision and takes actions that sets up the climax. I thought Gabe just became far too passive and allowed Jack to take over. Don't get me wrong I actualy liked Jack and thought he played a good role in things but he should never have been allowed to just take over. I did actually wonder what Jack was actually doing there, what are his motives? What was he looking for? I would have thought that Gabe would have figured something out to get them out of the mess and at the same time probably exploit a weakness in Jack's character too.

Gabe had already met the car salesmen, why could they have not had a better scene at the beginning and make it that it is actually the car salesmen who owe Gabe the favour? He should be the one calling them, that might work better.

* Yes, I firmly agree that Jill should have shown up near the end, I was actually expecting it. Not sure she needs to take an active role in things, or even have any lines. But it would have been nice for Gabe to see her out of the window, maybe she is on a bus heading out of town or something. It would be symbolic then for her finally leaving his life and his dreams. In fact why not have the greasy guy try to run from the car salesmen and is killed by a bus?  as the bus drives off then Gabe sees her on it - great callback and reversal in one short scene.

* I hate the title, not good at all to be honest. Far too wishy washy, I would have thought just "Coffee" would be better.

* I loved much of the dialogue, It is a Mike Shelton script after all, the dialogue should be good. Although again it was not his strongest, there were some moments that just did not work for me. The scene where Gabe meets Lilly for example and all that talk about Pittsburg, I thought that sucked balls to be honest . Yes it was a perfect example of real talk, it is exactly how I might speak to someone I have only just met. But is that good? Movie people are not supposed to talk like real people, every conversation should mean something, move forward the story, reveal something of importance. This was an example of probably 2-3 times in the script that I thought a conversation was banal. That scene in particular needs re-writing, I would have forgiven it maybe if it was funny, but it was not even that.

* I really do like character driven films, I watched Rachel Getting Married last week and is was similar in style to this in a way, very little in the way of plot but still managing to create tension and drama just by the characters interacting with each other. I don't think this was a bad job, although one could ague that Cam was a dick and really did not help on that front.

*Was this a comedy? I am not sure that is even debatable, If the writer says it is a comedy then it is. I didn't think so though, I think it would be a much better light hearted drama with Cam toned down a notch or two. Strange coming from Shelton who does write some great comedy, I think this missed the mark. This could possibly be compared to Pulp Fiction/Jackie Brown in style, I would certainly not call either of them a comedy but they are both quite farcical and certainly raise a few smiles.


Anyway, that is my two cents worth. It was alright really, I enjoyed reading it anyway.

Quoted from Tommyp Have the busdriver look like Cam, or be Cam maybe.

He would HAVE to wear an eyepatch! That ending would work SO much better in my opinion.

I think having Jill appear - either in what must now be called the Jillsplat ending or the less gory Jillgabewilltheywon'tthey form, would work really well. It'd give the close of the movie more of a definite sense of its characters having achieved something. Also, Cam said she wasn't coming back, so if she did I'd LOVE to see him have to admit he was wrong.

Quoted from Dreamscale What happened?  Well, we were told that Gabe had writer's block, and then we were told that he was cured after spending an entire day in a diner.  So what does that leave us with?  Exactly...nothing.

I didn't feel any urgency in Gabe getting over his block, so when he did, it had no impact for me.  Mike needs to show Gabe suffering with his block and why he needs to get over it.


Phil

I feel I should say more, but I'm out of things to say...I think everyone's covered everything in detail.

What else is left to talk about? And at what point can Mike jump in and start responding to our thoughts?

Quoted from dogglebe I didn't feel any urgency in Gabe getting over his block, so when he did, it had no impact for me.  Mike needs to show Gabe suffering with his block and why he needs to get over it. Phil

Uh, Phil, and what do you think all those dreams with Jill were about?

Quoted from mcornetto Uh, Phil, and what do you think all those dreams with Jill were about?

I wouldn't call it suffering.  Those daydreams were more of an inconvenience to me.


Phil

Just a suggestion. Why not do Hollywood scripts that are either in production or have sold for a good amount of $ so you'll learn more about what is selling and how it's improved along the way. I think your best clubs are when you do these type of critiques like, "I Wanna F*ck Your Sister." etc.

Quoted from trailertrashers Just a suggestion. Why not do Hollywood scripts that are either in production or have sold for a good amount of $ so you'll learn more about what is selling and how it's improved along the way. I think your best clubs are when you do these type of critiques like, "I Wanna F*ck Your Sister." etc.

We've done that one and the Strangers and some sci-fi that I can't remember the title of right now.

We alternate. Some people prefer Hollywood scripts and others prefer unproduced written by members here.

Quoted from mcornetto Actually George if you look at the history of the Script Club it came out of a thread called "Breaking the Rules".  I know you weren't around when this started so I don't expect you to know this but the reason we started doing it was to examine scripts without being bogged down by formatting issues or even structure issues.  Formatting discussions were banned from the original Script Club threads.  It isn't that we look for scripts that don't have those issues, its that we don't discuss those issue (those issues are for the normal script threads and there is no reason to discuss them here).   As far as ending the discussion I don't think people were even aware we went on beyond characters.   Plus there are still people who haven't read it yet.

I vaguely remember when the script club started, as I recall there being some discussion as to which board it should be on, and I agreed that the Screenwriting Class board was the best for it (I was the moderator for it then, too.)

This script club was more unstructured than the previous ones by request to see how it would go. There was no holding to specific topics or waiting to move on. It was simply someone bringing up a topic and then see where the topic led us. I haven't been leading the discussion any specific direction. Only trying to give an idea of what to talk about next when it seemed to be foundering.

I made my suggestion when the discussion seemed to be dying out. All of the topics had been touched, although I was not aware of who had or hadn't commented. Let me ask: where are we on the discussion?

I do like talking about the ending, since it's probably the most inportant aspect of any story. It'll be the last thing anyone remembers so it has to be satisfying. That's satisfying in the confines of the story you've told, and not ending it a certain way because you want to.

This script has a simple story that meanders its way to a simple ending. It was about writer's block and the ending had us moving past writer's block. For there to be more of an ending, I would think there'd have to be more of a story. Right?

And for choosing a script, I don't mind either at the end of the day. I like having the writer present, but there is value in reading something produced. It was talked around for awhile, and I did a poll to make the final decision (despite how pointless everyone insisted it was).

Quoted from Murphy * I hate the title, not good at all to be honest. Far too wishy washy, I would have thought just "Coffee" would be better.

I want to second this. The title, as it is now, is really offputting. I actually had to look up the title when I was finished reading the script because I forgot what it was. "Coffee" is more memorable and to the point. Good advice, Murphy.

In that case I think INSPIRATION would work even better. After all that's what Gabe is looking for. Coffee is just something they consume...