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I've just finished reading the earlier one. I'll say this. I GET it! At least I think I do. I think I get the playful tone you're going for. That, to me, comes across really well. And yes, now that I've read it, Danny and Carlie's luvy duny-nes is completely justified because their fucking nuts! Imean, you'd have to be, right? To want to do something like that. There like a pair of thrill seekers on a quest for the ultimate hight.
It's very modern storytelling. Very contemporary. Conceptually, it's similar to 'Hostel'. But the tone, it's a little like this new film I watched, 'Funny Games'. You seen that? It has that same playfulness, juxtaposed with extreme violence. And the violence in yours, certainly was extreme! So much so, that I found it difficult to imagine how it could be done. You need a top effects guy to take that on.
Now, on a creative level, from writer to writer, I'd say, be careful with just HOW explicit you make you violence. I know that's kind of the point of the film. I don't know how best to articulate myself, but I personally wouldn't make it so explicit. And also, I tend to think that it shows you have greater flare if you can achieve the same reaction from your audience without showing as much on-screen violence. You get what I'm saying?
Anyway. Overall. I really liked it. At first I was really put off with the extended Bar scene. But since you said you've trimed it, I'm sure it will now work better. And you said you threw in another scene somewhere. That's good too. Because, for the length it was, it was a little uneventful.
Sorry, my girlfriend's nagging me. We're supposed to be sitting down to watch a film, so I gotta rush this.
Just trying to think quick of stuff to say about that might help you.
Oh, one thing I can think of. The music stuff. When you have a specific song playing by a certain group. I thought that was a little distracting. I get that your trying to set you scenes to certain songs and in turn gain a certain mood for the scene. But I'd say, why not just say what TYPE of song is playing. I don't know. Maybe something to think about.
What else? Oh, I liked the way the end credits worked. Totally in keeping with the tone of the film. Maybe work on them a little more. Give us more on how they tie in to that specific scene that they're supposed to tie in to, because those little scenes would be really fun to watch over your end credits.
Anyway, that's all I got time for. I'd like to ask though, I'd like to email you a portion of one of my screenplays. Would be interested to read it?
Hey thanks for the comments. I wish you could have read the new version though, as I'll be doing a final rewrite this week most likely.
The songs are gone now and the ending has been revamped and should be a bit more clear.
Sounds like you didn't really "get it" though, like most haven't. If you read back through some previous posts and my responses, you'd see that Xavier is actually Satan and the reason why Danny and Carlie did what they did. It's purposely ambiguous, but it appears to be too ambiguous, as no one is understanding X's role or character. In your earlier post, you mentioned that you thought maybe there was a supernatural element to the story, and that Danny seemed to be possessed when he killed Jake. Actually, you were on to something there.
In its original conception, this was a take on Hostel, but I changed that with subsequent rewrites. A few have mentioned Funny Games, and I am familiar with that movie, but haven't seem either version.
Sure, I'd be more than happy to read what you've got. I'll give you very detailed commentary. It would be great if you could possibly read the new version and see what you think while it's still fresh in your mind. Any and all thoughts are very appreciated, especially since I'm gearing up for my final rewrite.
Ok, man this is just gonna be me enumerating some tech/formatting/typos errors etc I found along the way. I'm sure some are in correct & I probably missed many but this is what I got.
I'll include some reactions/thoughts along the way.
The Title: I like it, though something more abstract could be considered as there is nothing worse than an over explanatory title. "Fade to White" to me describes the closing shot of a happy, feel good, life affirming movie which this is most certainly not, thus its misleading (which is good) & it makes all the more sense with the setting & renegade snowflake sequences.
The Logline: Just seems lazy. I'm sure you could come up with something a little more intriguing then "The white of the falling snow won’t be the only color they’ll see."
"A single snowflake falls through the darkening sky. Below, miles and miles of runs crisscross the mountain in ribbons of white."
Good intro - tight although poetic descriptions (which I must say are very solid throughout) of what is on screen:
Also the immediate confrontation & resulting decimation reels us in straight away. Sets the tone for the rest of the script as well as gives the reader/viewer the impression that Tobias will be the main antagonist.
The "comma before name" which I thought was a given even if it a nickname or pet name e.g honey , baby etc but you have said that this is not the case It can be either way. So I'll list what I saw & you can see whether they are valid or not, you know best.
Pg 2 - Buns(,)Lloyd -- "ax" or axe is correct ( I always thought it was "axe") -- Do you always capitalise sounds e.g "THUD" which pops up an awful lot. Or is it the standard?
Pg3 - "Rights himself" sounds a little odd. "Composes" or "regains" will read better.
Marshall seems to recover very quick from the shock considering a complete stranger has just invaded their domain & tried to electrocute them, he is out of the water pulling Tobias's leg in seconds!
Are Cyndi & Marshall bro & sis or a couple or what?? --
The way you described events with him shooting Cyndi, the shotgun range seems unreasonably long.
Pg 5 "ALL" is capitalised. Why? I was under the impression capitalising dialogue is out.
"...." One dot too many -- In general I think you have too many elipses in the prose, try to use them in moderation (I use them frequently in dialogue as I think they are essential for phrasing, not as important in the descriptive. You're better off using "--" though this is of course a matter of taste)
You never mention that the child is asleep the first time around we only find out when he wakes up after the turbulence
pg 6 - The whole part here with the child is my least favourite in the piece & way too saccharine for my liking -- The line:
ROSIE (CONT'D) I know it's none of my business, but I think you'd make wonderful parents. I can just tell.
made me cringe like a mother fu?ker, leave it out, brother.
I realise later that this "squeaky clean" couple is portrayed intentionally to counterbalance what happens later but it can be done in a more subtle, less Nancy Meyers way if you know what I mean. It just seems way too overkill (As I said in the last post so I won't dwell)
Pg 7 - Just on a personal level I hate the word "Klutz" & later when you used "Klutzo" it killed me...but that my problem.
