Making a script a page turner is a mechnical process.  There's a trick to it.  I get lots of comments about my features and scripts in general about people being forced to continue even though they aren't enjoying the scripts.  And that's just because I employ this trick.

So page turning is not the difference.  It's that layer of transparent slime I tell you!  

George, I applaud you for jumping in here with the obvious sincerity that you intended.  And, you are 100% correct in everything you said.

For those who "know" or "think" they do not possess "pro quality", you are also 100% correct.  You don't, and most likely, you never will.  That's not a knock, either.  As you have said, either you have it or you don't...and if you yourself don't think you have it, chances are very, very good that you don't.

As I say over and over again, it just boggles my brain to hear all this horse shit about Pro scripts, Pro writers, blah, blah, blah.  These are all the same Pro writers and Pro scripts which we all fucking hate day in and day out.

And let me try this one more fucking time for those who are a bit dense or just downright dumb...what happens when a non Pro writer, suddenly becomes a Pro writer, because somehow, someway, they sold their baby for big bucks?  Do you suddenly view their script, the same one that you earlier thought was non Pro quality, as a Pro quality script?  HUH?  WTF am I missing here?

If you don't believe in yourself, and you know you can't write worth a fucking shit, why not just do exactly what everyone tells you to do with your piece of shit scripts?  Damn, I'm so confused by all this.

You know, personally, I cherish the moments when people can bring up problems in my scripts.  I crave perfection.  It pisses me off when I make mistakes, miss things, etc.  I go out of my way to let others know of the problems in their scripts, and I get shit on for doing that.

I'm one of a few who can also see obvious flaws and problems in Pro scripts and am not afraid to bring them up, which again is seen as blasphemy, as a Pro writer can't be incorrect...can't do wrong, and all should praise it at its fucking little temple.

C'mon, people!  Get out of the sheep mode you're in.  Believe!  Strive to set your own agendas.  Dance to your own beat and be proud to do so.

WEAK!!!!

Calling someone a pro because they've sold a million dollar script is like calling my next door neighbor lucky when he whens the lottery.  There isn't any skill involved there.  It's all timing.

I'll be the First to admit I have no passion for screenwriting at the moment.  I have no dedication to the business this very second, but I've read tons of "pro" level scripts, I've done classes, have read all the books, and talked to this person and that person.  I even have an analyst who, in moderation, reads my work nominally.

The story is what matters.  Simple and clean.  If your story sucks -- EXAMPLE "Frozen" -- It sucks and there isn't anything you can do about it.  I don't care how crafty and word savvy you are.  Your story has to be good.  

For instance, I know proper format.  I can write a very clean looking script.  I don't even have to use "ING" words if I don't want to.  But if all I'm writing is "SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT", it isn't going to matter how it's formated.

The audience isn't reading your script.  They're watching it.  A script isn't something you brag about until you sell it.  Unless it's something I've written.  Then it's the best thing ever.  And even peanut butter is jealous of it.

all I'm going to say is how many features do you read in a month and how many of those are "pro" scripts?  Start reading ten of each every month and you will soon see what we are talking about...

and Balt, just because you don't like something doesn't it's crap...

Yeah, you are right, I am wrong, sorry about that, God knows what I was thinking.

It's screenwriting, there are no skills to learn and develop, no hard work needed, you either have it or you don't and if you don't you never will.

It is all down to luck, getting produced is nothing more than catching a break, Fade to White is a piece of genius and just bloody unlucky that Hollywood have not yet discovered it.

I will depart this thread, will leave it for those that "have it".

Good luck with that!

Quoted from Grandma Bear all I'm going to say is how many features do you read in a month and how many of those are "pro" scripts?  Start reading ten of each every month and you will soon see what we are talking about...

I'll say I've read about 70 to 75% of the movies I have been inspired by.  A month I probably read 2 or 3 feature length scripts.  And they often don't inspire me, either.  It depends on how readily available they are.  We're talking actual copies, by the way.  Not rewritten word pad copies of movies or shooting scripts.  Then again, it's more of a hobby of mine and not a passion at the moment.  Some of you all are much more dedicated and more sincere about making it than I am, maybe ever will be.

Edit for Pia - Nope, you're right.  Just because I hate Waffles and prefer pancakes, doesn't mean Waffles aren't in demand.  I agree.  But One thing that is a certainty when One sets out to write a script -- The story has to be good or do something to stand out.  Be it so shocking it's revolting.  Be it so new it spawns a new genre.  Be it so suck it creates a new word for the word Suck.

Now, of course movies are made all the time.  90% of them do nothing new or different from the next in the genre it represents.  Those movies are products.  Those movies are like toys on an assembly line.  

Quoted from Grandma Bear Rendevous, I think you're right too. It goes for all types of businesses. The people that are pros and are in the business only need a glance and they can tell. I used to be in the sport horse business and even though I was not a big player, I can still tell by just looking at a horse if it has what it takes to be a good jumper or dressage horse. I can tell just by conformation if it has potential or not. If I think it might, I want to see it move. If it passes that test too, I want to see it ridden. I imagine that's how it is when you've been in the business for a while. Regardless of what business it is.

Ah, while I was sleeping I see the mice were at play. Nice guns... Did I call 'em gloves earlier? Musta been the whiskey...

Either way you seem to have hit a nerve young lady, judging by all this verbiage later. I see Murph and GW have some good points but I'll stick to yours, as you started it.

Here's how you become a good screenwriter - I wouldn't say I'm one, but even if I was I wouldn't admit it, but, I know a few.