Pg -8 Again, the over affection:
DANNY I love you Honey. God, I love you.
"The screen fades to white." -- This happens a number of times( a nice effect). But FADE TO WHITE written in capitals like so, will suffice.
Pg 9 - "cool is" instead of "cool's" - I know, nit picking.
Pg 10 - The "Cool" conversation -- waay too cute, annoying.
Pg 11 - A clever device you used here to perpetuate this apparent impending menace of Tobias but it "just being a cat in the dustbin" is such a shameless cliche. Obviously keep the scene in, it works brilliantly, just have something, ANYTHING! other then what you've chosen to stop the drunk in his tracks.
Danny singing to the song in the bar -- Characters singing along to something is dodgy territory & can come off looking cheesy, be careful with it.
Pg 12 - As I have said, I dig the snowflake effect, but you just raised your budget up by half a million to generate these scenes, hehe.
At this point I hate Charlie, hate her, hate her, hate her!! Danny only slightly less.
When describing the characters you have "actually" featured in two descriptions for Johnny & Janelle, was this intentional? Its sounds repetitive.
Pg 13 - Should "OK" always be in caps? ditto with "HELL"?
Pg 14 - "Jake boy" I liked that phrase. "Big Boy Kusic" funny character. Funny that you call them "Jagies" we just call them "Jagers" over here.
It’s an amusing anecdote, but are we to believe the Kusic didn't realise the chick had puke all over until he got to the house, that’s booze for ya I suppose. It just seemed a tad far fetched.
Pg 14 -19 - Hurrah! a four minute conversation, I don't feel so bad now for "Charm", ha.
A lot of embarrassed looks at this juncture (and we find out why later) But a variation on the "embarrassed" remark wouldn't go astray.
Pg 21 - Again a personal thing for me but High fives are a no no. I think when you get to a certain age i.e 12, 13 high fives are just lame. (excluding sport)
Pg 22 - Good passage with the three guys, Martin especially. Wow, that story turned real hairy, didn't it. I mean murder!!
Around this time due to no fault of the script but I stopped noting "EVERY" mistake as it would be just too time consuming, sorry.
Pg 24 - Nicole grabs Megan, pretends to bite her neck. -- This would look a bit cheesy.
Pg 25 – “There you go(,)hun” -- Comma left out.
Pg 27 - "Col Mustard" -- great line.
LISA There they are. What's up guys?
Should that be LISA (O.S) as we are on the guys going back the table, when she calls them.
Pg 28 - "Carlie smiles up as well." -- Funny way of describing that.
Pg 29 - 5 cases of no comma in front of names: Johnny, Janey, Danny, Honey & Dan.
NICOLE That's right (D)octor. -- Should not be in caps.
As I said characters, dialogue etc aside I have no problem with the length you took here. It didn't feel long reading it so I'm guessing on screen it would do enough to keep the audience's interest piqued. (Again this is all subjective.)
Pg 33 - A gross case of drink driving here. I don't know about your native state Arizona or even Colorado but they have clamped down on it big time over here. It doesn't seem to be an issue to these people however as it’s not even remarked on.
"emergency breast job on you ()Lees." -- No comma.
I love Nicole at this point & in retrospect it would have been an interesting undertone if she treated the couple a bit warily from the getgo. That she just felt something didn't sit right or whatever. They're overtly cutesy relationship should conflict with Nicole's cynical, sharp tongued attitude effectively. Create some tension, if only slight.
You might this could be a giveaway but believe me, bro, when I say, that nobody will see that twist coming.
Pg 36 - DANNY Hold on() Baby! -- No comma
Pg43 – Snowflake effect -- Niiice!
Janelle is an arrogant, self absorbed bit?h, she is grating me.
Pg 44 - JILL Jesus Bobby! Any-fucking-thing else? -- Read it aloud a few times, it doesn't sound right.
Pg 47 - "That’s just great" -- Ditto above, just seems odd, doesn't fit in to the flow of conversation.
Pg 51 -- WHAT A FU?KING TWIST!!! NEVER EVER EVER saw it coming, kudos.
When Jake got struck he should have been howling in pain, very little reaction from him.
Whistling the tune is a nice if overused eerie mechanism. Glad you included it though.
Definitely the best part of the script, the strongest & the fulcrum of the whole piece. Well done again on the structuring & patience, let’s hope the viewer is willing to go on the ride with you.
Pg 52 - Good scene with Janelle & Martin I'm already warming to these characters a bit more. Its not too sentimental or mushy, just enough emotion & unspoken urges (if unrequited) bubbling under the surface. Well scripted.
Pg 54 -- Very good sexually charged exchange, loving Nicole.
Pg 56 - Jill seems to have been frozen for the past few pages, (in other words, a few minutes screen time). She has made no progress in any way.
Johnny is really over doing the compliments for Janelle. He’s coming across as a sleaze which is not intended, right?
All the time thinking is Carlie in on it, an intriguing subtext that really strengthens the story & your attitude/feelings whilst you read, nice job.
Pg 61 -- Jill finally gets to the friggin' house. Takes far too long, man. Not in terms of pacing but how big is this estate of houses? The Schaefers house was within her sights nearly 10 pages ago so I'm thinkin' it can't be huge.
Would the dogs have dragged her like that. If so she shouldn't be takin' em for walks on her own. I found her death, though entertaining, very unrealistic. It wouldn't happen in real life (but to coin a phrase "stranger things have happened,")
The Lisa & Danny is singly handedly my favorite scene. Great battle between the two (there was always gonna be one winner), sorta cat & mouse scenario, well written.
Pg 63 - "HELL" is caps gain...why? "Asshole" strikes me as much too soft a word given the situation.
Pg 65 - She looks terrible -- Odd way to put it.
"THUD" & " Bloody mess" have become all too ubiquitous by this point. Change of phrase is badly needed.
Loving Danny, complete reversal. He rules the final third of the script.
Pg 70 - Good tension
Pg 71 - Not the most obsure but i liked the "The Shining" reference.
Pg 74 - Carlie is becoming a lot more interesting. The lesbian factor has been cranked up. (I'm not one that goes for a film cos of gratuitous "tits" "ass" "bush" whatever) but as I said in my last post the underlying erotica it provides adds a very potent spice to the story.
Pg 75 - It culminates here nicely, along with the delightful revelation that the goody two shoes, photo over the mantlepiece, presumably straight A swot is a crazy psycho killer bia?ch, excellent.
My notes just said "thank you thank you thank you" at this point because of this. Makes the sugary, over the top affection from earlier between the two, worth enduring.
Pg 78 - "I think Megan's dead." -- Should be “Megan is dead” The apostrophe denotes ownership. I'm pretty sure you can't own a dead, hehe.
Pg 81, 82 - An almost surreal conversation between Danny & Carlie, very good.
Pg 83 - "Then & Than in the same sentence, weird.
Pg 84 - Why does Johnny say "your friend Lisa" does he not know her thru Jake?
Pg 87 - Johnny's death -- sickening "flattened and broken face." – gruesome! all in a good way I may add.
Pg 88 - They are incompetent at the best of times, which of course is understandable given they are not trained killers.
Pg 90 - This showcases probably your best quality as a writer from what I've read of yours. The action scenes are top notch throughout, flow brilliantly despite the odd repetition.
Pg 96 - I know I touched on this already. I was surprised, I thought Martin was gonna be the hero, thankfully not.
"It's an all out fight though." Funny phrasing.
"He holds Officer Jacobs(') arms behind their heads." The comma is at the wrong side of the s
Pg 97 – There’s that "Klutzo" word again, Grrr!
Pg 98 You spelt "Ociffer" instead of Officer.
Pg 100 - "aiming at different parts of her body." I liked that, toying with her. Danny's dialogue is strong here too.
Pg 101 - The no bullets twist...well it just isn't a twist anymore, is it?
Pg 101 – CARLIE No Janey, fuck you! -- A little unimaginative from her, have her say something completely random, off the wall, some real sick sh?t. The game is more or less up now, go wild.
Dirty Harry reference is too obvious, didn't work for me.
Pg 103,104 - Would Jill have survived that long in them conditions?
SHERIFF HAWKINS I cannot believe this Goddamned mess. M'God...never seen anything like it in m'Goddamned life...well...least not in m'town.
What accent is that, with the "m" at the start of the words. Plus the extensive use of "Goddamn" I feel like I'm reading Catcher In The Rye again.
..."I rightly don't know." again I'm presuming it’s a colloquialism, cos it sounds odd.
Pg 110 - "His teeth look terrible." Sounds awkward. Personally I think the word "terrible" should be used in moderation
Pg 111 - "Tire" -- Should be tyre.
Pg 113 - Jake saying " It’s not going to kill us" is a little too blatant, overly significant looking at it now in hindsight. Then again it would have been worse if it had being said during the course of the script.
Pg 115 - Last line -- Not so sure about it. I'm talking about the "totally" element. Even if it does accentuate their madness. (But, like various parts of the story here & there, it feels a little OTT)
Xavier claps his hands together...his fingers long, pointed...strange.
Trying to suss out who or what X is. In relation to the above description he sounds like Lucifer or even Count Dracula.
I mean if we are to take him as a living & breathing human being like you or me, you would have to wonder about all the practicalities (that I mentioned in the last post so I won't repeat) that would face us mere mortals if we were to spearhead this sort of "operation" he has going on.
This is what’s leading me to believe that he is someone inside these people, an alter ego, an evil conscience , a spirit possessing Tobias, Carley, Danny and countless others we imagine.
Xavier smiles...cold and evil, an odd flickering shimmer in his dark brown eyes.
This further backs up the "extra terrestrial/not of this world" claim...
I remember you mentioning the ski scene with the pilot as key. But I'll admit his appearance is inexplicable to me (And we find out later that he gives them the detonator but I’m sorry I don't get the link.) Is he just another guy that's part of Xavier "disciples" for want of a better word or does he have a greater significance
That’s about it I'm sure I missed lots & you will have a few things to say about the parts I highlighted similar to the issues I have with your "charm" review (If I ever get back to it in the near future)
In conclusion, you know I like this, you've got a good script although there are some things I would do differently but you have your vision & I wish you the best of luck with it. This has a lot going for it.
I see that the new draft has an extra ten pages. What were the important alterations you made?
I just finished Fade To White and I'll try to get as much down here while it's still fresh in my head. Like all reviews, mine is subjective. There are things I like that you probably don't and vice-versa, so take what you can from this review.
!!!SPOILERS!!!
This felt like it was inspired by different movies. I saw some 'Death Proof' in there (the bar scene), 'Kalifornia' (the supposedly psychopathic serial killing couple) and 'Saw' (the "reveal" in the end). And I didn't think it worked as a whole. You start off really well, though, with the killings in Steamboat Springs. That set the tone for the script (or so I thought) and it got me interested right away. Okay, I wasn't crazy about the electrocution scene in the swimming pool - a little too Hollywood like for my taste. Also, without getting too technical, throwing the boom box in the water doesn't guarantee that Marshall gets toasted. It actually depends on his location in the water and where the nearest grounded part of the pool is (which would probably be the drain). If positioned just right the current would actually go for the drain and not him, but in Hollywood terms, it would definitely go for him (unless the place has a GFCI installed - which they should if the pool's grounded) but that's an entirely different can of worms.