Firstly, get the fuck out your house and get out there. Fly. Visit other places. Meet people. Don't piss them off. Talk to folk. Learn things like

Quoted from Me I want to see it ridden.

sounds to Irish people like you're talking inadvertantly about sex. Just like Jasper Carrot used to make Ozzies laugh by ROOTING in his attic. Er, the young in both countries keep changing their slang for it so be carefull and get it right.

Personally, not my favourite word but it will sufice for now, I've had a few minor credits on a few minor movies. What separates us from the big folks who live on the Hill?

Not much. They need people like us. If you wanna become one of them, like Danny Boyle, from Radcliffe in Manchester did then you just gotta perservere, Of course you need talent, and skill with people and words. But, if you watch Shallow Grave, Trainspotting, Millions and Slumdog Millionaire you may think this: wow. I coulda directed this. I do. And I will.

SO there. Pia, whatever they say about you I've always admired Swedes who live elsewhere. And your works good. You certainly know how to put the cat amongst the pigeons. Stay on the radio. If you wanna guest, I need encouraging.

Hugh xo

my comment wasn't really aimed at you Balt. you just posted something while i was typing.  

anyway, all i was trying to do here was open a discussion about the differences. if people don't read a lot of pro scripts then i can see how this is not helpful, but a lot of "serious" writers i know, refrain from reading amateur scripts and instead read only pro scripts...

For some really odd reason, no one can respond to a point I continue to make...

So...what happens when an SS script turns into a feature movie?  Does it change the talent level of that writer?  Does it make him or her a Pro?  Does it mean suddenly that they write at a Pro quality?

Do all Pro scripts just flat out rock?  Was the script for 88 Minutes a great concept that was well researched, made alot of sense, and was just dying to be made into a feature with Al Pacino and a bunch of other high level talent?

Huh?  Please...tell me.  Enlighten this old, fucking, soon to be insane A-Hole.  

Alright.

Here's why I love SS and will continue to post here...

This place taught me a lot. I teach part time, guitar, English etc. I like kids, I just don't like touching them. I have a broom which I use to show the distance and size of my "aura". One little cocky cow called Fionnula said my aura is actually my ego. All the kids laughed. So did I. Fionnula will probably be Ireland's first female prime minister, aka Taoiseach.

SS taught me a lot. I love reading amateur scrripts. God forbid I have to read Pro ones all day again. A lot of pro ones are about as pro as a load of Rugby players after a match.

But then half of the pro scripts are amazing. They put you in the scene, with minimum words. And they make you feel it. That is a pro script.

HD xo

Actually, I will make one last comment.

You know what pisses me off the most about this site, and always has done?

It is the utterly ironic notion that discussing the act of screenwriting is a no go area. How weird is that? Whenever threads like this spring up they turn into arguments and discussions about how crap a film is and pro writers are just the same as us. There seems to be zero interest at all in actually discussing the real skills needed to write quality screenplays.

Have a look at other sites, read some writers blogs, John August for example and read his readers comments. All people who have a genuine interest in improving as writers. Why do things like the Script Club, when we discussed produced works just fall apart with bickering?

There is a fundamental difference between a well written but bad film and a badly written script and I am amazed that so many supposed "scriptwriters" do not understand this simple and yet true concept. This site should be a place for people to help each other understand what makes a good script good.

It is the strangest thing.

Quoted from Dreamscale For some really odd reason, no one can respond to a point I continue to make... So...what happens when an SS script turns into a feature movie?  Does it change the talent level of that writer?  Does it make him or her a Pro?  Does it mean suddenly that they write at a Pro quality? Do all Pro scripts just flat out rock?  Was the script for 88 Minutes a great concept that was well researched, made alot of sense, and was just dying to be made into a feature with Al Pacino and a bunch of other high level talent? Huh?  Please...tell me.  Enlighten this old, fucking, soon to be insane A-Hole.

I have already addressed this. Scripts sell because they are good scripts. Therefore a pro writer who has sold a script is a good script writer.

Quoted from Murphy I have already addressed this. Scripts sell because they are good scripts. Therefore a pro writer who has sold a script is a good script writer.

Add that to my points and GWs and Pia's and this conversation is over. Almost.

Love and verbiage,

H ex

I agree with you, Murph.  I just don't agree that one has to be a Pro writer to write a good script, and that any non Pro, SS writer doesn't have the talent to write a quality movie.

If 90% or more of the movies that are filmed suck ass, what does that say about the quality of the scripts they are using?  I'd say something is wrong with the assessment of what makes a good script or better yet, a good movie.  The 2 do not necessarily go hand in hand.

Don't know how this thread got off course, I think I know, but I'm not getting into all that...

My take on the OP's question.  They probably wrote atleast ten screenplays, without pay before they got the hang of the craft.  They've developed their own unique voice.  Ten screenplays before they probably sold their first one unless they caught lightening.  And chances are, they can walk into a boardroom with executives that have been in the industry for a while and have Masters degrees from film school and hold their own story.  Simple... "They know their stuff."  

Can I say that yet?  No, but I'm pretty freakin' close... and so are a lot of writers on this site.

@Pia... this is my take on how I tell the difference.  Hope it helps.

@Welocme back RV... where you been hiding at?  I need a movie poster for my script?

@Baltis... I like your no nonsense, straightforward, tell it like it is approach.  "Peanut butter was funny.

@everyone else... you'll made some good points.

Ghostwriter...