Enter Danny and Carlie (a name I had tough time getting used to for some reason). In 20/20 hindsight it makes sense that you made them that cutesy-wutsey. You either did it to show that they're somewhat retarded/dim-witted (easy to coerce) or to lead the reader astray - setting up the surprise for when they go on their killing spree. Or maybe they just really really love each other. What ever the case, I think you overdid it. Show it when it makes an impact on the story or makes a statement, but not in every scene they're in. It got to the point where it, to me, felt toe-cringingly fake. The same went for everyone really when they team up with the group of youngsters at the Horny Toad (I like that name btw.), they're all just too quick and eager in my opinion to keep telling each other how great they thought each other were. It just didn't feel natural to me. I'm all for character development, it is very important for a script but at some point you have to trust your reader that they get it and move on with the story. Having said that, I do think Danny and Carlie worked pretty well as characters.
The youngsters (Lisa, Jake, Johnny, Martin, Nicole, Janelle and Meghan) was...I don't know how to put this without sounding like a complete asshole...a pain from the start. To me, nothing is more boring than drunk people (unless I'm drunk too, then everyone's funny) - you know what I mean. Especially if they keep saying Fuck, Shit, Ass, Bitch etc. all the time and at the same time keep reminding everybody how wasted they are (which they did quite a lot in the bar scene and later as well). Another thing, and this needs work, they came across very alike. If I had blocked out their names when I read this - it would read like it was the same person saying the whole thing. There's really nothing in their dialogue or behavior that sets them apart except for the fact that one is more drunk than the other. Okay, maybe Martin and Meghan stand out a little bit but it's only because we see and hear so little of them compared to the others. Sticking with the dialogue, to me, real-life talk in movies shouldn't sound like what real-life talk sounds like in real life but rather how real-life talk sounds like in movies. There's a big difference. There's a lot of real-life talk going on in the bar scene that doesn't really go anywhere. That reminded me of 'Death Proof' which I thought was a disaster (except for the scenes with Kurt - cos' Kurt's, like, God). All you had there was two groups of bitches flapping their boring cunts off and it made my dick fall asleep. Move it along, Kurt needs to kill somebody here. That's the same how I felt with the bar scene - move it along. Yes, you introduced the new characters but like I said earlier, know when nuff's enough. Also, the story Johnny tells about Jake being wasted did not have a strong enough punch line imo. to pull off that rather long setup. And the "real" story he tells to Martin afterwards doesn't really come into play at any point (unless Jake had had an encounter with Xavier before that as well, but I seriously doubt that - there's no evidence really to support that). The same can be said for the Johnny-Janelle-Martin love triangle, you lead us down a path that ultimately turns out to be a dead end.
To be continued...
Down in the hole / Jesus tries to crack a smile / Beneath another shovel load
After they get to the house is pretty much a continuation of the bar scene with Nicole making a dick of herself (although I fail to understand why she was picking on Lisa and to a certain extend Jake. Whatever animosity that laid buried there was never explained. Unless she was just talking drunk of course, and if that's the case why use it). After thatt it pretty much just turned into a standard slasher flick. And that's not a bad thing at all. It was definitely a big shocker when Danny went berserk on Jake and then Lisa, and later when Carlie off'ed Nicole and Meghan (sort of). I didn't buy the need to change into work clothes though. I mean, they were getting logs not drilling for oil. Also, why did Lisa go outside with Danny? Danny, from Lisa's point view, seemed to be managing the logs just fine. Of course you had to set up the kill scenes but in my opinion it you did use a couple of cheap tricks here - that's okay though, we all do. The same sorta goes with the whole use of Jill and Bobby - other than needing a reason to phone the police, these two characters bear zero importance to the plot. Again, it's distracting and it takes us away from the core story.If you can figure out a way to get the 5-0 outthere, without using the Jill excuse, you can cut those two completely from the script (and all you really need is one of the youngsters phoning the police during an attack and you're home free). While on the subject of scenes I think could be cut, the little conversation Officer Jacobs has with his wife. Why is that even in there? I don't care about what his wife was expecting him to do - he'll be dead soon anyway (which was rather obvious - especially with the bad connection with the Dispatch - typical Horror/slasher cliché). Don't get sidetracked by irrelevant stories. Focus on the plot.
I wasn't crazy about the dialogue throughout the script - granted, the were some exellent nuggets in there - but for the most part the dialogue was a little boring to me and stretched out (I'll get to that later). Obviously the dialogue and characters go hand in hand and I felt you could have varied it a bit - especially iro. the youngsters and the cutey-pie talk from Danny and Carlie (as I've already mentioned earlier). But mostly I felt the dialogue could be trimmed all around. There are alot of lines in there you could remove without it changing anything story wise. I'm not talking about hacking the script with a broadsword but rather a scalpel - finesse it. Example:
Quoted from The Scripy pg. 45
MARTIN Oh yeah, I'm fine. Pretty fucked up though. Must be the altitude, huh?
He laughs...nervously.
JANELLE Yeah, me too Marty. You're not alone my friend. I'm trashed.
Right there, Janelle says basically the same thing three times. Surely, once is enough. You don't have to cram it down the readers throat.
Another thing:
Quoted from The Script pg. 64
LISA You fucking asshole! What the fuck is wrong with you?
I though that was kinda a weird thing thing to say to some who's trying to kill you (and who has just killed your boyfriend).
Also:
Quoted from The Script pg. 65
LISA Fuck you asshole! Why are you doing this? What's wrong with you?
Her words are weak. She looks terrible.
You do this in other places as well, stating how the characters say the different lines - after they have said it. In my opinion, you should do that in parenthesis prior to the dialogue, cos' when I read the dialogue and that it had a exclamation point in the end, I thought she was screaming.
The writing itself is fine, could be a little tighter for my taste - that's just how I like it, but overall it was good. I think you have three instances where "bodies bounces back violently" in the script. I think you should mix up the wording a little. Also, all the characters in the script seem to giggle and laugh at an unhealthy interval, I would personally cut down on that.
Now, THE BIG REVEAL in the end reminded me a lot of how it was done in 'Saw I', only difference is that it worked in Saw because - looking back - all the pieces of the puzzle was there, you just weren't able to see the big picture. Here you bring in Xavier, a character that's mentioned maybe two or three times up until that, and it doesn't have that WOW effect. In fact it was a MAJOR LETDOWN cos' it's pure Deux Ex Machina tactics - and that never works. As far as who or what Xavier is, frankly, I don't care. Whether he's an alien, Don Corleone, Santa Clause or Satan himself it doesn't matter to me, because he comes in too late to make an real and meaningful impact.
And that's why I think the script didn't work as a whole.
That's not to say that it can't work - because it can. Deep down it's a good plot - you have at least two interesting characters here - but in my personal opinion it needs a major overhaul. Focus on the plot and keep it tight.
I hope I didn't come across as too harsh here but it is my honest opinion.
Good luck with the re-write.
Cheers Rob
Down in the hole / Jesus tries to crack a smile / Beneath another shovel load
I read this last night and it's very good. Being a horror fiend, I'd say it's more creative and effective than quite a bit of filmed crud I've seen lately. I like a lot of the dialogue, and there are some nice twists (I do have a problem with the gratuity of Joey's fate--but then again, I'll relent that it does further the story).
Overall, it flows well and is absorbing, and I'd love to see it as a feature film. And seriously, this is coming from someone who watches EVERYTHING horror genre related.
Thanks Steed! I appreciate your kind words. The version you read is an older one. The new one is 10 pages shorter, tighter, and much better in my mind. I am gearing up for a final rewrite this week. Most don't seem to "get" the ending.
Thanks, Col! Excellent info here. Really appreciate it man...but…one of these days, I’m going to find out what your real name is…for now we’ll go with Col.
Sorry it took me so long to respond, but I've been sick.
Funny about the title, because it was actually originally titled “Whiteout”, but when I finished the first draft, I went to buy up all the .com, .net, .movie, etc, and I found that there was already a “Whiteout” in post production…a pretty big scale graphic novel deal with Kate Beckinsale…damn!!!! I was crushed. So I came up with the new title about 2 weeks later. I actually like it better now, and what you just said there is cool, and I see it now playing a few different ways. Good catch!
I’m terrible with loglines and I came up with this one in a hurry. It definitely needs help. The latest one I’m using goes like this…
Good friends, great skiing, epic snow… Oh yeah… And a shitload of killing! The blood that’s shed will never fade to white.
Any suggestions are very, very welcome (as I’m not crazy about this one either).
Thanks for that. My writing history is not script writing, but short stories, novels, etc. I’ve always liked writing that has a poetic feel to it, and imagery is something I always strive for, even in a screenplay.
Yeah, my goal was to make you think Tobias is the Antag, and will be showing up to start his killing all over again in Durango.
I’ve gone over the examples you brought up and I’m starting to agree with you here on using a comma before a name in dialogue. I don’t believe it’s a must, but I agree that it looks better with them in there. Thanks for bringing this up!
It is standard to CAP a sound effect that occurs. It’s basically making the production crew aware that this sound needs to stand out, and is of some importance.
A few people have been confused by the term “rights himself” and “gathers herself” on the same page. I think I will rephrase both these lines. Good catch!
Marshall doesn’t really grab or pull Tobias’ leg…he merely flails at his leg, in a last gasp of life, trying to do anything to save his wife, Cyndi (yes, they are married – Marshall is Lloyd’s son, and Joey, is Marshall and Cyndi’s son). I think I’ll also have to rephrase this scene, as a few have also commented on it.
The pool room they’re in isn’t much bigger than the pool itself, so the exterior glass wall that Tobias shoots through to hit Cyndi, is only some 4 feet or so away from the pool edge. The total distance of the shot is no more than 25 feet or so.
Maybe CAPing dialogue is out, but I included it to emphasize what Carlie was saying. Maybe I’ll take it out.
Wow, great catch on the extra “dot”! Incredible…thanks! I hate mistakes! Yeah, I agree that I definitely enjoy the ellipses and aposiopesis…maybe too much! In dialogue they’re perfect to show a pause in speech, and in the prose portion, I think they’re nice for combining thoughts. I also just like the flow they give text. Yeah, I’m definitely guilty as charged here!
The sleeping toddler scene has been drastically cut from its original incarnation. I’ll add something to show he’s asleep. Good catch!
Many don’t like the sweetness here, but I think it’s important to present D & C this way early on. I also think it’s fairly normal and to me, it doesn’t come off as cringe-worthy or too saccharine at all, but your point is taken for sure.
D & C are definitely in love with each other and they’re the kind of people that like to show it. Again, to me, I don’t find this at all weird or irritating, but many have said the same thing about them being way too lovey dovey. Point taken.
I’m considering using the correct “FADE TO WHITE”, but not quite sure yet.
“Cool’s” is a contraction for “cool is”.
I like the “cool” conversation! I really do. It’s just the whacky way they are together.
The original draft had Danny being frightened by the cat. Many said I needed something in between the Patterson kills and the long bar scene, so I added the vagrant scene being killed and combined it with the cat scene. I’m a cat lover, so I need to include a cat in here. You think it’s a total cliché? I really don’t think so.
The original draft had a few sing-alongs, but I also had actuall songs they were singing to. I pulled them out but left in the singing along, as again, it just shows what kind of character Danny is. I like it in here, but I do agree it could come off as cheese…if it does, it’ll hit the floor.
I love the snowflake scenes! They will be very cool effects. It can be pulled off and I really think it adds a lot to scene changes.
I love Carlie!! C’mon now!
I’m not sure what you’re referring to when you say, “When describing the characters you have "actually" featured in two descriptions for Johnny & Janelle, was this intentional? Its sounds repetitive.” Let me know.
I decided that I was going to always spell “ok” as “OK”. I think it looks better.
The Kus didn’t care about the puke until it became apparent how bad it really was. He was hoping she’d jump in the shower with him, but she wasn’t even thinking about a shower.
Yeah, 4 minutes of meandering, meaningless banter! A lot of people thought this was way too long. It’s been cut down a bit, and may be cut a bit more, but overall; I don’t think it will play out nearly as long as it reads.
I’m still a High Fiver, but I agree, they can get irritating very fast. All things in moderation!
The Nicole fake biting Megan’s neck will look cool I think. Actually, I see this image in the trailer, so you have no clue where the story’s going. It’ll be done kinda goofy-like.
I always CAP the first letter in anything that’s used as a name (Doctor, Babe, etc.).
A few have commented on the amount of drinking, but in reality (at least my reality!), I don’t think it’s that crazy. With all the snow falling and accidents going on, the last thing they need to worry about is being pulled over for swerving or whatever, as the cops have too many accidents to deal with on a night like this.
Glad you like Nicole! She calls ‘em likes she sees ‘em!
I’m surprised you think Janelle is an arrogant bitch. Other than D & C, she’s my favorite. She’s cool people actually. The things she says are mostly joking around and in a filmed version, I think you’d like her a lot more….at least I hope you would.
I love the way “anfuckingthingelse” sounds! I really do.
Glad the big twist worked for you. It is meant to be the turning point to everything. The slow, pondering pace now picks up and everything gets crazy…kinda like 2 movies in 1!
Agreed, Jake should be screaming more. I’ll put that in. Good catch.
I like the whistling too. It’s actually quite an eerie tune if you do it right…check it out…
Glad you’re appreciating Janelle and Martin now. They are good people.
Jill walks the opposite direction when she leaves her house, so she’s in essence walking in a circle, coming back to the Schaefer house.
Johnny’s not a sleaze in the classic sense, but he’ll say whatever he has to, to get what he wants. He does actually like Janelle though. His character is just kind like that. I don’t know if you noticed or not, but he usually calls women that he talks with “Beautiful”. Just the way he is.
Yeah, I was hoping you’d be wondering about Carlie. Thanks!
Again, with Jill walking the dogs, she originally goes the opposite direction, so the dogs can get their walk. I like Jill’s demise. I agree that it could be looked at as far fetched, but not completely…she’s very petite, it’s snowy and slippery, and she’s being pulled by 5 big dogs, so…suspend your disbelief for a few moments if you can. I too think it will be a really cool scene though.
Thanks for the compliments. Lisa’s demise is a good scene. She has a chance, and that’s the surprising part. I like how the door opening in the wind serves both Lisa in giving her a chance, and Jilly in her demise. Kinda cool.
I don’t see where “HELL” is all CAPPed on page 63.
I’ll come up with another word for “THUD” and “bloody mess” Good catch…thanks!
Danny’s a new Danny now. Glad you like this one better!
Glad you like the tension on page 70 with the 2 legs walking scenes. Others have liked that also.
Glad you liked the erotic side of this. Not too much T & A, but enough to satisfy everyone…hopefully.
Glad you’re cool with Carlie now. See? She’s cool, huh?
Again, “Megan’s” is a contraction for “Megan is”. It’s speech, so lines re blurred in terms of proper grammar.
Johnny knows Lisa from College, but Janelle is her friend now.
Yeah, I love Johnny’s death. Brutal! Something you don’t see very often…or ever?
Yeah, everything doesn’t work out exactly like they thought it would…it never does.
Thanks…glad you liked this scene. I agree, it’s pretty cool, cause anything can happen from here.
Since “Jacobs” is plural, the comma has to come after the “s”.
Funny as shit!! The “Ociffer” spelling is correct. It’s a joke actually…they’re toying with him. Like when you get pulled over by a cop, and you’ve been drinking, you want to sound as sober as possible…first thing out of your mouth is “Hello Ociffer”…you’re busted!
You don’t like the Dirty Harry reference, huh? I actually think it works quite well here.
Jilly could survive, as she’s really only been out there for 2 hours tops, probably less.
Sherriff Hawkins is going to be a main character in the sequel. He’s a good ol’ country boy. The “m” is short for “my”, and yeah, he swears a lot. I see someone like Tommy Lee Jones in his part.
“Tire” is spelled correctly…at least here in America.
Yes, X is Lucifer. I didn’t want to make it completely clear, and open to each person’s opinions. He is far from mortal or human, and that’s how he “finds” his people to kill…he “sees” something in them and he goes from there.
Blacky is friends with D & C from AZ. They know each other well.
The new draft that you read has 10 pages less than the original. It also has an additional scene or 2. I cut a lot of shit out to trim it to this. I’ll most likely cut out another 5 pages or so for the final draft.
Glad you liked it. I really appreciate your thoughts and comments. They have helped a lot.
I see you have your reasons for a lot of the stuff I said, so I'm willing to trust your vision on how this would be played out on screen.
And I totally agree that with proper direction & acting so much more can be articulated in front of the camera then what you could ever fit on a page.
In relation to the "actually" point -- All I was saying is that particular word features in both their descriptions. I know its only a small thing but when reading it I noticed it straight away as being repetitive, no big deal.
I agree, the biting would be ideal for an enticing trailer cut. But in the context of the scene I feel it could be left out.
Rather funny logic you have on the drink driving matter but I see its necessary for them to drive home in order for the story to progress. So again no big deal, we've all done it in the past at some point, so "he who has not sinned...
Fair point on the grammer & speech, it should be comprised for realism.
Although you have confirmed my suspicions about Xavier I don't think you give the reader enough to go on. It's all too ambiguous & open ended.
You say he's gonna be more prominent in the sequel, in light of that lets hope the audience is willing to hang in there for it as I'm sure you will make it worth their.
Unfortunately genaral cinema audience are (from my experience) inherently very impatient (something that's steadily increasing -- Being directly proportional to the amount of sh?t programming thats clogging our visual medium & getting beamed all over the world) People like their three acts, good & bad characters, distinct identifiable plot points & motivations, gratuitous T & A if possible & preferably have it all nicely wrapped & posted within 90 minutes screen time tops (including end credits) so they can make it home to watch CSI: Whatever.
Don't fret though I'll stay till the last reel, but my point is: Xaxier isn't fleashed out enough. For someone who has a pivotal part to play in this whole grizzly scenario, we really don't know anything about him until the end where we only get a couple of vague lines.
As I said, I can handle this & anticipate a sequel where we will learn more & be able to put the pieces together, the "general audience" won't bother. They'll be crying out for another "epic movie" to go whoop & laugh to without having to use thir brains (and all in the space of a tight 90 min slot. Anything more you see and their minds start to wander before the wither and die...mmm that gives me an idea)
I know I sound like a major condescending prick here, I'm being sarastic...kind of...sorta...er not really.
Anyway best of luck with this, glad my comments helped, as did yours on "Charm" which I will have in front of me when I get around to rethinking &rewriting it, its gonna be a big job.
Keep me posted on any interest or developments you have with this.
Wow so I just finished reading this. i jot these down while reading:
When you introduced all the kids at the bar you did it all at once. I found myself having to go back to that part to see who was who. Not a huge deal but maybe you could describe each person when they begin talking.
I liked how you used the idea of following a snowflake several times.
The script starts off with a f***king knuckle punch and then slows down for 50 or so pages. I almost forgot this was a horror script and when they got back to the house I was expecting Tobias to show up. Great twist.
Sometimes in the bar conversations dragged. Especially when they were trying to tell Jake's story. I was just like c'mon get on with it. Too wordy maybe? The image of Jill getting dragged by her dogs is almost silly but I guess you needed a reason for the Po Po to show up. Btw that standoff with the Police officer and the Janelle and Danny was brilliant. You built the tension up reall well. I also thought it was funny how you put the lesbian make out scene in the closest. Just a nice tough
The ending is the only part that bothered me. Why did there have to be some organization that sent people out to Skiing resorts to kill. I thought the idea of Carlie and Danny being a crazy killing couple was kind of fun. Instead it came out as some kind of 100 bullets type conspiracy. Maybe it only bothered me because you introduced it but could've gone further (hey that's why we make sequels eh?)
One more thing i see that your director will have to pay an a**load in royalties for that soundtrack. Just something to think about if you decide to shop this around to low budget horror companies
Nonetheless I really enjoyed reading it and think it would make a perfectly fun horror flick.
Hey Rob, thanks so much for taking time to read and give your comments. I totally appreciate it. Sorry for taking so long to respond, but I’ve been sick, and had a bunch of shit going on also. Here are my comments in return, in order with yours, to keep things understandable.
Original inspiration came over Christmas 2005, while skiing in Durango. Most of the initial writing took place in 2007, culminating with a first draft in August, 2007. I’d say my influences were actually TCM (and all its clones) and Hostel. As I began to understand screenwriting, Wolf Creek became an influence as well.
I’m surprised you didn’t think it worked. When I watch movies and read scripts, the bottom line for me is always whether or not it works, and I feel this definitely works when all is said and done. That was my goal at least.
The initial scene in Steamboat is definitely there to start things out with a bang, and let everyone know that no one is safe and nothing is sacred. The electrocution scene is quite Hollywood for sure. Others have commented on the fact that it probably isn’t completely realistic, but keep in mind that neither Marshall nor Cyndi was actually killed by electrocution. Marshall’s “reanimation” is really just a last ditch effort to save his wife. He doesn’t actually purposely grab Tobias’ leg, but he’s merely doing anything he can to give Cyndi a chance. The rewrite phrases a few things differently here, and hopefully, it’ll help with the visualization.
Danny and Carlie are far from dim-witted. I’m still surprised that most dislike their interactions with each other. They really are just totally in love with each other, but I’ll also admit that I definitely wanted to lead the reader (and the future viewers) astray. I’ve actually toned down Danny’s lovey dovey routine quite a bit, but decided to leave Carlie intact. For me, they come off as real and likeable people. I think a lot of it will have to do with the delivery of the lines (or maybe the delivery you’re envisioning isn’t what I’m seeing…or intending). It’s pretty much that they’ve been together for a very long time, and this is just how they act together. Glad you think they do work as lead characters though.
Again, a lot have said the same kind of thing about the drinking and the younger characters. I guess everything is relative. One person can say how wasted they are after 2 drinks, while others can slam down 4 drinks and 4 shots and have no problem. Guess I’m in that second category, so for me, I don’t see much excess here, and based on the situation (a vacation for all, the Holidays, epic snow and skiing, good friends…), I’d be doing exactly the same thing!
You mentioned that they all sound the same. I don’t agree really. If you go back, you’ll see that only certain characters swear, and each has their own personality. For instance, Johnny continually refers to women as “Beautiful”, and is much more outgoing than the others. Nikki is definitely an individual, in just about every way. Martin and Megan are much more reserved and quiet. They are friends and that means that they do share a lot in common, so they’re going to come off sounding somewhat alike, IMO.
The real life talk is definitely something I was after, and totally appreciate in movies. I can’t stand hearing (or reading) lines that come off as completely inane and unbelievable. In terms of the banter not going anywhere in the bar scene, I’m OK with that, and actually was trying for a “where the fuck is this thing going” vibe. I personally like this kind of thing in movies, but rarely really ever get it. When characters say things that don’t make sense or don’t go anywhere, for me at least, it shows that they’re real, and not just some cardboard cutout of a clichéd character that I’ve seen 100’s of times before. I personally thought that the bar scene in Death Proof was the highlight of the film, as it kept me guessing where it was going, and I found the banter to come off as very realistic and funny.
The real meaning of the story in the bar was twofold…first of all, it’s supposed to be funny, and show that these characters actually know and like each other. Secondly, it shows that Jake actually killed a guy before and if nothing else, should be a character that can take care of himself. It has nothing to do with Xavier, BTW. When Jake is the first to go, and he doesn’t even put up a fight, I wanted it to come as a complete shock.
The Johnny-Janelle-Martin situation is what it is, and is meant to show who they are. Martin and Janelle are close friends. I wanted that to be clear. Johnny’s advances on Janelle are the last thing that Martin wants to see, as he’s been after her for years. I wanted Janelle and Martin to be the two you were routing for to survive or save the day. Johnny was meant to be a strong character, like Jake, that would be a tough foil for any antag to take out. His lack of fight when it comes down, was again meant to be a big shock. Many have said they like Janelle and Martin the best, and I was hoping that would be the case.
Nicole is the only outsider here. She’s with Megan, but no one knows that. Megan is friends with Lisa, Jake, and Johnny from college. Nicole is somewhat jealous and the kind of person that when she drinks, she changes and becomes a beeyatch, for the most part. Just who she is.
I’m surprised you thought the stuff at the Schaefer house came off as a standard slasher flick, cause that sure wasn’t my intent. I was definitely going for a completely different vibe in the 2nd half, and wanted to ramp up the tension and action, but I didn’t want to go the standard route with people running away, screaming, etc. Once we know that Danny (and then Carlie) aren’t who we thought they were, everything changes…except that the kids don’t realize this at all. Thus, a very different feeling to the kills and tension, as we’re the only ones who understand when someone should be concerned for their safety.
The work suits were because Danny had an expensive ski jacket. They also helped conceal some bloody kills.
Glad you were shocked when Danny started killing. That’s definitely a highlight and really changes to tone of everything.
Lisa went outside because Danny said that Jake wanted to see her. She wasn’t thrilled about going out, but obliged anyway, thinking Jake needed her for something.
Bobby and Jill are there for comic relief in a way. Also, as possible victims or saviors. And yeah, I liked how Bobby got Officer Jacobs there without anyone else knowing it. The conversation with Officer Jacobs and his wife was just so you got to know him a bit, and hopefully got you liking him and routing for him. It’s a pretty short scene, and also gives us an idea of timing when the Lexus drives by. You know he’s only going to be a few minutes behind them when they arrive at the house. For me, it totally ups the tension and believability by knowing this. Yeah, the radio going out at a bad time may come off as cliché, but it’s really just about the only cliché in here, and in a snow storm like they’re having, very plausible for me. It also doesn’t really come into play that much anyway, cause whether or not he got through to dispatch when he tried, it wouldn’t have saved him or anyone else.
Yes, you’re correct. I have given direction to the actors in many places and I’m cutting those out. They will be in parenthesis under the characters name before they talk in the final draft.
You’re right…there are a lot of instances where characters laugh or giggle. Again, guess that’s just how they are. I’ve noticed that myself and I have to laugh out loud sometimes, cause they do it a lot!
I’m bummed you didn’t like the ending. I’m more bummed you didn’t get the ending. Most haven’t, and I just don’t understand why. I do not agree with the Deux Ex Machina comment though. It’s far from that IMO. X is Satan, and I’m trying to make that more apparent but still ambiguous. In a filmed version, it would be much more obvious, or at least much more of a possibility. I wanted to leave this ambiguous and up to each to think about, but maybe it’s still too ambiguous.
Rob, don’t worry at all bout being too harsh. If you’ve read any of my reviews, you’ll know that I appreciate honesty and give my comments completely in that manner. No need for Kid Gloves.
Again, I totally appreciate your feedback. It definitely helps. Thanks so much!
I personally thought that the bar scene in Death Proof was the highlight of the film, as it kept me guessing where it was going, and I found the banter to come off as very realistic and funny.
And there's the main difference between you and me and why I didn't think the script worked. When I watch a movie (or read a script) I want to be entertained - and it doesn't matter whether it's horror, sci-fi, action, comedy, thriller, drama or porn. Entertain me. I don't like non-story stories that aren't leading anywhere except me switching the channel (so to speak). You could lock me in a room and force me to watch Catwoman non-stop for a week and I'd do it with a smile on my face - anything but Death Proof.
If I wanted real life banter I could just talk to my wife...and that's not, like, gonna happen
Quoted from Dreamscale
I’m bummed you didn’t like the ending. I’m more bummed you didn’t get the ending. Most haven’t, and I just don’t understand why. I do not agree with the Deux Ex Machina comment though. It’s far from that IMO. X is Satan, and I’m trying to make that more apparent but still ambiguous. In a filmed version, it would be much more obvious, or at least much more of a possibility. I wanted to leave this ambiguous and up to each to think about, but maybe it’s still too ambiguous.
Don't be bummed that I didn't get the ending cos' IMO there's nothing to get. Xavier is the bad man himself and he sends out people to kill other people cos' killing is cool and it opens new doors for you. My response to that is: And?
If Xavier had been a reoccuring character in the script (and I'm not talking about someone mentioning his name every now and then - I mean an actual character), then it might have worked. As it stands now, the end, to me, feels like I'm getting an answer to a question I never asked. Huh?
I don't mean that he should come across as Satan throughout the script (that could be revealed in the end as it is now) but more like the guy pulling the strings. Also, set up why Danny and Carlie and whoever he's got working for him, why they do it and how he does it. The "it will open new doors for you" doesn't work IMO and that's why the whole thing feels like Deus Ex Machina in the end - and I stand by that.
After I finished your script I asked myself if I wanted to see this on the screen and rewatch it? The answer to both those questions were (this won't surprise you) no. But that's just my opinion of course.
Cheers Rob
Down in the hole / Jesus tries to crack a smile / Beneath another shovel load
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